JF-17B Updates, News & Discussion

[Tank131]

Hi so basically we also need B version for your own trainee so how many
We need for the training any memeber can give some info
Thank you

Pakistan now has over 100 JF-17 in service and has not needed a two seat model to train its pilots. It uses simulators and is fully emersed in that training environment. It is not likley to change that. What the role of the JF-17B will be in PAF is more likely as a strike platform and marketing platform (take up various chiefs whose services may be considering the type). Other services like Nigerian AF may be more likely to get it if they dont want, ir are unable, to fully invest into the simulator environment. But simulator training is noted to be equally effective and is far far cheaper and safer

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Why do folks consider a 2 seater as a strike platform?
You can still strike eney with 1 seater

 

[The-Hack]

how can you convert blk-2 in trainer version which is single seater bro think logically @The Hack

You are right sir, i said this in a different context
Block 2's specification and JFTB's are same except later has twin seat @pakistanipower

Hi,

Why in God's name---would you want your fighter / strike aircraft to be named a trainer---.

Is the 2 seater F16 a trainer---or a 2 seater F15 a trainer---?

What kind of stupidity is this---. Instead of rating the aircraft higher---you want to bring its ratings down---.

Are you kids getting lessons from home or school to act less intelligent---.

I already explain my reply in post #43
with due respect sir

 

[rizhussain44]

Do we know when the first deliveries will be made to Myanmar and Nigeria?

 

[The-Hack]

Do we know when the first deliveries will be made to Myanmar and Nigeria?

Maybe in last quarter of this year, Nigeria already allocated budget for three aircraft......

 

[Maarkhoor]

Dosra Teja Bahi ko diya hai,un ko urna sikhaye ga,kab tuk truck ke sawari karein gai

Teja Seth aka Kachra seth? you mean

Do we know when the first deliveries will be made to Myanmar and Nigeria?

Myanmer jets are ready (first batch).

 

[PakEye]

https://twitter.com/x/status/969876576337891329

On side note, It will be flying infornt of Public on 23rd March!

slightly different in shape of JF-17 Block-I and Block-II

 

[denel]

Pakistan now has over 100 JF-17 in service and has not needed a two seat model to train its pilots. It uses simulators and is fully emersed in that training environment. It is not likley to change that. What the role of the JF-17B will be in PAF is more likely as a strike platform and marketing platform (take up various chiefs whose services may be considering the type). Other services like Nigerian AF may be more likely to get it if they dont want, ir are unable, to fully invest into the simulator environment. But simulator training is noted to be equally effective and is far far cheaper and safer

Simulation can only do so much; you need to have a flying training aircraft; my guess there will be around 12-30+ B's if not more for both deep strike/training. This is a new line; lot of opportunities ahead in terms of roles/development.

 

[deep_blue]

Because if you make enough variants, you might as well
give each plane a name of its own? I'll call mine Julie ...

Seriously, here are examples of those letters in use :

Rafale :

• B / Biplace or two-seater
• C / Chasseur or fighter
• M / Marine or Navy/Naval

F-16-18 :

• A / B Single and dual seaters original build.
• C / D Single and dual seaters 2nd gen. build.
• AM / BM European MLU, old cell w. new build avionics again in Single seater and dual.
• E / F Single and dual seaters, 3rd / latest build.
• CJ / I / N etc are one-off variants - Israel, SEAD/DEAD and Naval adversary respectively.

Note that the non-combat N had the T/F-16 designation for Twin seaters.​

Now a look at the F-18 to draw our lesson's points :

First, notice the other lettering change - F/A-18 indicating a swing-role fighter/attack Ac.
Then, that it covers two different planes with the SuperHornet being a 25% bigger redesign.

• F/A-18 A / B as above.
• F/A-18 C / D as above.
• F/A-18 E / F / G : New Aircraft, same names as above plus the EW variant Growler.

If you compare with the Thunder, it goes A / B as we're all saying . . .
unless you want to go Biplace and Single place but it will confuse
potential export buyers if the brochure reads JF-17 B/S ? ... so .

Added to letters are also numbers as in F-16 Blocks. These are just
production standards by another name. Different standards can be
ported to different builds but not always nor always entirely. Raffys
have had many standards : LF1, F1, F2.1, F2.2, F3.1 .2 .3 to F3.4
in use now and F3-R later this year then F4.1 and the first standard
F4.2 that will constitute according to previsions a different build. You
can further check the blocks by orders of ten in the F-16 as in Block
10 20 30 etc up to 60 on the EF and also each has a variant with 2
added block 10/12 save Block 60 because it represents the buyer's
choice of motorization with either a GE or P&W engine respectively.

I'm guessing that by now you're as unhappy with this numerical soup
as you are with alphabet one but these designations pack a whole lot
of informations in short hand for those who learn them?

In any case, you know of the Thunder Blocks I, II and III ... that are
actually part build part blocks but nevermin' and that it's only been
in service for 7 years and already found an export client. Compare
that to the 1980 service entry date of the F-16, the second most sold
fighter ever after MiG-21 and most used nowadays, and one can very
rightfully wonder how many blocks and variants may be needed.

At the risk of utterly infuriating you, I vote for more numbers and heck
enough letters to justify switching to Chinese characters!

Still, have a great day, Tay.

Thanx for such a nice and informative post.
You deserve a positive rating.

 

[Lil Mathew]

Dosra Teja Bahi ko diya hai,un ko urna sikhaye ga,kab tuk truck ke sawari karein gai

Teja bhai already achieved these steps long before in 2009...
Two seater (Trainer) version of Tejas (PV-5) made its maiden flight on 26 Nov 2009.

LCA Tejas PV-6 (Prototype Vehicle 6), a final configuration two-seater trainer aircraft, successfully completed its maiden flight at the HAL Airport in Bengaluru.. 08 Nov 2014...

 

[MastanKhan]

Simulation can only do so much; you need to have a flying training aircraft; my guess there will be around 12-30+ B's if not more for both deep strike/training. This is a new line; lot of opportunities ahead in terms of roles/development.

Hi,

That is what the initial assumption of the Paf was for foreign buyers---.

They were selling them simulator training for the JF17---. The outright refusal came as a surprise.

Plus---Paf had not done its homework right---. It pulled all its tier 1 pilots from the F16's and put them on the JF17 for the 1st 50 aircraft---.

So---was there a shortage of tier 1 pilots---Paf won't admit to it---but I am pretty sure that there was and possibly is---.

 

[denel]

Hi,

That is what the initial assumption of the Paf was for foreign buyers---.

They were selling them simulator training for the JF17---. The outright refusal came as a surprise.

Plus---Paf had not done its homework right---. It pulled all its tier 1 pilots from the F16's and put them on the JF17 for the 1st 50 aircraft---.

So---was there a shortage of tier 1 pilots---Paf won't admit to it---but I am pretty sure that there was and possibly is---.

As usual they never do their homework; the issue is the R&D and Functional design teams need to be seperate; this is classic issue when people from armed forces are made to run projects. In our cases, it was always a strict seperation.

 

[MastanKhan]

As usual they never do their homework; the issue is the R&D and Functional design teams need to be seperate; this is classic issue when people from armed forces are made to run projects. In our cases, it was always a strict seperation.

Hi,

Arrogance runs deep in the Paf ranks. They simply want to keep all the sales jobs and money inside of their circle---.

Their thinking was that if you were not a part of the Paf fighter pilot mafia / heirarchy---you had no place in the group---.

A closed knit group keeps all the bad decisions and mistakes hidden and that is what the Paf has been able to do---.

How they can get away with it---? Because on the average---educated pakistanis are illiterate about major weapons and weapons systems---.

 

[denel]

Hi,

Arrogance runs deep in the Paf ranks. They simply want to keep all the sales jobs and money inside of their circle---.

Their thinking was that if you were not a part of the Paf fighter pilot mafia / heirarchy---you had no place in the group---.

A closed knit group keeps all the bad decisions and mistakes hidden and that is what the Paf has been able to do---.

How they can get away with it---? Because on the average---educated pakistanis are illiterate about major weapons and weapons systems---.

Noted, a very very different approach and arrogance gets one nowhere. We have distinct R&D groups each one competing with out of box solutions working in silos. Noone from armed forces is allowed to part take in any design work except just to provide requirements and testing. They are end users and should not influence product design; if you do that you lose the edge.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Here is a direct quote from ACM Sohail Aman from an interview in 2015 ... "I began looking at a LIFT, but the difficulty is many like the KAI T-50 and Hongdu L-15, with their afterburners, are like fighters, and will cost around the same as an F-16. We cannot afford that now. We're concentrating on modifying the training so people can safely convert from the F-7P and Mirages to the new platforms. Anyways, when we get our dual-seat JF-17s, several of these issues will the resolved."

I think it is pretty clear from his statement that PAF will be using the JF-17Bs for conversion training.