Indian Navy N-LUH update

[Abingdonboy]

By the first week of next March, the Indian Navy (IN) is expected to receive all responses to the RfP issued on August 7, which calls for the supply of 56 armed light twin-engined multi-role helicopters between 2016 and 2023. The RfPs, which have already been received by Eurocopter SA, Bell Helicopter Textron, Boeing, AgustaWestland and Rosoboronexport State Corp/OBORONPROM, are most likely to result in the shortlisting of two contenders—in all probability the Bell 429 and AW-109P—following which final selection based on the lowest bidder (L-1) will be made. As of now, the Bell 429, MD-900 Explorer, A-109Power and AS.555 Fennec are the contenders. The winning design (which I believe will be the Bell 429) will be required to have a MTOW of 4.5 tonnes, be armed with 70mm unguided air-to-surface rockets, twin lightweight torpedoes and a pintle-mounted 12.7mm machine gun, be equipped with night vision-compatible glass cockpit avionics and a chin-mounted FLIR turret, along with a nose-mounted search radar and an emergency floatation system. Also to be acquired will be three simulators (of which one will be a full-flight unit) and 28 spare engines. Of the 56 light twin-engined multi-role helicopters, 46 will be of the armed-type, while the remaining 10 will be utilised for flying training purposes. The 46 units will be deployed on board the IN’s planned five 2,500-tonne AOPVs now being built by Pipavav Defence & Offshore Engineering Co Ltd, four NOPVs built by Goa Shipyard Ltd (GSL), and the 16 stealthy 400-tonne shallow water ASW patrol vessels of a foreign design (being proposed by Thyseenkrupp Marine Systems, DCNS and Rosoboronexport State Corp), which are likely to be built by both GSL and Hindustan Shipyard Ltd. The stealthy shallow-water ASW patrol vessels will each be equipped with two twin-tube heavyweight torpedo launchers, hull-mounted panoramic sonar, stern-mounted active/passive towed-array sonar, and a VSHORADS-based point air-defence system like MBDA’s SADRAL.

Apparently the Bell 429 is the favorite, looks like a decent platform:

Somthing to keep in mind is, if the news of the 429 being the favorite is true, that this will be just the latest in of a growing list of IN purchases from US: P-8, S-70B/MH-60R are favorites, Sea Kings, USS Trenton, GE maritime engines, Sea Herc and P-8 "diet" are favorites for the MR-MPA of IN, MQ-4C UAV (alegadly), FireScout (IN are reported to be very interested). It would also mean an entirly US origin rotary-wing of the IN as, as mentioned, the US offerings are favorites for the N-MRH procurement so the N-LUH would complete the line up and if the IN does eventually go for the V-22,FireScout and E-2D then the US content in the IN will continue to grow. Could this also be a sign of IN willing to accept the F-35 for N-MMRCA?

 

[Abingdonboy]

Some more pics of the 429:

The more I read about it and see it, the more I like it- seems to be a perfect fit for the IN and a really cool looking helo!

 

[Skull and Bones]

Would like to know more about the onboard sensors and weapon systems. And what other alternatives we have over this?

 

[subincb]

Some more pics of the 429:

The more I read about it and see it, the more I like it- seems to be a perfect fit for the IN and a really cool looking helo!

Can we use Dhruv III for the same with navy requirement rotor design? Shakthi engine is better than the one used by 429 and could fall cheaper than 429 due to huge number of Dhruvs being produced. Vibration issues in DHruv I is rectified in mark III.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Would like to know more about the onboard sensors and weapon systems. And what other alternatives we have over this?

I belive the AW-109 is also in the fray as is the AS555 but it will take time for the picture to become clear.

Can we use Dhruv III for the same with navy requirement rotor design? Shakthi engine is better than the one used by 429 and could fall cheaper than 429 due to huge number of Dhruvs being produced. Vibration issues in DHruv I is rectified in mark III.

Apparently the ALH is too heavy to operate on some of the intended platforms such as OPVs and others.

 

[arp2041]

I think India specially Indian Navy is getting too dependent on US. US attaches too much strings to it's defence sales, are we doing it the right way??

 

[Skull and Bones]

I think India specially Indian Navy is getting too dependent on US. US attaches too much strings to it's defence sales, are we doing it the right way??

Not anymore, never heard of such strings after USS Trenton sale. And i guess CISMOA doesn't apply for choppers, and if it is, we'll change the onboard communication equipments to suit our doctrine.

 

[arp2041]

Not anymore, never heard of such strings after USS Trenton sale. And i guess CISMOA doesn't apply for choppers, and if it is, we'll change the onboard communication equipments to suit our doctrine.

mate, what about the EUA which India signed, it's such a humiliating agreement in which US can check it's equipment selled to India whenever it wants.

 

[Skull and Bones]

mate, what about the EUA which India signed, it's such a humiliating agreement in which US can check it's equipment selled to India whenever it wants.

I guess that was only for USS Trenton, as it was bought keeping humanitarian efforts in mind and not for assault. So we shouldn't be bothered much about it.

 

[Abingdonboy]

mate, what about the EUA which India signed, it's such a humiliating agreement in which US can check it's equipment selled to India whenever it wants.

Firstly it is not whenever it wants, inspections are planned well in advance to suit both nations. Secondly this is the price you have to pay if you want advanced kit such as the P-8 and the like which no other nation on earth can provide. But I hear you, in the future it is fair to say India will have more indigenous content in its armed forces but for the immediate to med-term future India needs the best and sometimes that means going to the US.

I hardly think it is humiliating- it is a deal signed by professionals and handled accordingly. I don't foresee India breaking ties with the US anytime soon or vice versa in fact I see ties only getting stronger. The Indian military aren't fools, they will undertake a cost benefit analysis for every purchase and if the benifits out-weigh the costs then they will move forward.

 

[sancho]

Apparently the Bell 429 is the favorite

Buddy can you add the source? If the mentioned helicopters are part of the competition it is as I thought, a big waste of time and money. Most of them were offered in IA/IAF LUH competition as well and we could have done a simple joint competition, with navalised versions for dedicated trials of IN and ICG.

 

[Gessler]

Why not just speed up development of the single-engined LOH & LUH from HAL??

All they would need is 1 Shakti engine instead of 2 and better use of composites to reduce weight,
they'll be the best bet. But ofcourse the Italian Waitress is sitting on top of the Sansad and she
won't get her big packet of bribe if she tells Navy to buy indigenous alternatives.

I wait for the congress party to die.

 

[keerthan]

i thought HAL was working on LUH of its own.
what happened to it.

 

[sancho]

Why not just speed up development of the single-engined LOH & LUH from HAL??

All they would need is 1 Shakti engine instead of 2 and better use of composites to reduce weight,
they'll be the best bet. But ofcourse the Italian Waitress is sitting on top of the Sansad and she
won't get her big packet of bribe if she tells Navy to buy indigenous alternatives.

I wait for the congress party to die.

Because that is far from beeing ready developed, proven, let alone available in naval version. Not sure if they ruled out the issues with Snecma regarding Shakti engine, if not the development will be further delayed because they will held a tender for possible engines.
So it has more to do with our indigenous development (especially planning) capabilities, lets just hope it will be ready soo to be inducted into IA and IAF.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Because that is far from beeing ready developed, proven, let alone available in naval version. Not sure if they ruled out the issues with Snecma regarding Shakti engine, if not the development will be further delayed because they will held a tender for possible engines.
So it has more to do with our indigenous development (especially planning) capabilities, lets just hope it will be ready soo to be inducted into IA and IAF.

Hole in one!! HAL is overburdend as is and LOH doesn't seem to high on their "to do list", I'd say the IAF/IA are not going to wait for HAL to be ready, if the LOH isn't ready and fully meeting their critieria by a certain point in the future then we are going to see a large follow-on order for the foreign LUH that will already be in service by then.