Lockheed Martin offers F-16 Block 70, for India, from India, exported to the world

[WOW_FACTOR]

Yes, 30 years ago. That's how old the aircraft is.

Pakistan never asked for TOT because it would not be financially effective to produce it in Pakistan with the relatively small amount they needed.

The reason it is being phased out is that it cannot be updated any further. It is more cost effective to design new aircraft.

It is like beginning construction of brand new mig-21's when there are mig-29's and mig-35's out there.

If sir you are comparing F 16 to Mig 21. all the best to you sir. PAF operates the largest Mig 21 oops F 16 squad in south asia and ask any PAF experienced Pilot about F 16 Vs JF 17 . He will say that JF 17 is very good but F 16 is still dam strong and considered the finest it has . I dare to say that even Jf 17 block 3 vs f 17 block 70 , PAF pilots will still have hearts for F-16.

It is the best multi role fighter in the world till date and there is no shame in accepting

 

[kaykay]

I do know.
Keyword eventually.

F-16 blk 70 was rejected for a reason.
Rafale fared better in the tests, for a reason.
Pakistan is moving ahead with JF-17 (blk 2, blk 3) for example.

While the numbers of Aircraft India has will be larger than Pakistan for a long time, the specs difference will reduce.

Sticking to Rafale was a much better idea for India.

I didn't quite understand that how India is losing in air superiority with or without F-16IN.....Su-30MKIs are further gonna be upgraded to Super Sukhoi standard(Su-35 comparable), atleast 36 Rafales will join the fleet, 100+ F-16IN/F-18SH/Rafale/ Gripen( all AESA equipped) will come eventually under make in India, 100 Tejas mk1A again with AESA......All in all we'll have a fleet of 500 AESA equipped aircrafts of all heavy, medium and light categories.

 

[jamal18]

Stop your brain farts for a change. These aren't your antique block 52 F-16s Fighting Falcons. These are spanking new F-16 BLOCK 70/72 Super Vipers which is the closest you can get to the present stealth platforms. They are in the same category as the Rafale and EF if not better. Most of all they will be highly cost effective as India would become the base for sale and maintenance of the 4500 F-16s in air forces around the world.

The integration of fifth-generation technology into the fourth-generation platform is pretty much what makes an already-potent fighter an even more potent air-to-air and air-to-ground killer. Lockheed Martin added a number of upgrades to beef up the Fighting Falcon into the Super Viper.

The most powerful upgrade comes in the form of the AN/APG-80 AESA (Active Electronically Scanned Array) radar system. The AN/APG-80 gives the pilot incredible situational awareness and the ability to target and track in any weather/atmospheric condition with stunning precision.

An infrared search and track (IRST) system, the ability to integrate the Indian Air Force’s Operational Data Link (which allows for interoperability with other Indian fighter/attack/AWACS/support units), an onboard electronic warfare suite from Raytheon, and an upgraded modular mission computer add to the F-16IN’s sizable resume.

The cockpit has been redeveloped to an extent, with three color high-definition MFDs (multi-function flight displays) feeding the pilot everything he needs to know, as well as the ability to integrate the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JHMCS). An updated General Electric F110-132A functions as the sole powerplant, able to output over 32,000 pounds of thrust, and the Super Viper also carries conformal fuel tanks (CFTs) with a built-in fuel probe, designed to mate with the basket/drogue refueling system used by Indian aerial tankers, instead of the boom/receptacle system commonly used by American F-16s.

So, in reply to your laughing smiles, take this...

Cut the insults, or I will reply to you accordingly.

I am saying that this is a bad investment. If there was a future for this aircraft, the US would continue to produce it. You are getting something that they don't want.

I can get a model-T ford and put the latest engine in it and give it power steering. It will remain a model-T ford.

There is only so far you can go with upgrading.

 

[denel]

here is the mil $ question, why cannot Pak approach LM to get this?

 

[jamal18]

If sir you are comparing F 16 to Mig 21. all the best to you sir. PAF operates the largest Mig 21 oops F 16 squad in south asia and ask any PAF experienced Pilot about F 16 Vs JF 17 . He will say that JF 17 is very good but F 16 is still dam strong and considered the finest it has . I dare to say that even Jf 17 block 3 vs f 17 block 70 , PAF pilots will still have hearts for F-16.

It is the best multi role fighter in the world till date and there is no shame in accepting

Thank you for your sane reply. It was the best multi-role aircraft of its day. Time moves on. It is old technology. To establish an expensive production facility for an old aircraft is not sound investment.

 

[kaykay]

Thank you for your sane reply. It was the best multi-role aircraft of its day. Time moves on. It is old technology. To establish an expensive production facility for an old aircraft is not sound investment.

Well that depends on the variant you are getting....If its coming with APG-80 AESA, engine with 142 kn thrust, CFT, AIM-120D, Integrated advance EW suite and other goodies with moderate price then It makes sense especially if you buy in numbers....It might not be as capable as Rafale or Typhoon but then its also costing alot less...Better for India to go with hi-lo mix i.e 36 Rafales and 100 F-16IN/F-18SH or Gripen. Just my views.

 

[Blue Marlin]

@Abingdonboy seems you might be correct on Rafale in MII, but Gripen is out @dadeechi i continue to disagree on f-16s, not happening. If at all F-18s.

@Blue Marlin can you shed something about EF offer? Getting some whispers but issue is the consortium involved. The Brits are a pain and unreliable under US pressure

@OrionHunter stop spanking kiddies ... LOL! You need to have patience with them. Indulge or ignore them. You are becoming terribly cruel - spanking them left and right like @Rain Man.

david being david must have offered alot hence the city. im assumming they would have offered help on the lca and provide engine to amca ej-220 which is what turkey is getting and have a factory to build/assemble them. rolls have been putting some of their bean in differant baskets and only one taker so far, turkey. most likely they willbe deploying for focus on the "vce" variable cycle engine, like the f136 but it will be europen as its needed to replace the tornadoes and thats a different ball game. as a lotof european countries are skipping fith gen fighters infavout for 6th gen. we are geting both .

as for india here... if they do get to build the f16 in india it will be under the similar terms as turkey, japan, and south korea, europe dont count as they did not have the juicy tech back then. india is not specail lockheed is not gonna bend ofver for india, remember they need to sustain jobs as the f16 line runds dry next year so chances are theywill be building parts for india too and transfered to the f35 program.

f18's are the same case but they have more to lose as they dont have another fighter program to go to as boeing is building the final f15's for saudi arabia. word out is israel wants 24 f15se's. saab is ok as theyhave signed a huge deal with brazil and other smaller countries.

no word from mig with the mig 35...... which is interesting sukhoiis upgrading the mki's.

 

[Hellfire]

no word from mig with the mig 35...... which is interesting sukhoiis upgrading the mki's.

That is something I forgot to mention. Mig-35 might just be a surprise ... Uncanny u mention

 

[jamal18]

Well that depends on the variant you are getting....If its coming with APG-80 AESA, engine with 142 kn thrust, CFT, AIM-120D, Integrated advance EW suite and other goodies with moderate price then It makes sense especially if you buy in numbers....It might not be as capable as Rafale or Typhoon but then its also costing alot less...Better for India to go with hi-lo mix i.e 36 Rafales and 100 F-16IN/F-18SH or Gripen. Just my views.

Precisely my point. Fitting the latest engine, or yet to be designed radar, in a body shell whose design is 30 years old is not sound investment. It is OK for people like the PAF; refurbish an old Mirage that costs nothing, then put the latest radar/ missile combination is very cost effective.

But to produce the Mirage from new? No. And if it is worthwhile, why aren't the US doing it?

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

 

[DavidSling]

Go for F-35

 

[UKBengali]

Indian buying F-16s from 2020 onwards. Talk about the height of stupidity.

They already are stronger than Pakistan by a fair margin and F-16s will be no match for the
J-20s and J-31s that will come into Chinese service soon.

 

[kaykay]

Precisely my point. Fitting the latest engine, or yet to be designed radar, in a body shell whose design is 30 years old is not sound investment. It is OK for people like the PAF; refurbish an old Mirage that costs nothing, then put the latest radar/ missile combination is very cost effective.

But to produce the Mirage from new? No. And if it is worthwhile, why aren't the US doing it?

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

Well It is a sound investment if it'll be made at home, and you look at all the goodies like AESA, Aim-120D etc you are getting in moderate price when an airforce is still using hundreds on 3rd gen aircrafts. And here we can't compare our situation with USA...They are building 5th gen aircrafts for quite some time while we have just started building our first 4th gen aircraft...F-16IN will still be a okay bet for less price if you look at adversaries options.

Indian buying F-16s from 2020 onwards. Talk about the height of stupidity.

They already are stronger than Pakistan by a fair margin and F-16s will be no match for the
J-20s and J-31s that will come into Chinese service soon.

India have its own plan for fifth generation aircrafts...that's why we have invested in Pak-Fa/FGFA. Not to mention AMCA too. Hell we have options for F-35s too as plan B if need arise..

 

[GURU DUTT]

Cut the insults, or I will reply to you accordingly.

I am saying that this is a bad investment. If there was a future for this aircraft, the US would continue to produce it. You are getting something that they don't want.

I can get a model-T ford and put the latest engine in it and give it power steering. It will remain a model-T ford.

There is only so far you can go with upgrading.

lets put it this way ever seen those overhauling kinda shows on discovery turbo well now consider both F16Blk 52 and F16Blk70/72 as hotrods/ souped up version of the basic ford model T

while Blk52 is the 1999 version with a 3litre V6 with twin cam 24 valve setup fuel injectors and 8bid compoutor controlled engine with turbocharger and all independent twin wish bone suspenssion with latest hydrolick dampers and liquid based hydrolic steering making 300Bhp and going 0-100Km at 8sec with top speed of 150MPH but still giving avrage of 8KMPL

while Blk70/72 is new version 2016 is a latest intel atom based computor controlled V6 with direct fuel injection and twincam 24 valve per cylendar twin turbo + intercooler and latest version of gas based dampers computer controlled suspension and latest electronic steering system and making 400+ Bhp and going 0-100 Km at 5sec with top speed of 200 MPH but still giving 10KMPL

so you tell me who and why gonna win the race under same circumstances & same ammount of fuel hope you get it this time

 

[shhh]

I didn't quite understand that how India is losing in air superiority with or without F-16IN.....Su-30MKIs are further gonna be upgraded to Super Sukhoi standard(Su-35 comparable), atleast 36 Rafales will join the fleet, 100+ F-16IN/F-18SH/Rafale/ Gripen( all AESA equipped) will come eventually under make in India, 100 Tejas mk1A again with AESA......All in all we'll have a fleet of 500 AESA equipped aircrafts of all heavy, medium and light categories.

Yup, but but quality gap will close.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Yup, but but quality gap will close.

how with magic