Lockheed Martin's F-16 block 70 (F-21) for India

[Edevelop]

Pakistan in the next decade will be severely outclassed by India.

There isn't even a decent economy or STEM base to support indigenous R&D, not much foreign options and quite expensive

Let them. India is a continent, 7x larger than us. They've got their own goals and challenges. I believe our focus should be having a quality population which could look like in the form of having an educated class with a higher GDP per capita but in order to do so we must separate religion from governance, introduce taxes on the wealthy to fund programs to alleviate poverty and end feudalism.

 

[ziaulislam]

I also think pak cannot match Indian military head to head for next ten years due to bad economical condition

Would the country be there in 10yrs??
Half of the country (Punjab) believes there golden era was when the other half (KP FATA BALOCHISTAN) was being bombed to oblivion in exchange for 3 Bill of CSF funding

 

[TheSolution]

Let them. India is a continent, 7x larger than us. They've got their own goals and challenges. I believe our focus should be having a quality population which could look like in the form of having an educated class with a higher GDP per capita but in order to do so we must separate religion from governance, introduce taxes on the wealthy to fund programs to alleviate poverty and end feudalism.

I would like that too, but at the bare minimum we should have proportional parity. There's no reason for the mass size difference to deter us from pursuing R&D and indigenous products, and staying on top in other domains.

Separating religion from governance formally is likely not possible, but in practicality it already happens. It's all about will, if you can pass transgender bills, why can you not pass other policies for other purposes?

 

[CLUMSY]

F16 is a good jet, its one of the most battle proven jets. But everything has a weakness, and PAF knows F16s inside and out because of how long they have operated it. That probably prevents India from buying it.

Rest of the jets are just for show, if it don't have any decent battle experience its just an experiment not a fighter.

Also at the end of the day, technology only gets you so far. Flying experience under tough circumstances, and capability and skill far outweigh tech advantage. Always about the man behind the machine

F-16 Block 70 is literally an entirely different beast. Our F-16s use MSA radars while the blk 70 uses the same radar on F-35 iirc

Pakistan in the next decade will be severely outclassed by India.

There isn't even a decent economy or STEM base to support indigenous R&D, not much foreign options and quite expensive

I think for PAF investing more in SAMs and ground based radars is a much better and cost effective solution

 

[Edevelop]

Would the country be there in 10yrs??
Half of the country (Punjab) believes there golden era was when the other half (KP FATA BALOCHISTAN) was being bombed to oblivion in exchange for 3 Bill of CSF funding

Pakistan has a fair share of problems but one of the biggest is identity crisis. I believe neither English nor Urdu is compatible. Clearly this combination has created a polarized population. Let us admit, both have nothing to do with majority of the population and like you said yourself Punjab is half of the country. Yet it would be unfair to put blame on them as they themselves are a victim of colonial oppression and speaking of ruling the country, most of the prime ministers and presidents in fact have been outside of Punjab. Rather than blaming each other, the solution is to go back where we all were before British colonialism which is recognizing regional cultures and politicians and Farsi being the language that unites us in history, science and literature.

 

[Wesen Hunter]

The F-21 is likely not going to be picked by the IAF(although stranger things have happened) but may be LM trying to keep its foot in the door for IAF’s medium aircraft requirement


What does not having the F-21s have to do with Pakistan - it was obvious that the Rafale is a superior aircraft to the Pakistani F-16 fleet but since the J-10s have arrived the Rafale is matched not only in Radar, EW but also outsticked by a bit in the PL-15 vs Meteor. Heck, other than the Rafale even with the Astra roll out the PAF will continue to maintain a BVR weapons edge for the foreseeable future.

There is no proof or indication the PL-15 outsticks Meteor.
Infact RUSI research report state the opposite is true.
The PL-15 official specs has shown it's max range is 145 km compared to 200 km of Meteor as stated by Luftwaffe itself.

No proof either that range of PL-15E and PL-15 are different.

 

[LeGenD]

So you do agree that Rafales are much superior to F-21s, which even Pakistanis don't have.

Based on what exactly?

F-21 > F-16 Block 72/70 > Rafale F3R

Indians continue to show that they are "idiots."

No it only confirms that the Indians are dumb and lack skills.

Our J10Cs are already superior to Rafales. So we have no worries.

Agreed with top statement. Though some are good.

It isn't, but it is good in capable hands.

It remains to be seen how IAF will utilize Rafale F3R, what tactics they have devised.

 

[Goritoes]

So IAF wants to operate...

1) Su-30MKI Russia
2) Mig-29 Russia
3) Rafale (French)
4) Mirage 2000 (French)
5) Tejas *India/other countries*
6) F-21 $America$

Well this seems like a logistical nightmare for a Air force, Plus Russian system will they be able to communicate with American's ? I think for IAF, best way moving forward is to order more Rafale which is top of the line fighter with variants for AF/Navy which is perfect for IAF, adding numbers for Rafale also checkmate PAF, PAF has no chance for getting any newer F-16's so Pakistan just live with whatever they have, I doubt any good/Advance tech is coming from Americans not until some miracle happen.

 

[INS_Vikrant]

EXACTLY!!!! In top Gun tom cruse shot down 4 fifth gen fighters with an f14 tomcat. Pilot skills > all else.

You are kidding right? Plus Maverick himself says that they'd been shot down already if SU57 pilots knew who they were before the dogfight even starts.

 

[CivilianSupremacy]

So IAF wants to operate...

1) Su-30MKI Russia
2) Mig-29 Russia
3) Rafale (French)
4) Mirage 2000 (French)
5) Tejas *India/other countries*
6) F-21 $America$

Well this seems like a logistical nightmare for a Air force

Still, better then Egyptian air force which is mix of all.

However, if india proceeds with F-21s, after 15 years India will only have American & French fighters from foreign countries. As most of russian fighter jets would be phased out or nearing retirement.

PAF knows F16s inside and out because of how long they have operated it. That probably prevents India from buying it.

This is true, however it goes both ways. India by receiving F-16s most modern variant and by experiencing it first hand will know what kind of advantages PAF had. They will know exactly what extra features they will employ with latest variant to offset PAF's F-16 capabilities. We can eve boost doing exercises with Qatari Rafales that we now have experience of how to deal with Rafales, So owning a platform and with local manufacturing, it will be matter of time india will know all what PAF had in its cards. But good news for us is that F-16 is not the only aircraft we fly, the J-10C and its future variants will form PAF's tip of spear.

I'm speaking on the topic that what ever India gets now pak cannot counter it

This is true because india is world's top 5th economy. We will not be able to match india's purchases if we don't change our mindset. We need to stop thinking about military equipment. We need to only think about our economy. Once we are a strong economy then everything else comes as a by product including latest tech military stuff.

 

[Abdul Rehman Majeed]

Who do you think wins, a veteran israel pilot who flew in the wars with the arabs with many hours of flying experience in his aircraft, or a Syrian pilot in a Rafale that he was trained on for 6 months? Please using some braining.

Exactly!

A Pakistani Airforce pilot who have skills and experience on F-16 will win against an unskilled Indian Airforce pilot flying a F-21 or SU-30 or Rafale.

Talking about skill, Indian fighter pilots collide head on during peace time.

IAF orders inquiry after Su-30 and Mirage 2000 crashed in MP's Morena​

While the two pilots on the Su-30 sustained minor injuries, the pilot on the Mirage died after being fatally wounded in the crash.​

IAF orders inquiry after Su-30 and Mirage 2000 crashed in MP's Morena

While the two pilots on the Su-30 sustained minor injuries, the pilot on the Mirage died after being fatally wounded in the crash.

www.businesstoday.in

Let them. India is a continent, 7x larger than us. They've got their own goals and challenges. I believe our focus should be having a quality population which could look like in the form of having an educated class with a higher GDP per capita but in order to do so we must separate religion from governance, introduce taxes on the wealthy to fund programs to alleviate poverty and end feudalism.

India is a continent masquerading as a country.

India needs to be balkanized.

TROLL we don't need to overhyped ourselves j10c is not combat proven but rafale is combat proven plate form

What combat proven? You mean Libya?

 

[Abdul Rehman Majeed]

Based on what information?

PL-20 is on the way. Chinese missiles cost a fraction of the cost of US or EU missiles with equal or superior capabilities.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1443748393637933074

 

[White and Green with M/S]

What combat proven? You mean Libya?

Yes and its take years to develop tactics against Indian rafale using j10c

 

[Foinikas]

PL-20 is on the way. Chinese missiles cost a fraction of the cost of US or EU missiles with equal or superior capabilities.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1443748393637933074

 

[White and Green with M/S]

PL-20 is on the way. Chinese missiles cost a fraction of the cost of US or EU missiles with equal or superior capabilities.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1443748393637933074

Do you know what is no escape zone?