India Responsible for LOC incidents

[Gandhi G in da house]

Another admission:

“Let’s just put it this way,” a senior government official in New Delhi said, “there was no formal permission to stage a cross-border raid to target Sawan Patra. However, in the heat of fighting, these things have been known to happen. Pakistan has done this, and our forces have done this, ever since fighting began in Jammu and Kashmir in 1990.”

So Pakistanis were right about Indians conducting a raid across LOC. That is just great. Three soldiers are dead, peace process is threatened, dumb allegations are flying about how Pakistanis are barbarians and when semi-credible information trickles out, we find that Pakistanis were right after all. Indians act as though they own IOK, LOC, and Azad Kashmir as well.

How can peace succeed in face of such arrogance?



Saying that ceasefire violations will happen is a bad excuse for Indian behavior during a fragile peace process.

Pakistani narrative is in the process of being vindicated. India started this, Indians ignored our protests, Indians conducted a cross-LOC raid, and Indians have been crying about a beheading, which most likely did not take place.

Are you alright ?

Read this part already posted before -

Following the announcement, shells followed. Pakistani troops fired mortar and high-calibre automatic weapons at Indian forward positions. The fire missed its intended target, but killed three villagers, 25-year-old Mohammad Shafi Khatana, 20-year-old Shaheena Bano, and a ninth-grade school student, Liaqat Ali. In the weeks leading up to the New Year, military sources said, hardly a week went by without occasional shots being fired at troops headed to the new observation posts.



Pakistan started shelling and firing first , it was only after that , that the Indians retaliated and one Pakistani was killed followed by the death of two Indian soldiers.

 

[kurup]

Another admission:

“Let’s just put it this way,” a senior government official in New Delhi said, “there was no formal permission to stage a cross-border raid to target Sawan Patra. However, in the heat of fighting, these things have been known to happen. Pakistan has done this, and our forces have done this, ever since fighting began in Jammu and Kashmir in 1990.”

So Pakistanis were right about Indians conducting a raid across LOC. That is just great. Three soldiers are dead, peace process is threatened, dumb allegations are flying about how Pakistanis are barbarians and when semi-credible information trickles out, we find that Pakistanis were right after all. Indians act as though they own IOK, LOC, and Azad Kashmir as well.

How can peace succeed in face of such arrogance?



Saying that ceasefire violations will happen is a bad excuse for Indian behavior during a fragile peace process.

Pakistani narrative is in the process of being vindicated. India started this, Indians ignored our protests, Indians conducted a cross-LOC raid, and Indians have been crying about a beheading, which most likely did not take place.

Please don't spread misinformation .

Al this incidents happened because some trigger happy moron$ in PA shot an Indian soldier in Dec 26 .

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/226349-1-army-jawan-killed-loc.html

IA repayed it and now PA has crossed all limits and beheaded and mutilated two IA soldiers .

They will surely be repayed back .

 

[Windjammer]

It has been repeatedly mentioned that India is no Israel and Pakistan certainly isn't Palestine......but sometimes you learn the hard way......Even say if Pakistan initiated the ceasefire violation....rather than replying in kind, does that give the Indians an excuse to carry out a border violation, murder a Pakistani soldier and then thinking there will be no reaction..... very immature delusion to say the least. !

 

[Chak Bamu]

Is this the real reason behind Indians escalating matters along LOC?

Asia Sentinel - India Cuts its Defense Budget

"India Cuts its Defense Budget - Big shock for a military trying to catch up with the Chinese"

 

[Windjammer]

Please don't spread misinformation .

Al this incidents happened because some trigger happy moron$ in PA shot an Indian soldier in Dec 26 .

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/226349-1-army-jawan-killed-loc.html

IA repayed it and now PA has crossed all limits and beheaded and mutilated two IA soldiers .

They will surely be repayed back .

Before that some Bharti Baboon couldn't even differentiate between military and civilians, hence got a reply in kind.

Civilian killed by Indian LoC firing - thenews.com.pk

 

[Chak Bamu]

I ask the Indian commentators: When Indians violate the ceasefire and ignore Pakistan's protest and continue with the violation, what do they realistically expect? Flowers? For those of you who are focused on Pakistan's retaliation, you need to think about how it all started and how it may end. Not who did what in between. Have some sense of responsibility.

 

[KRAIT]

Is this the real reason behind Indians escalating matters along LOC?
Asia Sentinel - India Cuts its Defense Budget
"India Cuts its Defense Budget - Big shock for a military trying to catch up with the Chinese"

There are many narratives from both sides.

According to Pakistani narrative - India breached LOCand the attack may be non-state actors.
Attack may be by GOI orders to take way pressure on GOI due to Rape cases.

According to Indian narrative - Pakistan breached Geneva convention and may have covered non-state actors who did the attack and beheading so it is asking UN probe as the blame may go to India or non-state actors.

Pakistan Army didn't like democratic govt. making headway with Indian GOI and wanted to disrupt the peace process.

According to anti-GOI Indian narrative - Military wanted for roll back of defense cuts. GOI did so for bringing Kashmir issue to suppress anti-corrption and rape issue considering coming elections.

 

[Chak Bamu]

@KRAIT, I am just pissed at all this. I did not comment about this in the beginning. I wanted to get some facts first. Things are getting clearer. Wish I could say that this was a misunderstanding. That it is not. It is an escalation.

Before that some Bharti Baboon couldn't even differentiate between military and civilians, hence got a reply in kind.

Civilian killed by Indian LoC firing - thenews.com.pk

That ought to shut some trollers up. But they would just keep on coming. Wish they would think a little before commenting.

 

[KRAIT]

@KRAIT, I am just pissed at all this. I did not comment about this in the beginning. I wanted to get some facts first. Things are getting clearer. Wish I could say that this was a misunderstanding. That it is not. It is an escalation.

Sir whatever the case is, I personally think there are factions on both sides of border who don't want peace. I have explained it in the thread in Senior's cafe.

Can you imagine we will be discussing issues like this in the past. Now both Indian and Pakistanis are listening to each others narratives.

The social media has already presented the different picture about each other country. I never knew so much about Pakistan before PDF. May be same for many Pakistani poster. Now I have dozens of friends in Pakistan. Of course I am a patriot.

But I am rational enough to see that there are two aspects of the situation and two different perspectives. That's why I won't close my ears or eyes about hearing what you think. What Pakistanis think.

Tell me one thing, don't you think, this might be deliberate attempt by IA and PA to disrupt peace talks. Many people have this doubt. This doubt will build up even more.

 

[explorer9]

Sir whatever the case is, I personally think there are factions on both sides of border who don't want peace. I have explained it in the thread in Senior's cafe.

Can you imagine we will be discussing issues like this in the past. Now both Indian and Pakistanis are listening to each others narratives.

The social media has already presented the different picture about each other country. I never knew so much about Pakistan before PDF. May be same for many Pakistani poster. Now I have dozens of friends in Pakistan. Of course I am a patriot.

But I am rational enough to see that there are two aspects of the situation and two different perspectives. That's why I won't close my ears or eyes about hearing what you think. What Pakistanis think.

Tell me one thing, don't you think, this might be deliberate attempt by IA and PA to disrupt peace talks. Many people have this doubt. This doubt will build up even more.

The question you have raised is of the high degree of importance, what i suggested on another thread on the same subject, there must be must be comprehensive investigation and it must simplify that there was only the commander involved in the escalation or higher ups were also involved in scaling up the tensions.

Deep states or kind of infrastructure exists eve in most advanced country, only the tough government and leadership can comprehend the outcome of investigation.

 

[Ashoka The Great]

It has been repeatedly mentioned that India is no Israel and Pakistan certainly isn't Palestine......but sometimes you learn the hard way......Even say if Pakistan initiated the ceasefire violation....rather than replying in kind, does that give the Indians an excuse to carry out a border violation, murder a Pakistani soldier and then thinking there will be no reaction..... very immature delusion to say the least. !

Agreed with the bolded part...just wait a little and PA will be paid what's due

 

[Chak Bamu]

Sir whatever the case is, I personally think there are factions on both sides of border who don't want peace. I have explained it in the thread in Senior's cafe.

Can you imagine we will be discussing issues like this in the past. Now both Indian and Pakistanis are listening to each others narratives.

The social media has already presented the different picture about each other country. I never knew so much about Pakistan before PDF. May be same for many Pakistani poster. Now I have dozens of friends in Pakistan. Of course I am a patriot.

But I am rational enough to see that there are two aspects of the situation and two different perspectives. That's why I won't close my ears or eyes about hearing what you think. What Pakistanis think.

Tell me one thing, don't you think, this might be deliberate attempt by IA and PA to disrupt peace talks. Many people have this doubt. This doubt will build up even more.

I can not say for sure about this being deliberate. There ought to be something concrete to be able to say anything with conviction. But of one thing I am quite sure. People in Pakistan at least want peace to work. There is a genuine desire for peace. What is upsetting is that GOI is beholden to entrenched attitudes. Just take this present issue for example. There are 'unnamed sources' claiming the Indian soldier(s)' bodies were beheaded. This too is turning out to be a lie. Some people just run with it and there is something in the air that supports such behavior.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/strate...esponsible-loc-incidents-2.html#ixzz2HYl5f56M

Pride and Prejudice, that is what all this is.

 

[mr42O]

THANKS thats many of thinks a says.

I persoanly think Its either IA or PA or any offical who want to disrupt peace talks. Its same forces which left issue as Kashmir left behind who does not want to see peace. There are many reason for that i think every one here i understand. As in cricket i think Indian media cant behave here too which they should. I feel Pakistani media is better in this case but catching up very fast

Sir whatever the case is, I personally think there are factions on both sides of border who don't want peace. I have explained it in the thread in Senior's cafe.

Can you imagine we will be discussing issues like this in the past. Now both Indian and Pakistanis are listening to each others narratives.

The social media has already presented the different picture about each other country. I never knew so much about Pakistan before PDF. May be same for many Pakistani poster. Now I have dozens of friends in Pakistan. Of course I am a patriot.

But I am rational enough to see that there are two aspects of the situation and two different perspectives. That's why I won't close my ears or eyes about hearing what you think. What Pakistanis think.

Tell me one thing, don't you think, this might be deliberate attempt by IA and PA to disrupt peace talks. Many people have this doubt. This doubt will build up even more.

 

[Dushmann]

india started beheading and mutilations? what nonsense.

 

[Chak Bamu]

Another angle. Perhaps getting close to the truth here:

DNA exclusive: Uri commander’s forceful retaliation led to beheadings? - India - DNA

"As New Delhi raged over the attack by Pakistani troops claiming the lives of two Indian soldiers on Indian soil, and the mutilation of the bodies, the Union ministry of home has received inputs that suggest that Indian army units in the Uri sector could have provoked the incident. While there was sporadic firing exchanged in some parts ofthe LoC, a cross-border raid by the ghatak (commando) platoon of the 9th Maratha Light Infantry (MLI) in the early hours of Sunday could have been the provocation."

Also at the end of the peice:

"There is a feeling in the government that Brig Rawat has a very “aggressive track record” which could have escalated tensions on the LoC at a time when the nine-year-old ceasefire was holding up well. An inquiry into the incident has been ordered by Army Headquarters and a decision on Brig Rawat could also be taken in the coming days."