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Lahore Police Academy crises over | One gunman, five collaborators arrested

First sort otu between yourselves whether there was a hostage situation at nariman point, or not.


One thing is was very clear that there was actual negotiation went with nariman terrorists and worldwide rabbi group who used to an indian prof based in USA to interact in Hindi with the terroists.Its difficult to tell how many were alive,but the terrorists tried to create the impression that some hostages were alive.At one point, in the hours of the attack itself,one of the handler were heard telling the terrorists to kill a specific hostage instantly.

Even though the Govt denied of negotiation with the terrorists,their were some sort of negotiation even at hotel taj & oberi took place which ofcourse failed.

Its all part of the transcript.
 
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b.s , i think - our operation was slow and we must agree to this, yes situation were very different for sure, but Its time we learn a thing or two from other forces, and we are doing that by going to Germany. to learn from their special task forces.

3 DAYS for all that shyt was too much, it was a slow process, and lot of life were lost, lack of infrastructure was main reason behind the slow approach by our teams.

we never said we were perfect, there was will to do it but we were lackign in right technique.

Most life were lost at the train station and the restaurant in excess of 80 odd lives most in the first hour itself.

And both the 5 * hotels had combined high profile
guest of couple of thousand in its combines rooms nearly one thousand rooms .And only less than 100 died those to two places .

There is always scope for improvement in infrastructure & training for every CT force out there.

going to Germany is news to me.

Lastly, lets not loose prospective of the difference between of the two distinct cases, in our display of magnanimity.
 
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Max two guys each corner? How so? you are assuming that the OPFOR is so stupid as to not think that possible entry points would be front and rear? allocating resource accordingly.

Placing 2 men on each side of the quadrant would create cross fire not only killing the LEA's but also the terrorists in the process.

Does Numerical Superiority count? Yes it does!, You need to have elements and party's for specific tasks:

Advanced Party
Rear Guard
Crowd Control
Perimiter Control/Access
Recon/Remote Recon Element
Sniper Team (With Observer/Spotter)

You forget that en element when room clearing has to follow its arc's of fire based on potential location or recon based intel. When moving in stack formation breacher will carry responsibility for potential site selection and opt for either dynamic or stealth entry.

There is no point entering a room all guns blazing because the OPFOR could have easily placed a trip wire attached to a crude meat grinder and hey presto your entry element is toast, now you have to send in another element to get the first one out.

Diagram included:



MOUT and CQB is not as simple as walking on a range and firing 5 rounds to get the best MOA or grouping, once the suspect is barricaded the odds are against you already.

Entry to the building was from a elongated stairwell, this is very difficult to negotiate for a assault team, as i am sure you will be aware and appreciate why.

So it is not about who is better and who is not, it is about managing the risk and taking appropriate steps to safeguard your team in an attempt ac hive the mission objectives.

And as far as i am conerned our boys did a damn good job!

May be we should call in NSG chief to this dabate for a fair analysis.:)
 
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Max two guys each corner? How so? you are assuming that the OPFOR is so stupid as to not think that possible entry points would be front and rear? allocating resource accordingly.

Placing 2 men on each side of the quadrant would create cross fire not only killing the LEA's but also the terrorists in the process.

Does Numerical Superiority count? Yes it does!, You need to have elements and party's for specific tasks:

Advanced Party
Rear Guard
Crowd Control
Perimiter Control/Access
Recon/Remote Recon Element
Sniper Team (With Observer/Spotter)

You forget that en element when room clearing has to follow its arc's of fire based on potential location or recon based intel. When moving in stack formation breacher will carry responsibility for potential site selection and opt for either dynamic or stealth entry.

There is no point entering a room all guns blazing because the OPFOR could have easily placed a trip wire attached to a crude meat grinder and hey presto your entry element is toast, now you have to send in another element to get the first one out.

Diagram included:



MOUT and CQB is not as simple as walking on a range and firing 5 rounds to get the best MOA or grouping, once the suspect is barricaded the odds are against you already.

Entry to the building was from a elongated stairwell, this is very difficult to negotiate for a assault team, as i am sure you will be aware and appreciate why.

Sry for the wrong usage of words!!:argh:
It shud have been numerical strength, I meant of the terrorists.
Not numerical superiority, obviously security forces will have numerical superiority in all such cases.

But thanx for the legend. Informative. plz post some links abt such operations. You seem to be an expert on the field.:agree:
 
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This thread suddenly turned into a "Mumbai Attacks" discussion board? Comparing similarities or differences is one thing but some of you are now completely focusing on the Mumbai attacks. :what:
 
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First of all it seems pakistan is better equpped or have the experience in fighting terrorists.. as they have been suffering from it more, and may be from an outsiders view, every person in pakistan is a solider, willing to fight for islam, pakistan, kashmir etc... That according to me explains the predominant influence of army in their society. I really feel we should learn our lessons from where ever we can, from pakistan if it is, then pakistan. Comparing Mumbai and Lahore is as someone rightly said like comparing apples to oranges. However similar two situations are, the outcome may be different each time, depending upon the circumstances of that situation.

But one of the good things that i noticed in this thread was the comments of Mr. Omar. I thought this guy cannot think anything beyond the prism of anti india hate. But its good that people realise that apart from the differences in kashmir, we both are having the same enimies, that is terrorists & extrimists, bet it hindu, muslim or christians.

So lets come together in eliminating the people who take guns and think that they can get away by giving it a name be it Jihad, or freedom struggle. And i hope this helps in triggering a more frank and open interospection of ones own situation with an objective of removing terrorisim and the growing extrimist thinking which is a fodder for these terrorists from this part of the sub continent.
 
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b.s , i think - our operation was slow and we must agree to this, yes situation were very different for sure, but Its time we learn a thing or two from other forces, and we are doing that by going to Germany. to learn from their special task forces.

3 DAYS for all that shyt was too much, it was a slow process, and lot of life were lost, lack of infrastructure was main reason behind the slow approach by our teams.

we never said we were perfect, there was will to do it but we were lackign in right technique.

Slow !!! Lack of infrastructure? Which infra? You mean transport?
 
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The TTP guy has claimed this attack it seemed. Wasnt he blamed for BB's assasination too?
 
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.....off topic a bit ............ but following should be the treatment given to all terrotist in this world...

 
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Xtreme racing zone:

That's a great wallpaper! You beat me to it because I'm already working on one :P

Please make a new thread so that everyone gets a chance to look at it :tup:
 
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Xtreme racing zone:

That's a great wallpaper! You beat me to it because I'm already working on one :P

Please make a new thread so that everyone gets a chance to look at it :tup:

BEZERK ill Kill u tu pakistan aa :mad::mad: u r nomi na im waleed :mad::mad:: lolz andif u r not nomi thn sorry lol cuz i miss my very old buddy name Nomi nick BEZERK here... anyway

i have already thread in PHOTO section go n reply maroo :pakistan::rofl::argh:


View attachment 0cce7abb4c1a52162cd5836eafceb330.jpg
 
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BEZERK ill Kill u tu pakistan aa :mad::mad: u r nomi na im waleed :mad::mad:: lolz

i have already thread in PHOTO section go n reply maroo :pakistan::rofl::argh:

I know, I was just pulling your leg :D Your outbursts are priceless and that's exactly why lol! Anyway, will check it out now.
 
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The chief of the Pakistani Taleban, Baitullah Mehsud, has told the BBC his group was behind Monday's deadly attack on a police academy in Lahore.

He said the attack was "in retaliation for the continued drone strikes by the US in collaboration with Pakistan on our people".

He also claimed responsibility for two other recent deadly attacks.

Baitullah Mehsud said the attacks would continue "until the Pakistan government stops supporting the Americans".

Security officials are interrogating at least four suspects captured after the attack, police say.

Eighteen people, including two civilians, eight policemen and eight militants, were killed and 95 people were injured during the eight-hour battle to wrest back control of the academy, the interior ministry said.

Pakistan's interior minister earlier identified the Taleban as well as other extremist groups as possible perpetrators and suggested a foreign state could also be involved.

'Retaliation'

Baitullah Mehsud is the supreme commander of the Tehrik-e-Taleban Pakistan group (Movement of Taleban in Pakistan).

He operates out of a stronghold in the Pakistani tribal region of South Waziristan and the US state department recently issued a $5m (£3.5m) reward for his capture.

Speaking to the BBC by phone, he also claimed responsibility for two other attacks:

A suicide attack on a security convoy, also on Monday, near the town of Bannu in North West Frontier Province, which killed seven security personnel
An attack on the offices of a police station in Islamabad on 25 March
But he denied responsibility for the bombing of a mosque in north-west Pakistan on 27 March, in which at least 50 people died.

Baitullah Mehsud warned the attacks would continue in Pakistan and threatened future attacks on American soil, while he shrugged off the risk of "martyrdom".

Local attacks are expected to increase in line with the newly announced US strategy for Afghanistan and Pakistan, says the BBC's Barbara Plett in Lahore.

Different Taleban factions in the border region, including Baitullah Mehsud's, have joined forces in readiness to confront the planned American troop increase in Afghanistan, she says.

Meanwhile, as the Pakistan government attempts to build a national consensus to fight the Taleban, it is faced with trying to overcome deep opposition among its people to an American role in that struggle.

Pakistan's 'choice'

Earlier on Tuesday, Pakistan's interior minister urged the country to unite against insurgents after the attack on the police academy in Lahore.

Rehman Malik said the country had a choice between letting the Taleban take over and uniting to fight them - adding that Pakistan's integrity was "in danger".

He told reporters that the militants were believed to be fighters loyal to Mehsud and included an Afghan national.

The minister also suggested that a foreign country was interfering in Pakistan's domestic affairs.

"Some rival country, or some hostile [intelligence] agency is definitely out to destabilise our democratic forces," he said, in a possible reference to Pakistan's long-time foe, India.

Indian officials have condemned the attack on Lahore.

Carnage

Gunmen seized the Manawan police training school on the outskirts of the city during a morning drill on Monday
Helicopter gunships backed up troops who confronted the militants. They were armed with grenades and some are believed to have blown themselves up with suicide vests.

Our correspondent, who witnessed the aftermath, saw broken glass, bullet casings and body parts scattered over the floor of the academy.

The attack came days after US President Barack Obama pledged to put Pakistan, along with Afghanistan, at the heart of his fight against al-Qaeda militants.

He said "al-Qaeda and its extremist allies" were "a cancer that risks killing Pakistan from within".

US officials have pledged to help Pakistan target so-called "safe havens" for militants in Pakistan's north-west tribal region bordering Afghanistan.

BBC NEWS | South Asia | Lahore 'was Pakistan Taleban op'

As i said this Attack looked like there is certain intelligence agancy behind it for them destroying there own country to get there way is no big deal

http://img9.imageshack.us/my.php?image=2009331835183616213.jpg
 
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