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honestly can't see the point of Yasin if we are going to invest in Kowsar, Kowsar in every metric is better than Yasin . if our pilots are going to fly Kowsar just make a trainer version of the damn aircraft , why build another airplane with different aerodynamic and train them with that airplane .
and I don't bet anything on Su-35 or Mig-35.
and hope along those UAVs , we are gong to send two dozen communication satellite into space

Umm no and I will tell you why ...

... Imagine 2030s, You have an IRIAF made of:

- 170-200 x Kowsar-II (4++ gen if RCS <1.0 m2) + Kowsar-I (upgraded to 4+ gen avionics)
- 200 x MALE UCAV Interceptors/wingmen (I wish Shahed-171 low RCS stealth Jets)
- 200 x HALE/MALE - SIGINT/ELINT+PGM carriers (Next Gen Shahed 171-191/Kaman-22/Fotros)
- 70 x F-14AM + MIG-29 9.12 will need IEI Bayyenat-AESA + IEI 5th generation e-warfare suites to stay relevant in combat, provided if they get through an extensive MLU program [Otherwise we will need some 70 x 4++ Gen Su-35S/MIG35S or may be J-31 with TOT from China]

-This group will be supported by a network of GWACS + LORADS + SHORADS on the ground with ~400 km interception ranges + Satellite guidance/surviellance from above.

What is common in this group? avionics, nav-comm, radars, e-warfare suites, and datalinks are all by IEI SAIRAN. So how do you train pilots/engineers/electronic warfare experts/maintenance crew for such a diverse fleet? you train them on one single small platform first before they go to combat squadrons. They fly/work on the same electronic systems that they will find in combat squadrons or in the battlefield. IRIAF still to this day maintains an average of 160-190 flight hours/year for frontline pilots in conjunction with their ground crew. The irony is that they work on different platforms ranging from AWG-9, IEI upgraded AWG-9+, Phazotron of MIG, Cyrano IV, APG-153/120, Bayenat I, Bayenaat-II, NRIET SY-80. So there is zero interoperability among pilots and crews. One pilot/technician has to get massive training on fighter-trainer versions of an aircraft before getting operational on another machine. Its a waste of time/energy/resources to have so many different platforms with different training programs for them.

Forget the future, let's say IRIAF gets its advanced training squadron of 12 x Yasin AT with the same avionics package of Kowsar with IEI e warfare package, Bayenat-II radars with HMD slaved Fatter missiles etc. Pilots who train on them can go to ... Kowsar-I, F-4E/D (dowran upgraded at Busher), Kowsar-II in future, whichever aircraft gets IEI SAIRAN upgrade (MIG?). This happens because they have operated and trained themselves on same-origin electronics, and systems. It IMPROVES combat efficiency multifold.

My assumption is that Yasin or its variant will get operational but may be only some 1-2 training squadrons.

Yasin was attempt to build Yak-130 class fighter jet. Another test bed project that couldn’t get green light by IRIAF or get proper funding (or both).

Zero evidence exists for YAK-130.

All fingers pointed to AT-3

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First of all, I find it amusing that when countered with evidence how swiftly you retreated from your initial claims e.g

- You claimed there are 6 "prop" airframes for official visits with nothing else at HESA floors but when proved with serials and pictures that there are atleast 18 (minimum guess) and highest 24 (I am myself not convinced).

- You claimed that there was some level of serial production of SaeghehI/II with 2 squadrons (like Kowsar or its future will be same) while the serials confirm some 6-7 testbeds with single and dual seater versions built over a period of 11 years.

- You also claimed that I said that Kowsar is getting local BVR package which you failed to provide evidence for. The only post I ever made was for Babaei missile industries testing Maghsoud ARH-LR-BVR for F-14AM fleet.

Also you just showed 25 years of tinkering with the F-5 with less than 17 total aircraft built (if your guesses are correct)

- One can thank Shahi legacy of reliance upon imports + low IQ Akhoonds leading R&D projects in the 90s and 2000s. But this was not a loss at all. Like I said before thanks to this "tinkering with F-5" even if we get zero fighters from Russia or China, we can still manage to give IRIAF some 200 x 4.0 to 4+ generation interceptors built from scratch at home within the next 7-8 years if we throw in the money. That, without even importing a bolt. Yes they will still be relevant since nobody will be flying F-22 and SR-72 in the Iranian neighborhoods before you pull that argument. Besides, Our MALE UCAV fleet is the largest in the entire region. It will grow and evolutionise along the way.

Now we know the Turks like to exaggerate and probably engage in propaganda more than any other nation in the Middle East. But one can see why IRIAF is not heavily invested in Kowsar. We can blame lack of funding (probably true) we can blame lack of mass production facilities (also true) and we can blame mentality shift of not viewing IRIAF as critical to overall defense. Nonetheless, at the end of the day when Iran puts its mind to something (Bavar-373) (RQ-170 reverse engineering) it is able to turn a project into reality on a timeline similar to Western armies.

- Turkish have learned to do feel-good propaganda presentations very well. Altay after 10 years of slides and presentations cant find a market other than Qatar ensuring Turkish political support through a mini purchase order. Their own army won't replace 65 years old M60 Patton with it. Other socio-political simp countries they have, won't take it either. The same story goes for their Atak129 Helis that everyone checkout but won't order. So take this Unmanned-F-22 "Mehmet-raptor" with some grain of salt. They are working on these platforms, kudos to them, but what makes you think we are not? Keep Iranian money+R&D rankings in mind before assuming things.

- It's a simple strategy that other nations failed to read. Iranian strategists saw that even if they procure some 600 x 4th generation jets from Russia and China for 40-50 Bln USD (Combination of MIG-29SMT/35, SU-27SK/30SM/35S, J-10C) in a conflict with the US+Jewrab alliance the airbases will be gone in few days by American 2000 x Tomahawk+SOW strikes. There will be air battles in which we will create new Jalil Zandi and Abbas Dowran like heroes but to what avail when you will lose the war? Hence the money went to create the "Fangs of Iran". Today, an enemy of Iran will be seen from 2000 KM away by our OTHRs, tracked and locked on outside Iranian borders and will be taken out with layer after layer of mobile LORADS/SHORADS or growing aerial interceptor force, all the while the IRGC's underground Missile Silos will breathe fire and the enemy's own bases, infrastructure, will be gone even if its 2000-2500 KM away. Their ships won't lurk closer than 1000 KM, their bases wont be safe from loitering UCAVs. Thanks to this unconventional strategy now we can even have some 7-8 fission devices from known enriched quantities in a matter of weeks if we seek to. So we killed the chances of being attacked with this development. Could we have achieved all this had we neglected this strategy and just went for 600 4th generation aircraft for 40-50 Billion USD? take the example of the Egyptian berserk shopping spree these days. They are taking the Shahi route financed by Riyadh. If in a few years Akhwan kicks out Sisi through a revolution and goes all anti-American how long this large Misri AF will operate you think?

Now here is another idea, why not make Kowsar II a drone? The removal of the pilot section will allow for bigger radar and more fuel. The reduction of support systems will lighten the aircraft and possibly allow heavier avionics suite and weapons layout.

To me that would make a little bit more sense at this point. Personally I been calling for a delta wing or flying wing UAV bomber similar to Sofreh Mahi mixed with RQ-170. But a pilotless Kowsar would be a nice step.

- IRIAF's and HESA decision-making has been in hands of egomaniacs. Have you read Tom Cooper's recent detailed articles about the complicated kind of decision-making structure in Tehran? He called Khamanei quite powerless in front of other self-centered institutions which is one of the reasons the SU-35S deal has not been officially announced yet despite both sides agreeing. Yes even Cooper thinks that this deal of SU-35S (72 total) is being challenged from within Iran, probably within MoD who are calling this a waste of money against their own projects of Missiles/AD etc. The worst era was under war-hardened soldiers turned managers (wtf??) like Vahidi and Dehghan who knew nothing about defense production. All the clownery and PR stunts you find happening in Iranian projects was done under their noses during Ahamdinejad and early Rouhani years. Things improved under Hatami and his nominated Ashtiani is doing brilliant work. Its not about IRGC and Artesh its about the background education of an individual.

If Kowsar ment to be some avionics suite for a future fighter, the avionics aren’t that advanced. Certainly not a 4++ in its current format. To me the project has always been “if it’s 2040 and all our planes are grounded and Russia and China refuse to sell us anything can we at least produce something to keep the skies with aircraft”. That and a F-5 modernization program similar to Karrar for Iran’s extensive amount of T-72 tanks supply.

- That avionics package is likely the most advanced thing in the entire IRIAF right now. Lets compare it to our MIG fleet. So Bayynat-II is ditto of Grifo 346 which GRIFO's/NRIET's most advanced product just below Grifo-E/KLJ AESA series for 4++ or 5th gen. It's extra light, long-range A2A tracker with SAR mapping, ECM/ECCM control. It easily stomps over the ~400 kg Soviet era heavy RLPK-29 of our MIG fleet which won't even see a Kowsar-sized thing (1 m2 RCS) in the sky beyond ~50 KM by the time they will themselves be fired upon. The plane is laced with flight+weapon+navigational management computers which MIG lacks. It also has a modern Nav-comm-datalink package that MIG lacks. Last but not least it has a modern e-warfare suite from SAIRAN with a long-range RWR+ECM+Jammer that was copied/modernized from F-14A's AN/ALR-45/67. MIG uses a famous failure SPO-15 which was thrown out in 9.13 Fulcrum versions in favor R Pastel system. Some people think IRIAF MIGs lacked RWR which resulted in them being planned to have IEI RWR. Apart from this the MIG also lacks jammers, ECCM. It has no chance of getting HMD that Kowsar can get just by ordering few from SAIRAN which also produced Fatter all-aspect IR seekers, so the enslavement is easy. So this is MIG ... I won't talk of the rest of the circus. We can do a product-to-product comparison to know better. This avionics suite beats everything else we have. If MIG-29 gets an MLU, I would rather have their entire soviet era layout thrown out and be replaced with whatever Kowsar-II will have to give them some relevance in modern combat instead of being the toothless oldies that they are becoming now.

Now here is another idea, why not make Kowsar II a drone? The removal of the pilot section will allow for bigger radar and more fuel. The reduction of support systems will lighten the aircraft and possibly allow heavier avionics suite and weapons layout.

To me that would make a little bit more sense at this point. Personally I been calling for a delta wing or flying wing UAV bomber similar to Sofreh Mahi mixed with RQ-170. But a pilotless Kowsar would be a nice step.

- Unless we have a 1.4-2.0 mach, 45000 ft/min climbing UCAV pulling 12 G's with 100+ km tracking range for BVR attack, the manned fleet is not going anywhere. The attack aircrafts SU-24/22 or good for nothing F-7N/Mirages/F-5 will be replaced by improved KAMAN-22/Fotros and Shahed 171.

This ever-growing unmanned fleet will be doing SIGINT/ELINT, launching AShCM/LACM and A2A missiles (future) too. We already have Jet powered stealth ones with 0.001 m2 and internal bays while some carry around SAR/ECM pods can launch 200+ km ranging LACM. So we may turn from manned age to unmanned before others around us.
 
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200 x MALE UCAV Interceptors/wingmen (I wish Shahed-171 low RCS stealth Jets)
too slow to be any sort of wingman or interceptor
70 x F-14AM + MIG-29 9.12 will need IEI Bayyenat-AESA + IEI 5th generation e-warfare suites to stay relevant in combat, provided if they get through an extensive MLU program [Otherwise we will need some 70 x 4++ Gen Su-35S/MIG35S or may be J-31 with TOT from China]
wait to receive that, I believe it when I see it. by the way i wonder how many f-14 or Mig-29 will be flight worthy in next 8-10 years
Forget the future, let's say IRIAF gets its advanced training squadron of 12 x Yasin AT with the same avionics package of Kowsar with IEI e warfare package, Bayenat-II radars with HMD slaved Fatter missiles etc. Pilots who train on them can go to ... Kowsar-I, F-4E/D (dowran upgraded at Busher), Kowsar-II in future, whichever aircraft gets IEI SAIRAN upgrade (MIG?). This happens because they have operated and trained themselves on same-origin electronics, and systems. It IMPROVES combat efficiency multifold.
the question , why train on Yasin instead of kowsar ?
My assumption is that Yasin or its variant will get operational but may be only some 1-2 training squadrons.
that would be waste of resource , time and everything

He called Khamanei quite powerless in front of other self-centered institutions which is one of the reasons the SU-35S deal has not been officially announced yet despite both sides agreeing.
neither of side agreeing on anything , just some fanboy daydream
 
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too slow to be any sort of wingman or interceptor

wait to receive that, I believe it when I see it. by the way i wonder how many f-14 or Mig-29 will be flight worthy in next 8-10 years

the question , why train on Yasin instead of kowsar ?

that would be waste of resource , time and everything


neither of side agreeing on anything , just some fanboy daydream

- If they operationalize Shahid-171 as an A2A wingman then they can replace the Toloue microjet it currently uses with 2 x Jahesh-700 turbofan for speed enhancement from the current 470 km/h to ~900-1000 KM/H. With IRST it can carry some atleast 2 x Fatter IR missiles in internal bays. Imagine an enemy fighter while sparing with IRIAF fighters, not seeing anything else on the radar because of .001 m2 RCS and suddenly BAM!!! Remember IAF could not track and lock it from Air defense. They had to rush F-35s who had to get within WVR range. IRIAF would be a fool not to focus on Shahed series.

- which is why I wrote MLU. If MIG fleet doesn't get MLU'ed in next 4-5 years they might end up in storage. With MLU and radar+avionics package replaced with local IEI SAIRAN (Whatever Kowsar-II's will have) these 23 fighters (Russian sources claim they delivered 42) will come to MIG-29SMT or beyond levels. They are currently just more powerful MIG-21s with their stupid radar + no avionics. 9.12 was a joke Russia played on everyone else.

- Basic jet training is always done on a smaller light jet trainer. You cant jump from a Propeller directly to a two-seater 4th generation fighter. Almost major nations have such a platform.

- Tom C did not "report" this deal, schizo BT did. Cooper merely commented that decision-making in Tehran is a very complicated process and the supreme leader does not have one-man authority over military decisions. This is one big reason IRIAF won't get foreign jets or some projects never see anything beyond a promising prototype. This situation will improve with time as war hardened soldiers from the war times will get old and retire from top posts.
 
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It's a simple strategy that other nations failed to read. Iranian strategists saw that even if they procure some 600 x 4th generation jets from Russia and China for 40-50 Bln USD (Combination of MIG-29SMT/35, SU-27SK/30SM/35S, J-10C) in a conflict with the US+Jewrab alliance the airbases will be gone in few days by American 2000 x Tomahawk+SOW strikes.
If that is the case why not build underground mountain airbases like China and North Korea have?

China's underground airbases are basically impossible to destroy. You can't destroy it even with nuclear weapons.

IRIAF could built 5-10 underground airbases hosting IRIAF most valuable assets.
 
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If that is the case why not build underground mountain airbases like China and North Korea have?

China's underground airbases are basically impossible to destroy. You can't destroy it even with nuclear weapons.

IRIAF could built 5-10 underground airbases hosting IRIAF most valuable assets.

Jews know they can not do anything anymore. They missed the bus ... one stupidity from them and we have enough HEU enriched U235 for 7-8 fission nuclear devices, from last known quantities by IAEA. The quantities may have doubled by now.

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Meanwhile

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Bro I meant for fighter jets. I already know Iran hosts UAV and missiles underground.

Something like this:

View attachment 855703

I think it might pop up someday that they may already be creating something similar somewhere. IRIAF certainly won't mind its more modern light interceptors to pop out of mountains out of nowhere suddenly to mess with intruders. F-14AM+MIG29+Kowsar-I (150 fighters) are needed for FAB/TAB's around Iran. Yet to come 5-6 (60-72) squadrons of Kowsar-II with AESA can be inside these mountain tunnel bases as an axillary force.

Btw in case of conflict with Jewarab Alliance, Airforces will play very little role. It will be more of a Missile + UCAV exchange with massive cyber attacks on each other's infra structure.
 
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- If they operationalize Shahid-171 as an A2A wingman then they can replace the Toloue microjet it currently uses with 2 x Jahesh-700 turbofan for speed enhancement from the current 470 km/h to ~900-1000 KM/H. With IRST it can carry some atleast 2 x Fatter IR missiles in internal bays. Imagine an enemy fighter while sparing with IRIAF fighters, not seeing anything else on the radar because of .001 m2 RCS and suddenly BAM!!! Remember IAF could not track and lock it from Air defense. They had to rush F-35s who had to get within WVR range. IRIAF would be a fool not to focus on Shahed series.
for the role of wingman , imagine if they inject enough money into the eagle ray project . that one is far more suitable for the role in design than Shahed-171 which is more suitable for long range bombing in contested skies

- which is why I wrote MLU. If MIG fleet doesn't get MLU'ed in next 4-5 years they might end up in storage. With MLU and radar+avionics package replaced with local IEI SAIRAN (Whatever Kowsar-II's will have) these 23 fighters (Russian sources claim they delivered 42) will come to MIG-29SMT or beyond levels. They are currently just more powerful MIG-21s with their stupid radar + no avionics. 9.12 was a joke Russia played on everyone else.
well I'm somehow concerned with their airframe aging.
by the way i believe right now the only advantage those Mig-29 have over kowsar is in its engine , and so i believe if we manage to fix that in kowsar , there is no necessity for doing a MLU (in these cases end of life upgrade) ion those mig-29s and we could chalk them off beside those F-7s and Mirage-f1s (god it make me angry to mention them)
- Basic jet training is always done on a smaller light jet trainer. You cant jump from a Propeller directly to a two-seater 4th generation fighter. Almost major nations have such a platform.
the problem i see is that Yasin is not lighter than kowsar , in fact its several hundred kg heavier and if also in every metric you consider inferior to kowsar. then why divert resource to it , while we can remove some weapon from kowsar and use it for a trainer which its flying characteristic is a lot more like the airplane those pilots later going to fly with.
by doing this our rate of production would be higher than we produce to different airframe . those two airplane are going to use the same engine and probably avionic the different is their airframe and kowsar airframe is more agile and swifter and maneuverable . the only advantage Yasin have is that its engine are separated from each other and that give it advantage in cas roles but look at it it don't have the necessary armor like A-10 or Su-25 so its better give that role to attack helicopters and drones and i still believe that's a role more suited for army aviation not air-force .
- Tom C did not "report" this deal, schizo BT did. Cooper merely commented that decision-making in Tehran is a very complicated process and the supreme leader does not have one-man authority over military decisions. This is one big reason IRIAF won't get foreign jets or some projects never see anything beyond a promising prototype. This situation will improve with time as war hardened soldiers from the war times will get old and retire from top posts.
you see leader always supported domestic production over import of foreign weapons and equipment. and honestly I didn't see any strong sign that air-force is interested in foreign fighters all I see is that military enthusiasts that are interested and right it in media .
and honestly I don't see Russia as a viable source for importing advanced fighters , if they give us something I'm sure we already have something better or very soon we produce it. they just see us as an competitor in middle east and it was the case since several hundred years ago

If that is the case why not build underground mountain airbases like China and North Korea have?

China's underground airbases are basically impossible to destroy. You can't destroy it even with nuclear weapons.

IRIAF could built 5-10 underground airbases hosting IRIAF most valuable assets.
5-10 under ground base will answer survivability of the airplane but one problem remain , enemy actually don't need to destroy the aircrafts, they just need to destroy those base entrance to made those aircraft remain grounded for several day at least and then they can do that again . another problem our fighters in future probably be of lighter variants with shorter range so they need to be all around country to be able to cover all country in wartime, to me such underground bases are only useful for housing bombers and special planes like sigint airplanes
 
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for the role of wingman , imagine if they inject enough money into the eagle ray project . that one is far more suitable for the role in design than Shahed-171 which is more suitable for long range bombing in contested skies

Shahed-171 has zero utility for a long-range strike. Its main weapon is its 0.001 m2 RCS which is possible because of its internal bays. Now, these internal bays are not very large and cant hold some very large PGM in them. Yes they can intrude enemy air space with ease, won't be detected and the enemy may have to use fights to track them from aspects where they can't be tracked (Which happened with the Israeli F-35). So their best utility will be in the air where they can serve as Wingmen.

Most air battles happen submach and happen at a distance of 30-50 KM. 2 x Jahesh-700 powered Shahed 171 can carry 2 x Fatter in its internal bays to help manned platforms mess with enemy intruders while they can also carry IEI jammer package to keep on jamming enemy fighters radars.

well I'm somehow concerned with their airframe aging.
by the way i believe right now the only advantage those Mig-29 have over kowsar is in its engine , and so i believe if we manage to fix that in kowsar , there is no necessity for doing a MLU (in these cases end of life upgrade) ion those mig-29s and we could chalk them off beside those F-7s and Mirage-f1s (god it make me angry to mention them)

Like I said its an eventuality. MIG-29 fleet is not very useful in modern combat. The RPLK-29 is a heavy old radar that has a small range for a Kowsar sized fighter. 9.12 model that we received either had weak SPO-15 RWR (from MIG-21/23) or lacked it along with other ECM packages that were later given to 9.13 variants.

The biggest weapon MIG has is its speed, climb rate along with the almost undodgeable R-73 so that makes them more powerful MIG-21s but that is just it. Either this fleet gets MLU'ed locally with extreme level airframe strengthening, revitalization + Receives local IEI like avionics package, otherwise their relevance will become questionable. Below is a possible route to bring MIG fleet to SMT standards.

Extensive airframe strengthening
Alloy + composites. SSJO unit in Mehrabad before has previously overhauled these airframes extensively.

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IEI Fire control Radar BAYYENAT II/II
AESA version (ditto of Grifo-E or KLJ-7A) version with ~140 km Track + 180+ km detection range with SAR, ECM control, strong Air to Air mode (RWS, TWS, PRF, STT, Range and velocity search).

IEI SAIRAN E-Warfare Suite
RWR/MAWS
ECM Jammer
Chaff/flare dispenser
IFF (IEI-IFF AN/APX-95)

Cockpit
IEI FHUD-I-1 integration control panel with 3 x LCD-MFDs
HMD (SAIRAN HMDS-I-3 display)
MIL STD 1553

Navi-Comm
Navigation: IEI FMMS Mobile Map generator + INS/GPS + TACAN
Communications: IEI ARC-620/1400B U/VHF
Encrypted Datalink

Weapns and Flight management
(AMC) Avionic mission computer
(WMC) Weapons management computer
(DMG) Digital map generator

Weapons: R-77-1 + R-73 WVR

If possible Iran can get some 12 more airframes from russia to raise 3 squadrons of these interceptors.


the problem i see is that Yasin is not lighter than kowsar , in fact its several hundred kg heavier and if also in every metric you consider inferior to kowsar. then why divert resource to it , while we can remove some weapon from kowsar and use it for a trainer which its flying characteristic is a lot more like the airplane those pilots later going to fly with.
by doing this our rate of production would be higher than we produce to different airframe . those two airplane are going to use the same engine and probably avionic the different is their airframe and kowsar airframe is more agile and swifter and maneuverable . the only advantage Yasin have is that its engine are separated from each other and that give it advantage in cas roles but look at it it don't have the necessary armor like A-10 or Su-25 so its better give that role to attack helicopters and drones and i still believe that's a role more suited for army aviation not air-force .

Like I said before Yasin may serve as a basic jet trainer like AT-3 and that is about it. It has no CAS or anything else role in IRIAF. If it comes into production. A pilot may train on its OWj-90 + IEI avionics before moving to Kowsar I/II or other fighters.
 
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Shahed-171 has zero utility for a long-range strike. Its main weapon is its 0.001 m2 RCS which is possible because of its internal bays. Now, these internal bays are not very large and cant hold some very large PGM in them. Yes they can intrude enemy air space with ease, won't be detected and the enemy may have to use fights to track them from aspects where they can't be tracked (Which happened with the Israeli F-35). So their best utility will be in the air where they can serve as Wingmen.

Most air battles happen submach and happen at a distance of 30-50 KM. 2 x Jahesh-700 powered Shahed 171 can carry 2 x Fatter in its internal bays to help manned platforms mess with enemy intruders while they can also carry IEI jammer package to keep on jamming enemy fighters radars.
shahed-171 can't carry even sidewinder in its internal bays . so its air to air weapons probably will be limited to some manpad. and also the design is not that maneuverable,but is eficient on fuel consumption and on a sidenote , the most weapon used by American aircraft is Aim-120, Pakistan hit Indian airplanes in last war by BVR missiles , I say todays most weapon used are BVR weapons.
on other hand you need one small pgm to do much damage to a workshop or an airplane parked on runway or these old shelter which is used in middle-east and only protect you from free fall bombs

Like I said before Yasin may serve as a basic jet trainer like AT-3 and that is about it. It has no CAS or anything else role in IRIAF. If it comes into production. A pilot may train on its OWj-90 + IEI avionics before moving to Kowsar I/II or other fighters.
my question is , why the pilot don't do the training on kowsar itself, then we have an extra production like for kowsar.

by the way my guess is IRIAF don't plan using Kowsar as a fighter but trainer (because of its weak engine) ,and they are waiting on a more powerful and fuel efficient engine become ready so they can produce Kowsar II and use that as a fighter and the Kowsar that already are built will be used as a trainer. that's why they are building them in two seat formation otherwise there are better use for the second pilot space in such small airframe
 
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shahed-171 can't carry even sidewinder in its internal bays . so its air to air weapons probably will be limited to some manpad. and also the design is not that maneuverable,but is eficient on fuel consumption and on a sidenote , the most weapon used by American aircraft is Aim-120, Pakistan hit Indian airplanes in last war by BVR missiles , I say todays most weapon used are BVR weapons.
on other hand you need one small pgm to do much damage to a workshop or an airplane parked on runway or these old shelter which is used in middle-east and only protect you from free fall bombs


my question is , why the pilot don't do the training on kowsar itself, then we have an extra production like for kowsar.

by the way my guess is IRIAF don't plan using Kowsar as a fighter but trainer (because of its weak engine) ,and they are waiting on a more powerful and fuel efficient engine become ready so they can produce Kowsar II and use that as a fighter and the Kowsar that already are built will be used as a trainer. that's why they are building them in two seat formation otherwise there are better use for the second pilot space in such small airframe

We will continue this discussion but can you find me that 1 x Turbofan model Kowsar HESA presented in some airshow? hanging from threads.

Out of all the models we have seen, that one is pretty much the MOST plausible one for Kowsar-II.
 
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Nice report! Includes construction in HESA (Simorgh in particular) and stats on quantities.

 
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You do realize that underground tunnel:

Is similar width and height

To this:

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Just because there is no fighter jets now doesn’t mean they can’t fit them in there. No point right now since war is not on horizon. Pilots still need to train.

Plus outside of F-14 and a few Mig’s not a lot of high value air assets exist in Iran’s airforce anymore.
 
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