High rates of Divorce in Pak society and esp in Military class

[El Sidd]

From they day one I am in favor of pardah and likes women who stay at homes....rest showbiz girls...I like the most who shows more skin...

 

[PakFactor]

Man, what happened to you ?? You are slowly becoming a mullah.



Yes, still Indian. There are many non-Muslims here who are protesting in my favor.

Still have to have others to protest for you. How long they gonna keep your citizenship active? You got your papers ready?

He said more skin not more males bro.

 

[El Sidd]

He said more skin not more males bro.

Direct him to the next PTI concert then bro

 

[PakFactor]

Direct him to the next PTI concert then bro

Lol..

In regards to the high divorce rate(s) a lot of issues I see is due to monetary situations in the family. A friend purchased so and so -- and wife comes home acts bitter and accidentally slips out, I had other better rishta's and it was my mistake i chose you, etc. and situation just explodes from their not carrying how the kids will be impacted. I have a very good university friend going through the same issue and it's not pretty because ex-wife says something in public and he'll say something and both sides look bad end of day and future ristha's don't come then.

The other issue is how the younger generation before agreeing are on the phone 6+ months and then boom suddenly he/she comes out saying, "communication issue" -- seen this with my own brother.

Or the mother plays the Istakhara game, hell these same aunti's couldn't get their own Istakhara right and they wanna do the daughter, lol.

Thankfully the 1st girl that said yes to me I quietly accepted and happily married 8+ years didn't go through the whole talk on phone 6 month crap and shit.

 

[El Sidd]

Lol..

In regards to the high divorce rate(s) a lot of issues I see is due to monetary situations in the family. A friend purchased so and so -- and wife comes home acts bitter and accidentally slips out, I had other better rishta's and it was my mistake i chose you, etc. and situation just explodes from their not carrying how the kids will be impacted. I have a very good university friend going through the same issue and it's not pretty because ex-wife says something in public and he'll say something and both sides look bad end of day and future ristha's don't come then.

The other issue is how the younger generation before agreeing are on the phone 6+ months and then boom suddenly he/she comes out saying, "communication issue" -- seen this with my own brother.

Yeah Malik Riaz was let go because catching him would have left all Pakistani men as Randway !!

Marriage is not the ultimate success of life. It is bad enough that this is taught to women, now it is being taught to men too.

Ye ghar ki chaar diwari me discuss kia karo mamlaat. bazaar me akar kapre phaarne se masle nahi hal hone

 

[blain2]

Hi Everyone @Oscar @Horus @Windjammer @Everyone else

I have recently seen four marriages dissolving and family going into disarray with destruction of family and children. This is all what i have seen in last one year. All have come from our military class and not the high officers class but from relatively decently educated middle grade young officers class. The divorce rates are already astonishingly high in civilian classes and that is all due to the 'faminine revolution' and rules being drafted in legislature giving females unprecedented rights in name of female liberty. Most certainly these females living with young officers are not oppressed, they come from good origins, have good education. They are not like the poor unducated class. This is bizzare and i was distressed with that. In one case, the female not only destroyed the life of the young man but also took away the children and now he has to present himself to court every month to meet his children. In this case, the female's father is a former brigadere and he has concieved several bogus charges against him in addition to divorce ( i say they are bogus, because i know the family for 25 years atleast).

This is all happened when we have embarked on dajjals feminist revolution and started drafting all kind of pro-female legalities and rules changing the balance between male and female as ordained by Allah SWT. I feel shattered to see this. We need to kickstart a campaign to stop this fanatic course of destruction.

I think life is more complicated than when I was around the Army.

Lets start with a trend which has been accelerating across the country over the past 2 decades and this entails more emphasis on women's education and pursuit of careers to build dual-income households to cater to the needs of the family and providing a higher quality of life given the expenses/inflation in the country.

Having dual-incomes means requiring stability for both spouses to stay in their careers and grow. In the civilian life, you get planted in one place and can stick around. If you don't want to move with the job, you can quit and opt for another. Relatively easier than what goes on in the military. When the posting comes, you can try but its not easy to get out of it. Along with it comes the uprooting of the family in many cases or leaving behind the family to stay in the family home etc. The one wearing the uniform moves away to his post, yet the spouse left behind, who may be a professional, is the one stuck with managing a job and also the care of children and all else. Anyone who has been married for any period of time knows what these stresses are like on a marriage.

I think this is a phase many in uniform are going through. Some adjustments need to be made on all ends including even the military services to accommodate officers and families to the extent possible.

The religious angle you are taking is fine, however this is a problem increasingly all over the Muslim world (as well as in non-Muslim countries). One can blame the feminist revolution on one hand, but having 50% of your population uneducated, under-employed and under-leveraged is also no longer a viable option.

 

[StormBreaker]

I think life is more complicated than when I was around the Army.

Lets start with a trend which has been accelerating across the country over the past 2 decades and this entails more emphasis on women's education and pursuit of careers to build dual-income households to cater to the needs of the family and providing a higher quality of life given the expenses/inflation in the country.

Having dual-incomes means requiring stability for both spouses to stay in their careers and grow. In the civilian life, you get planted in one place and can stick around. If you don't want to move with the job, you can quit and opt for another. Relatively easier than what goes on in the military. When the posting comes, you can try but its not easy to get out of it. Along with it comes the uprooting of the family in many cases or leaving behind the family to stay in the family home etc. The one wearing the uniform moves away to his post, yet the spouse left behind, who may be a professional, is the one stuck with managing a job and also the care of children and all else. Anyone who has been married for any period of time knows what these stresses are like on a marriage.

I think this is a phase many in uniform are going through. Some adjustments need to be made on all ends including even the military services to accommodate officers and families to the extent possible.

The religious angle you are taking is fine, however this is a problem increasingly all over the Muslim world (as well as in non-Muslim countries). One can blame the feminist revolution on one hand, but having 50% of your population uneducated, under-employed and under-leveraged is also no longer a viable option.

Agreed.

As for the reforms,
Military must stop copying the inherited British laws and make most of their own.
There must be flexibility for officers to take their social lives alongside.

Basic Human nature, when messed with, creates tyrannical minds and all sorts of messed up brains. What are the laws btw for an officer to meet his family given that they are within area and when they are not in reach ? Are they same from captain till General ?

 

[blain2]

Agreed.

As for the reforms,
Military must stop copying the inherited British laws and make most of their own.
There must be flexibility for officers to take their social lives alongside.

Basic Human nature, when messed with, creates tyrannical minds and all sorts of messed up brains. What are the laws btw for an officer to meet his family given that they are within area and when they are not in reach ? Are they same from captain till General ?

It's the same. You take leave on your own and visit family. If they happen to be living locally then after your official working hours, there is no bar in your visiting family. This applies to all ranks with the difference that most other non-commissioned ranks such as NCOs and jawans don't bring their families around to live in unit accommodations for the married. Reason being there aren't enough and secondly and more importantly because they prefer their womenfolk to stay back in their rural/ancestral homes.

 

[StormBreaker]

It's the same. You take leave on your own and visit family. If they happen to be living locally then after your official working hours, there is no bar in your visiting family. This applies to all ranks with the difference that most other non-commissioned ranks such as NCOs and jawans don't bring their families around to live in unit accommodations for the married. Reason being there aren't enough and secondly and more importantly because they prefer their womenfolk to stay back in their rural/ancestral homes.

But Sir, security and flow of info POV, don’t you think that is a flaw ?

Paid people can be anywhere, people are least under surveillance when they are on leave or return home every day, don’t you think that is a concern to some extent ?

The whole problem here is, and i further quote my earlier post on reforms,

It is not easy to adjust your life, balance it when in military.

There are some organizational requirements that require you to sacrifice social life to much extent as well.

When a person wears the uniform, he is wearing a piece of cloth which symbolizes his oath and his agreement to give up personal ambitions in turn for greater good.

Not easy being an officer i must say, especially a naval officer !!!

 

[blain2]

But Sir, security and flow of info POV, don’t you think that is a flaw ?

Paid people can be anywhere, people are least under surveillance when they are on leave or return home every day, don’t you think that is a concern to some extent ?

The whole problem here is, and i further quote my earlier post on reforms,

It is not easy to adjust your life, balance it when in military.

There are some organizational requirements that require you to sacrifice social life to much extent as well.

When a person wears the uniform, he is wearing a piece of cloth which symbolizes his oath and his agreement to give up personal ambitions in turn for greater good.

Not easy being an officer i must say, especially a naval officer !!!

Depends on what the job is but more importantly the military life has to be a balanced one. Officers and men who know their families are well taken care of, tend to perform better in their jobs when they don't have the stresses of domestic life. This is a universal finding. If the MI sleuths are all over you and you are constantly worried about whom you interact it, then it isn't much of a professional career and most would quit or not join up at all.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

"Herem-lik and Selam-lik" in all spaces including cyber is the solution....

Even the Evliya aren't free from the tribulation and tests from the Nefs...

Control the un-taxed Haram money circulation...

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

good, divorce gives husband sometime to have free breathing space..to know himself...build his kingdom up again and then marry a suitable, younger , more fertile, eager ,coy woman

 

[ps3linux]

Stumbled upon this thread went and through few pages first and then through all, decided to summarize the opinions between categories which are:

· Feminist type

· Religious type

· Fantasy type

· Illogical argumentative type

· Understanding type

Generally it is the last type who have real idea of the challenges of marriage, first three types to me seem more like what they expect the relationship to be whether from the female perspective or male perspective.

Being married for over two decades with a lady; both of us coming from two entirely different backgrounds and language proficiency, never seen or met each other before the day of “nikah”, not even informed about it, put into an arranged marriage during their college/uni days I think I have a fair idea about how marriages work and don’t work.

Let me establish one thing first Allah has created both men and women but he gave more compassion to women as compared to men; with compassion comes sensitivity women are much more sensitive to any stimuli as compared to men. A simple comment like “you are looking good” can have different responses from a male and a female, the male would acknowledge it and forget about it after 5 minutes, while a lady would start mulling over it and at the first opportunity would stand in front of a mirror and check herself from every angle and if god forbid she finds any flaw that’s it; I’ll leave further repercussions to imagination. It’s not about ridiculing them or making fun of ladies it’s just establishing that they are much more sensitive than their brutish counterparts.

Now the topic of the thread seems pretty naiive to me, high divorce rate in Forces linked families, and that number comes to 4 no offense, Army’s strength ballpark is over half a million 4 out of half million doesn’t even register. I know military families which have been happily married for over 5 decades, 3 decades, many of my class mates are in the forces, many of my navy batch mates have been married for over two decades now and except for one I haven’t seen cases of divorce and I am not talking about 4 cases I am talking about 300 plus families and these are just my class/course mates what does it prove nothing.

Correct statement would be divorce rate has increased exponentially in Pakistan as well just like the rest of the world where divorce is spreading like an airborne viral infection.

Marriage is a social contract and as such carries obligations on part of both parties, it also requires important ingredients like tolerance, adaptability and flexibility on part of both parties. Ours is a unique society where joint family system having its pro about the institution of marriage has its serious cons as well.

Much as I hate to say I’ll quote something someone said to females of his family after his marriage and they are “women are the worst enemy of women, and mothers are the worst among them all they have two spectacles one for daughter in which everything is bright and sunny son in law bringing their daughter every weekend to meet them is good, the other spectacles reserved for daughter in law shows everything dark and gloomy if son takes his wife to her parents once in a month then it’s being a rann mureed, first they have this uncontrolled desire to bring daughter in law, for which they insult and reject countless girls, break their hearts with very unkind comments and when they finally find a match, they are unwilling to share their son with her post marriage. You have to understand this she has spent her whole life in another family with different norms, may be different culture has been raised and cared like an expensive doll, she is a human being and you are expecting her to adopt to your values in a week. Have you given her any comfort, have you tried to understand why she is doing/acting the way she is doing may be she has a different perspective on things, would you be ok if same happened to your own daughter, what do you think she is a piece of paper whom you would pass through the photocopier of your values and it will be copied instantly? she is a human being not a damn servant or slave”

@blain2 has effectively highlighted some points about challenges of marriage in forces families, many a times husband even officer is posted in a far off front “Siachen” is a typical example for Army and “submariner” is a typical example for Navy families. If the lady is a career oriented one and working in the corporate world a transfer/posting to another place is not really congenial to career. Besides what is the fun in first having education for daughters (despite the fact I have seen certain families discriminate between sons and daughters education, good school universities for son and average for daughters) and then expecting them to give it all up and become house maids. Women of today want to be independent financially as well and that transfer in armed forces families doesn’t get along the career so well. Of course there are excesses on both sides but I am talking in general terms there are families/husbands where women is nothing more than a house maid with no value and then there are women to whom marriage is nothing more than a burden.

I will try and put in few more words later. The impact of media/social media and the misconception about religion regarding marriage later.

 

[pakpride00090]

Stumbled upon this thread went and through few pages first and then through all, decided to summarize the opinions between categories which are:

· Feminist type

· Religious type

· Fantasy type

· Illogical argumentative type

· Understanding type

Generally it is the last type who have real idea of the challenges of marriage, first three types to me seem more like what they expect the relationship to be whether from the female perspective or male perspective.

Being married for over two decades with a lady; both of us coming from two entirely different backgrounds and language proficiency, never seen or met each other before the day of “nikah”, not even informed about it, put into an arranged marriage during their college/uni days I think I have a fair idea about how marriages work and don’t work.

Let me establish one thing first Allah has created both men and women but he gave more compassion to women as compared to me; with compassion comes sensitivity women are much more sensitive to any stimuli as compared to men. A simple comment like “you are looking good” can have different responses from a male and a female, the male would acknowledge it and forget about it after 5 minutes, while a lady would start mulling over it and at the first opportunity would stand in front of a mirror and check herself from every angle and if god forbid she finds any flaw that’s it; I’ll leave further repercussions to imagination. It’s not about ridiculing them or making fun of ladies it’s just establishing that they are much more sensitive than their brutish counterparts.

Now the topic of the thread seems pretty naiive to me, high divorce rate in Forces linked families, and that number comes to 4 no offense, Army’s strength ballpark is over half a million 4 out of half million doesn’t even register. I know military families which have been happily married for over 5 decades, 3 decades, many of my class mates are in the forces, many of my navy batch mates have been married for over two decades now and except for one I haven’t seen cases of divorce and I am not talking about 4 cases I am talking about 300 plus families and these are just my class/course mates what does it prove nothing.

Correct statement would be divorce rate has increased exponentially in Pakistan as well just like the rest of the world where divorce is spreading like an airborne viral infection.

Marriage is a social contract and as such carries obligations on part of both parties, it also requires important ingredients like tolerance, adaptability and flexibility on part of both parties. Ours is a unique society where joint family system having its pro about the institution of marriage has its serious cons as well.

Much as I hate to say I’ll quote something someone said to females of his family after his marriage and they are “women are the worst enemy of women, and mothers are the worst among them all they have two spectacles one for daughter in which everything is bright and sunny son in law bringing their daughter every weekend to meet them is good, the other spectacles reserved for daughter in law shows everything dark and gloomy if son takes his wife to her parents once in a month then it’s being a rann mureed, first they have this uncontrolled desire to bring daughter in law, for which they insult and reject countless girls, break their hearts with very unkind comments and when they finally find a match, they are unwilling to share their son with her post marriage. You have to understand this she has spent her whole life in another family with different norms, may be different culture has been raised and cared like an expensive doll, she is a human being and you are expecting her to adopt to your values in a week. Have you given her any comfort, have you tried to understand why she is doing/acting the way she is doing, have you comforted her, would you be ok if same happened to your own daughter, what do you think she is a piece of paper whom you would pass through the photocopier of your values and it will be copied instantly? she is a human being not a damn servant or slave”

@blain2 has effectively highlighted some points about challenges of marriage in forces families, many a times husband even officer is posted in a far off front “Siachen” is a typical example for Army and “submariner” is a typical example for Navy families. If the lady is a career oriented one and working in the corporate world a transfer/posting to another place is not really congenial to career. Besides what is the fun in first having education for daughters (despite the fact I have seen certain families discriminate between sons and daughters education, good school universities for son and average for daughters) and then expecting them to give it all up and become house maids. Women of today want to be independent financially as well and that transfer in armed forces families doesn’t get along the career so well. Of course there are excesses on both sides but I am talking in general terms there are families/husbands where women is nothing more than a house maid with no value and then there are women to whom marriage is nothing more than a burden.

I will try and put in few more words later. The impact of media/social media and the misconception about religion regarding marriage later.

Very mature and insightful post.

 

[wali87]

The main source of divorces in Pakistan these days is called ‘Wannabe ism.’ It is all encompassing and can come in any form’