Featured JF-17 Emerged As The Star of Swift Retort

[Nomad40]

Feb 27th they found out that
They brought knife to a gun fight
Next time they will bring guns and we shall say
"We got more"
They match our guns our response
" Ours are bigger than yours"
Psychological diarrhea at full swing on these Endian brain's

That is how you will fight the bandars? Psychological warfare is good for suppression but...

 

[PradoTLC]

Let India make another mistake. I don't think Pakistan will let them off the hook this time. It's only a matter of time now.

That the chinese will do...

 

[imadul]

I understand that you are entitled to an opinion and I respect this. However please understand the strategy for PAF is drawn keeping multiple factors in mind. If PAF was led by jingoistic imbeciles then there would be a lot of charred earth where Pakistan and India stand today and most of my and your family would be residing in ether. Modern day wars are mostly about creating the right narrative. In a hostile environment where Modern day India remains the darling of the world, to execute an operation of the nature that we did and not have anyone lift a finger at you(other than sullen recognition of the sublimeness of the whole event managed by the Pak establishment) in criticism is a huge victory. You really need to grasp this concept before you post on the subject.
Kind regards


I meant your previous DP yaar.
A

Thank you for your reply. With high regard for you, I am quiet shocked what you are saying!
Like you, I also look at strategic outcomes and on that front this operation was not even a small tactical victory.
.....so PAF shot down one bison, one SU-30 whuch they dont acknowledge and, one was a friendly fire fixed rotor.
Now what india has gained before and after Feb 27, 2019:
1. India set the pattern to strike Pakistan across IB
2. Officially ceded entire Kashmir. Mind you, IoK is an official Pak occupied territory.
3. Kashmir in lock down and indian brutalities increased manifold.
4. They got their POW back in no time.
5. Increased terror activities in Pakistan. Attack at Karachi PSX is a glaring example, notwithstanding, activities in Karachi, Baluchistan, and FATA.

So Pakistan's Operation Lack Of Resolve has emboldened India, all because whoever were the planners were got cold feet and totally lost in a foggy mind.

If however, PAF had shot down all aireal targets of opportunity, sunk their sub on recon in Pak waters, that would have sunk enemy's morale into bay of Bengal and india wont dare cede Kashmir and locked down Kashmir.
PM IK fighting Kashmir war on tweeter, ISPR just releasing song after song, videos, audios, thus the story of fabled Pakistan Armed Forces ends.

I would like to see if you have any answer to my points.

I have lost my confidence in the courage and ability of the armed forces.

 

[omegalamba7XL9]

That is how you will fight the bandars? Psychological warfare is good for suppression but...

Well that's what they call sort of escalation ladder.
If it was upto me I would've gone for a knockout blow with clear message all around the world capitals. Rather than worrying about them rallying for India. We need to get rid of terms like
Minimum deterrence
minimum damage
Professional courtesy with these Monkeys. This bunch of IA is not the one that should be shown respect at all.
We need to introduce terminologies like
Knockout blow
Detruction of enemy
Total victory
The problem is "hesitation " which is not only through chain of command but also political will and clear objective. We have hesitated and reversed our gains time after time. And whenever we faced pressure and put the paddle down to the floor we have been rewarded with success and results beyond our imagination (west).

Rumors are Nepal shot down Indian jet.
Any verified source??

 

[The Accountant]

Thank you for your reply. With high regard for you, I am quiet shocked what you are saying!
Like you, I also look at strategic outcomes and on that front this operation was not even a small tactical victory.
.....so PAF shot down one bison, one SU-30 whuch they dont acknowledge and, one was a friendly fire fixed rotor.
Now what india has gained before and after Feb 27, 2019:
1. India set the pattern to strike Pakistan across IB
2. Officially ceded entire Kashmir. Mind you, IoK is an official Pak occupied territory.
3. Kashmir in lock down and indian brutalities increased manifold.
4. They got their POW back in no time.
5. Increased terror activities in Pakistan. Attack at Karachi PSX is a glaring example, notwithstanding, activities in Karachi, Baluchistan, and FATA.

So Pakistan's Operation Lack Of Resolve has emboldened India, all because whoever were the planners were got cold feet and totally lost in a foggy mind.

If however, PAF had shot down all aireal targets of opportunity, sunk their sub on recon in Pak waters, that would have sunk enemy's morale into bay of Bengal and india wont dare cede Kashmir and locked down Kashmir.
PM IK fighting Kashmir war on tweeter, ISPR just releasing song after song, videos, audios, thus the story of fabled Pakistan Armed Forces ends.

I would like to see if you have any answer to my points.

I have lost my confidence in the courage and ability of the armed forces.

Yes and next day india would have given us Kashmir. In which worl u r living kid ? This didnt happened even in 1965 when we had air superiroity over indian skies and naval comtrol in indian ocean.

Annexation of kashmir was a legal move planned after getting majority. It has nothing to do with swift retort.

Regarding brutalities in Kashmir , how was the situation before feb 2uth.

So i didnt agree with your analysis at all as it have lots of ifs and buts

 

[SQ8]

Wg Cdr Noman (RIP. Allah Jannat Me Jagah day Aur Darjat Buland Farmye) wasn't in any SR Flight Package.

The young ones and others were “bawling” the day he went down.
As if someone lost their real older brother.

 

[MastanKhan]

those nuclear weapons are the last resort and our insurance policy against Indian aggression where our survival as a state as a nation is at stake.
they are not a weapon of intimidation or bullying. look around you when you go out. close your eyes an imagine the Pakistani cities you visited. they will be reduced to nuclear rubble with charred bodies. those who will survive the initial fallout will die in weeks and months if you survive somehow then be assured that 70 or 80% of people you know will be dead already.
nuclear capability shouldnt even be brought in discussion while arguing our counter against Indian regular diplomatic and border hostilities.

Hi,

What a B S---. There will be no usage of nuc weapons by pakistan. The US will neuter them even before pakistanis start to take action---.

That nuc threat has long evaporated Mr. Baloch---. Trying finding something else to take a stand on---.

The USA has mapped out every location---it is now a matter of when they decide to take them out---.

 

[crankthatskunk]

iska kiya matlub hua? they block ours and we block their communications?

That's where Pakistan has made good progress. I know certain things, I cannot discuss.

 

[YeBeWarned]

Ok the Kill Switchers are here, There goes a wonderful and informative thread down in the gutters of Conspiracy theories

 

[The Accountant]

Hi,

What a B S---. There will be no usage of nuc weapons by pakistan. The US will neuter them even before pakistanis start to take action---.

That nuc threat has long evaporated Mr. Baloch---. Trying finding something else to take a stand on---.

The USA has mapped out every location---it is now a matter of when they decide to take them out---.

Yup. If that was so easy. U r taking about 25 to 30 most guarded places in Pakiatan.

U can woeship USA but your USA got himiliated in Afghanistan and now begging for safe package.

 

[crankthatskunk]

Perhaps because Pakistan RoE and preference is the enemy jet being well enough in our airspace so that the debris of it falls in our territory. The Bison did, the MKI ended up in IoK.
You say you trust PAF, but if you want answers to things, you will have to get a position where you can get answers from PAF. Afterall, there is so much in Pakistan that is withheld from general population.

Great secrecy indeed. They put the plaque of the kills, including SU 30 s at an Airbase.
They are telling the world we had a Su 30s kill.

While I agree that the PAF response was calculated and aimed at sending the message that we will not tolerate any aerial violations and would respond in kind and at the same time managed to not force them into a corner to invoke a response, BUT

After getting two planes shot down and almost every other kind being jammed and locked they realized that they were no match for PAF that day and quickly resorted to a missile launch (at least tried to) and were only stopped by a warning of a disproportionate response from our side. So they did what they had up their sleeve that day. Shooting down 6 or 7 more of their jets would have totally deflated any air that was still left in them and seeing almost every kind of top fighter in their arsenal being shot down in their own skies would have absolutely demoralized IAF and their pilots and they would have still tried to launch Brahomos that they already did only after two jets down ................ so in my opinion, which is just my opinion and might not be correct, nothing would have happened and PAF would have gained a psychological advantage over them for decades to come, the whole world would see PAF in a new light, we would have gained a lot more pilot training contracts from across the world, and probably sold a ton of Thunders.

But they started the unprovoked aggression, our war had started on Feb 26th. What if their bombs had landed on the buildings and killed some children? would we still give a calculated response?

You are wasting your time, like we have wasted since Feb 2019.
Pakistan is the only country, despite attacked by the enemy with huge bombs dropped on its territory proper, claims of 350 killed. Still went over the border, just to slap its enemy and said, "naughty child don't do it again".
Claim of 350 dead had turn out to be false, but it wasn't because of lack of efforts or planning on India's part. Something, the objectors for maximum response from Pakistan keep forgetting.

The arguments presented and cowardice by PAF that day is beggar's belief.

I understand that you are entitled to an opinion and I respect this. However please understand the strategy for PAF is drawn keeping multiple factors in mind. If PAF was led by jingoistic imbeciles then there would be a lot of charred earth where Pakistan and India stand today and most of my and your family would be residing in ether. Modern day wars are mostly about creating the right narrative. In a hostile environment where Modern day India remains the darling of the world, to execute an operation of the nature that we did and not have anyone lift a finger at you(other than sullen recognition of the sublimeness of the whole event managed by the Pak establishment) in criticism is a huge victory. You really need to grasp this concept before you post on the subject.
Kind regards


I meant your previous DP yaar.
A

Oh this is great, just great. So PAF was also worried about India's clout in the world that day , and "measured" their response accordingly.

"Aren't you confirming" my allegations of "Cowardice"!!

 

[Mrc]

Hi,

What a B S---. There will be no usage of nuc weapons by pakistan. The US will neuter them even before pakistanis start to take action---.

That nuc threat has long evaporated Mr. Baloch---. Trying finding something else to take a stand on---.

The USA has mapped out every location---it is now a matter of when they decide to take them out---.

easier said than done

if thats your strategic thinking and you pretend to be an intellectual here.
your god will be left with no leg to stand on if they try...... lets keep it in reality

 

[Thorough Pro]

Like a sniper taking aim of 7 enemy combatants and then letting them go?

Do you have any idea of the Indian mentality?
They gave their highest military ward to the pilot who was shot down, captured, interrogated, and then returned all in the public eye, recorded on camera and shown across the globe on all types of media and credited him with an F-16 kill, which he himself never claimed and which is not possible due to the undeniable proof presented in the shape of all 4 missiles still attached to his crashed plane. They even claim their downed SU30MKI dodged half a dozen AAMRAMs and you are saying locking them was as good as shooting them down.

The story from their perspective is they landed in one peace, they made Paksitani fighters run away and they are heroes. Now counter that.


I know their mentality better than the back of my hand. They understand only one language. See their response to the arse-kicking by Chinese.

Locking onto 7 jets had the same effect on the morale of the IAF pilots as if we had shot them down, especially when they were unable to break the locks. We achieved the same result without bloodshed and without giving India an excuse to escalate further thus killing two birds with one stone.

IT was not cowardice by PAF, they were eager, willing and very much capable of doing much more than that, they were just following orders from the government, which again was not due to cowardice.

Great secrecy indeed. They put the plaque of the kills, including SU 30 s at an Airbase.
They are telling the world we had a Su 30s kill.



You are wasting your time, like we have wasted since Feb 2019.
Pakistan is the only country, despite attacked by the enemy with huge bombs dropped on its territory proper, claims of 350 killed. Still went over the border, just to slap its enemy and said, "naughty child don't do it again".
Claim of 350 dead had turn out to be false, but it wasn't because of lack of efforts or planning on India's part. Something, the objectors for maximum response from Pakistan keep forgetting.

The arguments presented and cowardice by PAF that day is beggar's belief.



Oh this is great, just great. So PAF was also worried about India's cloud in the world that day , and "measured" their response accordingly.

"Aren't you confirming" my allegations of "Cowardice"!!

 

[F86 Saber]

I genuinely don't understand how some of you believe that PAF could have shot down every IAF jet that came within range without repercussions.

PAF targeting Indian Army sites was already an escalation over and above what the IAF did the previous day. How was PAF to justify an even bigger escalation of shooting down a large number of IAF jets over Indian territory? And what exactly do you guys think the IAF would have done after - just sit around?

The only jets that were shot down was a Mig21 that entered Pak airspace (justifiable) and a Su30 that was targeting our jets (somewhat justifiable). Anything more and we would have been seen internationally as the agressors and the Indians would have responded (with international support).

What the PAF did was calculated! They achieved their objective and taught the enemy a lesson, but didn't go overboard. Shooting down 7 jets wouldn't really have affected the IAF (that has many 100s more) but would certainly have led to a response by them, and even perhaps, it would be the Indians today who'd be boasting about how well they did last year.

The fact that we hit them, shot down 2 jets, and swiftly ended the Indian dreams of a 'new norm' shows that the right decisions were made.

Just to add - those saying that we showed our hand (surprise capability) and should have at least achieved more kills to make it worth while - please explain how 5 extra kills would have had any impact to an airforce with over 500 4th gen jets? And what would it have achieved other than boost your own ego?

Like a sniper taking aim of 7 enemy combatants and then letting them go?

Do you have any idea of the Indian mentality?
They gave their highest military ward to the pilot who was shot down, captured, interrogated, and then returned all in the public eye, recorded on camera and shown across the globe on all types of media and credited him with an F-16 kill, which he himself never claimed and which is not possible due to the undeniable proof presented in the shape of all 4 missiles still attached to his crashed plane. They even claim their downed SU30MKI dodged half a dozen AAMRAMs and you are saying locking them was as good as shooting them down.

The story from their perspective is they landed in one peace, they made Paksitani fighters run away and they are heroes. Now counter that.


I know their mentality better than the back of my hand. They understand only one language. See their response to the arse-kicking by Chinese.



IT was not cowardice by PAF, they were eager, willing and very much capable of doing much more than that, they were just following orders from the government, which again was not due to cowardice.

What you have stated is what their media fed their public, they did the same about the *** kicking they received from China. I am sure had we shot down half of their airforce that day, their media would have swung it in their favor some how through denial and disinformation. Like seniors have mentioned in this thread, the extent of damage suffered by India was much more than a single downed MIG-21 especially on the ground, yet their Govt. covered up the entire thing with the help of false bravado and chest thumping projected by their media.

The message we delivered was not meant for their general public, it was delivered to those who it was supposed to be delivered to. We never wanted to claim dominance, this is the reason why Gen. Asif Ghafoor in his first press conference on 27th Feb openly admitted to not shooting down the Heli. This is the reason we never claimed anything other than shooting down two of their jets.

 

[litman]

You can't stop the inevitable. War is going to happen for 1 reason or the other and that too within a matter of years. This decade has already shown that its going to be really bloody 2020s. Either a few near pear forces would separately fight for their own survival at various points around the globe or it could be World War 3 right at our door steps.

UN is as irrelevant to the issues of today as it was league of nations back then. There is no single hegemonic military/economic power in the world. There is an old slowing down or declining power and the other one growing up rapidly and emerging power. If their dispute can't be readily settled down by cold war tactics. This may escalate to hot war sporadically once the time comes. Israel's official annexation of Jerusalem is underway, the tri nuclear neighbors in South Asia are effectively in state of undeclared war. The middle east has been cooking off since many decades specially in the last decade and its perfectly reaching to the point of implosion. Thanks to globalization, today no 2 powers can fight their way through in isolation as it was done previously. We have turned this planet into a global village and everything is interconnected more than everything before.

Unless humanity, somehow miraculously, finds any other Non violent ways to settle their long standing issues once and for all, the war is the einevitability. You may deny the fact as clear as a Sun but you can never avoid it.

Be prepared for the worse and hope that it passes away swiftly, causing least damage and stays in its cold stage and never goes hot. But still somehow manages to dissolve the deep rooted fault lines of major conflicts and conflicting interests of the powers

o yes. WW3 . and who will enjoy the out come of this WW3. north america, europe, russia, china, pak, india, middle east all will be destroyed . about 5 billion world population will be either killed or they cease to exist as human beings good for nothing. no humanity , no civilization. no religion. the only aim of the survivors will be to survive by stealing, scavanging, killing etc. that leaves behind africa, australia, south east asia and south america and due to changes in global climate agriculture in those areas will also be effected and they may also face starvation. who will be the ultimate winner of this WW3??? No body.
if we keep religious escatalogies aside there are 0 chances of WW3 .the world has plenty of fanatics but for starting WW3 and MAD you need people 100 times more fanatic then hitler and modi.
there are many people who say that israel will survive the war and will become the ruling state in the world. but what are the chances that israel will come out unscathed out of the total destruction of the world. almost 0. israel is a small part of the same earth where we all are living. if all other regions will be destryed so will be the israel. it is so small that only a few nukes can turn all of it into rubble. and climate change will also make them starve to death.