Exclusive: US intel shows Saudi Arabia escalated its missile program with help from China

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

I see we have an alchemist here .

You are welcome trying to build any nuke by those reactors.

Something along those lines. Very close.

Well, I would if I ruled the country. I believe that it is the sovereign right of each country to build nukes. There have never been a war between two nuclear powers. It seems to me that nukes help deter wars and conflict. Something that is badly in need in this region if you ask me. I never said anything about Iran, Bahrain, Turkmenistan or Afghanistan not being allowed to make the bomb, hydrogen bomb or other weapons. I am in favor of a bipolar world. Not a world of 2 opposites (USA and China for instance) and everyone else should be following their tune.

We Arabs as a whole if geography, population, wealth, landmass, riches, history etc. is concerned should also have a permanent seat at the UN. If there was any fairness in this world and history had occurred differently. If UN had been created 1000 years ago this would be the case and not back in 1945.

So if I was KSA I would not only built the bomb but also hand it out to every Arab country. Just to make a statement. No sane country would use nuclear bombs against another nuclear state as that would be suicide and no sane person wants to commit suicide let alone collective suicide.

 

[skyshadow]

We likely have the most advanced ballistic missile program in the region given our collaborations, military budget and the fact that this is a work in progress for well over 3 decades now. Unlike certain other failed entities to the east we do not boost, make fake claims nor parade anything other than what we had 30 years ago. There is total secrecy. As it should be. Cooperation with Pakistan dates back to pre-nuclear Pakistan and people can make their own conclusions.

what is advanced ballistic missile program? i do not want this thread to close so PLZ respond with military facts i want to compare your program to ours.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

what is advanced ballistic missile program? i do not want this thread to close so PLZ respond with military facts i want to compare you program to ours.

First of all what we bought from China over 30 years ago is more advanced than anything you have in 2019. That was 30 years ago. You can figure out what has happened in the meantime. KSA was hit by ballistic missiles and scuds (Saddam Hussein) during the First Gulf War. We have obviously long studied your ballistic missile program as well. We have worked with countries such as China and Pakistan on our ballistic missile program for ages. You have users here from Pakistan with parents working in KSA who have seen this first hand. Not mentioning the Yemeni conflict.

The problem is that there is a lot of secrecy involved. Few people know all the details but you can do the match given the situation in the region, our military budget and reports from Western and non-Western media. After all KSA having the bomb has been spoken about for almost 3 decades too.

One must be really naive to believe that our ballistic missile program is not extremely sophisticated when having all of the above in mind.

Not only that our deterrence against missiles is also the most sophisticated in the region alongside Israel. Patriot, THAAD (soon), S-400 (soon) and maybe other systems too as per the rumors. That is serious protection. Add that our air force (only Israel is stronger) and ballistic missile power and I would claim that anyone attacking us not named Israel (only due to their nukes), USA, UK, France, Russia, China (once again due to nukes, technology, firepower, manpower) would be very foolish.

I have seen many Iranian users here who seem to live in their own fantasy world imaging that they can destroy infrastructure in KSA without getting a reply that is tenfold.

 

[Hack-Hook]

First of all what we bought from China over 30 years ago is more advanced than anything you have in 2019.

Well there is a reason that China replaced DF-3 with DF-21 . let be honest higher payload or higher range is not equal to be more advance . I wonder what make DF-3 and DF-21 more advance than Khoramshahr ?

Patriot, THAAD (soon), S-400 (soon) and maybe other systems too as per the rumors.

If we are to go in the realm of the soon we also can say s300, and Bavar (soon) also don't forget hawk family also have the capability to engage short range balistic missiles .

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

Well there is a reason that China replaced DF-3 with DF-21 . let be honest higher payload or higher range is not equal to be more advance . I wonder what make DF-3 and DF-21 more advance than Khoramshahr ?

If we are to go in the realm of the soon we also can say s300, and Bavar (soon) also don't forget hawk family also have the capability to engage short range balistic missiles .

With all due respect to that Iranian reserved engineered Soviet/North Korean tech (or wherever it originates from) you cannot compare it, even in the wildest fantasy, to long-established systems that have been tested in battle. Even the fairly outdated patriots system has had a tremendous success rate (practically 100%) in KSA.

The vast majority of successful strikes are done by short range projectiles on Najran and Asir, which are much more difficult to intercept due to their short flight times.

Will you sleep safely at night if an updated DF-21 and DF-3 (that is if KSA has done nothing else in the past 30 years which any sane person can rule out there is a reason why we have invested this much in a missile program for 30+ years and so much secrecy surrounds it) aimed at Tehran or another city will be fired and all you have to protect yourself with are some "indigenous" systems that have never been tested in a war? I would certainly not be.

 

[Hack-Hook]

With all due respect to that Iranian reserved engineered Soviet/North Korean tech (or wherever it originates from) you cannot compare it, even in the wildest fantasy, to long-established systems that have been tested in battle. Even the fairly outdated patriots system has had a tremendous nitrate (almost 100%) in KSA.

Com on make a comparisson and show those Chinese missile are better .
We can fire K horamshahr and point our camera to a target and say it hit that target . can you do that with DF-3 ?
And what is the similarity between Bavar and russian systens ?
And what I said about Hawk is usa claims not iran claims.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

Com on make a comparisson and show those Chinese missile are better .
We can fire K horamshahr and point our camera to a target and say it hit that target . can you do that with DF-3 ?
And what is the similarity between Bavar and russian systens ?
And what I said about Hawk is usa claims not iran claims.

First of all comparing makes no sense as KSA's missile program is a deep state secret. Information (100% reliable as in proven) date back to the 1980's. 30 years is a LONG time. As I said since that time we experienced a wide range of scud missile attacks on KSA from Iraq during and before the First Gulf War.

For all I know we might have developed an "indigenous" system with the help of friends from China and Pakistan long ago. Those Chinese missiles for instance have long ago been updated. One must be incredibly naive to believe that they have been left to collect dust in the past 30 years all while KSA's military has been buying some of the best weapons that money can buy.

The push (serious) for an indigenous military industry is no joke either.

All I can say is what I already wrote. Rest is speculation. Until a possible war, nobody can answer anything with 100% certainty but what is certain is that KSA has much more in its store than some missiles imported from China 30 years ago even though those missiles alone are better than what most countries have in their arsenal.

Those many secret military base used to launch missiles (potentially) discovered by Western intelligence in KSA are not exactly areas with public access either.

When MbS says that we have the most potent ballistic missile program in the region, I believe him. When I see Chinese and Pakistani involvement, that belief is not exactly weakened. That and our military budget and allies or the fact that we already did what we did with China in the 1980's and the CIA, M16, Mossad etc. did not realize this until years later. There are many areas in KSA which are military areas (closed cities) as well. Unlike the Iranian Mullah regime, our regime does not parade our state secrets or boost. We do things in secrecy. Those of strategic importance that is.

 

[S.Y.A]

What intel? Chinese help was acknowledged by Prince Khalid bin Sultan, in the book Desert Warrior as early as the 90s. Very easily available.

Pathetic intel.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

What intel? Chinese help was acknowledged by Prince Khalid bin Sultan, in the book Desert Warrior. Very easily available.

That was over 30 years ago and long after it became public. Mossad, M16, CIA etc. had no clue of this until years later. It even occurred at a time when KSA and China had no diplomatic relations (officially).

There have been many reports form West and East of Saudi Arabia's missile program and cooperations with a wide range of countries raging from China to Pakistan (mostly but not only). Even rumors of North Korean involvement. Obviously one must be incredibly naive to believe that a country like KSA (regional power) engulfed by conflict in the neighborhood and with a regional adversary whose main focus are there missiles (Iran), a country that suffered from Saddam Hussein's scud attacks on KSA almost 30 years ago, a country with so many powerful allies and so much cash as well as heavy investment in local brainpower, has not been developing something quite sophisticated. Unless someone of course believes that what was bought from China over 30 years ago is the only thing that KSA has in store and moreover that those Chinese missiles have been left to collect dust.

 

[Timur]

So if I was KSA I would not only built the bomb but also hand it out to every Arab country

I would give al qaida and isis and hezbollah the bomb..

We do things in secrecy

oh and how secrecy #khashoggi

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

I would give al qaida and isis and hezbollah the bomb..




oh and how secrecy #khashoggi

That is your choice.

Khashoggi the MB terrorist trash who ran off to the US to badmouth and write propaganda against KSA. There was not any secrecy of getting rid of him. Good riddance as well. That should be the faith of every traitor if it was up to me. Much like the recent terrorists executed. Erdogan desperately milking that case ended with failure. Now his economy is ruined as well as relations with KSA and most of the Arab world. Great policy to please some tiny micro state Qatar otherwise known as Quntar.

 

[skyshadow]

First of all what we bought from China over 30 years ago is more advanced than anything you have in 2019. That was 30 years ago. You can figure out what has happened in the meantime. KSA was hit by ballistic missiles and scuds (Saddam Hussein) during the First Gulf War. We have obviously long studied your ballistic missile program as well. We have worked with countries such as China and Pakistan on our ballistic missile program for ages. You have users here from Pakistan with parents working in KSA who have seen this first hand. Not mentioning the Yemeni conflict.

The problem is that there is a lot of secrecy involved. Few people know all the details but you can do the match given the situation in the region, our military budget and reports from Western and non-Western media. After all KSA having the bomb has been spoken about for almost 3 decades too.

One must be really naive to believe that our ballistic missile program is not extremely sophisticated when having all of the above in mind.

Not only that our deterrence against missiles is also the most sophisticated in the region alongside Israel. Patriot, THAAD (soon), S-400 (soon) and maybe other systems too as per the rumors. That is serious protection. Add that our air force (only Israel is stronger) and ballistic missile power and I would claim that anyone attacking us not named Israel (only due to their nukes), USA, UK, France, Russia, China (once again due to nukes, technology, firepower, manpower) would be very foolish.

I have seen many Iranian users here who seem to live in their own fantasy world imaging that they can destroy infrastructure in KSA without getting a reply that is tenfold.

i do not live in any fantasy land war will bring mass destruction to both sides as any system has a weak point, well as you said SA missile program began 30 year by buying missiles from China Iran's missile program began at the same given time by buying Russian missiles from Syria and Libya but i do not believe that is more advanced than anything Iran have in 2019 as Iran missile program is the biggest in ME and North Africa and yes there is not a lot of information about SA or Iran missile programs well we are on the same level with Pakistan on missiles and nuclear programs we were not at first but we catch up to them real fast so there is nothing more advancer in Pakistan missile or satellite launch vehicle program than Iran's, the difference between SA and Iran is that we build our own missiles but we can not see an Saudi Arabian ballistic missile at this time or missile test as we have Khorramshahr missile 2000 KM range with almost 2 ton warhead or multiple warheads with 800 KG warheads that can go up to 4000 KM with 1 ton warhead and Iran missiles have shown there advancement in combat with there speed and size and there carbon fiber body and there pin point accuracy with there CEP under 30 meters and Anti_ship ballistic missiles and the would first Anti_radiation ballistic missiles i can not confirm or deny SA advancement as we do not have any information about your missile program we do not know if you coping or building your own missiles but as of now SA need a lot of catching up and live tests to do as there is no information that SA has a big ballistic missile or cruise missile program like Iran.


in part of Air Defence yes SA with Israel are the best in ME but Iran will make S400 like system as they already built a system more powerful than S300 PMU 2 so SA need to work on that too and SA needs a advance UAV program too. its all well and good, i like to see a missile test some day.

 

[Hack-Hook]

First of all comparing makes no sense as KSA's missile program is a deep state secret. Information (100% reliable as in proven) date back to the 1980's. 30 years is a LONG time. As I said since that time we experienced a wide range of scud missile attacks on KSA from Iraq during and before the First Gulf War.

For all I know we might have developed an "indigenous" system with the help of friends from China and Pakistan long ago. Those Chinese missiles for instance have long ago been updated. One must be incredibly naive to believe that they have been left to collect dust in the past 30 years all while KSA's military has been buying some of the best weapons that money can buy.

The push (serious) for an indigenous military industry is no joke either.

All I can say is what I already wrote. Rest is speculation. Until a possible war, nobody can answer anything with 100% certainty but what is certain is that KSA has much more in its store than some missiles imported from China 30 years ago even though those missiles alone are better than what most countries have in their arsenal.

Those many secret military base used to launch missiles (potentially) discovered by Western intelligence in KSA are not exactly areas with public access either.

When MbS says that we have the most potent ballistic missile program in the region, I believe him. When I see Chinese and Pakistani involvement, that belief is not exactly weakened. That and our military budget and allies or the fact that we already did what we did with China in the 1980's and the CIA, M16, Mossad etc. did not realize this until years later. There are many areas in KSA which are military areas (closed cities) as well. Unlike the Iranian Mullah regime, our regime does not parade our state secrets or boost. We do things in secrecy. Those of strategic importance that is.

You see there is a catch you can't say a missile is operable unless it pass live test and you can't hide a live test . you may have some program in various stage of development but unless you do some live test I can't accept them as operational systems.

And about the missile you bought from china I doubt those Df-3 are of any use they have passed their storage life long ago . so I believe what you have is your DF-21 and what you have got from Ukraine in the short range missiles category . I yet to see evidence of Pakistan gave you any missile.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

You see there is a catch you can't say a missile is operable unless it pass live test and you can't hide a live test . you may have some program in various stage of development but unless you do some live test I can't accept them as operational systems.

And about the missile you bought from china I doubt those Df-3 are of any use they have passed their storage life long ago . so I believe what you have is your DF-21 and what you have got from Ukraine in the short range missiles category . I yet to see evidence of Pakistan gave you any missile.

You are perfectly free to believe in any speculation or your own made up opinions. The reality is with all certainty (logic dictates that at least) much different. KSA could have done live tests without it being detected. As done underground with nuclear weapons testing for instance.

Obviously all those missiles have been updated so storage life is no longer an issue.

Well, the reality is that you have not heard about it for a good reason as KSA is a secretive state and even more so when it comes to strategic areas such as our missile program. With good reason again.

Have Israel ever tested a nuke or have anyone seen them parade it? You should get the picture here. Also you can ignore the 100's of reports from West and East that talk about KSA's missile program, nukes etc. and much more. Already posted some of them in this thread.

Now this report (the source of this news) as well.

I believe MbS too when he says what he said about our missile program.

 

[Hack-Hook]

a country that suffered from Saddam Hussein's scud attacks on KSA almost 30 years ago

Come on Iraq fired 46 Scud variant toward PGCC countries and majority of them disintegrated in air .

KSA could have done live tests without it being detected. As done underground with nuclear weapons testing for instance.

Well you say live missile test underground ,well my opinion is of no consequence let other members decide and no you can't hide ballistic missile test from satellite eyes.