JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 5]

[Munir]

Hi,

Miyanmar would have the same restrictions from pakistan & china that pakistan has on the F 16 from the U S. So--that should not be a worry. If they go for the JF 17---then they have made a very smart choice---.

Myanmar has high costs due to serviceability and maintenance of mig29. Besides that it has some older second generation planes like A5 and F7M. If you look at the options (and they really have to modernize due to neighbors) then there is a wish for affordable multi role light weight fighter with low operational costs. And adding to that they really cannot afford strings or boycotts. So with this in mind you do not have unlimited choices. Dual engines are expensive. Russians need lots of maintenance and the upgrade is PITA. So you end up with a plug and play fighterjet that can be produced inhouse: JF17. They already have experience with the RD33. If you buy 75-150 you can replace pretty much the entire frontline fleet for a decent price and have something that has long future ahead with EASA, new BVR, smart weapons already integrated (Ra'ad, MAR, hypersonic ASM, SD10, LGB, etc etc)

We know loiter time is seen by some as an issue. Do check travel range of JF17 and you know it is fine. With IFR you get better range. More then you would wish for a decent light weight fighter.

 

[FunkyGen]

Sirs,
Vcheng is not a troll---he is just calling a spade a spade---. JF 17 is a great aircraft---an outstanding aircrft in its class. But it is not what pakistan needs----please understand---I didnot say paf---but pakistan. Pakistan needed a right in your face kind of air craft to give out message----which this aircraft does not deliver.
Plus the biggest loss the nation has suffered is about 10 to 15 yers of falling behind in equipment.
anyone wants to talk about having no cash---why don't you people not want to talk about making unconditional peace with india then.

Would you like to specify about the "right in your face kind" kind, because as far as i know JF can
take out aircraft carriers, (Indian one.... yeah!)
can fire BVR missiles (i said fire), fear factor
is inter linkable, AWACS
has helped our aviation industry a lot (it's based ON IT)
I believe your majesty wants Pakistan with space ships and light sabers....? (all in due time i guess)
What Pakistan needed and now has is the capability to manufacture on it's own an aircraft which cannot be sanctioned. The lost decade WAS BENEFICIAL for Pakistan as it told us to move our lazy bums since we are a nuclear power + a rougue state (as per the world).....
Due to our standing on Kashmir and nuclear issue and a hostile neighbour it is advisable that we start manufacturing our key defence systems along with better economy and stuff.

 

[Manticore]

He means a western double engined weapons truck which doesnt need awacs/refuelers support to hit deep inside india
The question for a different thread is if we need this western fighter from a reputable vendor or skip the 4.5 gen and go for chinese 5th gen unproven fighter.
Having only single engined fighters is one 'cost effective deficiency' but can we afford a complete 'in your face' generation disparity with india when pakfa is inducted?

 

[Manticore]

 

[TeesraIndiotHunter]

There is nothing subliminal in what I have said. The numbers do not lie:

The empty weight of a JF-17 is about 14,500 lbs, and it can carry a payload of about 6500 lbs.

The empty weight of a JAS-39 is similar at about 14,500, but it can carry a payload of about 11,500 lbs.

Building an airframe that is light and yet strong requires not only good design, but contemporary construction techniques. The JF-17 is a blast from the past. But it does work very well for PAF, as I have said all along.

The payload of JF-17 Thunder is 8,000lbs+ or 4000kg+

This comes from the official presentation at international airshows.

Hopefully, later blocks of JF-17 would be medium-weight fighter jets with more payload and increased range...

 

[MastanKhan]

Would you like to specify about the "right in your face kind" kind, because as far as i know JF can
take out aircraft carriers, (Indian one.... yeah!)
can fire BVR missiles (i said fire), fear factor
is inter linkable, AWACS
has helped our aviation industry a lot (it's based ON IT)
I believe your majesty wants Pakistan with space ships and light sabers....? (all in due time i guess)
What Pakistan needed and now has is the capability to manufacture on it's own an aircraft which cannot be sanctioned. The lost decade WAS BENEFICIAL for Pakistan as it told us to move our lazy bums since we are a nuclear power + a rougue state (as per the world).....
Due to our standing on Kashmir and nuclear issue and a hostile neighbour it is advisable that we start manufacturing our key defence systems along with better economy and stuff.

Hi,

Some of your aircraft have to be able to take on the opponents frontline aircraft one on one and come out ahead.

The enemy needs to be concerned about some of your fighters---.

I always wondered Why Jf17 varies less internal fuel despite being slightly longer then Gripen? and why JF17 has shorter range despite having a smaller (less consumption) engine? are we sure the released stats about internal fuel quantity and range are not conservative?

Promise less---deliver more---.

 

[viper2020]

Would 20-30 J-10's perhaps be "in your face" enough and does anyone know if we are getting any?

"In July 2011, Daily Jang reported that China will give a squadron of the advanced J-10B fighter aircraft to Pakistan. According to the report,"the offer was made by senior Chinese military leaders to visiting Pakistan Army's Chief of General Staff, Lt Gen Waheed Arshad".In March 2012, talks were held between the two countries to discuss the delivery of latest J-10B fighter jets to Pakistan"

Some of our past performances:

"Between May 1986 and November of 1988, PAF F-16s have shot down at least eight intruders from Afghanistan. The first three of these (one Su-22, one probable Su-22, and one An-26) were shot down by two pilots from No. 9 Squadron. Pilots of No. 14 Squadron destroyed the remaining five intruders (two Su-22s, two MiG-23s, and one Su-25). Most of these kills were by the AIM-9 Sidewinder, but at least one (a Su-22) was destroyed by cannon fire. Flight Lieutenant Khalid Mamood is credited with three of these kills. At least one F-16 was lost in these battles, this one in an encounter between two F-16s and six Afghan Air Force aircraft on April 29th, 1987."

 

[FunkyGen]

Hi,
Some of your aircraft have to be able to take on the opponents frontline aircraft one on one and come out ahead.
The enemy needs to be concerned about some of your fighters---.

I see your American side has taken over you. My point however is just that even blk 1 JF 17 would've served the purpose (i.e. the fear factor) with the blk 2 we are gaining the required momentum, with blk 3 we will severely challenge our enemy, (all of this without the consideration of sales, if exports happen then we're talking about quantum leaps in the project with certain customers).....
As far as American equipment goes, geo politics suggest that currently we can milk both the US and the bear at the same time and get away with it, better to do it.

Promise less---deliver more---.

Exactly, no bogus talks, all in due time...

Would 20-30 J-10's perhaps be "in your face" enough and does anyone know if we are getting any?

"In July 2011, Daily Jang reported that China will give a squadron of the advanced J-10B fighter aircraft to Pakistan. According to the report,"the offer was made by senior Chinese military leaders to visiting Pakistan Army's Chief of General Staff, Lt Gen Waheed Arshad".In March 2012, talks were held between the two countries to discuss the delivery of latest J-10B fighter jets to Pakistan"

Some of our past performances:

"Between May 1986 and November of 1988, PAF F-16s have shot down at least eight intruders from Afghanistan. The first three of these (one Su-22, one probable Su-22, and one An-26) were shot down by two pilots from No. 9 Squadron. Pilots of No. 14 Squadron destroyed the remaining five intruders (two Su-22s, two MiG-23s, and one Su-25). Most of these kills were by the AIM-9 Sidewinder, but at least one (a Su-22) was destroyed by cannon fire. Flight Lieutenant Khalid Mamood is credited with three of these kills. At least one F-16 was lost in these battles, this one in an encounter between two F-16s and six Afghan Air Force aircraft on April 29th, 1987."

J-10 has been delayed due to some apparent reasons... you can browse the previous pages for the info.

 

[Indus Falcon]

Post in today Defense Industry Daily:

Pakistan & China’s JF-17 Fighter Program
Jun 25, 2014 by Defense Industry Daily staff

June 15/14: Myanmar.The government of Myanmar has stepped back from its close Chinese alliance in recent years, but reports indicate that they may be taking a second look at the JF-17. The junta recently bought more Russian MiG-29s instead (q.v. Dec 23/09), but MiG-29s are notoriously difficult to keep in service. The problem is a combination of short part lifespans, and byzantine Russian “service” procedures.

“The Government of Myanmar is planning to acquire technologies from China and Pakistan to build JF-17 multirole combat aircraft at its own aircraft factory to boost its Air Force…. The force is plagued by serviceability issues due to lack of spare parts and trained manpower however introduction of JF-17 would mean that Myanmar Air Force will be investing in such areas to mitigate its short comings.”

Production may be a stretch, but parts production and a local servicing depot may be doable. The report offers an existing force breakdown of 32 MiG-29B/SE as the modern force, plus 25 F-7Ms (Chinese MiG-21 knockoff) and 21 Nanchang A-5C (Chinese plane based on MiG-19 but heavily modified). A mix of 16 Chinese (K-8) and Serbian (Sokol Galeb) jet trainers are used for ground attack roles, as well as pilot training. Sources: Burma Times, “Myanmar plans JF-17 production” | The Diplomat, “Burma to Purchase Chinese-Pakistani JF-17 Fighter Jets”

Pakistan & China’s JF-17 Fighter Program

 

[FunkyGen]

Post in today Defense Industry Daily:

Pakistan & China’s JF-17 Fighter Program
Jun 25, 2014 by Defense Industry Daily staff

June 15/14: Myanmar.The government of Myanmar has stepped back from its close Chinese alliance in recent years, but reports indicate that they may be taking a second look at the JF-17. The junta recently bought more Russian MiG-29s instead (q.v. Dec 23/09), but MiG-29s are notoriously difficult to keep in service. The problem is a combination of short part lifespans, and byzantine Russian “service” procedures.

“The Government of Myanmar is planning to acquire technologies from China and Pakistan to build JF-17 multirole combat aircraft at its own aircraft factory to boost its Air Force…. The force is plagued by serviceability issues due to lack of spare parts and trained manpower however introduction of JF-17 would mean that Myanmar Air Force will be investing in such areas to mitigate its short comings.”

Production may be a stretch, but parts production and a local servicing depot may be doable. The report offers an existing force breakdown of 32 MiG-29B/SE as the modern force, plus 25 F-7Ms (Chinese MiG-21 knockoff) and 21 Nanchang A-5C (Chinese plane based on MiG-19 but heavily modified). A mix of 16 Chinese (K-8) and Serbian (Sokol Galeb) jet trainers are used for ground attack roles, as well as pilot training. Sources: Burma Times, “Myanmar plans JF-17 production” | The Diplomat, “Burma to Purchase Chinese-Pakistani JF-17 Fighter Jets”

Pakistan & China’s JF-17 Fighter Program

Article suggests there are only grim chances.

 

[Indus Falcon]

Article suggests there are only grim chances.

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

 

[FunkyGen]

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

The government of Myanmar has stepped back from its close Chinese alliance in recent years

 

[Indus Falcon]

Your comprehension is a text book case of "how not to comprehend"

Secondly, and most importantly, WHY are they taking a second look at the JF-17?

 

[FunkyGen]

Your comprehension is a text book case of "how not to comprehend"
Secondly, and most importantly, WHY are they taking a second look at the JF-17?

Bro. i'd be just as happy as you would in case of the sale, it was just my opinion yar.... perhaps i shouldn't have expressed it...

 

[nomi007]