German envoy calls on Pakistan Air Force Chief

[Luftwaffe]

I see the word N Korea- Iran- Airspace poping up quite a few times in their discussion- -

How can Pakistan assist, Pakistan can't keep an eye on its Airspace sometimes out of laziness.

 

[FULL_METAL]

I highly doubt that, while the Germans have offered to sell Pakistan high tech equipment in the past (including drone tech), I don't think the Germans would sell the Eurofighter to Pakistan, simply because there would be no point. It's simply too expensive and high maintenance for PAF's requirements.



There is nothing funny about that, Germany is known for it's willingness to sell high tech equipment to Pakistan. Both nations have good military relations.

Care to explain buddy? any link would be appreciated

 

[Viper0011.]

Even if they did offered Pak EuroFighters.. how many of themcan Pak afford ? What about spare parts in the (god forbid) event of war?

1 squadron of AF's EFT's is good enough to counter about 150 of the SU-30's India has. EFT can carry 8-10 BVR's and that times ten equals about 150 SU-30's. That's very credible deterrence in my opinion. The Chinese will produce the spare parts when the time comes. BTW..........just kidding

 

[That Guy]

Well, for example: Type 214 submarine with full transfer of technology Pakistan on verge of selecting HDW submarine the reason why the deal was dropped was because it was simply too expensive, especially since the economy suffered a major down slide, which cause the Pak-Navy to cancel the deal and go for Chinese subs which were cheaper.

Like I said before, it's not that the Germans don't want to sell, it's that either the European Union won't allow the sales or because the Pakistani side just can't afford the German advanced military equipment.

In fact, Germany is a major supplier of arms to Pakistan.

 

[Peregrine]

Ok again day dreaming Pakistan wake up......hello....

When russia called they are selling us SU, when German calls they are selling us EF.....and so on but when we wake up we dont even have money to eat.....WTF guys....stop this...

You should have refered to my post at number 8....But, then again assuming that you may have seen it.....ill have you know that you are not the only one who is privy to ground realities. Just made a light statement for the sake of the thread...there is no need for you to go berserk.
I guess i should have gone with my intuition and mentioned that, JF-17 fan boys and defence.pk's very own defence analaysts..."kindly dont eat me up for saying that".

 

[fatman17]

Well, for example: Type 214 submarine with full transfer of technology Pakistan on verge of selecting HDW submarine the reason why the deal was dropped was because it was simply too expensive, especially since the economy suffered a major down slide, which cause the Pak-Navy to cancel the deal and go for Chinese subs which were cheaper.

Like I said before, it's not that the Germans don't want to sell, it's that either the European Union won't allow the sales or because the Pakistani side just can't afford the German advanced military equipment.

In fact, Germany is a major supplier of arms to Pakistan.

lets take out the sub non-deal, kindly name a few major defence eqipment (MDE) sold to PK.

 

[JonAsad]

How can Pakistan assist, Pakistan can't keep an eye on its Airspace sometimes out of laziness.

An angry Pakistan protesting over the violations of its air space is the last thing NATO wants when in a full scale war with Iran is in process- surely a violation cannot remain hidden from the Pakistan or Iranis which is dangerous-- as Iranians are unpredictable when it will come to retaliation- they will want to hit any thing to every thing which aids the amrikan attack willingly or unwillingly-

 

[fatman17]

Germany (FRG)

R: Pakistan 4 DSQS-23 ASW sonar (2005) 2009-2010 3 For 4 F-22 (Zulfiquar) frigates.

in 2012 only these sonar equipment was sold by germany.

they have no issues selling to us, we just dont have the finances.

 

[fatman17]

arms transfers from germany in the last 60 years...!


Germany.....90......F-86F Sabre.....Fighter aircraft...1965...1966
Ex-FRG; officially bought by Iran, but transferred to Pakistan.


Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...tries-pakistan-1950-2010-a.html#ixzz2QJgp1gcG


Germany.........30.......Luna..................... ..........UAV................... 2006.......2007-2008...
For 3 Luna UAV systems; delivery temporarily delayed after Pakistani state of emergency in 2007

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...tries-pakistan-1950-2010-a.html#ixzz2QJhANvOK

Germany..........45......DR-161/MPDR-45.......Air search radar..........1977........1979-1981.....
MPDR-45E version; incl MPDR-60.

Germany............5..... DR-172/MPDR-90....... Air search radar..........1977........1979-1980......



Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ies-pakistan-1950-2010-a-2.html#ixzz2QJhhaCoe


Germany...........100...UR-416..................... APC/ISV....................1972.........1973-1976.....
Incl for border guard; incl version with 20mm gun.

Germany...........250....M-113..................... APC.......................... 2007..........2009.....
Ex-FRG; status uncertain after German government halted deliveries in late 2007.delivered in 2009.

Germany/Pakistan..3500..Cobra.................. Anti-tank missile........ 1963.........1965-1979.....
Most probably assembled/produced in Pakistan; Cobra-1600 and Cobra-2000 version.




Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ies-pakistan-1950-2010-a-3.html#ixzz2QJi7z8al

Germany..............15.....SUT................... ....AS/ASW torpedo........................1989............... ..1990-1991......
For MG-110 midget submarines.

Germany...............59....DM-2A4 Seehecht....AS/ASW torpedo...................... 2005...................2007-2008.....
$80 m deal; for Agosta-90B (Khalid) submarines

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ies-pakistan-1950-2010-a-3.html#ixzz2QJiOTgYQ

Germany..........4....... MTU-538...................Diesel engine.............1990..........1997-1999.....
For 2 Jalalat FAC produced in Pakistan; designation uncertain.

Germany...........4.......MTU-538...................Diesel engine.............2003.........2006.......
For 2 Jalalat FAC produced in Pakistan.

Germany...........4...... MTU-4000 ..................Diesel engine.......... 2006........ 2007-2008.....
For MRTP-33 FAC delivered by Turkey

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...ies-pakistan-1950-2010-a-3.html#ixzz2QJieUICU


not significant when compared to US/China/France/Italy etc.

 

[HAIDER]

After Rafale deal with India, it open many choices for PAF ,,,,if they have money

 

[Munir]

The EF2000, Rafale were not even an option for PAF. Just look at the prices and costs of flying. Gripen was a candidate but they are not selling to a nation in war but they have no problem in selling to the opponent with whom we should have that war... Anyway, besides something from the USA we have China. Russia is not moving much closer due to Indian market. And one should be understanding that what is the value of buying top planes if India gets better ones, more and even future programs. Pakistan cannot afford anything else and needs even soft loans. We know PAF is good and we have good companies but we should not eliminate failed leadership that is as corrupt as can be.

 

[Luftwaffe]

An angry Pakistan protesting over the violations of its air space is the last thing NATO wants when in a full scale war with Iran is in process- surely a violation cannot remain hidden from the Pakistan or Iranis which is dangerous-- as Iranians are unpredictable when it will come to retaliation- they will want to hit any thing to every thing which aids the amrikan attack willingly or unwillingly-

Any or your neighbor would be unpredictable when you let others in and give them free space to do surveillance on neighbors and yourself putting Nation in danger. Do you know how many Flights C-17s landed with weapons-equipment in Shamsi Air Base [bulochistan] countless times, musharraf allowed them who knows in the middle of nights before arrivals they've air dropped munition/equipment for banned outfits and terrorists in bulochistan and who knows how many CIAs are in bulochistan. Bulochistan should have been the last place for US to enter musharraf had done some extremely anti Pakistan deals I only credit mushraaf for deals with China other than that I would fairly want him to be hanged for bringing chaos and destability to Pakistan.

 

[JonAsad]

Any or your neighbor would be unpredictable when you let others in and give them free space to do surveillance on neighbors and yourself putting Nation in danger. Do you know how many Flights C-17s landed with weapons-equipment in Shamsi Air Base [bulochistan] countless times, musharraf allowed them who knows in the middle of nights before arrivals they've air dropped munition/equipment for banned outfits and terrorists in bulochistan and who knows how many CIAs are in bulochistan. Bulochistan should have been the last place for US to enter musharraf had done some extremely anti Pakistan deals I only credit mushraaf for deals with China other than that I would fairly want him to be hanged for bringing chaos and destability to Pakistan.

Well i can understand your concerns- but Musharraf cannot do any thing about it- it was out of his control- if they can get in and reach abbotabad without detection they might aswell can air drop goodies to BLA et all all night long and PAF would be sleeping as usual- Dont blame Musharraf blame the army- Musharraf admitted yesterday that he has sanctioned amrika to use drones inside Pakistan- what do you think we could have done if amrika does it any ways?- Nothing- Thats the common perception cant change that-

 

[Luftwaffe]

Well i can understand your concerns- but Musharraf cannot do any thing about it- it was out of his control- if they can get in and reach abbotabad without detection they might aswell can air drop goodies to BLA et all all night long and PAF would be sleeping as usual- Dont blame Musharraf blame the army- Musharraf admitted yesterday that he has sanctioned amrika to use drones inside Pakistan- what do you think we could have done if amrika does it any ways?- Nothing- Thats the common perception cant change that-

Drones over KPK Area I understand the deal but stationing US in Bulochistan that is treacherous deal. By now US has completely studied in years Bulochistan we shouldn't take americans as fools where they go they do their good homework.

Anyway don't want to derail the Thread.

 

[JonAsad]

Drones over KPK Area I understand the deal but stationing US in Bulochistan that is treacherous deal. By now US has completely studied in years Bulochistan we should take americans are fools where they go they do their good homework.

I agree- but be it civilian government or dictatorship- Amrika always has its way-
and in early years the Drones that strike in KPK were stationed at Shamsi Airbase- that was an extension of the Drone Deal-
There are always strings attached- whether we like it or we dont-