India’s Muslims. Growing, and neglected.

[Mitro]

One scholar from India replies in answer to the question: “Are the terms of Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb still applicable?” Dr Zafarul-Islam Khan replies:

As is obvious from these terms, they were applied to various regions according to the practical or legal conditions prevailing therein vis-a-vis the Muslim state and its citizens. The basic concept behind this was that law and Shari’ah prevail only in Dar al-Islam (territory of Islam) while Dar al-Harb (enemy territory) territories were lawless where rulers and dominant people forced their whims on residents and therefore one’s life or property was not safe there. This is why Muslims were discouraged from living in such areas. In other words, the basic difference between Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb was the rule of law in the former and the lawlessness in the latter. So it is a Dar al-Islam wherever Muslims’ lives and properties are legally safe and they are legally allowed to follow their religion. A place is not a Dar al-Islam where Muslims’ lives, property and faith are not safe even though its ruler may be a Muslim. A just non Muslim society and Ruler is better than an unjust Muslim one.

It is evident today that in many ‘Muslim’ countries Muslims’ lives, honour and right to follow Islam are not safe while there are ‘non-Muslim’ countries, like our own country, where Muslims’ lives and properties are safe legally. Moreover, we enjoy legal rights to follow our religion and preach it. Therefore, it is a mistake to apply the old concept of Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb on the contemporary world. It is an indication of one’s ignorance of the wisdom of his religion. No new category is needed today. It is sufficient to understand that it is a Dar Islam wherever Muslims enjoy religious freedom and wherever Muslims do not enjoy such freedom is a Dar Kufr although its ruler or majority may be ‘Muslim.’

@Czar786

Dar-al-Islam means An abode, country, territory, or land where Islamic sovereignty prevails.

India is not Dar-Al-Islam.

India can be classified as Dar-al-amn meaning a land which is essentially non-Muslim and muslims are in minority, but they have complete freedom to practise their faith.





I hope you understand that the constant whining and complaining among muslims and their votaries about how they are discriminated, being conspired against, that they are suppressed do sometimes gets on people's nerves especially when there is no such systemic discrimination.

-------------->

no...........

 

[KS]

One scholar from India replies in answer to the question: “Are the terms of Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb still applicable?” Dr Zafarul-Islam Khan replies:

As is obvious from these terms, they were applied to various regions according to the practical or legal conditions prevailing therein vis-a-vis the Muslim state and its citizens. The basic concept behind this was that law and Shari’ah prevail only in Dar al-Islam (territory of Islam) while Dar al-Harb (enemy territory) territories were lawless where rulers and dominant people forced their whims on residents and therefore one’s life or property was not safe there. This is why Muslims were discouraged from living in such areas. In other words, the basic difference between Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb was the rule of law in the former and the lawlessness in the latter. So it is a Dar al-Islam wherever Muslims’ lives and properties are legally safe and they are legally allowed to follow their religion. A place is not a Dar al-Islam where Muslims’ lives, property and faith are not safe even though its ruler may be a Muslim. A just non Muslim society and Ruler is better than an unjust Muslim one.

It is evident today that in many ‘Muslim’ countries Muslims’ lives, honour and right to follow Islam are not safe while there are ‘non-Muslim’ countries, like our own country, where Muslims’ lives and properties are safe legally. Moreover, we enjoy legal rights to follow our religion and preach it. Therefore, it is a mistake to apply the old concept of Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Harb on the contemporary world. It is an indication of one’s ignorance of the wisdom of his religion. No new category is needed today. It is sufficient to understand that it is a Dar Islam wherever Muslims enjoy religious freedom and wherever Muslims do not enjoy such freedom is a Dar Kufr although its ruler or majority may be ‘Muslim.’

This is not the definition of Dar-al-Islam..the scholar is just modifying it in the context of the question asked that whether India is Dar-al-Islam or Dar-al-Harb with no intermediate positions.

Then what he said might be true..but in the presence of intermediate positions like Dar-al-amn, then India will be that and not Dar-al-islam as the sharia does not reign supreme here.

 

[Sugarcane]

That is why I am asking you, what is your problem..

Your thoughts are so random that I am not able to put together what you ultimately want.

One of your fallow want to give one way ticket of Samjhota Express to Indian Muslims to Pakistan and hell bent to send them to Pakistan and for Muslim fallow is saying that their is no problem at all. On other hand your Muslim fallow is trying to prove that there is no problem at all and he is 100% free to practice Islam and there is no Hindu-Muslim problem at all. I am trying to find out who is telling truth. Now tell me what's your version

 

[Mitro]

As you said that pakistan is not Dar al Islam so what was the point of making pakistan.The muslim who decided to live in india made better choice then you guys .Imagine the Shia hazara living in india enjoying peace,freedom and security.

you don't get it in india we slaughter wide variety of animal like goat ,sheep,bull,camel and cow,Cow slaughter is prohibited i think in just 4 states and i believe they should put banned all of india so the problem of communal harmony no more.

Apparently you are not doing it by choice, you forced to do so by state.

 

[BRICS]

Those are Indians and have no right over Pakistan because they didn't opted for Pakistan. If you don't like them do another partition and give them country but don't troll by bringing Pakistan

Sooner or later, 1000% it's going to happen! And it's not a question of giving Muslims another country.....Muslims will take another country, it has happened before and will happen again, there is no doubt about it. India is a weak country, ruled by impotent, incompetent and corrupt criminals (including rapists and murderers), with "elected" leadership like that, there is absolutely no hope. And to add to that, a country and people who allow their holiest of holy river's, which they call "God", to be in such a pathetic, horific and disgusting condition, has no chance. If Indians can't come together to keep their "God" in a semi-decent condition, then they most certainly cannot stop the coming storm!

 

[Mitro]

The concept of Dar Al-Harb (Abode of War) was introduced in the Fiqh Hanafi. Al-Imam (the legislator and scholar) Abu Hanifa divided the Muslim role into two categories:

Dar Al-Islam (Abode of Islam) and Dar Al-Harb (Abode of War). He would refer to any non-Muslim domain as Dar Al-Kufr (Abode of Unbelief) or Dar Al-Harb even if there is no current war between them and the Muslims.[5] According to him a country or a territory becomes a Dar Al-Islam if:
(a) The Muslims must be able to enjoy peace and security; and
(b) It has common frontiers with some Muslim countries (other Dar Al-Islam)[6]

However, the concept of Dar Al-Harb and Dar Al-Islam are not explained in the Qur'ân or Sunnah (tradition of the Holy Prophet (PBUH)), says the majority of scholars. It is, in fact, a result of Ijtihad (religious endeavour), which is a terminology used to describe religious endeavour to exercise personal judgement based on the Qur'ân and the Sunnah.[2]

Historical Conditions
It is indispensable to view the historical environment of the time, and of the centuries that followed the spread of this classification concept.

This is not the definition of Dar-al-Islam..the scholar is just modifying it in the context of the question asked that whether India is Dar-al-Islam or Dar-al-Harb with no intermediate positions.

Then what he said might be true..but in the presence of intermediate positions like Dar-al-amn, then India will be that and not Dar-al-islam as the sharia does not reign supreme here.

 

[mastaan]

Sooner or later, 1000% it's going to happen! And it's not a question of giving Muslims another country.....Muslims will take another country, it has happened before and will happen again, there is no doubt about it. India is a weak country, ruled by impotent, incompetent and corrupt criminals (including rapists and murderers), with "elected" leadership like that, there is absolutely no hope. And to add to that, a country and people who allow their holiest of holy river's, which they call "God", to be in such a pathetic, horific and disgusting condition, has no chance. If Indians can't come together to keep their "God" in a semi-decent condition, then they most certainly cannot stop the coming storm!

O bhai Nostradamus... While we may be unhygienic at times and absolutely callous about our sense of cleanliness, we have one thing pretty clear... We have ONE nation... Now, please change your flag and stop blabbering as if all the Indian muslims were crying outside your home yesterday... We have our problems. Any nation our size and diversity will have it, but we know how to resolve and move on...

BTW @KS @KRAIT when can I get a chance to post in Kashmir thread...? Is there a post count criteria?

 

[Sugarcane]

As you said that pakistan is not Dar al Islam so what was the point of making pakistan.The muslim who decided to live in india made better choice then you guys .Imagine the Shia hazara living in india enjoying peace,freedom and security.

you don't get it in india we slaughter wide variety of animal like goat ,sheep,bull,camel and cow,Cow slaughter is prohibited i think in just 4 states and i believe they should put banned all of india so the problem of communal harmony no more.

1. There is not point of discussing Pakistan as it's not topic here, and your question is already addressed thousands time, read previous threads. If Hindus were that much peaceful and kind towards Muslims than nobody would have asked for partition. So, i am not interested to imagine any akhand-bharat thing.

2. Again i am stating same, why ban. Why you guys can't leave this practice by choice?

BTW @KS @KRAIT when can I get a chance to post in Kashmir thread...? Is there a post count criteria?

Your are not even half way. 2000 posts needed, i hope by 2014 you will be able to do it.

 

[mastaan]

Your are not even half way. 2000 posts needed, i hope by 2014 you will be able to do it.

Then that's a lot of hard work man... I slogged 2 years to get to 400+ and at this rate, 2020 seems to be the year when I can participate in a discussion on my home state

 

[Mitro]

let me ask you why prosecute minority in your country are you guys above law.why killing Shia Hazara are they not pakistani .when you can discuss india then i can also discuss pakistan situation .Before partition i don't remember any communal riot happening in british india.Pakistani should worry about their country which is plunging from bad to worst day by day .and leave indian hindu to us don't worry we are good .

1. There is not point of discussing Pakistan as it's not topic here, and your question is already addressed thousands time, read previous threads. If Hindus were that much peaceful and kind towards Muslims than nobody would have asked for partition. So, i am not interested to imagine any akhand-bharat thing.

2. Again i am stating same, why ban. Why you guys can't leave this practice by choice?



Your are not even half way. 2000 posts needed, i hope by 2014 you will be able to do it.

 

[KS]

One of your fallow want to give one way ticket of Samjhota Express to Indian Muslims to Pakistan and hell bent to send them to Pakistan and for Muslim fallow is saying that their is no problem at all. On other hand your Muslim fallow is trying to prove that there is no problem at all and he is 100% free to practice Islam and there is no Hindu-Muslim problem at all. I am trying to find out who is telling truth. Now tell me what's your version

--> Muslims are 100% free to practise AND propagate their religion in india

--> There is Hindu-muslim problem just like between majority and minority in any counry but just not on the level as you like/wish to believe.


What I dont understand is you people betrayed the muslims in India after partition and refused them to migrate into Pakistan after forming Pakistan in their name. So why crocodile tears now ?

 

[Sugarcane]

let me ask you why prosecute minority in your country are you guys above law.why killing Shia Hazara are they not pakistani .when you can discuss india then i can also discuss pakistan situation .Before partition i don't remember any communal riot happening in british india.Pakistani should worry about their country which is plunging from bad to worst day by day .and leave indian hindu to us don't worry we are good .

Current topic is about Indian Muslims and Indian Muslims have nothing to do with Pakistan as i already stated dozen of time before. Regarding situation of Pakistan there are 100s of threads already there and also on 47's partition. You are really naive that you think one day Muslims woke up and started demanding Pakistan. And i don't bother to indulge with Indians on their internal matters If they don't drag Pakistan in it.

Then that's a lot of hard work man... I slogged 2 years to get to 400+ and at this rate, 2020 seems to be the year when I can participate in a discussion on my home state

Your posts are normally good, I can support you if you demand that title of Jr. T.T should be taken from @KRAIT and given to you. In that case you will be able to post.

 

[bigzgvr4]

--> Muslims are 100% free to practise AND propagate their religion in india

Umm no they are not they cannot zibah cow on eid and cow meat is imported in india becuase cow is a religious animal So stop it and admit it india is not secular as the media say it is

 

[KS]

Umm no they are not they cannot zibah cow on eid and cow meat is imported in india becuase cow is a religious animal So stop it and admit it india is not secular as the media say it is

huh facepalm.

Muslims according to Kuran can give sacrifice of any halal animal and there is no specific quranic reference that only cow should be given qurbani.

Infact muslims should ideally give qurbani of a sheep to closely follow what Abraham did.

 

[mastaan]

Your posts are normally good, I can support you if you demand that title of Jr. T.T should be taken from @KRAIT and given to you. In that case you will be able to post.

Nahi yaar, @KRAIT is an icon on pdf and i am a lazy, ageing consultant... For posting in the Kashmir thread, I am sure one day i will get the chance... mera bhi time aayega...