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How to Overtake the Indian Armour ?

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The feeling is mutual when your terrorists commit terrorist activities in Pakistan especially in Baluchistan.

But few months back i went to recruitment drive of terrorist in Baluchistan, they put no vacancy board and told me we will prefer sophisticated and professional people unlike u..... then i got to know we are nothing in-front of professionals like ----->
 
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Wow so many Expert opinions ,

Why is it that every one keep forgetting , That there will be no War , there wont be any invading force , Cold start of warm start whatever it is , its only for show , Neither of two countries are crazy enough to Try & do any misadventure , Long gone are the days of 90's and early 20's when this was possible.

There will be no War , bcoz if there is a War there will be No India or Pakistan left to enjoy Spoils of war , We are not that strong but still have enough power to Nuke Whole India 3 times & same goes for india .

If ever there is chance of any conflict it will be via Air between PAF & IAF , there wont be any ground forces involved .
 
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sorry to interrupt people i am just watching all flames coming out
the thread starter have no idea about blitzkrieg it waring at the most soft points avoiding any strong fight and do they think india will inform them about their plans as where they will enter can they monitor their whole border and then quickly change focus
now about the nasr the only idea of forming ibg is to remain so small yet powerfull that you remain unquestioned these weapons are only usefull at best when you know the possible path taken by the invading forces which are so small
 
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THERE WILL BE NO MASS INVASION OF pakistan.

People are getting paranoid about india,s military spending especially these last 10 years.

Pakistanis need to understand that some of this hyper expensive equipment IE C17 globemasters or P8 posideon planes and even MMRCA rafael/typhoon are not for use in indo pak war

BUT more likely china.

INDIA will do everything possible to prevent a war and the reason for this is simple

indian GDP is on the verge of $2 trillion and ready to overtake UK & FRANCE & ITLAY within the next 4 years.

Any war would destroy india,s impressive 8% growth rate which has been consistent dor over 10 years.

RELAX even AGNI 5 (5000KM thermo nuclear ballistic missle) tested last week is for CHINA and not pakistan
 
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Out of your mind ? - one Nasr Strike = total annihilation of those IBGs , with no reverse ! - you use your Parhaar or whatever it is called - we will take out all of your cities in response. No more "cold start" right ?



Doesn't help , ask those Israelis who ain't breathing anymore because of humble hizbullah ATGMs. Markeva is the most protective tank in the world for its crew - it got trashed - No APS stands a chance , its just a psychological comfort to the operators.



I just hope your Generals are as informed as you are - i truly do ;)



Same on Pakistani side , electronic warfare sites would be operational too which Indians cant bring along.



I just hope your Generals are as informed about cluster bombs as you are - i truly do ;)

For NASR to strike it has to come within 60km of IBG's.It is quite tough for NASR to escape short range-Medium range BM's like Prithvi's,Shaurya's.Also IBG's will have massive air support.So one hit from Popeye's can do unacceptable damage to your NASR.

The Hezbollah ATGM's weren't very humble.They were Iranian supplied Kornet's.

BTW if IA is so worried about Babur/RAAD they wouldn't have deployed MKI's & other Strategic assets just a few kms from the border.Spyder & Aksash can take on cruise missiles.

Looks like you are grossly misinformed about Indian EW capabilities.We have a number of mobile EW units.
This for you:
India develops largest electronic warfare system
I do hope GHQ has got researchers like you.

Rockeye doesn't have independently targeting Skeets like CBU 97 sensor fuzed weapon.A cbu 97 may destroy upto 40 tanks on it's own.
 
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A couple of things..
NATO forces knew throughout the 80's.. that eventually Soviet armor.. due to sheer numbers and improving weaponry would break open their lines. There was no way to match it tank for tank, shell for shell. Technology for technology.

However, late 80's.. USAF did a study on the Soviet logistics system and found that the Soviet supply system was made of some key hubs. If these key hubs could be taken out.hubs such as fuel supply stations and forward ammo dumps. The Soviet thrust would grind to a halt. The study was called "checkmate".

A similar approach may be adopted or may already be adopted or planned by the PAF. It is crystal clear that India CANNOT EVER be matched in terms of numbers and perhaps technology as well.
What must be adopted are smarter tactics, and a constant lookout for possible weakness that would negate the numerical and technological advantages.

What must also be understood, that unlike europe which has certain depth for fallback, Pakistan has none.
Any intrusion deeper than a few deca kilometers will threaten key industrial, logistical, population and infrastructure center's.
The effectiveness of an Indian force to penetrate this fault line is increasing exponentially with time.
The PA knows this, SPD knows this..
It is , whether anybody likes it or not.. very clear to the establishment that a determined Indian attack will be through within a few days if not hours.

One must also consider the PA doctrine, since the 80's and Brasstacks.. The PA is now convinced that its immediate goal is to slow down a certain IA advance, grab as much Indian territory as possible ..then hope that the diplomatic circles can get them a ceasefire.
Had the establishment been smarter , it would have slowly shifted logistical and industrial center's west, into the bad lands of Balochistan. Where there was possibility of falling back. However.. by their own folly and with a little encouragement by the perceived threat. Balochistan isnt going to be as welcoming to another encroachment by the PA.. Although efforts are underway to move the communication and logistical lines further back.

As ridiculous as it sounded.. The IA is moving to improve its mobility on the plains of Punjab, and its airborne element... but more on that later. The Idea of Cutting Pakistan in two (breaking it has been done already) via a thrust in the south.. blockading Karachi and perhaps cutting if off entirely.. the three main highway's.. and a rail artery are within a 180km from the Border.
The alternate link runs through balcohistan.. an area that can be made hostile for any resupply routes by the enemy through conventional and unconventional means.
Fuel and weapons may still arrive in Pakistan via alternate ports that may be defended for two weeks or so(if PA manages to hold its ground).

Then comes the captial, relatively open for Aerial attacks.. and if the Shakargarh bulge is taken.. a highway away from being overtaken.

Now that the likely scenario has been laid out.
The weight falls.. yet again.. on the PAF to save the day.
It must survive against insurmountable odds, and deliver precise blows that must cause any Indian IBG to slow down in its tracks.
It does not need to keep air superiority all over Pakistan, Just prevent key logistical lines of the PA from failing. These are fairly well protected in the Punjab.. but in the Thar and Cholistan areas.. and in Sindh.. they are well exposed to air attack.
the IAF will not have an easy time supporting its troops directly as the PA is in possession of many and very effective MANPADS and AAA. Which will extract losses from the IAF no matter what..as the nature of the Battlefield is as such.

However, whilst the reserves from the PA pour in.. the PAF must ensure that it survives long enough to make sure that these troops reach the fight quick.. and that their weapons do so as well.

PakMil can NEVER hope to annihilate, obliterate or do anything "ate" otherwise to the Indian Armour beyond what it is capable of.
What it must ensure is to keep it at bay long enough for diplomacy to prevail.
Problem is, if Pakistan has already lost on the Diplomatic front, then what?
Then sirs.. Weapons like the NASR come in.
However.. that is a new game.
A single NASR will invite a similar response on a greater scale from India.. We will retaliate with a strike on some airfield..
They will retaliate with a strike on GHQ or AHQ.. and we launch it all.. and they launch it all.
And the Indian subcontinent will be a quiet neighborhood for the next 300 years.
 
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Having said all above there is some equipment which i believe is pakistan specfic

"Arjun" Main Battle Tank

2nd batch of mk2 124 ordered (124 received already)

brahmos cruise missles

smerch BMRL

PINKA mbrl

ALL of these are fast efficient motorised mobile fire power units and will be used in any COLD START style assault
 
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Wow so many Expert opinions ,

Why is it that every one keep forgetting , That there will be no War , there wont be any invading force , Cold start of warm start whatever it is , its only for show , Neither of two countries are crazy enough to Try & do any misadventure , Long gone are the days of 90's and early 20's when this was possible.

There will be no War , bcoz if there is a War there will be No India or Pakistan left to enjoy Spoils of war , We are not that strong but still have enough power to Nuke Whole India 3 times & same goes for india .

If ever there is chance of any conflict it will be via Air between PAF & IAF , there wont be any ground forces involved .


whole India that too 3 times?? may be you can touch some main cities not at all whole India
 
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Santro

I believe the indians have a fairly good idea of Pakistans nuclear threshold
i dont believe the indians will pass this threshold in any scenario

THIS IS WHY THE INDIANS have no first use of nukes policy.

I am certain cold start does not involve going much beyond 50km accross the borders and splitting PAKISTAN IN 2 WAS their pre cold start strategy of yesteryear.

Naval blockade is a strong possibility couplede with air strikes hence massive investment in SU30MKI AND SOON mmrca rafael i think
 
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Santro is correct. This is precisely why diplomacy and CBMs is the only way.
I do not want to see anymore bloodshed of our brothers (pakistanis included). We must talk and resolve our issues, military action was never a solution.
 
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A couple of things..
NATO forces knew throughout the 80's.. that eventually Soviet armor.. due to sheer numbers and improving weaponry would break open their lines. There was no way to match it tank for tank, shell for shell. Technology for technology.

However, late 80's.. USAF did a study on the Soviet logistics system and found that the Soviet supply system was made of some key hubs. If these key hubs could be taken out.hubs such as fuel supply stations and forward ammo dumps. The Soviet thrust would grind to a halt. The study was called "checkmate".

A similar approach may be adopted or may already be adopted or planned by the PAF. It is crystal clear that India CANNOT EVER be matched in terms of numbers and perhaps technology as well.
What must be adopted are smarter tactics, and a constant lookout for possible weakness that would negate the numerical and technological advantages.

What must also be understood, that unlike europe which has certain depth for fallback, Pakistan has none.
Any intrusion deeper than a few deca kilometers will threaten key industrial, logistical, population and infrastructure center's.
The effectiveness of an Indian force to penetrate this fault line is increasing exponentially with time.
The PA knows this, SPD knows this..
It is , whether anybody likes it or not.. very clear to the establishment that a determined Indian attack will be through within a few days if not hours.

One must also consider the PA doctrine, since the 80's and Brasstacks.. The PA is now convinced that its immediate goal is to slow down a certain IA advance, grab as much Indian territory as possible ..then hope that the diplomatic circles can get them a ceasefire.
Had the establishment been smarter , it would have slowly shifted logistical and industrial center's west, into the bad lands of Balochistan. Where there was possibility of falling back. However.. by their own folly and with a little encouragement by the perceived threat. Balochistan isnt going to be as welcoming to another encroachment by the PA.. Although efforts are underway to move the communication and logistical lines further back.

As ridiculous as it sounded.. The IA is moving to improve its mobility on the plains of Punjab, and its airborne element... but more on that later. The Idea of Cutting Pakistan in two (breaking it has been done already) via a thrust in the south.. blockading Karachi and perhaps cutting if off entirely.. the three main highway's.. and a rail artery are within a 180km from the Border.
The alternate link runs through balcohistan.. an area that can be made hostile for any resupply routes by the enemy through conventional and unconventional means.
Fuel and weapons may still arrive in Pakistan via alternate ports that may be defended for two weeks or so(if PA manages to hold its ground).

Then comes the captial, relatively open for Aerial attacks.. and if the Shakargarh bulge is taken.. a highway away from being overtaken.

Now that the likely scenario has been laid out.
The weight falls.. yet again.. on the PAF to save the day.
It must survive against insurmountable odds, and deliver precise blows that must cause any Indian IBG to slow down in its tracks.
It does not need to keep air superiority all over Pakistan, Just prevent key logistical lines of the PA from failing. These are fairly well protected in the Punjab.. but in the Thar and Cholistan areas.. and in Sindh.. they are well exposed to air attack.
the IAF will not have an easy time supporting its troops directly as the PA is in possession of many and very effective MANPADS and AAA. Which will extract losses from the IAF no matter what..as the nature of the Battlefield is as such.

However, whilst the reserves from the PA pour in.. the PAF must ensure that it survives long enough to make sure that these troops reach the fight quick.. and that their weapons do so as well.

PakMil can NEVER hope to annihilate, obliterate or do anything "ate" otherwise to the Indian Armour beyond what it is capable of.
What it must ensure is to keep it at bay long enough for diplomacy to prevail.
Problem is, if Pakistan has already lost on the Diplomatic front, then what?
Then sirs.. Weapons like the NASR come in.
However.. that is a new game.
A single NASR will invite a similar response on a greater scale from India.. We will retaliate with a strike on some airfield..
They will retaliate with a strike on GHQ or AHQ.. and we launch it all.. and they launch it all.
And the Indian subcontinent will be a quiet neighborhood for the next 300 years.

A very good analysis by you Santro.

But, as you mentioned there, that the PA cannot obliterate the Indian Columns, and by having our country width so short, and our hubs near Indian Border, the margin for error is very small. And we do tend to be relying on international pressure after 1 day of war, so that the things can be kept in cool order, and possibly a ceasefire.

But, in all honesty, we do have enough capability to repel a cold start war, whose aim is to have a small but concentrated effort to capture some territory and break the enemy lines, relying on armored corps and Air force. And then, the international pressure will come and escalation more than this will be avoided.

But, in an all out war, without a cold start ( very unlikely, one in a billion), we cannot hold our lines for much more than a couple of days.

But lets all be honest, a war with India is not going to happen in the next 3 years.
 
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But, in an all out war, without a cold start ( very unlikely, one in a billion), we cannot hold our lines for much more than a couple of days.

But lets all be honest, a war with India is not going to happen in the next 3 years.

no. Cant agree with that one
 
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