Is Pakistan a soft state?

[Chhatrapati]

Yes, you are correct that Modi enjoys huge mandate but not all governments in the past in India enjoyed such mandates. Indeed often they were weak coalitions but did you guys get hordes marching on New Delhi?

Of course sir. There was a huge protest in Delhi during the last UPA government, many of their coalition left them high and dry. Delhi saw a huge protest headed by Anna Hazare (a freedom fighter), this created a public sentiment against congress, throughout India and the inflation at the time went high too. This happened just two years into the UPA 2 government. The rest three years was a train wreck.

You can't ignore these giant rallies, the well off people over internet wouldn't know the impact on lower middle class , the silent majority. They don't think much about the grater good and other complex thoughts about CPEC or importance of government schemes that might draw benefits at a future time, my comments regarding the strength of PTI is very relevant to swing public opinion or to keep stability of government in general.

 

[AfrazulMandal]

Go to 4:55. So Pakistan is a huge country that a mob of 20 thousand cannot be allowed to blackmail. Well can we have 30,000 armed riot police standing around the red zone like a wall of steel assuring everybody the power of the state?

The picture of Modi along with the maulana is misleading. The maulana has got little money.
Plus he is ... a maulana. Islamophobic Modi would have sent him to a 'detention center' in no time.

 

[pakpride00090]

Agartala Conspiracy Case surfaced in 1967 and death of one of conspirators led to a public uprising in 1969,which made Govt to bury this case and let all of them walk away free.
This case was used by AL for mass publicity and this case later led to events of 1971.


If PTI did that and you didn't raised a question than let Mullah do that also.
(Mullah is as jerk as PTI,PMLN,PPP,ANP and MQM are,two sides of same coin)


They are curse on Pakistan.

You see that is what I am talking about. Awami league and Sheikh mujib were already on the plan to separate east Pakistan. One member of the conspirator actually testified and accepted in 2011 that the charges brought to them in 1968 were accurate.

Whether they released Awami league or not, those guys had already made plans for separation. Do you really think by releasing them they would have dropped their plans ? Definitely NO.... If we actually killed 3 million and eliminated awami league when they presented their six points early on , I am pretty sure Bengali plan to separate would have had enormous difficulty to succeed.

It is a shame that we didn't even have 93000 combat troops as propagated.

We can shame India all we want but they brutally crushed Khalistanis and all separatist movements within their country. Now , Kashmiris would be brutally suppressed. They have more balls than us Pakistanis.

Pussyfooting and doing half-hearted attempts have led us to this situation. As I said before , question of morality should never arise if national interest are to be secured.

 

[Sine Nomine]

You see that is what I am talking about. Awami league and Sheikh mujib were already on the plan to separate east Pakistan. One member of the conspirator actually testified and accepted in 2011 that the charges brought to them in 1968 were accurate.

Whether they released Awami league or not, those guys had already made plans for separation. Do you really think by releasing them they would have dropped their plans ? Definitely NO.... If we actually killed 3 million and eliminated awami league when they presented their six points early on , I am pretty sure Bengali plan to separate would have had enormous difficulty to succeed.

It is a shame that we didn't even have 93000 combat troops as propagated.

We can shame India all we want but they brutally crushed Khalistanis and all separatist movements within their country. Now , Kashmiris would be brutally suppressed. They have more balls than us Pakistanis.

Pussyfooting and doing half-hearted attempts have led us to this situation. As I said before , question of morality should never arise if national interest are to be secured.

Tell this to Govt,they have been acting like that since 1950's.

 

[pakpride00090]

Tell this to Govt,they have been acting like that since 1950's.

I am not sure whether you are agreeing with me or not....

 

[fitpOsitive]

Yes. The question here I want to ask is Pakistan a fragile, banana, weak state? Right now we have couple of thousands of rowdy JUI-F supporters in H-9 Islamabad threatening the removal of a elected PM into one year of his term with four years left. The article from Dawn got me thinking.

"A massive crowd of tens of thousands of charged men exactly 7km from the Red Zone facing nothing but empty containers constitutes a huge existential problem. The police? Ah, well how many policemen armed with how many batons, equipped with how many tear-gas shells brandishing how many shields do you require to stop the 7km march by tens of thousands of men?"

https://www.dawn.com/news/1514395/here-comes-the-maulana


So the question is 7 Kms separate Mullah Diesel from PMIK. How can the state be worried about not being able to secure 7Kms? Why is the police of riot police incapable of protecting the red zone? Is this what Pakistan is? Mob rule? If you can get a mob then you can charge the red zone? We saw something similiar with TLP Rizvi doing the same thing some time back.

Can we please secure Islamabad before we secure the blue seas. If money is a issue sell some navy ships but for gods sakes raise at least 20,000 man riot police force with dedicated water cannons, equipment and training. Is this to much to ask?

It is impossible to complate mobs threatening Washington, London, Paris, Moscow, New Delhi or Ankara in Turkey. And they would not need the army to handle this threat. India has CPRF, Turkey has Gendarma etc.

Situations like this paint Pakistan as a weak and fragile country.

And the kind of discipline you are demanding paints a total dictatorship. Protests are healthy. And so is molana.

 

[R Wing]

USA is a superpower. Even Japan, Germany would cow at feet of USA so please don't bring that into it. We are talking about internal security and stability. Specifically keeping the capital of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan secure from Muslim mobs of JUI-F and Mullah Diesel secure.

lol. But seriously do you see my point. You think mobs could do threaten Modi in New Delhi, or Erdogan in Ankara, or MBS in Riyad, or even Sheikh Hasina in Dhaka leave alone Trump, Putin or Boris in Washington, Moscow and London?

One can get back at superpowers through asymmetric means... the US lost a lot of forces, inc spec ops and even a General or two in Afghanistan.

The best approach when it comes to rebellions is to kill the ringleaders. If that doesn't work, target their followers and keep on doing it until they submit. But ensure that you stick to basic soldiery, do not use airstrikes, tanks, artillery, etc. That has the possibility of backfiring massively.

The "best" approach sadly doesn't exist in the mind of small-minded mil and civ leadership in Pakistan. We have the tools (trained spec ops) to be able to do what you're suggesting but you also need brains and balls to plan and authorize such an op.

It is a country held hostage by the Corrupt Ruling Mafia in all levels of the Government, the Bureaucracy and the Military .... the very fact that this chaos was allowed, clearly demonstrates the level of Corrupt people involved. The ordinary people of Pakistan were forced into bad behaviors because these Corrupt Rulers imposed a corrupt system on them, and imposed hardships on them.

Absolutely correct. Those who aren't correct are well-meaning idiots with highly compromised creativity, intellectual capacity and courage.

Capability is not problem
Problems are political there are thousands of anti riot police elite force SPU etc if government orders them they will start firing at protesters
And use of rifles should be allowed in self defense

The Fauj and Democratic Forces are both full of incompetent people.

I was told that we did took revenge of that in Afghanistan. Maybe thru Taliban

I would hope so.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

And the kind of discipline you are demanding paints a total dictatorship.

They have that in UK. Is that dictatorship? I don't see Corbyn marching on London with 30,000 supporters to force Boris to resign?

Or do you see Hillary Clinton standing in front of 50,000 in Washington preparing to charge the White house to remove Trump?

One can get back at superpowers through asymmetric means... the US lost a lot of forces, inc spec ops and even a General or two in Afghanistan.

One fart at the FATF by USA would blow Pakistan and resemble Tezgam Express.

 

[fitpOsitive]

They have that in UK. Is that dictatorship? I don't see Corbyn marching on London with 30,000 supporters to force Boris to resign?

Or do you see Hillary Clinton standing in front of 50,000 in Washington preparing to charge the White house to remove Trump?

One fart at the FATF by USA would blow Pakistan and resemble Tezgam Express.

I mean just ignore these guys. Mr Arif Alvi will be in action in December anyway.

 

[Yankee-stani]

They have that in UK. Is that dictatorship? I don't see Corbyn marching on London with 30,000 supporters to force Boris to resign?

Or do you see Hillary Clinton standing in front of 50,000 in Washington preparing to charge the White house to remove Trump?

One fart at the FATF by USA would blow Pakistan and resemble Tezgam Express.

Or do you see folks protesting in Tiananmen lol, or in Istanbul

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Or do you see folks protesting in Tiananmen lol, or in Istanbul

Last time they tried and this is what they got.

China

Turkey

 

[R Wing]

They have that in UK. Is that dictatorship? I don't see Corbyn marching on London with 30,000 supporters to force Boris to resign?

Or do you see Hillary Clinton standing in front of 50,000 in Washington preparing to charge the White house to remove Trump?

One fart at the FATF by USA would blow Pakistan and resemble Tezgam Express.

Nobody is denying that. But nobody is denying that we supported an armed movement that was killing American troops either.

 

[American Pakistani]

No wonder why we are laughing stock. Even a Bangladeshi today was showing me his concerns and asking what is wrong with Pakistani people who are hell bent on destroying the country.

Now I understood why we are known as fragile failed state.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Last time they tried and this is what they got.

China

Turkey

Man if JUI-F and all those moulvi folks saw these guys they would s..t their pants

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Man if JUI-F and all those moulvi folks saw these guys they would s..t their pants

To be fair this is even thanks to past governments. Large parts of Pakistan were neglected and left in primitive stage of developemt. Southern K-Pk is terribly underdeveloped. So is South Punjab. We have huge % of people with zero education and desi thinking married to poverty leads to proliferation of madaris whose products are perfect as street mobs of JUI-F etc.

Also I am sick of "Islam made in India" which has been deliberately infected over the decades by governments. Check out where JUI-F origins are.