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I don't believe in Democracy.

In a parliamentary system, people do not choose a Prime Minister. You're thinking of American-style Presidential system.

Do u think khilafah is a parliamentary system ? That by the people khalifah will be selected? Or council will select khalifah? Their are two parts of council. 1- consults and 2- ummah council. Repablic means wish of the people and voting system. khilafah isn't under voting system.

Pakistan still now under US style democreacy. By the ppl, for the ppl, of the ppl.

Read it-

http://www.khilafah.com/a-khilafah-of-honour-and-integrity-or-a-republic-of-subservience-and-ruin/
 
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Do u think khilafah is a parliamentary system ? That by the people khalifah will be selected? Or council will select khalifah? Their are two parts of council. 1- consults and 2- ummah council. Repablic means wish of the people and voting system. khilafah isn't under voting system.


Read it-

http://www.khilafah.com/a-khilafah-of-honour-and-integrity-or-a-republic-of-subservience-and-ruin/

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Your blabbering on voting is idiotic since your own governance model suggests people vote.


You're debating semantics.
  • First, your issue was that a head of the state, Khalifah, cannot be voted in by people. Pakistan is run on a parliamentary system where we don't vote for the head of the state. Your response? Nothing.
  • Second, having failed to understand Pakistan's governance framework of Islamic republic, you're back to debating semantics around "Ummah Council". What is an "Ummah Council"? Its a citizen body siting on top of Majlis (Parliament). Pakistan's National Assembly (Parliament) is called Majlis-e-Shoora and the citizen body siting on top of it is the Awan-i-Bala (Senate). Simply because you call something "Ummah Council" doesn't mean it hails from the sky.
Here is my questions for you:
  • Show me a reference about your "Ummah Council" in Quran. If you can't, then you're wrong about all this. Simple.
Pakistan still now under US style democreacy. By the ppl, for the ppl, of the ppl.


You're reciting US constitution.

Here's Pakistan's constitution part IX, article 227 for you, "All existing laws shall be brought in conformity with the Injunctions of Islam as laid down in the Quran and Sunnah, in this Part referred to as the Injunctions of Islam, and no law shall be enacted which is repugnant to such Injunctions."

You're obviously confusing Pakistan with Bangladesh which is a secular democracy, not an Islamic republic. Pakistan is an Islamic republic with Federal Shariat Court.
 
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It's staggering how so many people believe in a system where a person or a law is considered legitimate just because a vast majority shares the same opinion. Look around you, if the majority of people were sane enough to elect a competent leader, the world wouldn't be in this state. Allah says in the Quran the Talood (a king) was chosen as a leader because he was the best in knowledge/wisdom, the best in physique and because Allah chooses as he wills; and that's how it should be
 
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Your blabbering on voting is idiotic since your own governance model suggests people vote.


You're debating semantics.
  • First, your issue was that a head of the state, Khalifah, cannot be voted in by people. Pakistan is run on a parliamentary system where we don't vote for the head of the state. Your response? Nothing.
  • Second, having failed to understand Pakistan's governance framework of Islamic republic, you're back to debating semantics around "Ummah Council". What is an "Ummah Council"? Its a citizen body siting on top of Majlis (Parliament). Pakistan's National Assembly (Parliament) is called Majlis-e-Shoora and the citizen body siting on top of it is the Awan-i-Bala (Senate). Simply because you call something "Ummah Council" doesn't mean it hails from the sky.
Here is my questions for you:
  • Show me a reference about your "Ummah Council" in Quran. If you can't, then you're wrong about all this. Simple.



You're reciting US constitution.

Here's Pakistan's constitution part IX, article 227 for you, "All existing laws shall be brought in conformity with the Injunctions of Islam as laid down in the Quran and Sunnah, in this Part referred to as the Injunctions of Islam, and no law shall be enacted which is repugnant to such Injunctions."

You're obviously confusing Pakistan with Bangladesh which is a secular democracy, not an Islamic republic. Pakistan is an Islamic republic with Federal Shariat Court.


Then why pakistan don't declare a khilafah state?
 
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U can say democratic islamic republic of pakistan. Not only Islamic republic. Bcz in islam democracy is totally haram.
 
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Then who is ur khilafah ?


"Khalifah" simply means successor. That's it.

This is what happens when you don't know Arabic.

U can say democratic islamic republic of pakistan. Not only Islamic republic. Bcz in islam democracy is totally haram.


I don't think facts matter to you.

The official name of Pakistan is Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Period.

Pakistan (Wikipedia): Pakistan, officially the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, is a federal parliamentary republic in South Asia.
 
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"Khalifah" simply means successor. That's it.

This is what happens when you don't know Arabic.




I don't think facts matter to you.

The official name of Pakistan is Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Period.

Pakistan (Wikipedia): Pakistan, officially the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, is a federal parliamentary republic in South Asia.

So u think ur country is ruling by the hukum sariya law?
 
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So u think ur country is ruling by the hukum sariya law?


What is Federal Shariat Court? What are the Hudood Ordinances of Pakistan?

I don't mind debating but you need to understand the governance framework of Pakistan before we can have a serious conversation.
 
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Before anything corruption needs to be eradicated from Pakistan or else no system can work.
 
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"Khalifah" simply means successor. That's it.

This is what happens when you don't know Arabic.




I don't think facts matter to you.

The official name of Pakistan is Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Period.

Pakistan (Wikipedia): Pakistan, officially the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, is a federal parliamentary republic in South Asia.
In my opinion as what he thinking Khalifa a spiritual figure who can guide and lead Ummat is appoint by Allah almighty and He make people or group around him to accept it ( mean Taeed karwata hai ) and as per era we living the solution is only Imam Mehdi who is promised one and can unite the Ummat as Allah will is with him. The OP correct as well about current democratic system we have in Pakistan or other Muslims countries not matched with the teaching of Islam as majority of Ummat morral corrupted. Wallaho Aalam
 
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Ya Allah, not the Khalifah proposals again. There was a comment on PDF's facebook page that democracy gives a vote to the illiterate and uneducated and makes men equal; rather than realising that they very origin of Islam had within its core message the idea of ending inequality in every form. Clearly people are sheep or simple enough to start bleating the same message

Ikhwan (since saying brothers or sisters might draw some fools with a grudge against using English along with Islamic teachings- It has happened)he term Khalifah has NOTHING to do with Islam. The Prophet PBUH did not invent the word nor was it revealed in a revelation. He did NOT proposed or leave any system and he never indicated that in anything except some of the most weakest hadiath; which the Khalifah brigade and extremist militant organisations like HT like to drag in with irrelevant passages of the Quran that have nothing to do with a system of governance.. at least not in terms of "what".

Even the choosing of the prophet's successor was similar as it was done with Arab Tribes and customs of the time. There were disagreements then which formed the stupid base for today's political and sadly social Sunni Shia divide (and not the initial different interpretations of Fiqh by the well learnt scholars).

Islam is a way of life demonstrated by the Prophet as he could within his time. Which is why if and when a Mahdi does come, he wont ride a camel unless necessary or use a sword against a ISIS tank. Democracy is basically giving a voice to the people, there is NO single version of it; there is American/ western interpretation.. there are Asian version of it and so on. It is an idea that the people can develop according to their wishes; the same way it is NOT a perfect system just as a dictatorship may not be. There is the idea of a popular leader ruling for a long time and this is where kings or otherwise came about; it is ALSO not a concept abhorred by Islam because Islam never gave a system. It gave guidelines for laws and social practices within whatever society which can be moulded and adapted to incorporate and assimilate the local culture/ traditions and wishes of the people whilst maintaining a focus on removing social injustices and evil.

So just as Islam has given clear guidelines on why not allow women dancing in public as it is unfair to human nature for BOTH sexes in terms of maintaining a balance(and not traditional masculine society or a feminine one); it has also given clear guidelines on where religion starts, where Qiyas could be taken and where it is onto the best judgement of human beings. There is nothing in the Quran that outlines a blueprint for Rocketry but there is a hint to those of learning.

So the key question is not Khilafat per those Hizb idiots, not Shariat since no modern scholar who understands its application(and implementations from scratch in a society starting from a neighborhood, to a village to an entire nation) has brought forward or been allowed to bring forward since either uneducated theatrical egomaniacs or downright sexist paedophiles are the "scholars" of today which people share happily on facebook.

I am expecting the usual parroting of copy paste arguments quoting irrelevant people , irrelevant ayah's(whose exact revelation time and situation/context that is documented to a large degree of accuracy in many exgesis/tafaseer is ignored by most modern copy paste "ulema") or misquoted or weak Hadiath in response; but frankly these are as repetitively boring and weak as the rants of people here talking about combat aircraft as if they just led the 65 air war.

The question is of getting men of learning who know something about everything and everything about something; and them being from the fields of study ranging from Fiqh, Seerat, Muslim History, Chemistry, Literature, Aerospace, Art, Finance, Social Media studies and everything else; to be able to come together and cast their opinions and votes on what should be a form of rule for the society they represent. These people can be vetted, and they also have to be elected by the areas they come from.. that is one possible ideal democracy.

It is NOT the issue of giving a voice or a vote; but the issue of the people being voted for. That is the lesson left by the Prophet; the Sahabi and especially the Ashrah Mubasharah represented the best from ALL spheres of that society. They were specific to 7th century arabia but they were the best of them; that is the lesson given. Those people were beside the prophet and choosing amongst themselves who should lead them after he left his earthly body.

Sadly, no one in HT or any of these Khalifah movements has the three brain cells to decipher that and instead are being misled by their leadership which is painting a picture of a repressive regime built to elect their own core leaders while disguising itself as many extremist and self serving movements do; under the guise of bringing "true" Islam and Shariat.

There is NOTHING to believe in democracy because as such we wrongly define it in light of either American democracy or the elected oligarchy such as is in Pakistan. The actual term is the basic definition of everyone having a voice; and if the revelation to the Prophet when he felt slightly irked about a poorer man coming to see him while he met with the leaders of the Quraish is any indication to those of understanding..we do not suppress any voice.
Be it the voice of a man with an IQ of 165 and no money, one with an IQ of 60 and lots of money, or any of these combinations. We do not suppress the voice of even a convicted murderer, and have no right to as Allah himself listens to all; who are we to question his ways?

But no, sadly we do. We are human beings who need discontent and discomfort amongst each other to thrive; who must create policies and politics of class and division, all disguised under(and making a mockery of) this ayat
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