'Indians' tortured, buried alive in Saudi Arabia: Report

[anonymus]

+ Marxism is a religion.

 

[janon]

+ Marxism is a religion.

Very much so. But even without going that far, it is easy to see that god fearing people have done more mass murders and pogroms than godless ones. In the past and in the present. Only the most blinkered god botherers can deny that.

 

[Falcon29]

The godless societies are also the most developed.

Anyway, you attributed godlessness as the cause when it suited your POV, but when given contradicting facts, instead of modifying the conclusion, you are finding new excuses.

If it has nothing to do with religion, why did you bring it in in the first place?



.

For Muslims and Arabs it is about religion, Saudi Arabia is a well developed society that is well educated but there is immorality and unnecessary structure of society and laws. When Muslims follow the true Islam, cases of sexual harassment become less. Non-Muslims won't understand this because they never had Godly societies in the first place and only people who did were the Jews at the time of Moses.

 

[janon]

For Muslims and Arabs it is about religion, Saudi Arabia is a well developed society that is well educated but there is immorality and unnecessary structure of society and laws. When Muslims follow the true Islam, cases of sexual harassment become less. Non-Muslims won't understand this because they never had Godly societies in the first place and only people who did were the Jews at the time of Moses.

Ah yes of course, the non muslims will never understand it anyway. That must be a slap on @Hermione 's face, the only other person who has been trying to propogate your view that godlessness causes these things. He is not a muslim.

While muslims make these ludicrous statements, people who have never been muslims, like south koreans and chinese and singaporeans and japanese and brazilians and swedes continue to live in peace and prosperity, valuing human lives and championing human rights, while muslim countries...

But that fact is conveniently explained away with the "no true scotsman" fallacy. Real muslims don't do that. Right.

 

[Hermione]

And similarly, the commies did not do genocides and mass murders because of godlessness, but because of communism. Which is why, bringing godlessness into it is ludicrous. BTW the topic is saudi arabia, and calling them godless is like calling jews as Nazis.

Germany may be a christian country technically, but in fact it has one of the highest percentage of atheists in western europe, and the world. In fact the eastern half of germany is the most irreligious part of the world. They have very high rates of goddlessness, and yes, a much better and peacceful and prosperous society than most god fearing ones.

Irreligion in Germany - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I didn't say gengiz khan was a muslim, did I? I said he was not godless, he practised religion. Your assertion that most mass murders were by godless people is historically unttrue. Timur, gengiz khan, hitler, ghazni, ghauri, and most mass murderers were religious people. Hitler may not have been a practising christian but he was very much a christian, and in bed with the catholic church. Besides, the entire nazi campaign of jew hatred was firmly rooted in christianitys persection of jews through two millenia, and nazism was only the culmination of that.

To keep it short - most mass murders were NOT by godless regimes, but by god fearing ones. Simple incontrevertible fact, that you god botherers cannot deny.

Communism itself was born of rejection of God/Church, so by extension their deed should be attributed to godlessness.

A large part of Europe's and Germany's prosperity can be attributed to their lack of defense spending. USA shoulders most of cost and Europe as a result is free to spend their earnings on non-defense expenditure. Another part of their prosperity is due to their inflated currencies. A result of the white dominance in the world market and nothing to do with their belief in god or lack of it.

 

[Falcon29]

Ah yes of course, the non muslims will never understand it anyway. That must be a slap on @Hermione 's face, the only other person who has been trying to propogate your view that godlessness causes these things. He is not a muslim.

While muslims make these ludicrous statements, people who have never been muslims, like south koreans and chinese and singaporeans and japanese and brazilians and swedes continue to live in peace and prosperity, valuing human lives and championing human rights, while muslim countries...

But that fact is conveniently explained away with the "no true scotsman" fallacy. Real muslims don't do that. Right.

For you

Peace=Godliness

That's not what religion is about and our Prophet told us we would be in the worst state eventually.

 

[Sriram]

Nonsense. Hitler was not a practicing Christian nor was Gengiz Khan a muslim throughout his rampage. Neither were motivated by their religious beliefs. Stalin, Mao, and the godless commies under Khmer Rouge were the most ruthless killers of all.

Germany is a Christian country as is UK. The Scandinavian countries who are leading in HDI and other prosperity indices do so not because they are godless but because they are resource rich countries with sparse population.

Gengis khan had nothing to do with islam ... KHAN is a title not a religious name

 

[janon]

Communism itself was born of rejection of God/Church, so by extension their deed should be attributed to godlessness.

A large part of Europe's and Germany's prosperity can be attributed to their lack of defense spending. USA shoulders most of cost and Europe as a result is free to spend their earnings on non-defense expenditure. Another part of their prosperity is due to their inflated currencies. A result of the white dominance in the world market and nothing to do with their belief in god or lack of it.

No. Communism was born out of marxism, a falied social and economic theory. There are perfectly capitalistic and godless societies. There is no logical corollary from godlessness to communism. These are empty charges that the god botherers bring up to pretend that godlessness leads to evils. No, empirically it is the other way round.

No, the prosperity of nordic countries and germany and japan is not due to inflated currencies. Sorry, I can't keep taking down one lie after another like this.

For you

Peace=Godliness

That's not what religion is about and our Prophet told us we would be in the worst state eventually.

No, peace != godliness. But godliness is not equal to peace either, which is your original assertion that started this exchange. Social evils like this do not arise due to godlessness, which was your original claim. And yes, today godless countries are more peaceful than godbothering ones.

 

[Hermione]

Ah yes of course, the non muslims will never understand it anyway. That must be a slap on @Hermione 's face, the only other person who has been trying to propogate your view that godlessness causes these things. He is not a muslim.

While muslims make these ludicrous statements, people who have never been muslims, like south koreans and chinese and singaporeans and japanese and brazilians and swedes continue to live in peace and prosperity, valuing human lives and championing human rights, while muslim countries...

But that fact is conveniently explained away with the "no true scotsman" fallacy. Real muslims don't do that. Right.

I never said that godlessness exclusively causes these things like you were trying to dump things on religiosity. Let me say that I have the utmost contempt for organized religions.

None of the societies you mentioned are free of violence or crime.

Gengis khan had nothing to do with islam ... KHAN is a title not a religious name

I said Gengiz Khan was not a muslim during his killing period.

 

[janon]

I never said that godlessness exclusively causes these things like you were trying to dump things on religiosity. Let me say that I have the utmost contempt for organized religions.

None of the societies you mentioned are free of violence or crime.

No, I waasn't. A total misrepresentation of what I was saying. I only said that these social evils do not happen due to religion, which was hazzy's original claim, which is a patentable canard.

No society is completely free of crime, but godless ones like germany and scandinavia and south korea have much lower levels than god botherers. And much better respect for human rights.

 

[Falcon29]

No, peace != godliness. But godliness is not equal to peace either, which is your original assertion that started this exchange. Social evils like this do not arise due to godlessness, which was your original claim. And yes, today godless countries are more peaceful than godbothering ones.

No, for me religion is more than peace and whatever 'peace' means to you. You don't what's peace.

God didn't create this universe to make it meaningless and without guidance. If we would all just live this how we wish and not be held accountable there is something very mysterious about such a universe.

 

[janon]

Gengis khan had nothing to do with islam ... KHAN is a title not a religious name

He practiced mongolian shamanism.

 

[Hermione]

No, the prosperity of nordic countries and germany and japan is not due to inflated currencies. Sorry, I can't keep taking down one lie after another like this.

It is. They do not have any defense expenditure. I did not include Japan in the group of countries with inflated currencies. For Nordic countries I had already given their huge resources and sparse population and lack of defense spending as the reason already.

 

[janon]

No, for me religion is more than peace and whatever 'peace' means to you. You don't what's peace.

God didn't create this universe to make it meaningless and without guidance. If we would all just live this how we wish and not be held accountable there is something very mysterious about such a universe.

All this is irrelevant to the argument.

Your claim was that godlessness causes these social eils, which is simply absurd as has been pointed out. It is the god bothering countriees that have a much higher rate of these issues.

It is. They do not have any defense expenditure. I did not include Japan in the group of countries with inflated currencies. For Nordic countries I had already given their huge resources and sparse population and lack of defense spending as the reason already.

Whatever the reason for their prosperity, the fact is that they value human rights, and have peaceful societies with low rates of crime. That was the point. And the issue in question is crime and human rights.

 

[Falcon29]

All this is irrelevant to the argument.

Your claim was that godlessness causes these social eils, which is simply absurd as has been pointed out. It is the god bothering countriees that have a much higher rate of these issues.

Now support it with information and specifics. All you will bring up are underdeveloped African nations. For Muslim countries today you don't understand their issues, they're for the most part unrelated to religion regardless of what you want to make of it.