Indian Double Standards on Terrorism

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

How long would majority of Pakistanis justify their support to pro-Khalistan insurgents and Kashmir insurgents by highlighting Indian role in Bangladesh Freedom Movement ?

perhaps as long as the countries in UNSC continue to support India over the Outstanding disputes to achieve their narrow interests in India .
Pakistan is a nuclear Power and its territory isnt going anywhere too..!!!

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

The casus belli in case of Kashmiri insurgency was not oppression of IA or Indian State.

so are you saying that without any Oppression of IM the kashmiri insurgency arosed, Its so lame . The more IM oppresses, the greater the chances of Kashmiri Mujahideen to emerge.
India faces several Paths, Either hookup with this issue till the next half a century or to fight its way out or to Make Peace and restore the freedom of Kashmir by giving the Kasmiris the right to choose there future .They way things are going, Its quite disappointing, Indian hawks would never want that Kashmir should become a throne in there path to become a global player..!!!
As long as Kashmir exists,There is always a chance for Indian rivals(Other than Pakistan)..!!!

 

[Irfan Baloch]

No they cannot because they have themselves taken responsibility for killing civilians - school teachers, principals, non-Baluch ethnicity laborers and residents etc.

They have also openly called for the killing of non-Baluch residents (civilians and non-civilians). I fail to see how any group that so openly calls for the murder of innocents, and acts in that manner, in pursuit of a political objective can be considered anything but a 'terrorist' group.

You summed it up so nicely. this is an issue which I feel very strong about.
BLA terrorism is only because of two tribes Marri & Bugtis and they have taken the whole provance hostage.

something that a group of Xenophobe & biggoted sardars started as a blackmail & extrosion has taken the shape of full scale terrorism

they murder, kidnap, loot & terrorise any one who stands in their way they destroy infrastructure, they kidnap and kill foreigners, teachers and civil servants
I dont see them any different to Taliban & Al Qaida
and the biggest shame is that a country which claims to be the biggest democracy & spare no chance to defame Pakistan at every possible platform is openly supporting & training from its sham councilates along the Afhgani Border.

So many Balochis even Bugtis have had to seek refuge in Punjab because of this Mafia which we all know as BLA

but my messge to Indians is that Balochistan is not east pakistan we dont have thousands of miles of gap between us. your conspiracies will fail

and finally for everyones information 50% of balochistan are Pashton who dont give a damn about BLA then we got Hazara & other Persian & Berahovi speaking people who despise BLA

so they can blow up things or kidnap & murder innocent people they wont get anywhere and shall be found and taken out like that obnoxious & arrogant Akbar Bugti who thought that he was a God of that place.

Long Live Pakistan, Long Live the freedom of Baloch people from BLA

 

[Paksindhi]

you can not compare JKLF struggle with BLA, 80,000 kashmiries dead and counting.

u see demonstration against rape's and cold blooded murder's in kashmir almost every day.

thousands of youth's missing in kashmir, abducted by BSF and ARMY.

systematic torture and abuse of prisnor's in kashmir.

forceing kashmiries to vote at gun point, threatning to break there finger's if there is no mark of voting ink.

ANY INSURGECY OR FREEDOM STRUGGLE CANT SURVIVE WITH OUT LOCAL SUPPORT.

SHOW ME 5% OF THIS HAPPENING IN BALICHISTAN.

WE WILL SEE HOW LONG BLA WILL SURVIVE.

 

[toxic_pus]

so are you saying that without any Oppression of IM the kashmiri insurgency arosed...

Not of the nature, or scale, that sparked the 1971 struggle for freedom among the Bengalis of East Pakistan. Kashmiris definitely had legitimate grievances against GoI, circa 1989. That, however, doesn’t justify picking up Kalashnikovs and driving out thousands of Kashmiris just because they were of different religious hue.

...restore the freedom of Kashmir by giving the Kasmiris the right to choose there future

Kashmiri insurgents are clear, by implication or otherwise, that ‘freedom’ for them means joining Pakistan or something that is favourable to the interest of Pakistan, which in itself, undercuts the whole argument of ‘freedom’. The fact that they have already made their choice through bullet and not ballot makes your demand for their ‘right to choose their future’ a non-starter. It is a circuitous argument. In fact by initiating insurgency, the insurgents have relinquished their 'right' to choose through a democratic process, which is what the ballot implies.

So if the Kashmiri insurgents want the ‘right’ to chose then they have to drop their choice and the insurgency to implement that choice, and that means you have to choose between a) supporting Kashmiri insurgency, calling it ‘freedom struggle’, which implies that you are supporting their choice and b) supporting their perceived ‘right’ to make the choice.

You can’t have it both ways. Also, whether they at all had a 'right' is another debate.

 

[brahmastra]

you can not compare JKLF struggle with BLA, 80,000 kashmiries dead and counting.

will you compare both when same amount of baloch will loose their life.

u see demonstration against rape's and cold blooded murder's in kashmir almost every day.

yes.we see demonstration against rape and murders sponsored by separatists sponsored by '___'(fill the blank). and those rape are done by their relatives and murders by their friend, later investigated by police.

thousands of youth's missing in kashmir, abducted by BSF and ARMY.

systematic torture and abuse of prisnor's in kashmir.

thats new.

forceing kashmiries to vote at gun point, threatning to break there finger's if there is no mark of voting ink.

ANY INSURGECY OR FREEDOM STRUGGLE CANT SURVIVE WITH OUT LOCAL SUPPORT.

agreed.

P.S. I neither support BLA terrorists nor kashmiry terrorists.

 

[notsuperstitious]

The 1971 comparison however does not take into account the 1965 operation gibraltor (failed) or the support to rebels in the north east india through what was east pakistan.

All this before 1971, but then the thread title is Indian double standards

 

[foxbat]

The main point relevant to this discussion is the violence perpetrated by EP rebels, specifically atrocities against civilian non-Bengalis in pursuit of a political objective, and the International Commission of Jurists (an NGO) does not, as far as I can tell, condone those killings in any manner, though it makes a broader argument that violence by rebels was justified (an argument for another thread).

Since the point about atrocities by rebels is clear, I'll move on to this bit of Indian double speak:

Nor is the Pakistani State sponsoring any crime. The Pakistani State is, however, sponsoring a struggle for freedom from oppression. Any death of innocents is always regrettable, however, this is the right time to recall that Mao speak:

'A revolution is not a dinner party, or writing an essay, or painting a picture, or doing embroidery; it cannot be so refined, so leisurely and gentle, so temperate, kind, courteous, restrained and magnanimous. A revolution is an insurrection, an act of violence by which one class overthrows another'

YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.

Again, India has no standing to be criticizing Pakistani support for the Kashmiri insurgency, or the atrocities by some insurgents, given its own actions in supporting what it calls 'terrorists' (in J&K) in East Pakistan in 1971.

If Pakistan is so right and justified in supporting Insurgency in Kashmir, why doesnt it own up to that..?

 

[EjazR]

you can not compare JKLF struggle with BLA, 80,000 kashmiries dead and counting.

I think you are still living in 1992. JKLF has disavowed itself from military struggle because the local Kashmiris had given up armed struggle by 1994. Moreover, it was the Jihadi organisations based in Pakistan who killed of most of the leadership of the JKLF because they were fighting for an independant J&K including Gilgit Baltistan which was not what GoP wanted. Post 1994, it has been mainly foreigners and Kashmiris from Pakistani side that have been involved in militancy. You have groups like Hizb, LeT, JeM e.t.c. that kill innocent civilians, murder Kashrmiris for denoucning their activities, forcefully do "nikah" with young girls, throw acid on girls faces who don't wear hijab, threatening cable and media journalists for reporting against them and in general make life miserable for the local populace.

It is not surprise when the local Kashmiris are at the forefront in providing intelligence about this groups. Former militants now fight these Taliban clones under the SoG part of the J&K police. In the army the J&K light infantry continues to play a prominent role. Has GoI committed wrongs in J&K, yes ofourse they have. But what these so-called Jihadi groups are doing in the name of Islam is nothing different from what TTP are doing in the name of Islam.

These militant groups target civilians more than they target security forces. The only reason that you see more clashes with security forces is because they are pre-empted by the army and police from launching terrorists attacks due to information and tips provided by the local Kashmiris themselves.

Please check out www.peacepolls.org and check the opinion poll done in Indian and Pakistani Kashmir of what the locals want. You will see that 90+% of Kashmiri Muslims themselves want the Pakistani government to stop supporting "rebel fighters" and close all training camps. Even those who want independence say the same thing.

Will GoP listen to what the Kashmiris want, or continue with its twisted policy of differentiating between TTP and assorted members of the UJC? Once the policy of differentiating stops it will go a long way in bringing back peace to Pakistan and the Kashmiri people themselves.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

If Pakistan is so right and justified in supporting Insurgency in Kashmir, why doesnt it own up to that..?

Haven't we? 'Moral support'.

In any case, the point is that given that Indians use the pretext of 'oppression and denial of rights to East Pakistanis' as an excuse for covert intervention in East Pakistan in 1971, they have no standing to criticize Pakistani support, moral or otherwise, to insurgents fighting in Kashmir, given the occupation of Kashmir and the oppression and subjugation of Kashmiris.

When India can condemn its own policies in 1971 is when it can argue against the insurgency in Kashmir, till then it is just Indian double speak and a distinction of 'good terrorism vs bad terrorism'.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Oops , same accusations which are levelled against the 'Mujahideen' in Kashmir .

Unlike most Kashmiri groups, the BLA openly claims atrocities against civilians, mostly non-Baluch, an openly claims to have a goal of eliminating non-Baluch from the province, i.e commit genocide.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The 1971 comparison however does not take into account the 1965 operation gibraltor (failed) or the support to rebels in the north east india through what was east pakistan.

All this before 1971, but then the thread title is Indian double standards

Yes, the thread is on Indian double standards since Indians today claim the insurgency in J&K is 'terrorism' while justifying. even glorifying, their own support for the insurgents that killed tens of thousands of innocents in East Pakistan.

Do you deny that India and most Indians subscribe to the above position? If you do not deny, then it is a double standard, and India's stance on J&K has no legitimacy.

If however you and most Indians condemn Indian support for terrorism/insurgents in 1971, then India's stance on J7K has legitimacy.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

P.S. I neither support BLA terrorists nor kashmiry terrorists.

Yet you support East Pakistani terrorists and Indian State support for them ...

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Not of the nature, or scale, that sparked the 1971 struggle for freedom among the Bengalis of East Pakistan. Kashmiris definitely had legitimate grievances against GoI, circa 1989. That, however, doesn’t justify picking up Kalashnikovs and driving out thousands of Kashmiris just because they were of different religious hue.

That determination, 'nature and scale', is not yours to make - from Pakistan's perspective, the denial of the right to self-determination, multiple rigged elections, tens of thousands massacred, raped and killed by the Indian security forces, and the deployment of hundreds of thousands of soldiers to enforce the occupation of a people is more than enough cause to support insurgents fighting against Indian occupation and State terrorism.

The fact that they have already made their choice through bullet and not ballot

The insurgents did not make that choice, the Indian State did, by unilaterally rejecting the option of self-determination for the Kashmiris and annexing the State.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

World including UN knows them [let,jud,jaish etc] AS TERRORISTS. .and yes gop too. .kya fark padta he? Agar kuch log unhe freedom fighter kahe? These jehadis r in the same category of TTP AND AQ. ..

And what category are the East Pakistani rebels, that massacred tens of thousands of non-Bengali civilians, men women and children, in?