If India & China go on war who will win?

[salimpheku]

India will declare moral victory for sure and give itself a participation trophy.

Is that why China is crying all over the world, for an Indian moral victory?
India kicked some commie buttocks in Bhutan and the commies have gone crying back.

 

[manlion]

I thought it was complete South which is with China!

Right now Madras regiment is playing ping pong with Chinese on the border, may be you should tell them to join China. Do it face to face

Not Tamil nationalists , except the anti Tamil -TamBrahmins (who identify themselves as Aryan) , Tamils who are pro India nationalists and non Tamils living in Tamilnadu, they would make up aroughly about 30 % of the pop.

If MR gets decimated by PLA , its good news for Tamil nationalism

 

[salimpheku]

Not Tamil nationalist , except the anti Tamil -TamBrahmins (who identify themselves as Aryan) , Tamils who are pro India nationalists and non Tamils living in Tamilnadu, they would make up aroughly about 30 % of the pop.

If MR gets decimated by PLA , its good news for Tamil nationalism

Blah Blah Blah.
Tamils are fighting for India and spanking the commies and Jihadis at the border and here you are claiming something else.

really funny

 

[manlion]

Blah Blah Blah.
Tamils are fighting for India and spanking the commies and Jihadis at the border and here you are claiming something else.

really funny

Tamils have no issue with Chinese, Cholas had cordial relationship with China. Its India's war not Tamils war with China.

https://twitter.com/x/status/788590364781322241

If they are fighting for India, good luck to them ....... but Tamils have no sympathy for these lot

 

[salimpheku]

Tamils have no issue with Chinese, Cholas had cordial relationship with China. Its India's war not Tamils war with China.

Cholas have been kicked out big time by chinese.
Want to know the status of Tamils in that region? Get your knowledge up to date. For some one claiming to be a tamil, your knowledge is woeful.
The Tamils are already angry, extremely with these people for allowing the Islamic beliefs. The Tamils in these countries are directly affected and suffering.

When push comes to shove, all the Tamils will rise up in these nations and kick out the Jihadi Jamat & support India
nothing like personal experience for tamils in these countries to know which is which and who is better.

 

[manlion]

Cholas have been kicked out big time by chinese.
Want to know the status of Tamils in that region? Get your knowledge up to date. For some one claiming to be a tamil, your knowledge is woeful.
The Tamils are already angry, extremely with these people for allowing the Islamic beliefs. The Tamils in these countries are directly affected and suffering.

When push comes to shove, all the Tamils will rise up in these nations and kick out the Jihadi Jamat & support India
nothing like personal experience for tamils in these countries to know which is which and who is better.

Cholas (with Sri Vijaya) controlled the straits of Malacca and Bay of Bengal no friction with China except Sri Vijaya (which later was their vassal state) .

Sanghi playing the non existent religion card as though TN is a Cow Nadu , but if that floats your sinking ship keep on dreaming

Let me remind you Tamils have not forgotten India complicit in 2009 Tamil genocide. I have been posting news articles/reports to validate my point, ignoramus do you know whats happening in Southern Tamilnadu right now ?

Tamils are a lost cause to India the defeat of India will spell end of Indian rule in TN

Dravidian Tamils enemy is India and the Aryans not China or Muslims

 

[salimpheku]

Cholas (with Sri Vijaya) controlled the straits of Malacca and Bay of Bengal no friction with China except Sri Vijaya (which later was their vassal state) .

Exactly buddy.
We controlled all that & now the Jihadis are controlling it.

Hence we are angry and will rise to get our land back.

Tamils are a lost cause to India the defeat of India will spell end of Indian rule in TN

Dravidian Tamils enemy is India and the Aryans not China or Muslims

Is that why Madras regiment is killing enemies of India all over the place?

psst...Jayalalitha a Kannda Bramhim, a devout Hindu, ruled Tamils for 20 years

Here is the truth about the Dravida movement

http://www.firstpost.com/politics/f...s-re-discover-religious-identity-2482412.html

 

[manlion]

Exactly buddy.
We controlled all that & now the Jihadis are controlling it.

Hence we are angry and will rise to get our land back.

Is that why Madras regiment is killing enemies of India all over the place?

psst...Jayalalitha a Kannda Bramhim, a devout Hindu, ruled Tamils for 20 years

change we / our to Tamil and Jihadis to Indians it will make sense

JJ and the past/present non Tamil elite Dravidian parties, is the reason for the Tamils plight and why Tamils are subservient slaves of India, having lost their pride and dignity. Tamils need a revolutionary leader not these non Tamil sycophant looters

 

[salimpheku]

change we / our to Tamil and Jihadis to Indians it will make sense

JJ and the past/present non Tamil elite Dravidian parties, is the reason for the Tamils plight and why Tamils are subservient slaves of India, having lost their pride and dignity. Tamils need a revolutionary leader not these non Tamil sycophant looters

Yet, all these Tamils revered Jayalalithaa, a Staunch Hindu, a Kannada bramhin as a goddess and repeatedly voted her to power.

So, EITHER the TN people are all morons for electing a staunch Hindu Bramhin as their leader OR you are speaking from your bottom.

Even the so called Hindu hating DMK's Stalin has started going to temples. Because he knows which way the Hindu wind is blowing in TN.

Look buddy, TN is gone to BJP. With Rajani Sir's entry, TN is firmly in grip of BJP & nothing will change that fact

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Nehru thought so as well.

India is making the same mistake of poking China while in a state of extreme military weakness. Do you know Chinese infrastructure reaches all the way to the LaC, while Indian infrastructure does not?

It will take several days of trekking over difficult mountainous terrain for the Indian troops to even arrive at the LaC, which will be several days too late. They will arrive days late in a state of exhaustion, with severely lacking equipment, how do you expect them to win in such a scenario?

I will answer your false rhetoric of 'extreme military weakness' once and for all,because you have rambled long enough.

Logistics -
What are you talking about?We don't need to arrive anywhere,we already have 200K + troops in the northeast deployed with 50K in sikkim alone.Your infrastructure advantage will allow you to mobilize more quickly in peacetime,but is useless in wartime.You have 3 main road links into Tibet through the mountains and tunnels.All 3 will be gone day 1.Then how will you supply your troops?Your army needs food,ammo and diesel and tibet is a barren area.You will starve,the more troops you have to feed and supply ,more helpless you will be.We are fighting on our home bases in Sikkim and Arunachal,while you are thousands of miles away from your core.Also understand its not enough to just bring in troops fast from the hinterland,unless they are acclimatized to mountain conditions they will fall sick.
Moreover your airlift capacity is very weak unlike USAF and most of heavy lift transports like IL-76 can't operate effectively in high altitude Tibet,while our airlift ability is also modest,C-17s can operate anywhere ,even on flat stretches of ground.

Terrain -
Just look at the above picture and try to understand the terrain.We have the high ground.Our forces are dug in on the heights overlooking yours.In mountainous terrain military wisdom has it you need a 8-9 :1 advantage in numbers against a defender.We found this to be true in Kargil.In 1962 you achieved this ratio and were able to get surprise.You have none of these now.Our artillery overlooks your positions and are sited on the reverse slope,thus largely invulnerable to counter battery fire.We pounded the chinese at Nathu la in 1967 precisely because of this .

The only area china can actually use its armour and artillery effectively is Ladakh region which more flat.Though we have deployed 3 tank brigades in this region recently due to this fear,i concede this is the one region where china could do some damage.The same logic doesn't apply to our mountain fortresses in sikkim and arunachal.Our forces are dug in,and you can't even use heavy vehicles in any quantity there.Even old ATGMs which we have in thousands are enough for light tanks,our best ATGMs can be reserved for Ladakh and Pakistan rajasthan/punjab plains area.

Our trump card in AT capability if the need arises of course will be - the CBU-105 cluster munition bomb.One good bomb run = one dead enemy tank regiment.Once we get the soon to arrive apaches with 16 hellfires it will seal the deal.

Troop quality -
We have 11 dedicated mountain divisions,almost all created after 1962 and trained in the High altitude infantry school,one of the best in the world where USA,UK,Israeli,German and Russian forces too have taken training.We have fought in Kargil,live in Siachen and conduct daily ops in such conditions.Many of our mountain units are composed of natural mountain fighters from these areas like garhwal,gurkha,dogra,tibetan forces.Moreover you will also have to deal with Tibetan commandos who know the terrain like the back of their hand,hate you with a passion and will wreak havoc on your forces and supply lines.In 1962 you had the veterans of korea,ww2 and the civil war.Now we have the veterans.

Airforce -
First of all you can only employ 30-40% of your airforce at most from the bases at Tibet and chengdu ,and they will be congested.
2nd ,all your main fighters ,except perhaps the J-11D lack OBOGs and will fly handicapped with limited sortie time,endurance,payload and performance.All our main fighters Su-30MKI,mirage-2000 and Mig-29s have OBOGs and will outclass yours.
3rd,our pilots have more flight hours than yours,especially the sukhoi pilots.Train with far more top quality airforces and have actual experience of high altitude aerial warfare in Kargil.
4rth,we have access to far better aerial reconaissance capability in the form of the Israeli Reccelite SAR pod on our sukhois which is used worldwide and unmatched by any equivalent except US products like DB-110.
5th,your jets will be taking off from the flat tibet plateau with little terrain cover and thus easily visible on our frontier radar systems.Our jets can operate from the hinterland behind mountainous cover and thus use terrain masking to effectively surprise your forces.We can also flank you from our airbases in Kashmir and Uttarakhand/himachal.
6th,we can operate on our side under the cover of our best AWACS -the phalcon.Whereas your jet KJ-2000 awacs can't operate at all from tibetan airbases due to altitude limitations.That is why you have had to substitute it with propeller driven ZDK-03 in tibet.Not only is it less capable than phalcon in electronic capability,its also based on a joke 1950s design propeller plane which will be a sitting duck in a high threat conventional environment.

Navy -
Your weakest link.If war starts India can sink your oil tankers with impunity in the IOR.You will survive with your internal strategic reserves,but your export economy will crash.You have a debt-GDP ratio of 260% the highest in the world matching the USA.Your economy will collapse.What can China do to intervene in IOR?Very little atm .

Your casino carrier joke breaks down in exercises and hardly goes out to sea,if that and any of your surface ships show up IN can easily sink the flotilla with a three pronged attack from underwater,land based aircraft and missiles ,and our own surface ships with brahmos and klub.Andaman ,our unsinkable carrier will be the lynchpin of such a defense.Before you bring in your ASBM theory,not only will you have no way to identify and track moving Indian ships in the IOR like you can in SCS (with land based radars and aircraft)except satellites(which can only do limited surveillence,otherwise there would be no need for surveillence aircraft). Furthermore this ASBM u people talk about has never ever been tested except on a static target in the gobi target lol.If you were going to talk about a wonder weapon,you will have to do better than that.

Coming to submarines.Your few SSNs are extremely noisy and are routinely picked up by us.We have a data sharing arrangement with the USA on movement of chinese submarines in IOR to boost this further.On to your vast SSK fleet,Song class is hopelessly obsolete.Kilos and Song class do not have AIP and thus can't operate in faraway IOR as they would have to surface regularly to recharge batteries and be sitting ducks.That leaves 15 odd Yuan class submarines.These are both quiet and have AIP,but would be at the end of endurance to operate in IOR.It would thus be a one way trip for them.Unlike in peaceful patrols when they could replenish themselves at neutral ports and move at periscope depth in international waters when necessary,they will have to operate in hostile endurance with not enough endurance to make it back to china unless they could dock in a friendly port -Sri lanka and Bangladesh won't allow you as that will bring down indian assault and will stay neutral.If only you could go around the entire indian peninsula and somehow reach pakistan you can survive,you will have to do that in the teeth of the entire IN and move in front of its bases of both western and eastern commands.In any case you will be more busy reaching pakistan to survive than spending time in active patrolling.Without a real string of pearls on the ground with naval bases in bangladesh and sri lanka(and we checkmated you on both occasions) to help replenish your submarines they are thus toothless.Our latest P-8I and ATLAS sonars on our ships will be eagerly waiting.

So to dispel your 'confusion',we are not 'extremely weak' at all.We can effectively defend ourselves while imposing a huge cost on China.Its just that we lack offensive power on land as of yet in NE until the strike corps is formed.Defensively we are ready and prepared and will only get better as our infrastructure comes up and new equipment arrives.You have become too used to bullying Vietnam and Phillipines and have begun to think of India in those terms.Above is a reality check for you ,on the actual conditions on the ground and not just paper strength that many of the fanboys seem to jerk off on.So don't provoke India in ultra sensitive areas,and go back the way you came like a good boy.No war and everybody cool.Or alternatively if u want a war,you will get one.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

In mountainous terrain military wisdom has it you need a 8-9 :1 advantage in numbers against a defender.

Again with this assumption. Who says that India will be defending against a Chinese invasion?

What if India starts the war (again), and China decides to retaliate by launching colossal numbers of mass produced conventional rocket artillery (with over 400+ km range) at every military target in North and Northeast India?

Starting with bombardment of the Chicken's Neck corridor to prevent reinforcements and supplies to NE India, while promising full military support to the NE Indian separatists to declare independence under the cover of a Sino-Indian War?

It hurts Indians here to acknowledge that China is light years ahead of India. But any objective observer will see this is clearly the case.

 

[salimpheku]

What if India starts the war (again), and China decides to retaliate by launching colossal numbers of mass produced conventional rocket artillery (with over 400+ km range) at every military target in North and Northeast India?

Flying over Himalays? Well, you don't have enough missiles and India won't be sitting quietly.

I thought we were talking about getting 'your' land back. I didn't know it was all about missile attacks.

Oh well.

Dear Dragon, we could send our stuff to mars, we can damn well send our 'stuff' to China.
You hit us with 400+ range missiles and we hit you with the same.

Next what?

@manlion Here are the brave Tamils prostrating before a Bramhin Hindu

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Flying over Himalays? Well, you don't have enough missiles and India won't be sitting quietly.

I thought we were talking about getting 'your' land back. I didn't know it was all about missile attacks.

Oh well.

Dear Dragon, we could send our stuff to mars, we can damn well send our 'stuff' to China.
You hit us with 400+ range missiles and we hit you with the same.

Next what?

We are not talking about expensive cruise missiles, we are talking about ultra cheap conventional rocket artillery shells with a range of over 400+ km. China has the largest manufacturing base in the world, we can pump out near infinite numbers of rocket artillery shells.

India's heartland lies right next to the Chinese border, the Indian capital New Delhi is only 300 km from the border. There is no way India can match our destructive output, conventionally or unconventionally.

China holds an overwhelming military advantage over India, we can use this rocket artillery to take out every military target in North and Northeast India without even leaving our borders, including the destruction of the connectivity in the Chicken's Neck corridor.

 

[salimpheku]

We are not talking about expensive cruise missiles, we are talking about ultra cheap conventional rocket artillery shells with a range of over 400+ km. China has the largest manufacturing base in the world, we can pump out near infinite numbers of rocket artillery shells.

India's heartland lies right next to the Chinese border, the Indian capital New Delhi is only 300 km from the border. There is no way India can match our destructive output, conventionally or unconventionally.

You got like 5 main cities in your nation, target them and your country is more or less finished.
All your oil flows through IOR, we destroy it and you are finished.

And you attack our city with missiles, tell me, what do u think India's response would be?
If your guess is India would sit quiet, you are smoking some serious stuff.

 

[Han Patriot]

We are not talking about expensive cruise missiles, we are talking about ultra cheap conventional rocket artillery shells with a range of over 400+ km. China has the largest manufacturing base in the world, we can pump out near infinite numbers of rocket artillery shells.

India's heartland lies right next to the Chinese border, the Indian capital New Delhi is only 300 km from the border. There is no way India can match our destructive output, conventionally or unconventionally.

China holds an overwhelming military advantage over India.

China will not attack Delhi, most likely she will cut off Siliguri by using cruise missiles on the railways and roads. India does not have long range precision cruise missiles. Then after cutting off the neck, China will attack Tezpur, all can be done from Lhasa, you don't even need to go to the border. After this is done, drones will come in to sweep the border from infantry, then artillery will occupy strategic area.