Indian muslim :Javed Akhtar's Pakistan

[Mujeeb47]

After all , Hindu and Muslims are different nations.

 

[jayron]

@ T-Faz

The argument works both ways.

Time for some Shairi, I guess.

Thanks for the detailed reply. But I think we are in agreement for most part. You have not refuted what Javed has said but have just given reason why these things happened.

1. If Jinna wanted Pakistan to improve the worsening conditions of Muslims, what did he do to improve the muslims who were in the worst condition? He just abandoned them in UP, and Bihar and left. The muslims who needed the most help were deserted.

2. The point is, India doesn't have the inter sect fight among muslims that Pak has. I know there are various reasons for this, but still this is the fact.

3. we agree on this.

4. A secular Pakistan is much easier to engage with than a fanatic one. Don't you agree? Indian media would cover the top stories in Pakistan. This usually does not have success stories of minorities.

Some Indians might have a sadistic laugh at a fundamentalist Pakistan . But it does not do us any good ideologically or politically.

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

1 . OK , but atom bombs dont make it the centre of islam . wait , what image of your religion are you trying to potray here ?
2. only in context of the war on terror because your country happens to be the epicentre of it along with afganistan , if that makes you proud then so be it. But again how does it make pakistan the centre of islam ?
3. going towarrds democracy but not a true democracy yet and most people in pakistan want khalifa or something like that not even a democracy . even if that becomes true how does it make pakistan the centre of islam ?
4. False , you ll have to work very hard to convince the world about that because hardly any minorities are left in you country . From 25 % in 1947 to 3 or 4 % in 2010 , its a shame .even if it happens how does it make pakistan the centre of islam in the world ?

think before you speak

---------- Post added at 02:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:08 AM ----------

@ nick
Pakistan is only Muslim Atomic power and has largest army in Muslim world.
Pakistan has always importance in international scenario.
Pakistan is going towards democracy.
All minorities are living peacefully in Pakistan.

1 . OK , but atom bombs dont make it the centre of islam . wait , what image of your religion are you trying to potray here ?
2. only in context of the war on terror because your country happens to be the epicentre of it along with afganistan , if that makes you proud then so be it. But again how does it make pakistan the centre of islam ?
3. going towarrds democracy but not a true democracy yet and most people in pakistan want khalifa or something like that not even a democracy . even if that becomes true how does it make pakistan the centre of islam ?
4. False , you ll have to work very hard to convince the world about that because hardly any minorities are left in you country . From 25 % in 1947 to 3 or 4 % in 2010 , its a shame .even if it happens how does it make pakistan the centre of islam in the world ?

think before you speak

---------- Post added at 02:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:08 AM ----------

I have traveled quite widely in india, and the rural areas, it has virtually nothing in common with us, except parts of indian Punjab - were I was met by people in tears - who miss Pakistani Punjab, and the places they were born.

youwere referring to indians in your post so i as an indian give you an idea of life in india . You needed to be responded .

If you dont want an indian response dont do it in the Indian's context otherwise you will always , i repeat always get a response .

 

[Mujeeb47]

I think we should acknowledge that Pakistan is reality.

 

[President Camacho]

I have traveled quite widely in india, and the rural areas, it has virtually nothing in common with us, except parts of indian Punjab - were I was met by people in tears - who miss Pakistani Punjab, and the places they were born.

How old are you... that 70 year olds started crying in front of you?

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

I have traveled quite widely in india, and the rural areas, it has virtually nothing in common with us, except parts of indian Punjab - were I was met by people in tears - who miss Pakistani Punjab, and the places they were born.

People are fond of places where they were born . It is not restricted to indians but humans in general .

Let me tell you they may miss it but they dont and wont leave indian punjab for pakistani punjab ever for obvious reasons .

And by the way , most punjabis in india have probably never even lived in pakistani punjab then how come they "miss it" ? The partition happened more than 2 generations ago you know. Now i know how true your stories are .

 

[T-Faz]

1. If Jinna wanted Pakistan to improve the worsening conditions of Muslims, what did he do to improve the muslims who were in the worst condition? He just abandoned them in UP, and Bihar and left. The muslims who needed the most help were deserted.

Pakistan was only meant to be a autonomous state within a federal republic of India.

The two nation theory was an idea being used by the Muslim League to demand equal rights for Muslims in a united India. The idea was to use this as a bargaining chip against the congress and gain access to a split rule between Muslims and Hindu's. Jinnah went as far as accepting the Cabinet Mission Plan but neither parties were able to come to a power sharing agreement.

This is another article by the writer which details Jinnahs plan:

Did Jinnah Want Pakistan? | Pak Tea House

2. The point is, India doesn't have the inter sect fight among muslims that Pak has. I know there are various reasons for this, but still this is the fact.

True, but the Muslims of India must remain united and that is what keeps them together, its just natural to see inter sect conflict within Muslims states owing to differences and that is why Jinnah advocated that we be known as Pakistani's alone and nothing else.

4. A secular Pakistan is much easier to engage with than a fanatic one. Don't you agree? Indian media would cover the top stories in Pakistan. This usually does not have success stories of minorities.

India could not engage with liberal and secular Pakistan under Ayub so what makes you say this?

Some Indians might have a sadistic laugh at a fundamentalist Pakistan . But it does not do us any good ideologically or politically.

That is correct but the fact is that you would rather see status quo remain rather than Pakistan's fall into the abyss.

 

[Mujeeb47]

My dear nick ,
1) Military power has always great importance.
2) Pakistan is considered as a key player of region.
3) Democracy is according to the spirit of Islam. So , we are going towards democracy.
4) There may be 25% minorities in 1947. But they choose to migrate and 4% choose to remain in Pakistan .

 

[T-Faz]

Similarly, the migration of Muslims to Pakistan continued on for some time after the partition, even in 1960's, many Indian Muslims moved to Pakistan, the ones who had stayed behind.

Hyderabadi's and others who did move kept a link with their own who slowly moved to Pakistan but the situation in recent times changed all this.

 

[President Camacho]

My dear nick ,
1) Military power has always great importance.
2) Pakistan is considered as a key player of region.
3) Democracy is according to the spirit of Islam. So , we are going towards democracy.
4) There may be 25% minorities in 1947. But they choose to migrate and 4% choose to remain in Pakistan .

All these make Pakistan the center of Islam?

How about this:

1) Much more modern military, that is 9 times worth that of Pakistan, and twice as bigger.
2) More important key player of the region, and beyond.
3) Democracy since inception, not intermittent experimental like that of Pakistan.
4) Greater number and percentage of happier minorities.

Don't you think India should be the center of Islam?

 

[Mujeeb47]

O.k buy chums. Dont want to waste time on such time wasting topic.

 

[President Camacho]

Similarly, the migration of Muslims to Pakistan continued on for some time after the partition, even in 1960's, many Indian Muslims moved to Pakistan, the ones who had stayed behind.

Hyderabadi's and others who did move kept a link with their own who slowly moved to Pakistan but the situation in recent times changed all this.

T-Faz, that could very much be because of the philosophy, widespread in Pakistan, that India is Dar-ul-Harb, and not Dar-ul-Islam. Anyone taking it very seriously will not look at the freedom or prosperity, but at the philosophy to decide where one wants to live. Besides, no one is denying that Pakistan was in a good shape in those times, at least in comparison to these times.

 

[@nline]

Will you please elaborate on that ??

 

[Mujeeb47]

@ Patanjali
we have no reservation , if you want to make India centre of Islam. Most welcome my dear

 

[Karachiite]

All these make Pakistan the center of Islam?

How about this:

1) Much more modern military, that is 9 times worth that of Pakistan, and twice as bigger.
2) More important key player of the region, and beyond.
3) Democracy since inception, not intermittent experimental like that of Pakistan.
4) Greater number and percentage of happier minorities.

Don't you think India should be the center of Islam?

Even with your supposedly very modern army we made you wet your pants in 2001 and 2008. And about happier minorities lmaooo. Says who? We have seen your actions towards minorities in the Babri Mosque demolition and riots, Mass killings of Christian in Orrisa, Mass killings of Muslims in Gujarat etc.
I can be classified as a minority here in Pakistan and I'm very happy here but that doesn't mean every single minority is.