Iran unveils hypersonic weapon 'Fattah'

[TheImmortal]

Have you checked the map? Diego Garcia is located about 3000 miles away from Iran.

K-4 has a range of 2,000KM with 1,500kg warhead

Go use a ballistic calculator to figure out what the range would be with a 500KG-1000KG warhead. Then come talk about a map.

Diego Garcia runway is massive as well, you cannot disable it with a limited ballistic missile strike.

Who talked about striking the runway? You would strike the command and control facilities, fuel depots, and the hangers pods. You know, the things you need to keep a facility that houses a high value strategic bomber running.

B-2 is very sensitive plane, the shockwave from a K-4 impact estimated at Mach 8+ is a tremendous amount of energy transfer and for a B-2 its sensitive VLO structure can take damage even from afar (non direct hit)

Unless you think this pod:

Is really going to do anything against a BM or it’s shockwave.

 

[Messerschmitt]

Iran's Claims of Developing a Hypersonic Missile Raise Doubts • Stimson Center

Iran recently announced that it had developed a hypersonic missile that can fly at 15 times the speed of sound and defeat missile defense technologies. But there are doubts about whether this is real or propaganda

www.stimson.org

That American Hypersonic RV is a dummy, not real thing.

Such a poorly researched article. This is the only paragraph that actually attempts to address Fattah’s capabilities:

„Speeds achieved by hypersonic projectiles are impressive, but it should also be underlined that conventional ballistic missiles can fly at high speeds, too. They also reach supersonic velocities, especially during their terminal (glide) phase. For example, Iran possesses the Shahab-3 liquid-propelled medium-range ballistic missile, which reportedly reaches a speed of Mach 7 in its final stage. Iran has not clarified whether the Fattah missile could attain hypersonic speeds during the initial phase, which is highly unlikely, or during its terminal phase, which is not an exceptional feature. A game-changing capability of the Fattah missile would be its ability to maneuver during flight, but Iran has not provided any details in this regard. There is no evidence to suggest that the Fattah possesses this capability.“

Ballistic missiles typically reach burn-out speeds that are hypersonic. Most Iranian ballistic missiles achieve that, including Fattah. Nothing unlikely about that. Fattah’s RV has both control surfaces (fins) and a TVC sustainer motor to maneuver during hypersonic flight. Is that no evidence?

 

[LeGenD]

K-4 has a range of 2,000KM with 1,500kg warhead

Go use a ballistic calculator to figure out what the range would be with a 500KG-1000KG warhead. Then come talk about a map.



Who talked about striking the runway? You would strike the command and control facilities, fuel depots, and the hangers pods. You know, the things you need to keep a facility that houses a high value strategic bomber running.

B-2 is very sensitive plane, the shockwave from a K-4 impact estimated at Mach 8+ is a tremendous amount of energy transfer and for a B-2 its sensitive VLO structure can take damage even from afar (non direct hit)

Unless you think this pod:

View attachment 936433

Is really going to do anything against a BM or it’s shockwave.

K-4 maximum flight range is 3000 KM with small warhead.

3000 miles = 4828 KM
2900 miles = 4667 KM

US can also deploy considerable defenses in Diego Garcia when the situation demands it.

Big boasts are easy to make.

Such a poorly researched article. This is the only paragraph that actually attempts to address Fattah’s capabilities:

„Speeds achieved by hypersonic projectiles are impressive, but it should also be underlined that conventional ballistic missiles can fly at high speeds, too. They also reach supersonic velocities, especially during their terminal (glide) phase. For example, Iran possesses the Shahab-3 liquid-propelled medium-range ballistic missile, which reportedly reaches a speed of Mach 7 in its final stage. Iran has not clarified whether the Fattah missile could attain hypersonic speeds during the initial phase, which is highly unlikely, or during its terminal phase, which is not an exceptional feature. A game-changing capability of the Fattah missile would be its ability to maneuver during flight, but Iran has not provided any details in this regard. There is no evidence to suggest that the Fattah possesses this capability.“

Ballistic missiles typically reach burn-out speeds that are hypersonic. Most Iranian ballistic missiles achieve that, including Fattah. Nothing unlikely about that. Fattah’s RV has both control surfaces (fins) and a TVC sustainer motor to maneuver during hypersonic flight. Is that no evidence?

Iran’s First-Ever ‘Hypersonic’ Missile Comes With a Catch

It can allegedly strike targets up to 870 miles away, but does it really do what it claims?

www.popularmechanics.com

If this missile was tested, you can bet your house on the fact that its flight characteristics including speed and trajectory were documented and processed by the SBIRS system for meaningful information. Americans would know what this thing is and how true your claims are. This data will be fed to American and Israeli defenses. This is how it works.

Russian Kinzhal [was] "unstoppable" as well, but...

Being humble is a virtue, Russians will learn this lesson the hard way as well. Try to fix your relationship with the US.

 

[drmeson]

Have you checked the map? Diego Garcia is located about 3000 miles away from Iran. Diego Garcia runway is massive as well, you cannot disable it with a limited ballistic missile strike.

Nothing actually suggests that Iran will have "a limited ballistic missile strike" on any target it deems to be struck. Previous records of IRGC missile strikes in Syria, US bases in Iraq, Kurdistan, Saudi Arabia hint towards use of salvos of missiles and drones.

List of Iranian Ballistic Missile attacks

Day	Date	Target	No. of missiles
Sunday	18 June 2017	ISIS after they detonated Bombs in Iran, killing children	6
Saturday	8 September 2018	Terror group KDPI that often targetted Iranian soldiers on the border	7
Monday	01 October 2018	ISIL	6
Satuday	14 September 2019	Saudi Aramco Oil production Facilities	25
Wednesday	08 January 2020	US bases in Iraq	22
Monday	13 March 2022	Anti Iranian Training Facility/Potential Threat in Erbil	12

............................
Khorramshahr-4 is a post-boost phase vehicle (PBV) that comes down at very high speed. Its actual range is unknown. Its predecessor Khorramshahr-2 with MaRV was estimated by IISS, UK (IISS published plot of range vs warhead) to have a range of 3000 KM for a warhead that can house 35 x 17 Kg clustered bomblets to take out runways. We do not know how many can Khorramshahr-4 PBV can carry for a IRBM range (high apogee). Southern most corner of Iran where TELs can launch salvos of 30 such missiles mean 1000+ bomblets on runaways. From yemen the equation changes even more significantly. Khorramshahr-4's bus can carry ~85 bomblets of 17 kgs each. 30 missiles implies 2550 bomblets. The bombers, the runways will be gone. Something like this level of destruction on US bases is theoretically possible.

Iran's Claims of Developing a Hypersonic Missile Raise Doubts • Stimson Center

Iran recently announced that it had developed a hypersonic missile that can fly at 15 times the speed of sound and defeat missile defense technologies. But there are doubts about whether this is real or propaganda

www.stimson.org

In the entire article, there is not a single technical detail, rather the entire article is made of nontechnical self-guesses and conjectures.

- The author is trying to establish a notion that because Fattah has not yet been battle tested against THAAD, PAC-3 so it's not a battle-tested system. The same logic can be applied toLGM-30 Minuteman ICBM since it has never been tested against S-400, S-300V, Bavar-373, HQ-18, Pongae-6 either so its also not battle-tested against modern long-range OTH clued AESA track-HIMADS of the east. The logic of the system being not battle tested is nonsense since it applies to most of the defense products. Iranian Rezvan (Burkan-3, in Yemen) crossed over PAC-3 defense layers in Saudi arabia in 2019, does this mean Rezvan is automatically better than every other missile in the world because its now "battle tested" against PAC?

- Author is wrong when he says "Iran possesses Shahab-3". Iran does not possess Shahab-3 anymore. It has long been replaced with Emad-MaRV/TRVs. Even their numbers are not that high considering the over-reliance of IRGC on Solid fueled SRBMs, MRBMS in strikes.

- Author is suggesting that Iran has not provided details of the MaRV. He is wrong again. The Arash TVC kickstages have previously been presented at exhibitions, they are used in successfully launched SLV Qassed of Iran.

https://pdf.defence.pk/threads/operational-space-launching-vehicles-slvs-of-iran.742579/

That American Hypersonic RV is a dummy, not real thing.

That means nothing. Mockups show real designed aerodynamics unless the designers come out and say that their previously shown mockup (or dummy as you say) was faulty and we have changed the aerodynamics, which would not happen.

K-4 maximum flight range is 3000 KM with small warhead.

that's K-2 MaRV with IISS estimate of 3000, I have not seen a single western educated guess (actual authetic publication) on K-4 yet. The PBV is totally different ball game than an MaRV.

3000 miles = 4828 KM
2900 miles = 4667 KM

From edge of southern most Iran to Diego Garcia.

 

[LeGenD]

Nothing actually suggests that Iran will have "a limited ballistic missile strike" on any target it deems to be struck. Previous records of IRGC missile strikes in Syria, US bases in Iraq, Kurdistan, Saudi Arabia hint towards use of salvos of missiles and drones.

List of Iranian Ballistic Missile attacks

Day	Date	Target	No. of missiles
Sunday	18 June 2017	ISIS after they detonated Bombs in Iran, killing children	6
Saturday	8 September 2018	Terror group KDPI that often targetted Iranian soldiers on the border	7
Monday	01 October 2018	ISIL	6
Satuday	14 September 2019	Saudi Aramco Oil production Facilities	25
Wednesday	08 January 2020	US bases in Iraq	22
Monday	13 March 2022	Anti Iranian Training Facility/Potential Threat in Erbil	12

Iran can strike at these locations with a salvo of missiles and drones due to their proximity to Iranian homeland.

Diego Garcia is located about 3000 miles away from Iran.

Iran has not shown that Khorramshahr-4 can reach Diego Garcia, speculation is not proof.

Khorramshahr-4 is a post-boost phase vehicle (PBV) that comes down at very high speed. Its actual range is unknown. Its predecessor Khorramshahr-2 with MaRV was estimated by IISS, UK (IISS published plot of range vs warhead) to have a range of 3000 KM for a warhead that can house 35 x 17 Kg clustered bomblets to take out runways. We do not know how many can Khorramshahr-4 PBV can carry for a IRBM range (high apogee). Southern most corner of Iran where TELs can launch salvos of 30 such missiles mean 1000+ bomblets on runaways. From yemen the equation changes even more significantly. Khorramshahr-4's bus can carry ~85 bomblets of 17 kgs each. 30 missiles implies 2550 bomblets. The bombers, the runways will be gone. Something like this level of destruction on US bases is theoretically possible.

View attachment 936445

US has deployed SBIRS constellation to observe and document flight characteristics of missile launches around the world. US would have a fairly good idea of the flight characteristics including range of Khorramshahr-4 from its tests.

THAAD and/or AEGIS can take out a ballistic missile before it can release its bomblets.

- The author is trying to establish a notion that because Fattah has not yet been battle tested against THAAD, PAC-3 so it's not a battle-tested system. The same logic can be applied toLGM-30 Minuteman ICBM since it has never been tested against S-400, S-300V, Bavar-373, HQ-18, Pongae-6 either so its also not battle-tested against modern long-range OTH clued AESA track-HIMADS of the east. The logic of the system being not battle tested is nonsense since it applies to most of the defense products. Iranian Rezvan (Burkan-3, in Yemen) crossed over PAC-3 defense layers in Saudi arabia in 2019, does this mean Rezvan is automatically better than every other missile in the world because its now "battle tested" against PAC?

None of these defense systems can intercept an ICBM, not a single test to this end.

- Author is wrong when he says "Iran possesses Shahab-3". Iran does not possess Shahab-3 anymore. It has long been replaced with Emad-MaRV/TRVs. Even their numbers are not that high considering the over-reliance of IRGC on Solid fueled SRBMs, MRBMS in strikes.

- Author is suggesting that Iran has not provided details of the MaRV. He is wrong again. The Arash TVC kickstages have previously been presented at exhibitions, they are used in successfully launched SLV Qassed of Iran.

https://pdf.defence.pk/threads/operational-space-launching-vehicles-slvs-of-iran.742579/

View attachment 936441
View attachment 936442
View attachment 936443

Thanks.

That means nothing. Mockups show real designed aerodynamics unless the designers come out and say that their previously shown mockup (or dummy as you say) was faulty and we have changed the aerodynamics, which would not happen.

Not sure how it looks.

Raytheon to develop control systems of U.S. Army’s new hypersonic weapon system

Raytheon Co., one of the world's largest defense contractors, has announced that it will use its extensive experience in advanced hypersonic technology to build and deliver the control, actuation and power-conditioning subassemblies that control flight of the Army's hypersonic weapon glide body...

defence-blog.com

Path to Install Hypersonic Weapons on Arleigh Burke Destroyers Unclear - USNI News

In order to accommodate the equivalent of an intermediate-range ballistic missile aboard the Navy’s current crop of destroyers, the service would need to undertake complex modifications to both the Zumwalt and Arleigh Burke classes of ships to install a long-range hypersonic strike weapon on...

news.usni.org

 

[Muhammed45]

Have you checked the map? Diego Garcia is located about 3000 miles away from Iran. Diego Garcia runway is massive as well, you cannot disable it with a limited ballistic missile strike.

Iran's Claims of Developing a Hypersonic Missile Raise Doubts • Stimson Center

Iran recently announced that it had developed a hypersonic missile that can fly at 15 times the speed of sound and defeat missile defense technologies. But there are doubts about whether this is real or propaganda

www.stimson.org

That American Hypersonic RV is a dummy, not real thing.

USA has developed a gliding vehicle. With hypersonic speed. It doesn't need to have edgy shape to make people believe it so.

Many people had doubts when Iranian warheads were raining over American airbase which hosted American presidents and defense ministers hemce well protected. Now they believe it.

 

[Hack-Hook]

1) Vietnam defeated US, because Chinese entered in Vietnam to fight US, there was danger of US, US forces were coming near China.

2)

After 9/11: Same, In Afghanistan, US came for China, Russia. So Russians weapons, Chinese money and Pakistani mullah of Madrasahs defeated them.

Soviet Days: US, NATO + Arabs supplied weapons+ money and Pakistan mullahs to defeat Soviets (Russia). Reason to support Pakistan was Soviets might disrupt trade route of US, EU from Pakistani waters.

If we even look Syria, Russia came just to support his own interest as EU, US want to pipeline to EU from Qatar via Syria. If this happened. EU was not getting Russians gas.

If we look Ukraine, if Russian win, Russia will be very close to EU,
If Ukraine win, NATO will have another territory to keep air bases and keep nukes there.

Iranis are living Fantasy world of Disney. Fight with nuclear power has same fate like Japan in WW2.

Unbelievable

 

[LeGenD]

that's K-2 MaRV with IISS estimate of 3000, I have not seen a single western educated guess (actual authetic publication) on K-4 yet. The PBV is totally different ball game than an MaRV.

American agencies will be tight-lipped.

Nothing concrete about K-4 from your side either. Even if it is IRBM class, small and/or relatively soft stuff such as PENAIDS/bomblets will not survive during the reentry process. Bomblets can be dropped on a target from suitable platforms in practical conditions. For instance, American forces will use an ATACM or a Tomahawk cruise missile to deploy bomblets on a target. K-4 RV is your best bet and kinetic option, therefore.

From edge of southern most Iran to Diego Garcia.


View attachment 936451

OK, I have rechecked this side on Google Maps. It turned out to be 3832 KM in this case. Still, engaging Diego Garcia from this far in a comprehensive way is not an easy task. The island is very thin and US can put significant defenses on it if necessary. I have pointed out before that American missile defense systems such as THAAD and AEGIS can take out an RV in exo- conditions or outside Earth. Time to dial down the rhetoric and be realistic.

You cannot win a war with conventionally-armed ballistic missiles. Time has shown this repeatedly in different fronts around the world. Iranian model of warfare has deterrence effects but it is not going to produce desired results in offensive capacity. But you people will not get it until war comes to you. Some people are destined to learn things the hard way. I do not have virtually endless time and appetite to address Iranian "theories." Carry on.

 

[drmeson]

American agencies will be tight-lipped.

You are wrong if we go by detailed public/private sector Western publications on Iranian missiles before. Here is IISS, a government funded NATO-affiliated think tank of UK/US experts obsessing with Iranian missiles for pages and pages. I can give more examples where even materials of jet vanes of Iranian missiles are discussed.

https://www.iiss.org/research-paper//2021/04/iran-missiles-uavs-proliferation

So yeah, Americans or NATO-affiliated publishing groups have never been tight-lipped about Iranian capabilities and their own counters to that.

Nothing concrete about K-4 from your side either.

You are wrong. They even showed its MaRV's inside.

Even if it is IRBM class, small and/or relatively soft stuff such as PENAIDS/bomblets will not survive during the reentry process.

Bomblets are never deployed at re-entry. Thinking that a 80 x 17-20 kg bomblet package will open-up at exo-endo transition phase at 50-100 KM is just absurd. The RV releases them over target much later in the terminal phase otherwise they will scatter here and there.

In case of K-4, PBV dodges Exo-atmospheric HIMADS, while cluster munitions dodges/takes out shorads. Its an almost perfect weapon tin its class to destroy airbases. 30 x K-4 strikes means an AB is gone.

https://twitter.com/muntagab/status/1663686012491505665

Besides, penaids are not EXCLUSIVELY deployed during re-entry either, it depends upon what kind of air defense the designers of the RV are trying to defeat. If it's a Mid-Ranged ABM layer then Penaids are deployed endoatmospheric or terminally, if ABM is HIMADS then case is different.

I gave the example of the relatively much downgraded Iranian Rezvan PBV (Qiam-3 in IRGC, Burkan-3 in the hands of Houthis) it flew over PAC-3 unchallenged in 2020. K-4 is just another level animal.

IRGC's Rezvan/Houthis Burkan-3 strike in 2021 (Blue)

PAC-3 defended zones in KSA.

We were told PAC-3 is just invincible

K-4 RV is your best bet and kinetic option, therefore.

We have a far more dangerous weapon called Sejjil-II/III in the arsenal for the IRBM strike. Apart from the extremely accurate solid fueled systems originating from the Fateh Solid fueled Quasi ballistic Family that gave birth to Kheybar Shikan and Fattah Skip/HGVs, Sejjil Family forms the larger MRBM/RBM/SLV core of Iranian strike forces and space program.

Its an entirely different family of solid fueled MRBM/IRBMs thats now 15-17 years old. What is its latest version? what is the trajectory, how much lateral vectors its MaRV can produce? no one knows.

Some experts like Norbert Brugge estimate that with a Kick-off TVC stage like in Iranian SLVs its range can be around 3700 KM (or with a powerful booster like Raafe)

One of the tested SLV's that shares Sejjil's origin.

OK, I have rechecked this side on Google Maps. It turned out to be 3832 KM in this case. Still, engaging Diego Garcia from this far in a comprehensive way is not an easy task.

I told you, your initial estimates were just wrong. You may have been measuring distance from some city in Iran.

The island is very thin and US can put significant defenses on it if necessary.

Well they did not, the last time IRGC struck them.

I have pointed out before that American missile defense systems such as THAAD and AEGIS can take out an RV in exo- conditions or outside Earth.

Conjecture. Exoatmospheric manuverability can negate tracking while Iranian missiles are constantly showing mid-course corrections in recent times. K-4, Rezvan, Fattah, Ghadr all do midcourse dance.

One example.

Time to dial down the rhetoric and be realistic.

You were claiming Diego Garcia is out of the question. I proved to you that it's possible.

You cannot win a war with conventionally-armed ballistic missiles. Time has shown this repeatedly in different fronts around the world. Iranian model of warfare has deterrence effects but it is not going to produce desired results in offensive capacity. But you people will not get it until war comes to you. Some people are destined to learn things the hard way. I do not have virtually endless time and appetite to address Iranian "theories." Carry on.

I don't do political commentary.

 

[drmeson]

Iran can strike at these locations with a salvo of missiles and drones due to their proximity to Iranian homeland.

Iran can strike anything around ~3000 KM away from its borders considering the Road mobile TEL's of K-2/4 and Sejjil-II/III. We can discuss the warhead choices but here the question is range.

Diego Garcia is located about 3000 miles away from Iran.

You were wrong. You accepted above.

None of these defense systems can intercept an ICBM, not a single test to this end.

And not a single test has been done by PAC-3, THAAD, AEGIS against Fattah either. Fair enough? Like I said the same stupid logic of the author whose article you posted, can be applied to LGM-30 Minuteman ICBM since it has never been tested against S-400, S-300V, Bavar-373, HQ-18, Pongae-6 either so it also not battle-tested against modern long-range OTH clued AESA track-HIMADS of the east.

Thanks.

You are welcome indeed. The author of the article you posted was wasting everyones time.

Not sure how it looks.

Raytheon to develop control systems of U.S. Army’s new hypersonic weapon system

Raytheon Co., one of the world's largest defense contractors, has announced that it will use its extensive experience in advanced hypersonic technology to build and deliver the control, actuation and power-conditioning subassemblies that control flight of the Army's hypersonic weapon glide body...

defence-blog.com

Path to Install Hypersonic Weapons on Arleigh Burke Destroyers Unclear - USNI News

In order to accommodate the equivalent of an intermediate-range ballistic missile aboard the Navy’s current crop of destroyers, the service would need to undertake complex modifications to both the Zumwalt and Arleigh Burke classes of ships to install a long-range hypersonic strike weapon on...

news.usni.org

And this proves what?

It actually reinforces my initial point that even if the American HGV is a dummy (you claimed), the aerodynamics of the vehicle is like Fattah. Dummy or not, the aerodynamic design is close to Fattah.

Some members here think that only way to be a hypersonic class weapon is that the vehicle should only be like DF-17's HGV. Unfortunately for them, even the American design is not like that forget Khinzal or Fattah.

 

[LeGenD]

You are wrong if we go by detailed public/private sector Western publications on Iranian missiles before. Here is IISS, a government funded NATO-affiliated think tank of UK/US experts obsessing with Iranian missiles for pages and pages. I can give more examples where even materials of jet vanes of Iranian missiles are discussed.

https://www.iiss.org/research-paper//2021/04/iran-missiles-uavs-proliferation

So yeah, Americans or NATO-affiliated publishing groups have never been tight-lipped about Iranian capabilities and their own counters to that.

This is open source analysis of Iran's missiles. I pointed out the fact that US does not publish data collected from its spy satellites.

But thanks for the share, something better than nothing.

You are wrong. They even showed its MaRV's inside.

View attachment 937307

I would like to see published specifications of K-4.

Bomblets are never deployed at re-entry. Thinking that a 80 x 17-20 kg bomblet package will open-up at exo-endo transition phase at 50-100 KM is just absurd. The RV releases them over target much later in the terminal phase otherwise they will scatter here and there.

Yes, this is correct. THAAD and AEGIS will have sufficient window to defeat K-4 RV (or MaRV), therefore.

Take a look at this:

THAAD intercept window is massive in comparison to Patriot intercept window.
AEGIS intercept window is bigger than that of THAAD as well.

In case of K-4, PBV dodges Exo-atmospheric HIMADS, while cluster munitions dodges/takes out shorads. Its an almost perfect weapon tin its class to destroy airbases. 30 x K-4 strikes means an AB is gone.

https://twitter.com/muntagab/status/1663686012491505665

An RV (or MaRV) cannot dodge a well-designed interceptor in real time. This is a blind vehicle following a preprogrammed pathway to reach a target. An MaRV will maneuver for course-correction or it can be programmed to follow a somewhat curved trajectory during reentry process to reach a target. A well-designed interceptor operates on an entirely different principle in comparison, it is programmed to take cues from radar system(s) and/or other forms of tracking assets to move in the direction of an incoming RV (or MaRV), and is equipped with an electro-optical sensor system of its own to detect, identify and engage an RV (or MaRV).

StackPath

The benefit of using a PBV is that it allows a ballistic missile to deploy a single RV with PENAIDS (or) several RV to engage different targets. This system compels the defender to launch more interceptors to intercept each RV if possible.

Besides, penaids are not EXCLUSIVELY deployed during re-entry either, it depends upon what kind of air defense the designers of the RV are trying to defeat. If it's a Mid-Ranged ABM layer then Penaids are deployed endoatmospheric or terminally, if ABM is HIMADS then case is different.

PENAIDS cannot survive in reentry phase of the flight.

PENAIDS are best used with an ICBM to create a threat cloud to disguise its RV during midcourse phase of the flight. But Americans are working to address this challenge:

Long-Range Discrimination Radar Reshapes Adversaries' Calculus for Attacks Against U.S. Ho

The Missile Defense Agency, U.S. Northern Command and the Space Force marked the completion of construction on the long-range discrimination radar site at Clear Space Force Station, Alaska, during a

www.defense.gov

I gave the example of the relatively much downgraded Iranian Rezvan PBV (Qiam-3 in IRGC, Burkan-3 in the hands of Houthis) it flew over PAC-3 unchallenged in 2020. K-4 is just another level animal.

IRGC's Rezvan/Houthis Burkan-3 strike in 2021 (Blue)

View attachment 937316

PAC-3 defended zones in KSA.

View attachment 937315

We were told PAC-3 is just invincible

Man-made stuff is not invincible, and I do not see Americans hyping their stuff as "unstoppable." I mostly see Asian countries hyping their stuff as "unstoppable" because Asians like to boast on average. This mindset is in part due to being underachievers.

Saudi Patriot systems have intercepted Burkan-2H and Burkan-3 missiles on different occasions. Saudi provided visual evidence of a Patriot system intercepting a Burkan-3 MRBM over Riyadh in 2021. Refer to information in following posts:

Zionist Analysts: No Systems Able to Hit Fattah

Zionist Analysts: No Systems Able to Hit Fattah TEL AVIV (Dispatches) -- Media analysts and commentators in Occupied Palestine have been discussing Iran’s new hypersonic missile that was unveiled on Tuesday by chief commander of the Islamic Revolution Guards Corps, Major General Hussein Salami...

pdf.defence.pk

Zionist Analysts: No Systems Able to Hit Fattah

Zionist Analysts: No Systems Able to Hit Fattah TEL AVIV (Dispatches) -- Media analysts and commentators in Occupied Palestine have been discussing Iran’s new hypersonic missile that was unveiled on Tuesday by chief commander of the Islamic Revolution Guards Corps, Major General Hussein Salami...

pdf.defence.pk

WE do not know what happened in Dammam. Emirati Patriot system might be undergoing maintenance checks or its software malfunctioned at the time. Anything is possible.

We have a far more dangerous weapon called Sejjil-II/III in the arsenal for the IRBM strike. Apart from the extremely accurate solid fueled systems originating from the Fateh Solid fueled Quasi ballistic Family that gave birth to Kheybar Shikan and Fattah Skip/HGVs, Sejjil Family forms the larger MRBM/RBM/SLV core of Iranian strike forces and space program.

Its an entirely different family of solid fueled MRBM/IRBMs thats now 15-17 years old. What is its latest version? what is the trajectory, how much lateral vectors its MaRV can produce? no one knows.

Some experts like Norbert Brugge estimate that with a Kick-off TVC stage like in Iranian SLVs its range can be around 3700 KM (or with a powerful booster like Raafe)

One of the tested SLV's that shares Sejjil's origin.

Thanks for providing this information. Iranian rocket industry is decent for an Asian country. You will not see me doubting Iranian rocket industry.

My argument is in view of the observation that Iranians on PDF have grossly underestimated American technologies and solutions. Anybody who has studied technology would know better. Refer to information in following post:

Iran unveils hypersonic weapon 'Fattah'

Gayreak Iran sells weapons to 50 countries worldwide and you talk about quality https://www.israeldefense.co.il/en/node/57301 Watch your language.

pdf.defence.pk

Both THAAD and AEGIS can intercept MACH 22 capable ballistic missiles. You can do the math.

I told you, your initial estimates were just wrong. You may have been measuring distance from some city in Iran.

And I have accepted this mistake. I do not argue for the sake of it. I strive for facts and figures.

Well they did not, the last time IRGC struck them.

View attachment 937297

Iraq does not have defenses against ballistic missiles. Iraq's Ayan al-Asad airbase does not have defenses against ballistic missiles.

Conjecture. Exoatmospheric manuverability can negate tracking while Iranian missiles are constantly showing mid-course corrections in recent times. K-4, Rezvan, Fattah, Ghadr all do midcourse dance.

One example.

View attachment 937322

See above.

You were claiming Diego Garcia is out of the question. I proved to you that it's possible.

See above.

I don't do political commentary.

Fair enough. I do appreciate you for sharing valuable information.

 

[ReasonableStar75]

Diego Garcia island would be destroyed by Iran, if uses this island to launch attacks on Iran, and the same goes with any other base used against Iran.

Iran is not Russia, if Iran is attacked anyone here must expect a real retaliation. Iran is the only country has dared to destroy US bases, if any attack occurs again, well Iran this time is btter prepared with powerfull missiles.

I assume US for now doesn t want to test Iran, for a reason,clearly, not because they are good guys.

Some people here overstimate US capabilities, yes they are good technology researchers, by i don t consider US troops suicidal... and don t worry, if a war develops in persian gulf, situation is favorable for Iran since Iran is not worried about any missile tradeoff with US military. Iran is ready for any showdown and take US oil in front of US military all the time.

Time is evolving favorable to Iran,betting for Iranian horse is the wise way in the region, all countries are aware of thsi reality by now, superopower sill be shocked with Iran power status in next years. Beware, Iran wants enemies to beware.

 

[serenity]

Conical type can be a "gliding" wave rider! Especially since we know both China and US have experimented and flown dual conical shaped wave rider HGVs.

Earliest American assumption (they were only tracking those flights using satellites and sea based radars plus the early warning ones in Taiwan island) of Chinese Wu-14 test flights imagined the Wu-14 as a dual conical shaped vehicle with endoatmospheric control surface fins. In fact China keeps most quite hidden but it's very possible the US knew something of those test vehicle shapes. China tested dozens in the 2000s and I recall seeing a graphic with a few dozen design types. More than half of that list were conical shaped HGVs.

Ever since, the shaping refinement process were made faster by the aid of supercomputing.

Cannot say this thing is not a glider just because it isn't the wedge form. In fact, rocket addition seems to indicate it is used for horizontal push which may suggest control in x.

The difficulty with these moving hypersonic (non ballistic hypersonic) is actually control, targeting and sensing chains (can't launch at targets you don't know exist and you don't know where), and communication with kinetic weapon to hit moving targets. Those technical feats are MUCH more impressive than a hypersonic object. If Iran can hit aircraft carriers or ships using these types of weapons then their ISR and targeting is second to none.

 

[mohsen]

He describes a missile without mentioning it's name!

Max speed: mach 12-16
Impact speed: mach 5-7

واکنش‌ها به توانمندی موشکی و پهپادی کشور | خبرگزاری صدا و سیما

 

[NooriNuth]

He describes a missile without mentioning it's name!

Max speed: mach 12-16
Impact speed: mach 5-7

واکنش‌ها به توانمندی موشکی و پهپادی کشور | خبرگزاری صدا و سیما

Impact speed is unusually high for a ballistic missile