Egyptian Armed Forces

[MirageBlue]

Take it for what it's worth..we don't know what the latest status is on the discussions between India and Egypt for an order of 20 Tejas Mk1A fighters.

In this context, the IAF's decision to order another 100 Tejas Mk1A fighters, for a total of 183 Tejas Mk1A fighters (in addition to the 40 Tejas Mk1s) makes for a total fleet of 223 Tejas Mk1A fighters in the IAF eventually.

HAL has been doing it's bit to ramp up the rate of production to 24 Tejas fighters per year including trainers. There should be capacity to take on any export order with this rate of production.

India- Egypt Tejas aircraft contract in the works

India’s Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) chairman, Shri C.B. Ananthakrishnan, has announced at Aero-India 2023 that the company is in talks with Egypt and Argentinian officials to secure a contract to supply 35 Tejas LCA Mk-1A to the nation’s armed forces.

The aircraft deal will see HAL supply 35 Tejas LCA Mk-1A to Egypt, as well as provide a complete transfer of technology (ToT) for Egypt to produce the aircraft locally. Egypt has projected a requirement for 20 aircraft.

Tejas is a light multirole and single engine 6.5t fighter aircraft designed for the Indian Air Force and Indian Navy. The 6.5t fighter jet’s noticeable hardware, software features and advanced technologies are quadruple fly-by-wire digital automatic flight control.

“Egypt has also shown interest in creating a local aerospace ecosystem. We will help facilitate that. Two teams from the Argentine Air Force have visited HAL and flown the LCA,” said Ananthakrishnan.

If successful, the deal would make Egypt and Argentina the first nations to procure the Tejas LCA Mk-1. The fighter jet is already being used domestically by the Indian Air Force. India and Egypt began collaboration late last year when Indian Defense Minister Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh on 19 September, met with his Egyptian counterpart in Cairo, to discuss and sign a Memorandum of Understanding (MoU) aimed at enhancing military and security cooperation between both nations.

Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh also met with Egypt’s President al-Sisi, where they discussed cooperation and focus on joint training, defence co-production, and maintenance of equipment and also exchange expertise in countering the threat of terrorism.

The diplomatic visit includes a discussion on the status of India’s bid to sell the indigenous Tejas MK1A light combat aircraft to Egypt in a deal that could include setting up a production facility in Egypt.

Early his year, India and Egypt sought to deepen military cooperation, including between their defence industries, and India’s foreign secretary. Egyptian President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi held talks with Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi in New Delhi as part of a state visit where met business leaders and was a guest of honour at India’s Jan. 26 Republic Day.

BTW, just for fun, this is a Tejas Mk1A aerial footage video. Beautifully captured.

 

[sami_1]

Take it for what it's worth..we don't know what the latest status is on the discussions between India and Egypt for an order of 20 Tejas Mk1A fighters.

In this context, the IAF's decision to order another 100 Tejas Mk1A fighters, for a total of 183 Tejas Mk1A fighters (in addition to the 40 Tejas Mk1s) makes for a total fleet of 223 Tejas Mk1A fighters in the IAF eventually.

HAL has been doing it's bit to ramp up the rate of production to 24 Tejas fighters per year including trainers. There should be capacity to take on any export order with this rate of production.

India- Egypt Tejas aircraft contract in the works



BTW, just for fun, this is a Tejas Mk1A aerial footage video. Beautifully captured.

There is competition between China, India and South Korea, and the competition is still accelerating. China has offered to produce the L-15 locally and to market to African countries, with a similar offer to India to produce 240 aircraft, of which Egypt will get 120-160 and the rest for export.
China also offers the J-10CE plane with the modifications that Cairo desires at a low price, parallel to the price of the LCA-MK1A plane, and also with financing through the Yuan/Egyptian Pound agreement outside the framework of the dollar. It also offers Egypt a comprehensive deal up to the production of the FC-31 plane locally in the event of a large demand for Egypt. To replace obsolete F-16 & MIRAGE-2000 fighters, 87 F-16 Block-15/32 and 20 MIRAGE-2000
India has a great opportunity. You proposed developing a radar for the Egyptian F-16/MIRAGE-2000/MIG-29M fighters.
Based on the UTTAM radar for the purpose of producing 300 radars for Egyptian fighters, India will benefit from recovering the cost of development programs for this radar and producing copies derived from it for medium fighters.

If India had completed the development of the Kaveri engine and integrated it into the LCA-MK1A aircraft, it would have encouraged Egypt, which would not submit to American pressure, to prepare the GE F-404 engines that Egypt desires, and which America will control, even though they are old engines with 1980 technology.
The South Koreans' offers in the field of cooperation are very expensive. They seek profits first and foremost and to link the customer to them permanently. Therefore, technology transfer operations will be modest and will depend on Egypt becoming a center for producing the aircraft with modest performance for the T-50/FA-50.

Egypt's problem remains the lack of a real industry for low-weight cruise missiles. Egypt needs a cruise missile similar to the Russian Kh-69, weighing 700 kilograms, With ranhe 1000km in huge quantities as a result of the experiences learned from the Ukraine war, and also at a low cost, as France did not agree to supply its old SCLAP/EG missiles in quantities of 400. One missile at a rate of 10 missiles for each RAFALE fighter. Egypt needs huge quantities for the F-16/MIG-29/SU-35 fighter fleet and the new air brigade.
China seeks comprehensive deals with Egypt

Egypt negotiated with China to produce 1,000 PL-15E missiles locally as a first batch in the event that Egypt purchased Chinese fighters.

Even in the Navy, Egypt may be offered to produce 4 TYPE-54B frigates locally equipped with all unmanned UAV/USV platforms.
China may compete with Germany in developing the SSM missile for Egypt instead of the old HARPOON / OTOMAT / EXOCET missiles, which are missiles designed in the 1960s.
Egypt possesses 600 of them, all of which do not match the level of threats provided by the Turkish and Israeli navies in the Mediterranean, as well as the Iranian navies in the Red Sea, or even providing a modern Chinese design for local production of Ramjet/supersonic surface-to-surface missiles with a weight less than the HD-1A/YJ-18 missiles.

 

[Gomig-21]

Take it for what it's worth..we don't know what the latest status is on the discussions between India and Egypt for an order of 20 Tejas Mk1A fighters.

Always been a fan of the Tejas and it would fit well with the EAF. Seeing some of the performances where Indian pilots are performing negative G pushover maneuvers in that thing was very impressive. The very large bat-like delta wing configuration helps that aircraft perform very well in low speed maneuvers.

I wonder what the weapons package would be, and if the Astra would be included in not only the 20 aircraft, but with the ToT proposal as well.

I think the UTAM AESA radar might be the deal maker TBH. Being able to manufacture those and substitute the Zhuk-ME and AN/APG-68 would be a huge plus. The only obstacle is of course the US allowing that replacement. I think it will come down to between the Tejas and possible J-10CE. Much of it will depend on the US allowing replacement of much of the hardware and if the EAF sees a favorable weapons package, certainly between the Astra and the PL-15E.

BTW, just for fun, this is a Tejas Mk1A aerial footage video. Beautifully captured.

Stunning. That aircraft looks brand new.

One missile at a rate of 10 missiles for each RAFALE fighter.

What do you mean "one missile at a rate of 10 missiles"? They're offering 1 SCALP per jet compared to the EAF's request of 10 per Rafale?

Egypt negotiated with China to produce 1,000 PL-15E missiles locally as a first batch in the event that Egypt purchased Chinese fighters.

Even in the Navy, Egypt may be offered to produce 4 TYPE-54B frigates locally equipped with all unmanned UAV/USV platforms.

If they offer ToT for the J-10CE and the PL-15E on top of the local production/building of the TYPE-54B frigates, that might just surpass the Indian offer. Only problem in the US would be more amiable to the Indian hardware (radar & engines) interchange on the F-16s than Chinese IMO.

 

[The SC]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695114295233929485

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695712754705846575

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695284939179114797

Participation of 8,000 fighters from 34 countries

 

[Gomig-21]

Participation of 8,000 fighters from 34 countries

BRIGHT STAR 2023 is a multilateral exercise between USA CENTCOM, Arab Republic of Egypt and other partner nations.Indian and Pakistani militaries will both participate in this exercise. However, the interaction between the two will be clear once the exercise.

Yeah, this will be super fun to watch!!! Leave it to the creators of peace and prosperity to attempt such a feat! Outstanding.

This was the picture I was looking for when I was telling @MirageBlue about the paratroopers mega jumps loool. Look at that crazy D-day style super jump. We could invade Ukraine and bring peace to that conflict if we banded together like that lol.

 

[Gomig-21]

Even in the Navy, Egypt may be offered to produce 4 TYPE-54B

The first Type 054B frigate for the People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) was launched in Shanghai.

First New Generation Frigate For Chinese Navy Launched In Shanghai​

The lead ship of a new type of frigate for the Chinese Navy (PLAN), informally designated Type 054B, has been launched at Hudong-Zhonghua, Shanghai, overnight on Saturday, the 26th of August.​

Alex Luck 29 Aug 2023
Rest of the article HERE.

 

[sami_1]

Always been a fan of the Tejas and it would fit well with the EAF. Seeing some of the performances where Indian pilots are performing negative G pushover maneuvers in that thing was very impressive. The very large bat-like delta wing configuration helps that aircraft perform very well in low speed maneuvers.

I wonder what the weapons package would be, and if the Astra would be included in not only the 20 aircraft, but with the ToT proposal as well.

I think the UTAM AESA radar might be the deal maker TBH. Being able to manufacture those and substitute the Zhuk-ME and AN/APG-68 would be a huge plus. The only obstacle is of course the US allowing that replacement. I think it will come down to between the Tejas and possible J-10CE. Much of it will depend on the US allowing replacement of much of the hardware and if the EAF sees a favorable weapons package, certainly between the Astra and the PL-15E.



Stunning. That aircraft looks brand new.



What do you mean "one missile at a rate of 10 missiles"? They're offering 1 SCALP per jet compared to the EAF's request of 10 per Rafale?



If they offer ToT for the J-10CE and the PL-15E on top of the local production/building of the TYPE-54B frigates, that might just surpass the Indian offer. Only problem in the US would be more amiable to the Indian hardware (radar & engines) interchange on the F-16s than Chinese IMO.

Egypt got a deal for 50 SCALP missiles and got 25 other missiles for free
Egypt requested 300 SCALP missiles for the deal of 30 Rafale aircraft
A heavy-weight SCLAP missile with a limited range of 1,400 kilograms, a warhead of 480 kilograms, and a range of 300 kilometers.

The Russians, the KH-69 missile, weighs 700 kg, with a destructive head of 300 kg, and a range of 300-550 km.
The KH-50 missile weighs 1,600 kilograms, has a range of 1,500 kilometers, and has a destructive head of 450 kilograms, i.e. the same class of missiles, but with three times the range. Besides, the Russian-Ukrainian scab has proven the effectiveness and accuracy of Russian missiles and their success in the war, and they are always one-third of the cost of Western missiles, which encourages Samar to develop a missile at a lower cost. From a million dollars, instead of a missile at a price of 3.5 million dollars, it was shot down by a missile at a price of 40,000 dollars, with PANTSIR-SM missiles Or the TOR-M2 missile

 

[Faceless]

Always been a fan of the Tejas and it would fit well with the EAF. Seeing some of the performances where Indian pilots are performing negative G pushover maneuvers in that thing was very impressive. The very large bat-like delta wing configuration helps that aircraft perform very well in low speed maneuvers.

I wonder what the weapons package would be, and if the Astra would be included in not only the 20 aircraft, but with the ToT proposal as well.

I think the UTAM AESA radar might be the deal maker TBH. Being able to manufacture those and substitute the Zhuk-ME and AN/APG-68 would be a huge plus. The only obstacle is of course the US allowing that replacement. I think it will come down to between the Tejas and possible J-10CE. Much of it will depend on the US allowing replacement of much of the hardware and if the EAF sees a favorable weapons package, certainly between the Astra and the PL-15E.



Stunning. That aircraft looks brand new.



What do you mean "one missile at a rate of 10 missiles"? They're offering 1 SCALP per jet compared to the EAF's request of 10 per Rafale?



If they offer ToT for the J-10CE and the PL-15E on top of the local production/building of the TYPE-54B frigates, that might just surpass the Indian offer. Only problem in the US would be more amiable to the Indian hardware (radar & engines) interchange on the F-16s than Chinese IMO.

Here check this out

https://twitter.com/x/status/1696183300472426880

 

[Gomig-21]

Egypt got a deal for 50 SCALP missiles and got 25 other missiles for free

Yes I remember that additional free 25 missiles because of the US restriction of their parts in the SCALPs that they "allegedly" didn't want to share with Egypt, so France had to install their domestic parts and because the delivery was delayed under the contract, they offered the additional 25 as a free gift to make good on the contract. I think we all know why they were restricted, and it wasn't because of US parts....

Egypt requested 300 SCALP missiles for the deal of 30 Rafale aircraft

I see. So the EAF wanted 10 SCALPs per Rafale. Even that is actually low TBH. Shame.

Here check this out

That pilot had great control. Very smooth and hardly any herky-jerky movements. You can't even notice any movement on the ailerons making all those barrels rolls and loops. That seems to be the common theme with delta winged aircraft.

Saudi contingent arrived in #Cairo to take part in the #BrightStar2023 multinational exercise under the command of US CENTCOM & Egyptian Armed Forces.

It's been a while since we've seen much the Mohammad Naguib Military Base. Should be very active with all the military personnel for Bright Star.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1697235391823417829

 

[MirageBlue]

Always been a fan of the Tejas and it would fit well with the EAF. Seeing some of the performances where Indian pilots are performing negative G pushover maneuvers in that thing was very impressive. The very large bat-like delta wing configuration helps that aircraft perform very well in low speed maneuvers.

I wonder what the weapons package would be, and if the Astra would be included in not only the 20 aircraft, but with the ToT proposal as well.

I think the UTAM AESA radar might be the deal maker TBH. Being able to manufacture those and substitute the Zhuk-ME and AN/APG-68 would be a huge plus. The only obstacle is of course the US allowing that replacement. I think it will come down to between the Tejas and possible J-10CE. Much of it will depend on the US allowing replacement of much of the hardware and if the EAF sees a favorable weapons package, certainly between the Astra and the PL-15E.



Stunning. That aircraft looks brand new.



What do you mean "one missile at a rate of 10 missiles"? They're offering 1 SCALP per jet compared to the EAF's request of 10 per Rafale?



If they offer ToT for the J-10CE and the PL-15E on top of the local production/building of the TYPE-54B frigates, that might just surpass the Indian offer. Only problem in the US would be more amiable to the Indian hardware (radar & engines) interchange on the F-16s than Chinese IMO.

I really have no insights into what is being offered. Except that HAL has offered to set up a MRO for the Tejas Mk1A. There could be other offers included, perhaps like making Egypt the African centric Tejas assembly line in case the order size is large enough.

The question of ToT will arise when the deal size is large enough to tempt the supplier. In India that has always been the case. E.g. being the Rafale where Dassault has stated multiple times that at least 100 Rafale need to be ordered to have an Indian assembly line set up. I would expect something similar, perhaps not as many as 100 units, but 20 is too few.

Astra Mk1 (and Mk2, Mk3 following it) have the advantage of being mostly Indian, including the active seeker. I'm pretty certain that a deal for Astra Mk1 and ASRAAMs will be offered along with the Tejas Mk1A. AASM Hammer is also integrated, so that is another option as well along with US JDAM PGMs.

 

[Gomig-21]

The question of ToT will arise when the deal size is large enough to tempt the supplier. In India that has always been the case. E.g. being the Rafale where Dassault has stated multiple times that at least 100 Rafale need to be ordered to have an Indian assembly line set up. I would expect something similar, perhaps not as many as 100 units, but 20 is too few.

Makes sense, for sure. Business is business and it has to be of value for the supplier and not just the buyer. It's the way economics have worked since the dawn of time and I totally see 20 aircraft as a small deal, even if it's the first export.

BTW, the Tejas is not that cheap, right? Looking it up quickly it seems to be around $64 million a piece. That's pretty much up there with some of the other 4+ gen fighters. I think that number might need to be a bit more flexible for the EAF and might be the reason why they're only looking for 20 to start with. I do hope this works out since IMO, the Tejas is the best option of the 3. I'm sure if the order is much larger, that number would go down.

Astra Mk1 (and Mk2, Mk3 following it) have the advantage of being mostly Indian, including the active seeker. I'm pretty certain that a deal for Astra Mk1 and ASRAAMs will be offered along with the Tejas Mk1A. AASM Hammer is also integrated, so that is another option as well along with US JDAM PGMs.

That's good, but ASRAAM? Not sure the US would go for that TBH. Having China as a friendly and having the US as a long-time ally has had its pluses but also its minuses. The main reason the US has tagged Egypt as a multiple infraction-ed member is because supposedly in the 1980s, the Chinese were invited to inspect one of the EAF's F-16s. Found out about from US personnel at the time and I remember Hillary freaking out about it and stirring up the pot in front of congress to cut military aid. If it's a true story, that was super stupid of the EAF to get caught! And multiple times, to boot!

A big reason for the signing of CISMOA that would supposedly clear the way for the AMRAAMs as well as JDAMs (only laser-guided ordinances were allowed) but even after signing it, they're still not allowing the missiles because they simply don't trust that the Chinese will have a birthday party with them lol. I don't think that India has signed the CISMOA yet?

I think the same case might be with the PL-15E. China might not want to supply the EAF with them for fear that the US will put pressure on Egypt to show them the missiles and help the US develop ways to defeat it. Maybe @Han Patriot or other Chinese members can give us more insight as to whether that's true if the Chinese would or would not supply those missiles. I know Pakistan uses the PL-15 and China has no issues with them, of course. And they'll probably get the PL-15E as soon as it's ready.

There are benefits to being neutral and benefiting from both sides of the superpower spectrum, but there are downsides as well. Do you think India would have any similar issues supplying the ASTRA, considering Egypt's relationship with not only the US, but with China?

 

[indushek]

Makes sense, for sure. Business is business and it has to be of value for the supplier and not just the buyer. It's the way economics have worked since the dawn of time and I totally see 20 aircraft as a small deal, even if it's the first export.

BTW, the Tejas is not that cheap, right? Looking it up quickly it seems to be around $64 million a piece. That's pretty much up there with some of the other 4+ gen fighters. I think that number might need to be a bit more flexible for the EAF and might be the reason why they're only looking for 20 to start with. I do hope this works out since IMO, the Tejas is the best option of the 3. I'm sure if the order is much larger, that number would go down.



That's good, but ASRAAM? Not sure the US would go for that TBH. Having China as a friendly and having the US as a long-time ally has had its pluses but also its minuses. The main reason the US has tagged Egypt as a multiple infraction-ed member is because supposedly in the 1980s, the Chinese were invited to inspect one of the EAF's F-16s. Found out about from US personnel at the time and I remember Hillary freaking out about it and stirring up the pot in front of congress to cut military aid. If it's a true story, that was super stupid of the EAF to get caught! And multiple times, to boot!

A big reason for the signing of CISMOA that would supposedly clear the way for the AMRAAMs as well as JDAMs (only laser-guided ordinances were allowed) but even after signing it, they're still not allowing the missiles because they simply don't trust that the Chinese will have a birthday party with them lol. I don't think that India has signed the CISMOA yet?

I think the same case might be with the PL-15E. China might not want to supply the EAF with them for fear that the US will put pressure on Egypt to show them the missiles and help the US develop ways to defeat it. Maybe @Han Patriot or other Chinese members can give us more insight as to whether that's true if the Chinese would or would not supply those missiles. I know Pakistan uses the PL-15 and China has no issues with them, of course. And they'll probably get the PL-15E as soon as it's ready.

There are benefits to being neutral and benefiting from both sides of the superpower spectrum, but there are downsides as well. Do you think India would have any similar issues supplying the ASTRA, considering Egypt's relationship with not only the US, but with China?

We signed three agreements

Basic Exchange and Cooperation Agreement for Geospatial Intelligence (BECA). General Security of Military Information Agreement (GSOMIA). Logistics Exchange Memorandum of Agreement (LEMOA)

In case of India CISMOA is called COMCASA, some alterations were done to satisfy our guys.

 

[Faceless]

BTW, the Tejas is not that cheap, right? Looking it up quickly it seems to be around $64 million a piece

That is the cost IAF pays but for EAF the jet will be cheaper than that because when IAF buys any military hardware they have to pay 18% tax which is not the case with export customers.

For Export Customers a single Tejas mk1a will cost 306 crore rupees or 41 million USD which I think is very competitive
This price quote is coming directly from HAL chief.

https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/lca-mk1a-to-cost-306-crore-hal-actively-pursuing-exports/article61755321.ece

 

[Gomig-21]

Here check this out

This is amazing.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1697898990027595964

 

[Gomig-21]

Speaking of joint military para jumps, I don't know for sure, but I don't think there has ever been a mishap with a single jumper through the decades since they have backup/reserve parachutes.
Take a look at this quick snippet from the US airborne.