Is this the end of Islam? or there is some silver-lining?

[FaujHistorian]

Good. Good for them. Good for those that want to follow.

As a human, don't you have a choice to do whatever you like as long as you do not impose? So if tribals are not fighting to impose their culture on others - Do we have the right to do so?

It is a great philosophical discussion. I guess I am talking to the wall here. You do not have enough skills to have an intellectual debate. At least for this topic.

If you belong to or supprt LGBTQ community - Westernized lifestyle and so on - Does that mean you have the right to impose that on others? If you are a Muslim/Jew/Christian - Does that mean you have the right to impose your religion on others?

I think a civilized way is to live and let others live. However, the state has to follow the opinions of its citizens. For example, France or Germany cannot become Islamic states and practice Islamic culture.

Similarly, if they are expecting us to change...just because of their superior technology - They are delusional to say the least.

you can't drive on the wrong side of road. you will cause trouble for yourself and others.

Tribals can live in the trees. I don't care

But if tree dwellers come down and force their Sharia on fellow land dwellers, then obviously things will go up in flames.

This thread is pointing to the same issue.

Bunch of primitive tribals are trying to impose their Sharia on fellow tribals

hence the flames.

It will remain so until they get civilized and no longer behave in primitive ways.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

how can u call ur self a muslim when u kill other human beings ? huh ? how can u live with that ? how can u chant "allaho akbar" with that ?

may the same allah teach u humanity , cause ur seriously fvkced up .

did you read a post of a false flagger or a real wahabi?
who justified all this and very Islamic and also quoted an infidel British PM to justify everything you asked?

I hope you enjoy the safety for a long long time but in 80s you were subjected to Arabian terrorism for over a decade.
you are not safe right now because your military is awesome .
its because the terrorists are busy killing people in other countries. they will definitely turn to you.

and now they got the weapons left by iraqi coward army as well. so they dont need help from Saudis.


I hope your military might matches your tough posts here but on paper its a third rate and you wont be facing ISIS alonebut Saudis , Bahrian and Qatar and maybe Egypt will also join the war to make it an Arab vs Persian war.
despite 10 years of war and our politicians our military is still strong and now banging the taliban

but in your case other Arab countries wont sit back and let ISIS loose because they invested too much in them.
this is my issue, you wont be able to safe your holy sites in Iraq and terrorism in your country from Jandullah via Pakistan and Afghanistan.

wahabis will declare victory by destroying the shrines in Iraq because this seems to be their major goal and wahabi Arabs regimes are desperate to see that happen.

I am sorry for comparing your military might with Punjabi police and Haryana police maybe its better but it hasnt done much in Syria or Iraq

your personnel have been abducted and butchered like cattle by the cannibal wahabis .

 

[mehboobkz]

nigga, Islam is going nowhere, its here to stay LOL

Above is your generic statement that hit your mind within seconds...
But, BTW, he is seeking a specific reply about the following:

From Morocco to Indonesia, or say from Atlantic to Pacific, entire Islamic World is up in flames, or in poverty, or under despotic oppressive governments...and Muslim masses are in misery, and utter hopelessness. Syria and Iraq are totally destroyed by civil war, superpowers have invaded, plundered, and destroyed many nations of Islamosphere. Israel is currently bombing Gaza, a territory it already illegally occupies and has colonized it for decades. On political front, Muslim masses are deeply divided and there is no order. From the dreams of Islamic Caliphate, to the vision of extreme secularism--all of the political thoughts are colliding within the fold of Islam. Muslims are globally being painted as "the problem" or as the "other" in the equation of civilized vs the other. Seems like entire world is on one side, and Muslims are on other. Any hope of empowerment due to revolutions in Arab World are turned completely upside down---with even status-quo forces returning back to power with even worse oppression.

By your logic, those 20 failed countries would be there too, nowhere to go, but how are they living vis a vis civilised world?
That is the key issue.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Let's not generalize @Irfan Baloch 's post, and he is no enemy of Shias, he is actually an enemy of these scumbags who blow up regularly, but I believe he has some misinformations about Iran's military system and how it works.

Like I said

i will live to kiss your hands if I am proven wrong.

Amen

the reports from Syria and Iraq and not very encouraging.

those terrorists have killed Iranians who went to fight against the FSA and AL Qaeda terrorists.

our soldiers in the "peace time" also suffered because our taliban apologist parties didnt want our military to take actions against them.

 

[forcetrip]

Though a little confusing what I understood from his post was-

In his last sermon Holy Prophet PBUH has said " Al youma akmaltu lakim deenukim wa islami deena" *forgive me if there is any mistake in the actual wording*

Trans: Today I have completed the Religion for you and Chose Islam as your religion.

So any event incident taken place after that is not part of the religion- its just history-

There are many verses about the battle of Badr in the Quran so what you are hinting at is a little off the mark.

Fortunately I also understand your point and will not further explain myself because of it being pointless. We all know the significance of the battle of badr and that of karbala, if our history lessons are not different.

 

[Jf Thunder]

Above is your generic statement that hit your mind within seconds...
But, BTW, he is seeking a specific reply about the following:



By your logic, those 20 failed countries would be there too, nowhere to go, but how are they living vis a vis civilised world?
That is the key issue.

u r correct, i am wrong you win, i loose

Battle of Badr is part of religion because the prophet was fighting there? Or is it some other reason?

because it was before the last Surah was revealed

 

[Slav Defence]

We badly need reformation within our establishment and we need to reassign people of upright characteristic within our command and control system.
We need massive reforms in our judiciary and education system so that justice and education can be easily approachable for subject.
We do not need reforms in Islam.Once we realize that,we will unite.Nothing will happen to Islam,but Muslims are gonna pay for dire consequences by not understanding the true guidance and true essence of Islamic teachings.
We also think that we are truly following Islam which is not true.Our misinterpretations are one key factor due to which we are going astray.Islam and Quran is theoritically /physically present but is not reflected practically into our lives.
My point will be explained in much better way from following extract:
Why Doesn't the Quran Have the Same Effect Today?
William Ewart Gladstone, four-time Prime Minister of Great Britain, is famous for telling the English Parliament, "As long as this Quran exists, Europe will never be able to conquer the Islamic East." Similarly, the French Colonial Governor of Algeria said, on the occasion of one hundred years of French occupation of Algeria, "It is a must to remove the Arabic Quran from their presence and to remove the Arabic language from their tongues in order for us to have victory over them. [16]
Actually, many of the enemies of Islam have perceived an even more important point: It is not necessary to physically remove the Quran from the hands of the Muslims. They only need to remove the Quran from being central to the life of the Muslim. It is possible for people Muslims— to possess the Quran and still not receive the benefits, guidance and blessings that should go hand in hand with the Quran.

The reason why the Quran does not have the same effect today has nothing to do with the essential nature of the Quran— as it will always be the true guidance that is ever available to take mankind from darkness into light. The source of the problem is in the way that many of today's believers approach the Quran. The possible reasons for this kind of situation could be many. In general, though, four, which were mentioned in the introductory chapter, stand out glaringly:

(1) Some Muslims emphasize secondary aspects of the Quran while ignoring its more important primary aspects;

(2) Related to (1), too many Muslims do not recognize and understand the primary goals of the Quran; therefore they read it but do not get out of it what it desires

(3) In addition, some Muslims do not approach the Quran in the proper manner, missing the essential link between what it teaches and how it is to affect mankind; and

(4) Even when the above obstacles or problems are overcome, still some Muslims do not interpret the Quran in the proper manner and, hence, although they read it they do not get its correct teachings from it.

Source:
http://islaam.net/main/display.php?id=1447&category=71

About current situation,I do not understand that why my friends are so astonished and asking this question?All these pridictions are discussed into our hadiths and even in Quran Allah subhana o tala has warned us that we will be replaced with better generations if we dare to exceed our limits. This is how transgressors are treated.
Regards

 

[forcetrip]

because it was before the last Surah was revealed nigga

Be prepared to never be answered by me again and be blocked if you talk to me like im your "peep". Keep that language contained to your family and friends and away from the forum.

 

[mujhaidind]

All these are signs of rise of islam to super power position. All non muslims are united against islam right from 1st day nothing new. Just observer within few years peak of anti islamic wars would result in fall of america and europe the allies and replaced by Islamic superpower. This is the max kufer could do...just wait for super reaction which is taking shape.

Ameen!

 

[Jf Thunder]

Be prepared to never be answered by me again and be blocked if you talk to me like im your "peep". Keep that language contained to your family and friends and away from the forum.

add some star plus lightning music too? (btw, it was not meant to offend , i was just high after iftaari LOL, sorry )

 

[JonAsad]

Tribals can live in the trees. I don't care

But if tree dwellers come down and force their Sharia on fellow land dwellers, then obviously things will go up in flames.
.

I have some interesting analysis- bear with me-
We hv tree dwellers and then we hv land dwellers.

Scenario is: Tree dwellers comes down and try force their shariah on fellow land dwellers.

The question is: is that an action or reaction?

The reason is: The land dwellers came for the Trees first- Trees ofcourse being Oil- then they tried implementing land dwelling way of life "democracy" by force on poor tree dwellers- the tree dwellers being weak in face of imminent defeat with no other option left resorted to inhumane but achievable ways of revenge or victory- case similar Kamikaze-

So the question is who defines which is a civilised world?- the victors? -

If we go by sheer numbers since ww2- Amrika as a country has killed more innocent people civilians women kids children old young in the whole world than all the terrorists regimes or dictators combined- thats the champion of civilised world?-

 

[forcetrip]

add some star plus lightning music too? (btw, it was not meant to offend , i was just high after iftaari LOL, sorry )

You are a habitual offender in that regard. My not bringing this up before has caused this to happen to me today. Serves me right.

 

[Slav Defence]

Here is another live example, our attitude damn it.You all can see practical examples of my theoretical post.When I was busy writing and proof reading , my fellow friends were busy fighting with each other and proving each other wrong,instead of realizing

 

[illusion8]

(2) Related to (1), too many Muslims do not recognize and understand the primary goals of the Quran; therefore they read it but do not get out of it what it desires

(3) In addition, some Muslims do not approach the Quran in the proper manner, missing the essential link between what it teaches and how it is to affect mankind; and

(4) Even when the above obstacles or problems are overcome, still some Muslims do not interpret the Quran in the proper manner and, hence, although they read it they do not get its correct teachings from it.

You mean here that the millions of pupils who study in madrassah's and who spend 12 -15 years of their lives reading the Quran over and over again fail to interpret it correctly? I find that astonishing.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

The moment Islam opens up to debate, questions and criticism will be the day there will be a renaissance in Islam, labeling anyone questioning Islam as munafiq, apostate etc will only help in leaving its control in the hands of the mullah. Claiming Islam to be the perfect religion that does not require any change or that it's better than all other religions and does not have to tolerate or take inspiration from any other faith will not help - because what's on display in the name of Islam right now is far from perfect.

already do that

the fundamentals cant be changed like Book and Belief in One'ness of God

what we have open for interpretition or Jurisprudence is Moamlat or our daily life and we do that according to the current times and take Quran and Sunnah as a source or reference.

so its not rigid as it appears or as wahabis have you believe.

had it been up to wahabis then not much would have changed since the darkages


do look up a book of wahabi fatwas back during the time of Biritsh Raj

who declared travelling in kafir train or Ship resulted in annulment of your marriage and expulsion from islam.
or listening to radio or talking over the phone etc was like having sex with satan and so forth if they had it their way then yes we all needed some serious rethink.

but like I said we have been more open and adapting than other faiths even at the time of early Islam

e.g.

we for first time accepted the rights of women and their right to property

before that.

women WERE the property (a tribal custom, which is unfairly associated with Islam).

do note that there are limitations what you can adapt and change what you cant.. you have to leave the fundamentals alone because thats what defines you or distinguishes you.

otherwise you are just a mishmash.
belief in monotheism doesnt stop you from conquering Moon and breaking up the atoms or finding cures to chronic diseases or making a new branch of mathematics.

remember the inquisition? burning people alive or drowning them on the charges of being witch in Europe back in the medieval times? I swear on my dog that ISI was not involved in it,