JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[ACE OF THE AIR]

1-2 years ago AVIC officials told Alan Warnes that it was unlikely that China and Italy/UK would work together in pairing the SD-10 to the Vixen. So you either go all in with China, go all in with Western COTS, or make your own stuff and be trusted by outside partners to keep their stuff (e.g., source codes) under wraps.

Sir,
With due respect over the years spoken to many PAF officials regarding what exactly are the JF-17's going to replace and how many would Pakistan be procuring for her own needs, no one was sure about this.

The best answer was PAF would not procure more than 150 JF-17's as we will also be procuring 50-75 F-16's new and old.

Today with the doors closed for F-16's were does PAF stands?

In my opinion there are mainly three (3) probabilities:
1) ADD more JF-17's.
2) Procure J-10
3) Any European fighter aircraft.

OPTION 1) JF-17.
Adding 150 JF-17's block 3 along with new production facility with a Western package + 100 JF-17 block 3 with Chinese package.
This would make PAF rely too much on JF-17...But the bright side would be PAF will no longer remain 60/40 partner but 90/10 partner.

OPTION 2) J-10
Procure 150 J-10 with Chinese package + Upgrade JF-17 with Western package + F-16s.
This will be a force multiplier however the source of aircraft would still remain Chinese.

OPTION 3) EUROFIGHTER TYPHOON
Procure 70-110 EFT of various tranche and JF-17s can be upgraded by Chinese package.

 

[HRK]

I think link 16 and 17 are connected via saab 2000 ... saab 2000 job is to connect both networks on real time basis ...

can't say with surety but as per some reports ground facilities are used to infuse the DATA form both link-16 and link-17 as one, and re transmit. I believe Oscar might be better person to comment about this

 

[Tempest II]

Sir,
With due respect over the years spoken to many PAF officials regarding what exactly are the JF-17's going to replace and how many would Pakistan be procuring for her own needs, no one was sure about this.

The best answer was PAF would not procure more than 150 JF-17's as we will also be procuring 50-75 F-16's new and old.

Today with the doors closed for F-16's were does PAF stands?

In my opinion there are mainly three (3) probabilities:
1) ADD more JF-17's.
2) Procure J-10
3) Any European fighter aircraft.

OPTION 1) JF-17.
Adding 150 JF-17's block 3 along with new production facility with a Western package + 100 JF-17 block 3 with Chinese package.
This would make PAF rely too much on JF-17...But the bright side would be PAF will no longer remain 60/40 partner but 90/10 partner.

OPTION 2) J-10
Procure 150 J-10 with Chinese package + Upgrade JF-17 with Western package + F-16s.
This will be a force multiplier however the source of aircraft would still remain Chinese.

OPTION 3) EUROFIGHTER TYPHOON
Procure 70-110 EFT of various tranche and JF-17s can be upgraded by Chinese package.

Slim prospects for the J-10.

 

[denel]

Reported. You are a sick man for posting such a writing. I would respond but you are not worth the writing. Let the moderators sort you out. Of all you sitting in Canada putting such garbage is just amazing.

Don't you see what happened when we released asia bibi even based on justice ...

Our nation's overwhelming majority don't want it ... We as a nation hate Israel and unless you want a full chaos and civil unrest in the country and want us to destroy ourselves recognition of Israel is a no go area ...

Its in our nation's DNA ... Even Arab don't hate Israel that much as we Pakistani do ...


I don't remember the exact name but a senior member shared this on this very forum ... However, I will check this with a friend as well ...

Agh.... man, that is the problem when you have mullah mobs running the show. If you go ahead and recognise no harm; they will shout and do what ever, but for how long.

Hate only breed hate that is reality.

 

[The Accountant]

Reported. You are a sick man for posting such a writing. I would respond but you are not worth the writing. Let the moderators sort you out. Of all you sitting in Canada putting such garbage is just amazing.


Agh.... man, that is the problem when you have mullah mobs running the show. If you go ahead and recognise no harm; they will shout and do what ever, but for how long.

Hate only breed hate that is reality.

This is not about Mullah ,,, I really hate Mullahs and event like Asia bib's issue ...

this is about sentiments of general public. I am not Mullah but I consider Israel occupation to be completely illegal and is against all the standards of human rights. So why should we accept an illegal act , just because they can provide us some weapons or they can stop lobbying against us in USA?

My common people are on a principle stand and I proud to be part of such a nation ...

We have lot of problems but here we are struggling for the right cause ... we are paying for it but thats what gentleman's do ... Side with the truth no matter the consequences are

 

[salman-1]

Sir,
With due respect over the years spoken to many PAF officials regarding what exactly are the JF-17's going to replace and how many would Pakistan be procuring for her own needs, no one was sure about this.

The best answer was PAF would not procure more than 150 JF-17's as we will also be procuring 50-75 F-16's new and old.

Today with the doors closed for F-16's were does PAF stands?

In my opinion there are mainly three (3) probabilities:
1) ADD more JF-17's.
2) Procure J-10
3) Any European fighter aircraft.

OPTION 1) JF-17.
Adding 150 JF-17's block 3 along with new production facility with a Western package + 100 JF-17 block 3 with Chinese package.
This would make PAF rely too much on JF-17...But the bright side would be PAF will no longer remain 60/40 partner but 90/10 partner.

OPTION 2) J-10
Procure 150 J-10 with Chinese package + Upgrade JF-17 with Western package + F-16s.
This will be a force multiplier however the source of aircraft would still remain Chinese.

OPTION 3) EUROFIGHTER TYPHOON
Procure 70-110 EFT of various tranche and JF-17s can be upgraded by Chinese package.

About the jf-17-thunder it is the work horse now. And who says Paf doesn't want more than 150. Paf has plans for 250 to 275. We already have 114 by the end of this year. Total 126 plus 4 dual seater are planned and afterwards 100 plus blk 3.
Now already in books for upgrading both blocks with Aesa radar. It's a new jewel in the crown. An Mlu of Jf17. Regards.

 

[denel]

This is not about Mullah ,,, I really hate Mullahs and event like Asia bib's issue ...

this is about sentiments of general public. I am not Mullah but I consider Israel occupation to be completely illegal and is against all the standards of human rights. So why should we accept an illegal act , just because they can provide us some weapons or they can stop lobbying against us in USA?

My common people are on a principle stand and I proud to be part of such a nation ...

We have lot of problems but here we are struggling for the right cause ... we are paying for it but thats what gentleman's do ... Side with the truth no matter the consequences are

Yes i concur, the occupation is illegal. unfortunately i dont see the arabs united at resolving. I personally feel that independence needs to be granted; the ultra-orthodox fueled by the evanlegists in US are driving the narrative to take occupation to a permanent status ... unfortunately that is lobbied right from US. Unless you can make the change there and unless there is engagement with the Isreali mindset they are not undersiege; things wont change.

 

[punit]

Everything is available with money.

PAF feels that AMRAAM, VIXEN, JHMCS, Darter combo is a good set of capabilities against Sukhois & Rafales.

So much so for super advance chinese weapons and avionics which will make rafale obsolate on arrival.

 

[The Accountant]

Yes i concur, the occupation is illegal. unfortunately i dont see the arabs united at resolving. I personally feel that independence needs to be granted; the ultra-orthodox fueled by the evanlegists in US are driving the narrative to take occupation to a permanent status ... unfortunately that is lobbied right from US. Unless you can make the change there and unless there is engagement with the Isreali mindset they are not undersiege; things wont change.

Actually arabs has lost their way ... leaders of arab countries are going to recognize israel very soon ...

Actually all this has a religious background as well ... all three monothesit religions were foretold about the great war to be started in middle east with israel being the center of power ...

Anyways everyone has it set of belief but above all is importance of human life ... people of palestine are sufferring badly ... they deserve a better life ...

So much so for super advance chinese weapons and avionics which will make rafale obsolate on arrival.

Not obsolete but if thunder will be able to take on rafael on its own that rafael will not remain the decisive factor ... so achieving this with fractional cost is awsome on part of Pakistan ... accept it or not ... a fighter aircraft as low as 40 million a piece can take on rafael and flanker is a nightmare for you guys ... lower cost we can reduce numeric superiority ...

 

[punit]

Actually arabs has lost their way ... leaders of arab countries are going to recognize israel very soon ...

Actually all this has a religious background as well ... all three monothesit religions were foretold about the great war to be started in middle east with israel being the center of power ...

Anyways everyone has it set of belief but above all is importance of human life ... people of palestine are sufferring badly ... they deserve a better life ...


Not obsolete but if thunder will be able to take on rafael on its own that rafael will not remain the decisive factor ... so achieving this with fractional cost is awsome on part of Pakistan ... accept it or not ... a fighter aircraft as low as 40 million a piece can take on rafael and flanker is a nightmare for you guys ... lower cost we can reduce numeric superiority ...

Tell that to TT who had declared Rafale DOA.

 

[Dazzler]

Tell that to TT who had declared Rafale DOA.

What edge will Rafale enjoy against an aesa equipped fighter?

 

[Mrc]

What edge will Rafale enjoy against an aesa equipped fighter?

Nil





Q

 

[denel]

Actually arabs has lost their way ... leaders of arab countries are going to recognize israel very soon ...

Actually all this has a religious background as well ... all three monothesit religions were foretold about the great war to be started in middle east with israel being the center of power ...

Anyways everyone has it set of belief but above all is importance of human life ... people of palestine are sufferring badly ... they deserve a better life ...


Not obsolete but if thunder will be able to take on rafael on its own that rafael will not remain the decisive factor ... so achieving this with fractional cost is awsome on part of Pakistan ... accept it or not ... a fighter aircraft as low as 40 million a piece can take on rafael and flanker is a nightmare for you guys ... lower cost we can reduce numeric superiority ...

absolutely.... i saw how bad it was here. i lived thru aparthied and it was still not as bad as what palestinans have been enduring.

 

[Dazzler]

All,

The thread should have pertinent discussion please.

Thanks

So much so for super advance chinese weapons and avionics which will make rafale obsolate on arrival.

And where does that post suggest that the existing capability falls short? Man, get real and present your argument instead of hiding behind cheap oneliners.

 

[CriticalThought]

What edge will Rafale enjoy against an aesa equipped fighter?

SPECTRA remains a question mark. We don't know what kind of radar will be on the Indian Rafales. If they get an LPI radar, that would be a problem. AESA itself is not a magic solution. It is the software behind AESA. And that software is developed through thousands of man hours worth of painstaking research. It is the quality of that software that determines jamming resistance. Ghosts can be introduced even to an AESA radar. Is the software intelligent enough to discern ghosts? Which leads to the question, how good are the capabilities of the radar on the Rafale? These questions can only be answered if you hold an exercise with a friendly airforce and use ELINT assets to analyze the signals from the Rafale.