India fuming over Russia lifting its Pakistan arms embargo, what next?

[pursuit of happiness]

@rockstar08
India fuming over Russia lifting its Pakistan arms embargo, what next? — RT Op-Edge
this is his view point ..
he is neither top notch journalist to access top leadership nor he is defence /forign policy expert
--
if you belive above op then same you have to belive this too
Sanctions effect: Russia to change its economic partners…for the better — RT Op-Edge
Defexpo India 2014 has reaffirmed the special relationship that exists between the defense industries of Russia and India, with a pavilion that houses exhibits of Russian companies being visited by top members of the Indian establishment. In general, the defense interactions between Russia and India are quite diversified, with almost every defense contract providing the creation of joint ventures or licensed production. In 2013, India’s import of Russian weapons reached $4.78 billion. Another industry which attracts India is computer-guided weapons, produced by the Russian Morinformsystem-Agat Concern.
---------
india - russia military projects
India–Russia relations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
An India–Russia co-operation agreement was signed in December 1988. It has resulted in the sale of a multitude of defence equipment to India and also the emergence of the countries as development partners as opposed to purely a buyer-seller relationship. Two programmes that evidence this approach are the projects to form Indian-Russian joint ventures to develop and produce the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) and the Multirole Transport Aircraft (MTA). The agreement is pending a 10-year extension.[25]



The Sukhoi Su-30MKI was jointly built by Russia and India


The jointly built FGFA will be based on the Sukhoi PAK FA
India and Russia have several major joint military programmes including:

• BrahMos cruise missile programme
• 5th generation fighter jet programme
• Sukhoi Su-30MKI programme (230+ to be built by Hindustan Aeronautics)
• Ilyushin/HAL Tactical Transport Aircraft

Additionally, India has purchased/leased various military hardware from Russia:

• T-90S Bhishma with over 1000 to be built in India
• Akula-II nuclear submarine (2 to be leased with an option to buy when the lease expires)
• INS Vikramaditya aircraft carrier programme
• Tu-22M3 bombers (4 ordered)
• US$900 million upgrade of MiG-29
• Mil Mi-17 (80 ordered)
• Ilyushin Il-76 Candid (6 ordered to fit Israeli Phalcon radar)

--
Joint Base
The Farkhor Air Base in Tajikistan is currently jointly operated by India and Russia
--
Trade
Indo-Russian trade (2009–12)
Year Trade Volume (Billion $) Annual Change
2009 $7.46[5]
2010 $8.53[5] +14.34%
2011 $8.87[5] +3.98%
2012 $11.04[5] +24.50%
---
Space
n. Chandrayaan-2 is a joint lunar exploration mission proposed by the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) and the Russian Federal Space Agency (RKA) and has a projected cost of 4.25 billion (US$90 million). The mission, proposed to be launched in 2013 by a Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle (GSLV)
--
Nuclear Deals
During Russian president Vladimir Putin's visit to India for the 13th annual summit, a co-operative civilian nuclear energy road map was agreed to. Running until 2030, sixteen to eighteen new reactors will be constructed, with installed capacity of 1000 MW each. A 1000 MW reactor costs around $2.5 billion so the deal may touch $45 billion in worth



--
So you think Russia will compromise indian sentiments for pak?
you decided

 

[airmarshal]

What a response from India. A type of bitching response that you can expect only from India.

 

[pursuit of happiness]

?

 

[rockstar08]

Now that's like a good boy.

 

[pursuit of happiness]

Mai tu dar gaya bhai



oh man ,, what kind of facts and figure you want ?? did you even read the thread before coming and replying ??

-
ooo baby...
abb kya hua..
when come to hard facts .. you become ignorant
so innocent
i know waht i am talking about..
why shuld india fumes .
we know russia better than you.. dont jump like other

 

[rockstar08]

@rockstar08
India fuming over Russia lifting its Pakistan arms embargo, what next? — RT Op-Edge
this is his view point ..
he is neither top notch journalist to access top leadership nor he is defence /forign policy expert
--
if you belive above op then same you have to belive this too
Sanctions effect: Russia to change its economic partners…for the better — RT Op-Edge
Defexpo India 2014 has reaffirmed the special relationship that exists between the defense industries of Russia and India, with a pavilion that houses exhibits of Russian companies being visited by top members of the Indian establishment. In general, the defense interactions between Russia and India are quite diversified, with almost every defense contract providing the creation of joint ventures or licensed production. In 2013, India’s import of Russian weapons reached $4.78 billion. Another industry which attracts India is computer-guided weapons, produced by the Russian Morinformsystem-Agat Concern.
---------
india - russia military projects
India–Russia relations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
An India–Russia co-operation agreement was signed in December 1988. It has resulted in the sale of a multitude of defence equipment to India and also the emergence of the countries as development partners as opposed to purely a buyer-seller relationship. Two programmes that evidence this approach are the projects to form Indian-Russian joint ventures to develop and produce the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) and the Multirole Transport Aircraft (MTA). The agreement is pending a 10-year extension.[25]



The Sukhoi Su-30MKI was jointly built by Russia and India


The jointly built FGFA will be based on the Sukhoi PAK FA
India and Russia have several major joint military programmes including:

• BrahMos cruise missile programme
• 5th generation fighter jet programme
• Sukhoi Su-30MKI programme (230+ to be built by Hindustan Aeronautics)
• Ilyushin/HAL Tactical Transport Aircraft

Additionally, India has purchased/leased various military hardware from Russia:

• T-90S Bhishma with over 1000 to be built in India
• Akula-II nuclear submarine (2 to be leased with an option to buy when the lease expires)
• INS Vikramaditya aircraft carrier programme
• Tu-22M3 bombers (4 ordered)
• US$900 million upgrade of MiG-29
• Mil Mi-17 (80 ordered)
• Ilyushin Il-76 Candid (6 ordered to fit Israeli Phalcon radar)

--
Joint Base
The Farkhor Air Base in Tajikistan is currently jointly operated by India and Russia
--
Trade
Indo-Russian trade (2009–12)
Year Trade Volume (Billion $) Annual Change
2009 $7.46[5]
2010 $8.53[5] +14.34%
2011 $8.87[5] +3.98%
2012 $11.04[5] +24.50%
---
Space
n. Chandrayaan-2 is a joint lunar exploration mission proposed by the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) and the Russian Federal Space Agency (RKA) and has a projected cost of 4.25 billion (US$90 million). The mission, proposed to be launched in 2013 by a Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle (GSLV)
--
Nuclear Deals
During Russian president Vladimir Putin's visit to India for the 13th annual summit, a co-operative civilian nuclear energy road map was agreed to. Running until 2030, sixteen to eighteen new reactors will be constructed, with installed capacity of 1000 MW each. A 1000 MW reactor costs around $2.5 billion so the deal may touch $45 billion in worth



--
So you think Russia will compromise indian sentiments for pak?
you decided

i didnt say Russia will broke the friendship with you , but if you are so confident about your friendship than why you along with your other indian members are crying from the day this news come out ?
abhi tu kuch hua bhi nai... aur itna boma boom ?

 

[pursuit of happiness]

what other sins Russia has committed or shall I say the crimes that have broken the heart and the back of the Indians?
if Putin backs out then it will be a major win for India and Modi will turn to Obama and say.. Putin is my Bitch.. now tell me do you want me to tell Russians to get out of Ukraine?

--
sir ji putin is head of state of russia
mind your lanaguge

 

[rockstar08]

-
ooo baby...
abb kya hua..
when come to hard facts .. you become ignorant
so innocent
i know waht i am talking about..
why shuld india fumes .
we know russia better than you.. dont jump like other

so now stop crying like rakhi sawaat and enjoy your friendship with Russian ..

 

[pursuit of happiness]

i didnt say Russia will broke the friendship with you , but if you are so confident about your friendship than why you along with your other indian members are crying from the day this news come out ?
abhi tu kuch hua bhi nai... aur itna boma boom ?

--
no you never said...
its not indian but some over ethusiastic member over imgaination only

 

[Rank]

"A lot of communication has taken place between India and Russia through diplomatic channels on this issue and India has conveyed to the Russians that until this red rag is removed once and for all India won’t be able to take it as business as usual with the Russians. "

lol Indian making fool themself! big LOL

Apache - US (Rejected Mi)
Chinook - US (Rejected Russian comparator)
Rafale - French (Rejected SU)
P8i - US
C17 - US

All these deals before Russia lift ban on weapons for Pakistan. Russia already knw that "India not consider Russian weapons for next 20 30 years". What Russia gain ??? and oh really Russia scared of third world country ? LOLZzzz

 

[pursuit of happiness]

"A lot of communication has taken place between India and Russia through diplomatic channels on this issue and India has conveyed to the Russians that until this red rag is removed once and for all India won’t be able to take it as business as usual with the Russians. "

lol Indian making fool themself! big LOL

Apache - US (Rejected Mi)
Chinook - US (Rejected Russian comparator)
Rafale - French (Rejected SU)
P8i - US
C17 - US

All these deals before Russia lift ban on weapons for Pakistan. Russia already knw that "India not consider Russian weapons for next 20 30 years". What Russia gain ??? and oh really Russia scared of third world country ? LOLZzzz

--
read post no 61
and wake up to reality

 

[Abingdonboy]

Oh please Russians knew exactly what the response going to be. Question is what will Russia Gain or lose ?

Russia have every rights to decide or sell to any country whatever they want, it is none of India's business. Russia can ignore their moaning, Russia haven't complain or emotional so far, only India does every issues.

Well India dont "own" Russia and the way Indians are behaving its a direct Insult to Russia

India doesn't own Russia of course not but it is common sense Russia will follow the money, I'll just outline the current deals large defence India has with Russia:

FGFA- $30BN
Su-30MKIs (and Super Upgrades)- around $3BN
29 follow-on MiG-29K/KUB $1.2BN
Bhramos ongoing orders- value hard to estimate but upwards of $5BN easily
T-90S- $1.5BN
MiG-29UPG- around $700MN


Prospective deals:

3 more Talwar class stealth frigates- $1BN
LUH/RSH-$1.5BN
2 more A-50 for 2 follow-on PHALCON AWACS for the IAF- $500MN

There's lots i'm omitting I'm sure but I think you get the picture.


It's pretty clear Russia stands to gain A LOT more from India than Pakistan and the first rule of business is the customer is always right. Forget the talk of friendships, this is pure business and right now and looking ahead India is the more attractive market than Pakistan unless this changes nothing will change.


If you can give me one reason Russia should put 10s and 10s of billions of money in their pocket on the line, at a time the West is putting the squeeze on other potential defence markets for Russia, and go for this deal with Paksitan I am all ears....

India fuming over Russia lifting its Pakistan arms embargo, what next?


Rajeev Sharma is a New Delhi-based journalist, author and strategic analyst. He tweets @Kishkindha and can be reached at bhootnath004@yahoo.com.

Mi-35 helicopters (RIA Novosti/Alexander Vilf)




India is fuming with anger over Russia’s recent baffling decision to lift its embargo on the supply of Mi-35 attack helicopters and defense equipment to Pakistan.

Well-informed Indian diplomats told me on Thursday that the Russian decision would actually be the proverbial last straw on the camel’s back if Moscow does not abandon this move.

A lot of communication has taken place between India and Russia through diplomatic channels on this issue and India has conveyed to the Russians that until this red rag is removed once and for all India won’t be able to take it as business as usual with the Russians.

Russian diplomats have tried to calm the Indian nerves by saying that Islamabad won’t be given access to sensitive technologies. However, Indians are not convinced and are dropping hints of an all-or-nothing approach.

Though there have been no official statements so far, it seems that India would like Russia to scrap its plans to lift arms sale embargo on Pakistan completely. Nothing less than that would satisfy New Delhi.

‘Spit on my face’
Indian diplomats have reminded their Russian counterparts of very strong statements made by Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on October 14, 2012, during his official visit to India for talks with then-Indian External Affairs Minister SM Krishna. Rogozin had told the Indian media to “spit on my face” if Russia were to arm India’s enemies.

Sample the highly publicized remarks of Rogozin in New Delhi: “You must understand that we do not deal with your enemies. We don't deliver any arms to them.... If you see otherwise, you may spit on my face.”

Rogozin did not stop there, saying that Russia had no restrictions in delivering arms and weapons to India "because there are no conflicts and contradictions in our relations." He added: "We never created problems for India on its frontiers in difference from other countries. That is a political advantage (for Russia) as a friend of India."

Indubitably, the Indian diplomats would be reminding Rogozin of his remarks along with press clippings when he arrives in New Delhi at the end of this month.

Rogozin came to India just 100 days ago and said some very positive things about Indo-Russian ties. He talked in glowing terms about the possibility of a new oil pipeline between Russia to India which will run parallel to the $7.6 billion Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India gas pipeline. Rogozin had gone on record as saying thus about the new pipeline in his media interview: “This is one of the major infrastructure projects that can be implemented. I think it has a right to exist, but we should make calculations to see how profitable it can be.”

India's Prime Minister Narendra Modi (R) shakes hands with his Pakistani counterpart Nawaz Sharif before the start of their bilateral meeting in New Delhi May 27, 2014. (Reuters/Adnan Abidi)

Tough Indian stand bamboozles Russia
It is quite probable that given the solid, half-century-old strategic relationship between India and Russia, Russian policymakers underestimated the Indian response. They timed the move at a time when a new government led by Prime Minister Narendra Modi has just come into office.

While the Indians have dropped hints to Russians about their “us or them” approach – meaning that it is for Russia to choose between India and Pakistan – India has not come up with any official statement so far, nor is it likely to.

Nobody from India has officially conveyed the “us or them” approach to the Russians officially, nor has anyone told the Russians that India would go slow on its current defense deals with Russia and push the pause button in its relationship with Russia, but the fact is that all these are strong possibilities.

One thing is for sure: That Rogozin will be told in clear terms that the Russian move has triggered a question of trust deficit with the Russians, something that never happened all these decades.

The Russian diplomats are already realizing that they enormously underestimated the response of the new Indian government and perhaps mistakenly thought that the new government would be too busy with other issues to bother about the Russian move.

Yes, it is true that Russia has had “very good cooperation and cohesion” with the new Indian prime minister, as stated by Russian Ambassador Alexander Kadakin.

Yes, it is correct that Modi had three successful visits to Russia when he was the chief minister of Gujarat.

Yes, it is also correct that Russia never denied a visa to Modi, like many western countries, including the US and EU bloc did over his alleged role in the 2002 Gujarat riots.

But Russia needs to remember that Pakistan still continues to be a major concern for India and no Indian government can expect Russia to make this kind of move and arm that enemy of India which has waged three full-fledged wars with India (1947-48, 1965, and 1971) and one limited war in Kargil (1999).

India would never compromise with any country on the issue of Pakistan. This is the bottom line that all friends of India need to understand and this has nothing to do with who is at the helm of power in India.

I would say that the Indian media gets away with spewing a lot BS by citing "unnamed sources", every time I see something written by the Indian media that doesn't really go along with what is officially accepted the article is using these pesky "unnamed sources" making it very hard to take such news seriously.


At the same time I would say that Russia has shot itself in the foot big time IF this is true. Not two years ago Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin stated himself Russia would never arm India's enemies and now look......




Let's be honest if it really is a "us or them" ultimatum laid down by India, Russia isn't going to choose Pakistan....

"A lot of communication has taken place between India and Russia through diplomatic channels on this issue and India has conveyed to the Russians that until this red rag is removed once and for all India won’t be able to take it as business as usual with the Russians. "

lol Indian making fool themself! big LOL

Apache - US (Rejected Mi)
Chinook - US (Rejected Russian comparator)
Rafale - French (Rejected SU)
P8i - US
C17 - US

All these deals before Russia lift ban on weapons for Pakistan. Russia already knw that "India not consider Russian weapons for next 20 30 years". What Russia gain ??? and oh really Russia scared of third world country ? LOLZzzz

Still has billions in defence deals to themselves, they may be greedy but they are not stupid yes they've lot out in many deals but they are still getting a lot of business from India.

 

[kalu_miah]

I have always wondered what will happen when Chinese jet engines, fighters and other weapons systems become superior to Russian weapons systems, lets say in about 10 years. Is that a possibility at all, what do people here think?

If such a situation comes to pass, what is India's contingency plan, will they still buy Russian? Or will they dump Russians then and go exclusively for Western systems?

 

[Rank]

Still has billions in defence deals to themselves, they may be greedy but they are not stupid yes they've lot out in many deals but they are still getting a lot of business from India.

They getting $$ and India paying $$ because of you already using their weapns from past 60 years... you want spares and making deal with them. Nobody can shutdown all infrastructure in single day and move to other...

 

[Bobby]

-
as per some pak member
russians sell junk to india
but china sell alien tech to pak
even jf17 have dsi and can beat f22.. one of their members view

If they get bullock cart from China they call it Tank