Khilafah in simple words

[R2D2]

Maulana Mohammad Ali Jauhar death anniversary

 

[punit]

3- Khalifah can be anyone of the above sects but most people will not agree to shia Caliph, resulting in infighting, so he has to be from the rest of the sects.

this one takes the cake!! @VCheng @Irfan Baloch

what so great about Khalifa ! khalifas were killed while leading prayer, khalifas killed the family of prophet muhammad. In this age you won't get khalifa like Ali .. but only the likes of yazids and Muwaiya.

 

[Socrates]

Sure, let's say it is (that the Khilafat wants people to become Muslim)... From the view of the Khilafah, it views its ideology as the correct ideology and that it spreading it is not for the sake of domination, but saving people from hellfire.

I am not going to sugar coat it, spreading Islam is the overarching foreign policy constant of the Khilafah. That's the reality of ideological states: When the U.S goes to war in Iraq or Afghanistan, it's there to preserve and strengthen its core ideological interests, i.e. capitalism (if not abroad, then definitely at home). Of course in the case of Khilafah, it isn't there to secure resources for the benefit of an entitled few, but rather, ensure that all people receive their entitled due.

Also, the Khilafat isn't in the business of fighting civilians or destroying property (*cough* U.S *cough*), but merely fighting enemy armies on the battlefield to the extent that Islam can flow.

In other words, collateral damage, harming individual people, etc, is categorically impermissible, regardless of the circumstances. The second Caliph, Umar ibn al-Khattab (RA), was assassinated by a disgruntled Persian, yet the Muslims did not put Persians under profiling or added oppression. In fact, the person the Muslims had a problem with was the son of Umar (RA)'s predecessor, who killed a suspect, which is not permitted in Islam! They even held a tribunal to determine if the person ought to be executed!

That said, while a democracy can legislate laws on a whim (i.e. one day tell me to abandon Islam entirely), the Khilafat system's laws and values are inalienable. In other words, when Allah (swt) says, "there is no compulsion in faith" - then that's end of story, neither the Imam or the Muslims could force non-Muslims to become Muslims, no matter what their wishes or whims.

Yes, one would have to be a Muslim in order to become a politically relevant figure (though non-Muslims are encouraged to participate in order to secure their rights, as non-Muslims), just as I would need to abandon Islam on matters of public affairs in order to be a relevant figure in the West. How can a system survive when its actors hold conflicting thoughts?

Of course the system would reject those that are not in alignment, that's not a moral PoV, it's a reality. Can I participate in the Western democratic system now and say women have no right to own property? Nope. On the same note, a person saying women can't own anything would be rejected by the Islamic system as well.

To put it simply, a non-Muslim individual wanting to live their life in the sense of attaining a comfortable socio-economic status (e.g. job, property, etc) could do so as much as a Muslim. Moreover, a non-Muslim can also manage their personal relationships (e.g. marriage, or not...pork, or not... etc) according to their own beliefs. No one, under any circumstance, can take that away from you...and if they do, they're oppressors.

In a meeting. I will send a detailed reply on this later to night.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

this one takes the cake!! @VCheng @Irfan Baloch

what so great about Khalifa ! khalifas were killed while leading prayer, khalifas killed the family of prophet Muhammad . In this age you won't get khalifa like Ali .. but only the likes of yazids and Muwaiya.

after the first four Caliphs or Khaliphas... Muslims descended into a civil war .. the name was adapted for convenience otherwise they were no different to a Sultan, Maharaja, warchief, or Caesar

regarding the murder of the Family of Prophet Muhammad PBUH in Karbala, the Sunni population as a whole in Pakistan has been targeted by the wahabis into distancing it from the Ahl Bait. and the event of Karbala is played down or even mocked by few who consider themselves to be enlightened and moderate sunnis. the founder of the leading Sectarian outfit held an open gathering and gave a speech where he openly praised Yazid and justified the murder of Imam Hussain and his family and termed them traitors of Islam... thats back in the 80s when halal dollars had started to have extra effect which was hidden in the small writing of the Afghan Jihad.

before this open hatred and shia targeting, sunni participation in the Moharam days of mourning was a norm and no big deal Sunnis attended gatherings (majalis) and offered food and drinks to the mourners although didnt engage in chest beating but avoided laughter and music out of respect.because as we knew it... Hussain and Ali were for all Muslims... not just shias...

but slowly we sunnis have been moved away from shias through a slow poisoning of wahabism.
I have mixed family members from both sects so I have seen it all how it went over time. the killing started in the name of protecting the honor of Sahaba r.a but it was later clear that in the eyes of takfiris the definition narrowed down to only those individuals who brought civil war upon Muslims and were directly involved in the killing of Muhammad PBUH's family. now organisations like ISIS and Al Qaeda deem it important to desecrate and destroy the tombs of the Muhmammad PBUH's family in the name of restoring honor.



re the quote you highlighted... well you cant engage in a logical debate with someone who bases his argument on theological and sectarian prejudice.

this 3rd point is universally agreed upon all takfiris who justify the killing of shia sect. currently they are busy killing everyone who is not Muslim enough for them so rest of the Sunnis are collateral for them and shia are deliberate targets. so expecting them to accommodate a shia caliph is impossible.

finally I dare to comment that petro dollar funding of global Jihad has pretty much finished the Islam.. what we have is a bunch of few sects some are very strong and some are weak and the strong ones are cannibalizing the weaker sects.

now something controversial
those that are converting to "Islam " in the west are mostly for wrong reasons.. they re attracted to its violence appeal. take nation of Islam and some Black gangs of the America who have converted who think its cool.

now the obvious question
which sect is "right"? well it depends who you ask..


oh come on thats not fair
let me catch you this way, can we play process of elimination? how about we decide that who is the wrse sect? so its the whabis right? because everyone is saying that and majority of "Muslims" and "everyone" in the world says it wahabis?

well.. erm NO

What? why?

well, just because "everyone" says wahabis are douche bags doesnt make them douche bags... such opinions are not decided by voting.. majority of people also said the earth was flat.. its the actions of people that count. the cult with different names that shares the same takfiri ideology across the globe and has been killing in the name of Islam is the worse one. (takfiri is a term used for those who claim to be Muslims and declare everyone else a kafir if he or she doesnt agree with them and doesnt fall in their criteria.. )

 

[punit]

after the first four Caliphs or Khaliphas... Muslims descended into a civil war .. the name was adapted for convenience otherwise they were no different to a Sultan, Maharaja, warchief, or Caesar

regarding the murder of the Prophet Muhammad PBUH, the Sunni population as a whole in pakistan has been targeted by the wahabis into distancing it from the Ahl Bait. and the event of Karbala is played down or even mocked by few who consider themselves to be enlightened and moderate sunnis. the founder of the leading Sectarian outfit held an open gathering and gave a speech where he openly praised Yazid and justified the murder of Imam Hussain and his family and termed them traitors of Islam... thats back in the 80s when halal dollars had started to have extra effect which was hidden in the small writing of the Afghan Jihad.

before this open hatred and shia targeting, sunni participation in the Moharam days of mourning was a norm and no big deal Sunnis attended gatherings (majalis) and offered food and drinks to the mourners although didnt engage in chest beating but avoided laughter and music out of respect.because as we knew it... Hussain and Ali were for all Muslims... not just shias...

but slowly we sunnis have been moved away from shias through a slow poisoning of wahabism.
I have mixed family members from both sects so I have seen it all how it went over time. the killing started in the name of protecting the honor of Sahaba r.a but it was later clear that in the eyes of takfiris the definition narrowed down to only those individuals who brought civil war upon Muslims and were directly involved in the killing of Muhammad PBUH's family. now organisations like ISIS and Al Qaeda deem it important to desecrate and destroy the tombs of the Muhmammad PBUH's family in the name of restoring honor.



re the quote you highlighted... well you cant engage in a logical debate with someone who bases his argument on theological and sectarian prejudice.

this 3rd point is universally agreed upon all takfiris who justify the killing of shia sect. currently they are busy killing everyone who is not Muslim enough for them so rest of the Sunnis are collateral for them and shia are deliberate targets. so expecting them to accommodate a shia caliph is impossible.

finally I dare to comment that petro dollar funding of global Jihad has pretty much finished the Islam.. what we have is a bunch of few sects some are very strong and some are weak and the strong ones are cannibalizing the weaker sects.

now something controversial
those that are converting to "Islam " in the west are mostly for wrong reasons.. they re attracted to its violence appeal. take nation of Islam and some Black gangs of the America who have converted who think its cool.

now the obvious question
which sect is "right"? well it depends who you ask..


oh come on thats not fair
let me catch you this way, can we play process of elimination? how about we decide that who is the wrse sect? so its the whabis right? because everyone is saying that and majority of "Muslims" and "everyone" in the world says it wahabis?

well.. erm NO

What? why?

well, just because "everyone" says wahabis are douche bags doesnt make them douche bags... such opinions are not decided by voting.. majority of people also said the earth was flat.. its the actions of people that count. the cult with different names that shares the same takfiri ideology across the globe and has been killing in the name of Islam is the worse one. (takfiri is a term used for those who claim to be Muslims and declare everyone else a kafir if he or she doesnt agree with them and doesnt fall in their criteria.. )

thanks for the detailed response. In india specially in Bihar both shias and sunni participate in muharram .. albeit in their own ways. the matam used to be more extreme in shias with blood and knife. while sunnis were more moderate in this regard. Even we used to participate, distributing sorbets, water and running with our mock swords to enact the battle of karbala. Now away from my village since last 10 years i miss those days.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

thanks for the detailed response. In india specially in Bihar both shias and sunni participate in muharram .. albeit in their own ways. the matam used to be more extreme in shias with blood and knife. while sunnis were more moderate in this regard. Even we used to participate, distributing sorbets, water and running with our mock swords to enact the battle of karbala. Now away from my village since last 10 years i miss those days.

According to Dr Shahid Masood (one current affairs program expert) India has the biggest Shia population of about 50 million.and that depresses the whabi death squads that they cant touch them since India is an infidel country and it wont give them a free hand they are used to from Africa to Middle east and Afghanistan and Pakistan and even far east where those sunnis who made the mistake of converting to shia were burnt alive.

 

[R2D2]

A beautiful view of Sultan Ahmet Mosque .. Moon on the mosque

Ottoman Caliphate Flag and State Flag

 

[R2D2]

OTTOMAN JERUSALEM, RAILWAY, PALESTINE, 1875

Gallipoli War 1915

 

[R2D2]

Gallipoli War modern song

 

[Contrarian]

Sounds like apartheid.



How will the business pay back the banks and how would banks make a 'profit' since the profit is not haram?



So 20% of Pakistan's population would not be represented, alienated, possibally declared Murtid and persecuted leading to an Iraq like situation (reverse the sect in this case), wouldn't that create the 'infighting' you are so scared about by having a Shia Caliph ?



HuT is a terrorist organization, its the Muslim version of Vishwa Hindu Parishad.
So is your Khilafa going to allow women heads of state or they will live as 3rd class citizens?



Would it include public executions, amputations, chopping heads off, charging extra taxes to non Muslims ?

The way your Khilafa sounds to me is as if though you want to divide the society from being equal to a segregated class system that is entrenched in your religious belief. We have seen this system already, its called the Hindu Caste System.

The way i read it is that your system is going to create a class as follows.

1st grade Citizens | Wahabi/Salafi/Deobandi Muslims, fresh out of a Jamia Banoria running all affairs, just like Brahmins.
2nd grade Citizens | Sunnis, Baravelis and other Sufi derivation who otherwise are in a majority.
3rd grade Citizens | Sunni women
4th grade Citizens | Shias, Ismailis, Bohras and other denominations.
5th grade Citizens | Non Muslims, like the Christians, Sikhs, Hindus etc

The way it sounds to me is that your Khilafa is going to take us back to the Hindu Caste System which made us reject Hinduism to begin with to adopt Islam as it promised 'Musawat' (Equality) rather than 5 or even more classes of citizens your system is going to bring.

@AgNoStiC MuSliM | @Hyperion | @Armstrong FYI

Why not.
Since you keep mentioning the caste system..

Just to let you know the oppressive caste system that has been prevalent in India is a distorted and vulgar corruption of the Varna system.

The Brahmins slowly kept manipulating it over decades and centuries to become the masters of everyone in Hinduism and oppress others.

The same corruption of Islam is also happening now - in exactly the way you pointed out of 1,2,3rd grade citizens.

 

[Kompromat]

@Contrarian l I don't think that the caste system was originally part of Hinduism. Someone screwed it up, just like these takfiri Islamofascists are doing yo us.

 

[Contrarian]

@Contrarian l I don't think that the caste system was originally part of Hinduism. Someone screwed it up, just like these takfiri Islamofascists are doing yo us.

I am surprised that you know that.
There is a debate. Some think it is, others don't, since its not part of the Vedas but written later by Manu.

But even what was written originally by Manu was the Varna system. It was not the caste system. And it was not oppressive, neither is it the heinous system of ''class by birth'' like the caste system is.

So for those who think that Varna system is not an original part of Hinduism, the Caste System is the - Distortion of a distortion.
For those who think that the Varna system is a part of Hinduism - Caste System is the first distortion.

The caste system is a creation of the Brahmins to usurp absolute power and dehumanize a segment of the population. Creation of a social order that keeps them in power for centuries and centuries and centuries together.

 

[Dubious]

By that logic is allright to impose "Jizya Type" taxes to muslims living in Non-Muslim Countries. Would you stand by that?

Jizya is tax....Apparently you didnt read the post!

 

[Kompromat]

@Contrarian l I've been reading Hindu texts for quite a while, just like i read the Torah, the Bible even the Book of Mormon.

Biggest give away of these Islamofascist, pseudo Islamic thugs is that they will ALWAYS refer to the Books of Ahadi'th, which were compiled much after the Prophet PBUH had passed.

Quran was revealed completely in 23 years and is the only authentic source of law. If Sharia is sourced from the Quran instead of the Ahadith, it would look much like modern democracy. Islamofascists take Ahadith as the main source of Sharia as it allows them the grey areas to establish the tyranny they so desire.

7 days before His passing the Prophet PBUH, stated 'Today your system/way of life has been completed and so has Allah's blessings been bestowed completely'.

No book of Hadith existed at that time. Islamofascists can go and smoke bong as their apartheid can simply be rejected for the source of their lawd wasn't ratified by the Prophet PBUH, which makes it non binding!

The first constitution of the Islamic state was written based on the Quran not the Ahadith.

@Hyperion @Armstrong

 

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Topkapi palace

The first attack on Islam is attack on personality of Prophet PBUH and Hadith. It is a well known fact. At the second stage they attack the Quran. The body of Hadith is well preserved and authentic. Khilafah is ijmah of Sahabah R.A and Ulema as well as Muslims for 1300 years.

Ottoman soldiers

Coins of Islambol .. during the period of Sultan Mustafa III