French JF-17 Deal Could Anger India

[Mani2020]

For last two days we are arguing on the same issues and going in circles instead of reaching a conclusion .You try day n day out but all the indians wil;l keep on insisting that india has influence on all the countries in the world.

Whenevr we make a thread these indians always come up with same india india chirping and involve india in every matter of Pakistan.And india always have problem with PAK buying anythng If india buy 2000 aircrafts then according to them its for security reasons but if PAK buy a single aircraft the they say Pak will use it against india lol r u kiiding me PAK with one aircraft will destroy india and indial with such number of aircrafts will keep watching and then come on three wheelers lol...dun know wat u people thnk of india keep fantasizing india is a super power having influence on evry country.....

In every post every indian is coming up with same thng MRCA,Subs n blah blah all of us have passed arguments and also agrred on various point but as soon as we again open the thread some indian would have again posted same thng

If u cant appreciate the possible future deal or cant give ur positive opinions about the deal then plz stop posting india india

 

[karan.1970]

Its such a riot.. One pakistani starts a thread that India is upset on Pakistani purchases and we have 5 pages of comments bashing India. Then another (or many) pakistani opens a thread on India spending too much on its defence purchases and we have another few pages on India's poverty, wrong priorities etc..And then India is accused of obcession with Pakistan

 

[Mani2020]

Its such a riot.. One pakistani starts a thread that India is upset on Pakistani purchases and we have 5 pages of comments bashing India. Then another (or many) pakistani opens a thread on India spending too much on its defence purchases and we have another few pages on India's poverty, wrong priorities etc..And then India is accused of obcession with Pakistan

Buddy um not talking about the other threads um just talking about this thread if u have any doubts then u can check n read all the posts urself u will found same arguments on each and every single post of indian we agreed to some points but dun u thnk its useless to raise same points day in day out when we all have already argued on that alot..i meant to say that come up with some other reasons and arguments.Hope u got me

 

[jagjitnatt]

The thread is here for no reason. The news is dependent on a lot of assumptions. We still don't know what's gonna happen.

MRCA deal is not finalized
JF-17 avionics deal is not finalized.

Why not wait for something to happen and then comment?

India is worried, Pak is worried kinda threads should be banned here.

 

[jagjitnatt]

its useless to raise same points day in day out when we all have already argued on that alot..

I agree.

 

[Tiger Awan]

Its such a riot.. One pakistani starts a thread that India is upset on Pakistani purchases and we have 5 pages of comments bashing India. Then another (or many) pakistani opens a thread on India spending too much on its defence purchases and we have another few pages on India's poverty, wrong priorities etc..And then India is accused of obcession with Pakistan

So after land wars, aerial wars, naval wars, cyber wars etc we have

THREAD WAR

 

[Mani2020]

Taimi buddy i thnk this thread is going noway near conclusion evryone is passing same arguments repeatedly without backing them up with any solid reasons and sources

 

[karan.1970]

Buddy um not talking about the other threads um just talking about this thread if u have any doubts then u can check n read all the posts urself u will found same arguments on each and every single post of indian we agreed to some points but dun u thnk its useless to raise same points day in day out when we all have already argued on that alot..i meant to say that come up with some other reasons and arguments.Hope u got me

my post wasnt in response to your post.. Was making a general comment on the thread

 

[sancho]

india never said that it will buy all of its arsenal from france...there are other bidders too.....like USA....Russia and all of them dont want big contract to go out of their hands...Russia dont want to lose india's big market as they had a big share since the independence and USA also wants to have indian market because they also wants big money and save job loses in boeing and lockhead.....so its not easy for india too...to satisfy every1...they have to see their priority 1st rather then theirs....so i dont think india will put their interest on stake just to stop france from providing their radars and avionics to pakistan....how ever french deal is not yet finalised from Pakistan end aswell..pakistan is also looking towards italian technology too...

It's the other way around mate, not India has to satisfy everybody, everybody is trying to satisfy us at the moment.
JV, co-developments, nearly all weapons and techs on offer, even from the US. We only have to start competitons, where they will try to compete each other with better offers and we can chose that one, that suits us the best.
Of course we will not buy everything from France only, but their chances to get a big part of our market are quit good (Rafale, Fennec helicopters, additional Scorpenes are possible too) and France knows that as well, so they will be a bit careful what they offer Pakistan, with the money they can make on the Indian market in mind.
That's why they offer mainly Mirage 2000 techs and not Rafale techs, so as long as they are careful, there is no need for India to be angry.

 

[Frankenstein]

U said LCA avionics and stuff are indeginous
then
wats ths?
Your Kaveri engine
In September 2008, it was announced that the Kaveri would not be ready in time for the Tejas, and that an in-production powerplant would have to be selected.[29] The ADA plans to issue a request for proposal (RFP) for a more powerful engine in the 95 to 100 kilonewton (kN) (21,000–23,000 lbf) range. The contenders are likely to be the Eurojet EJ200 and the General Electric F414. The Eurojet EJ200 propulsion offer has thrust-vectoring. The single crystal turbine blade technology, originally denied to Indian scientists, has also been offered to India by Eurojet via the EJ200 engine.[30]

LCA radar and software
Due to delay in development of MMR, government have come out with the collaboration with IAI for development of Radar the sensor for the new radar is supposed to be EL/M-2052 AESA from Elta and the remaining item and software will be combination of MMR and IAI developed products

LCA HUD

The CSIO-developed HUD, Elbit-furnished DASH helmet-mounted display and sight (HMDS), and hands-on-throttle-and-stick

If um not wrong ELBIT is an israeli company

LCA EW suite

In the interim, the Indian Defence Ministry has revealed that an unspecified number of EW suites have been purchased from Israel's Elisra for the LCA

Elisra again an israeli company

LCA ejection seat

Although two-seat variants of the LCA are planned, the examples built to date are crewed by a single pilot on a Martin-Baker zero-zero ejection seat

Mrtin Baker is a britsh company

LCA MFD

the multi-function displays (MFDs) by Sextant (France)

Missiles and Armaments all from russia


but still LCA is an indeginous fighter

same is the case with Force India VJM03

 

[Ruag]

Just have a few things to say...

1) The deal between France and Pakistan is still in the negotiation phase.
2) India has not made any official statement in this regard.
3) The French, like any other country, will sell their weapons to any country provided they get the cash in return. Remember... it's the same country which sold Mirage 5 to Pakistan and Mirage 2000 to India.

And yet, we have 70 posts long thread on this useless topic.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

Just have a few things to say...

1) The deal between France and Pakistan is still in the negotiation phase.
2) India has not made any official statement in this regard.
3) The French, like any other country, will sell their weapons to any country provided they get the cash in return. Remember... it's the same country which sold Mirage 5 to Pakistan and Mirage 2000 to India.

And yet, we have 70 posts long thread on this useless topic.

ur right mate.there is no use of discussing on this topic.
bottom line is that france is independent country and no country can change its decisions.

THIS THREAD MUST BE CLOSED.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

i haven't gone through the whole thread, but it is of general knowledge that france will sell equipmnt to both the sides in a conflict without prejudice or remorse. The french care less if you buy their product or not---just because you don't like it that your enemy got the equipment from france. They have always been like that.

It will be a miracle if they change their ways---.

 

[Wingman]

French JF-17 Deal Could Anger India

Feb 18, 2010

By Michael A. Taverna
Paris


Politics could yet derail French industry aspirations to upgrade Pakistan’s JF-17 fighter aircraft, even as the two sides near conclusion of a deal for the program.

While the project is supported by the administration of French President *Nicolas Sarkozy, reactions in New Delhi and Washington will also influence its fate . The U.S. is concerned about technology leakage to China, and India is already a lucrative market for French industry. Enthusiasm for the JF-17 upgrade could be tempered if there were signals that this might jeopardize business in India.

The Pakistan air force wants to develop a “Westernized” version of its Chinese-made JF-17, fitted with European avionics, fire-control radar and weapons systems. The upgraded aircraft is intended not only for domestic service, but also for export.

A team led by ATE—a Paris-based company specializing in integrating systems and weapons onto military aircraft airframes of different origin—is tipped to develop and market the upgraded version of the JF-17 Thunder. The aircraft was developed by China in cooperation with Pakistan.

Other partners, according to sources close to the deal, include Thales, Sagem and missile-manufacturer MBDA. Among the losing bidders, they say, are Astrac, a Thales-Sagem joint venture also specialized in retrofits, and Finmeccanica. The winning team would not comment on the selection, which has not been officially announced.

Industry executives say the project has strong backing from the French government, which has adopted a more focused and muscular arms trade policy under the Sarkozy administration .

Pakistan has a large fleet of French Mirage III and V fighters which the JF‑17 is supposed to replace. However, the deal must still run a gauntlet of threats before it can become reality, and how long this will take is anybody’s guess.

Cash-strapped Pakistan may have trouble funding the deal, and it could also face pressure from its Chinese partners—who want to supply the aircraft with domestic systems and weapons—and the U.S., which is already supplying F-16s to the Pakistani air force.

But the biggest hurdle, the industry executive suggests, is any Indian pressure regarding the proposed deal.

The upgrade would involve 50 aircraft, plus another 50 on option, that would go into production in 2013, following delivery of the first batch of Pakistani air force JF-17s. The project could be worth up to €1 billion ($1.36 billion), more than double the $500 million that the JF-17 development reputedly cost.

The principal target markets for export are in Central Asia and Africa. Any sale would require case-by-case approval by the French government. Up to 400 JF-17s may ultimately be built.

While the exact makeup of the modernization package is not known, it is thought to include Thales RC400 fire- control radar and the MBDA Mica medium-range family of air-to-air missiles, as well as air-to-surface weaponry.

Paris is insisting on a complete package approach to try to protect against leakage of design secrets to China or other unauthorized users. However, Islamabad is also known to be discussing the separate supply of specific additional items, such as South Africa’s A-Darter short-range imaging infrared-guided air-to-air missile. ATE was previously headquartered in South Africa and most of its 400 employees are still based there.

China’s Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corp. developed the JF-17 with support from the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC). The aircraft first flew in 2003 and has been in small-batch production at Chengdu since 2006. The first JF-17 to undergo final assembly at a purpose-built PAC facility was handed over to the air force in October of last year.

The first 50 aircraft for the Pakistani air force are expected to be delivered by the end of 2012. These aircraft will be fitted with Chinese avionics and radar, as well as radar- and infrared-guided short- and long-range air-to-air missiles and antiship weapons. China’s PL-12 radar-guided beyond-visual-range missile may be part of the package.

This capable missile is now in series production for the Chinese air force and it is not clear why Pakistan would want the Mica, whose range is inferior. Industry officials suggest the Chinese fire-control radar intended for the JF‑17 is unable to exploit the PL-12’s full capability.


French JF-17 Deal Could Anger India | AVIATION WEEK

Indians are always angry with Pakistan

 

[dave]

No Raffel in MMRCA France anger on india. It's free world you want to buy franch go my friend.