India's Missile Defenses Can Now Take On Decoys. That's a Really Big Deal

[Vijyes Yechury]

MIRV is intercepted one warhead at a time. India can do that. There is no MIRVED BMD missile which carries multiple kill vehicle in single missile. Every warhead is treated as separate and each one is targeted.

India has already reached this level

When you get there, then we'll talk.

You said the same thing about nukes, yet look where we are now.

 

[Hamza913]

India has already reached this level

Keep telling yourself that.

 

[LeGenD]

MIRV is intercepted one warhead at a time. India can do that. There is no MIRVED BMD missile which carries multiple kill vehicle in single missile. Every warhead is treated as separate and each one is targeted.

India has already reached this level

India is receiving valuable input from Russia and Israel in the matters of its BMDS.

However, Indian BMDS is in testing phase, and not close to being operationally relevant yet.

India needs a decade or two, to establish a comprehensive BMDS.

 

[hussain0216]

BMD does not stop everything but just many things. That is good enough. Better to get hit with 50 warheads than 150. Also, saturation fire on one target due to BMD can protect the others due to warhead limitations

We have 150 now by the time we are through we will have enough warheads to make india glow like candle

 

[Ultima Thule]

MIRV is intercepted one warhead at a time. India can do that. There is no MIRVED BMD missile which carries multiple kill vehicle in single missile. Every warhead is treated as separate and each one is targeted.

India has already reached this level

No india haven't that capability yet you have only explosive warhead to down incoming nuke warheads, there is only two nations that have posses MKV tech and that two nations are USA/China, Even russia haven't MKV tech @Vijyes Yechury enjoy:

 

[randomradio]

India is receiving valuable input from Russia and Israel in the matters of its BMDS.

Not Russia, France and Israel.

However, Indian BMDS is in testing phase, and not close to being operationally relevant yet.

India needs a decade or two, to establish a comprehensive BMDS.

The Phase 1 is ready for deployment and has been designed to stop anything Pakistan has in its arsenal meant to attack North and West India.

But South and East Indian cities are partially open to attack and require Phase 2.

We don't need a decade or two. The entire system for Phase 1 will be up and running very soon. And Phase 2 will be developed much faster than Phase 1 since the foundational technologies are already almost complete.

This will be the initial Phase 1 set up:

The early warning sites for Phase 1 have already been decided.

So the Phase 1 interceptors with their FCRs and C&C units can be placed anywhere inside the blue circles, up to a distance of 1000Km from the centre, and will provide BMD within the circle. You can imagine small 50Km radii peppered around inside the big circles.

When you get there, then we'll talk.

You said the same thing about nukes, yet look where we are now.

Stopping decoys was the problem. But stopping MIRVs is not as big a technical challenge, it's more of a financial and numerical challenge.

MIRVs are designed for saturation attacks and overwhelm BMD while at lower cost to the attacker. Firing 3 missiles with 3 warheads is more expensive for the attacker than 1 missile with 3 warheads. But the actual BMD process itself is the same, with the exception that the BMD has lesser time to react.

Earlier, 1 missile could drop only 1 warhead, so we had to earmark only a few missiles for BMD. But with MIRV, we now have to earmark many times more missiles for BMD.

With increasing number of targets, we need to increase launchers, missiles and fire control radars. So the main idea is to increase the financial burden on the defender, while making it cheaper for the attacker.

In the recent test, we could separate decoys from the warhead, which is a much, much harder task than defeating MIRVs.

 

[amardeep mishra]

Sorry i missed this one name one marv programme which had or is using such seeker

If you really want to discriminate between decoy and warhead in re entry stage you must sensor fuz high resolution xband radar data with high quality iir sensor data in real-time. That is beyond indian capability. Till date or use just xband

@Fawadqasim1
I am not here to spoonfeed you. But since you repeatedly fail to do your homework properly, let me school you. First off, pershing did have very decent terminal maneuvering capability aided by some sort of terminal guidance.
Secondly, throwing around words like sensor fusion will not help here. Sensor fusion is something that ordinary undergrad can implement at a lower level using ordinary complementary filter. I am assuming undergrads in Pakistan engage in fruitful technical education and not religious bigotry. Now in case you do not know what complementary filter is, I will briefly explain it here-
It is a filter(one of the most commonly used in hobby UAV design) to fuse angle data from gyro and accelerometer. A more advanced filter would be something like Kalman filter. Modern practice is to use Neural Network based Kalman filter to fuse data coming from more than one source. So no, it is not beyond India's reach at the moment.
And lastly, you can detect or shall I say discriminate between actual warhead and the decoy provided you have higher resolution focal planar array as IIR seeker in the missile or by an AESA radar-- thankfully India has both.
Just food for you thought-- kindly go through some of the ground based AESA radars designed by India or developed in collaboration with Israel(see swordfish) and their capabilities, thanks in advance.
PS- also see, when I talk about discrimination based on beta, I am invariably refering to indo-atmospheric interception, where atmospheric effects are relevant.
PSS- US does have very decent indo-atmospheric interception capability based on discrimination of target from decoy.

Really which decoy Einstein usa is wasting billions upon billions Uselessly. They should buy 1080*1080 sensor from Turkey they are cheap cheap and high quality, should hire a few system integration engineers and software engineers and walla you have a cheap abm system which can discriminate between a warhead and a decoy they are foolish aren't they. Einstein

Oh the ground based sensor

You know what your claims are like

engine which runs on pure water.

A perpetual motion machine

jokes aside if you are relying on iir tech to discriminate between decoy and warhead then God save you

Dont waste time, I know you cant comprehend anything technical. You have no idea about either exo-atmospheric interception or indo-atmospheric interception. Seriously is the level of technical education in Pakistan that low, like really that low?

The early warning sites for Phase 1 have already been decided.

So the Phase 1 interceptors with their FCRs and C&C units can be placed anywhere inside the blue circles, up to a distance of 1000Km from the centre, and will provide BMD within the circle. You can imagine small 50Km radii peppered around inside the big circles.

You're right this time. There are things I wish I could write here, but let me say that Indian radars specifically designed to track RVs have been deployed at certain places.

 

[Vijyes Yechury]

India is receiving valuable input from Russia and Israel in the matters of its BMDS.

However, Indian BMDS is in testing phase, and not close to being operationally relevant yet.

India needs a decade or two, to establish a comprehensive BMDS.

India will not test a system for 10 years and still keep testing. Phase-1 is almost complete. It is phase-2 work mainly going on. That will be much faster than phase-1.

India did not receive much of assitance from Russia in BMD except the study of older system. India may have used the older system of SA-6, S300 to study on working of BMD. India mainly collaborated with Israel in BMD and SAM.

We have 150 now by the time we are through we will have enough warheads to make india glow like candle

Pakistan, IMO, has about 250 warheads by now. It extracts about 25ton or Uranium and can make 20 bombs a year. So, at best, Pakistan will have 500 bombs by about 2030-2035. India can extract much more Uranium as India has much higher quantity. What Pakistan can do, India can do 50-100 times

No india haven't that capability yet you have only explosive warhead to down incoming nuke warheads, there is only two nations that have posses MKV tech and that two nations are USA/China, Even russia haven't MKV tech @Vijyes Yechury enjoy:

How many times should one tell you that MIRV is just about finance and multiplier? It is just more warheads with less missiles to make it cheaper for the attacker.

 

[Ultima Thule]

How many times should one tell you that MIRV is just about finance and multiplier? It is just more warheads with less missiles to make it cheaper for the attacker.

yes but tripled expenditures of defender @Vijyes Yechury

How many times should one tell you that MIRV is just about finance and multiplier? It is just more warheads with less missiles to make it cheaper for the attacker.

And radiation is the worst part of nuke, if few denotes in few hundred feet above the cities of India, it will a disaster for india @Vijyes Yechury

 

[Vijyes Yechury]

yes but tripled expenditures of defender @Vijyes Yechury

This is true but I am only speaking of capability. Cost is another issue.

And radiation is the worst part of nuke, if few denotes in few hundred feet above the cities of India, it will a disaster for india @Vijyes Yechury

That is a myth. It has been proven by several testing that nukes do not cause much radiation when exploded. It is the sustained reaction in reactors that cause more radioactivity than an instant explosion. Your radioactivity is based on media hype without any statistics or evidence to back it. Some cowards also write blogs and articles to scare people about nukes. But all of these are just myth. No data exists that says of radioactivity. The only main radiation in nukes is thermal radiation or heat wave for 5 seconds

 

[Fawadqasim1]

This false sense of security is the most dangerous thing. It will ensures a nuclear exchange between the two countries this system might be good for stoping 50% conventional warheads but nuclear or tn warheads. With three 1.5 mt warheads
With 45 to 50 seconds intervals one at 50km altitude the other at 25km altitude and the last one at 5km altitude will devastate your city with its bmds just with 3 shaheen iis it wont cost more than a jf 17. Its very easy to make a jet engine for an rc plane in a machine shop but making state of the art turbofan engine is a totally different ball game. I hope you understand what i am contemplating.

 

[Ultima Thule]

This is true but I am only speaking of capability. Cost is another issue.

capabilities wise also work not 100%, US mid course defense system will defend less then 50 ICBM out of 100 ICBM fired by China and Russia your AAD PAAD is definitely not better than US mid course defense system @Vijyes Yechury

hat is a myth. It has been proven by several testing that nukes do not cause much radiation when exploded. It is the sustained reaction in reactors that cause more radioactivity than an instant explosion. Your radioactivity is based on media hype without any statistics or evidence to back it. Some cowards also write blogs and articles to scare people about nukes. But all of these are just myth. No data exists that says of radioactivity. The only main radiation in nukes is thermal radiation or heat wave for 5 seconds

radioactivity still have greatest threats for mankind either its form of bomb or chain reaction both have same mechanism @Vijyes Yechury , Hiroshima, and Nagasaki radioactivity had gone in 2016, Chernobyl accidents and tree miles radiactivity will be gone in after 2050 @Vijyes Yechury

 

[Mrc]

There is a brain farting competition here by semi educated neighbours.... man whole thread is stinking now

 

[Fawadqasim1]

This is true but I am only speaking of capability. Cost is another issue.


That is a myth. It has been proven by several testing that nukes do not cause much radiation when exploded. It is the sustained reaction in reactors that cause more radioactivity than an instant explosion. Your radioactivity is based on media hype without any statistics or evidence to back it. Some cowards also write blogs and articles to scare people about nukes. But all of these are just myth. No data exists that says of radioactivity. The only main radiation in nukes is thermal radiation or heat wave for 5 seconds

Ask the survivors of hiroshima and nagasaki
And it also depends upon the design

There is a brain farting competition here by semi educated neighbours.... man whole thread is stinking now

Absolutely

 

[Mrc]

Absolutely

This is another tejas and arjun in making ...