Drinking liqour is not Haram - Federal Shariat Court

[VCheng]

The point is tht alcohol intoxicates n is the mother of many societ ills.............. all muslim clerics have declared it haram.................................Hence i dnt think how it cant be not haram..............

So how do you explain the FSC verdict? They looked at all such arguments presented before them, did they not?

And why are you now using "clerics" after trying to use the Quran and Hadith to justify the ban?

Yes u advocate its legality? lol

All I am saying is the the Quran does not declare alcohol haram, and I do not question its wisdom.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

So how do you explain the FSC verdict? They looked at all such arguments presented before them, did they not?

And why are you now using "clerics" after trying to use the Quran and Hadith to justify the ban?

Thts my second post in the thread... Tell me just coz FSC says somethin means its true>?? while the whole muslim world considers it haram.......... Mohammad PBUH,sahabas etc nobdy drank... thn how come its halal?



A man was once asked why he did not drink, and he replied, 'By God, I am not happy with my mind when it is sound, so why should I corrupt it even further?' - The Seventy-seven Branches of Faith - Imam Al-Bayhaqi, The Quillian Press - (1996, ISBN 1 872038 03 4) - Page 31
Alcohol is detrimental to your health especially your liver. Alcohol befogs the mind and prevents rational thinking. Alcohol causes road accidents and innocent lives lost. Alcohol increases the occurance of domestic violence. Alcohol addiction causes financial ruin.
The Holy Quran, 2.219: They ask thee concerning wine and gambling. Say: "In them is great sin, and some profit, for men; but the sin is greater than the profit." They ask thee how much they are to spend; Say: "What is beyond your needs." Thus doth Allah Make clear to you His Signs: In order that ye may consider.
The Holy Quran, 5.90: O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, (dedication of) stones, and (divination by) arrows, are an abomination,- of Satan's handwork: eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper.

The Holy Quran, 5.91: Satan's plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah, and from prayer: will ye not then abstain?

All I am saying is the the Quran does not declare alcohol haram, and I do not question its wisdom.

It would be amusing to see drunk mullahs.. haha

 

[VCheng]

...................
It would be amusing to see drunk mullahs.. haha

No, not amusing. They are like regular drunks, only with beards. I have seen them too.

All of what you have said has been discussed in the previous pages.

The fact remains: The Quran has NOT declared alcohol haram. It says to avoid it, and that is correct advice too.

 

[BATMAN]

they r there 5:91 & 2:219...!!!

Hi,
So here i'm with both references.
I agree it is recommended not to drink because of bad consequences ONLY.

Lets see one by one:

5.91
'It clearly says 'satan' wishes us to drink so that we make 'adawat' and 'bugaz' in society......'
My questions:
1- What about those who makes trouble in society without drinking wine? I think by virtue of Indian TV we only learn 'adawat' and 'bugaz' and this is what our new generation is learning.

Is it not much better to avoid such up bringing where we learn 'adawat' and 'bugz' without drinking wine?

2- How much one peg can un-sober you?

It is also clear 'satan' eventually wish us to be jealous of each other and be enemy to each other.
One ceremonial peg will not take away your senses and if inherently you are not a jealous person, you fail 'satan' even after drinking.
At the same time all men do not have same nature, therefore by rule it is discouraged/forbidden, what ever you believe.

The description of the 'ayyat' in above picture is self explanatory.
In the same sense many other things are non-recommended.

Does watching indian movie is recommended?

 

[MM_Haider]

a request to mods.. please change the title of the topic as it is misleading... FSC NEVER SAID THAT CONSUMING LIQOUR IS NOT HARAM.. THEY ONLY GAVE VERDICT AGAINST THE PUNNISHMENT OF EIGHTY WHIPS... IT IS HARAM AND IT IS PROVEN BY QURAN

even now a days Atiqa Odho is quoting this thread on her twitter account..

 

[VCheng]

a request to mods.. please change the title of the topic as it is misleading... FSC NEVER SAID THAT CONSUMING LIQOUR IS NOT HARAM.. THEY ONLY GAVE VERDICT AGAINST THE PUNNISHMENT OF EIGHTY WHIPS...

even now a days Atiqa Odho is quoting this thread on her twitter account..

The FSC verdicts outlaws whipping for using alcohol based on the fact that is is not haram, hence a person cannot be subject to the hadd imposed for haram acts.

 

[MM_Haider]

The FSC verdicts outlaws whipping for using alcohol based on the fact that is is not haram, hence a person cannot be subject to the hadd imposed for haram acts.

DUDE THIS IS YOUR INTERPRETITION OF THE VERDICT. LET ME JUST TELL YOU ONE THING THAT IT IS HARAM JUST LIKE TELLING LIE, GAMBLING, EATING ORPHAN'S WEALTH, BACKSTABBING ETC BUT FROM QURAN THE PUNNISHMENT OF EIGHTY WHIPS IS NOT PROVEN AS PER FSC SO THEY ADVISED PARLIAMENT TO RE-CONSIDER IT.

 

[S.M.R]

DUDE THIS IS YOUR INTERPRETITION OF THE VERDICT. LET ME JUST TELL YOU ONE THING THAT IT IS HARAM JUST LIKE TELLING LIE, GAMBLING, EATING ORPHAN'S WEALTH, BACKSTABBING ETC BUT FROM QURAN THE PUNNISHMENT OF EIGHTY WHIPS IS NOT PROVEN AS PER FSC SO THEY ADVISED PARLIAMENT TO RE-CONSIDER IT.

The FSC decision doesn't say that liquor is 'halal' or they have allowed the same. They have just said that whips ('lashes') under hudood ordinance are not proven from Quran or Hadith, 'hudd' cannot be applied on a person who is victim of drinking.

 

[VCheng]

The FSC decision doesn't say that liquor is 'halal' or they have allowed the same. They have just said that whips ('lashes') under hudood ordinance are not proven from Quran or Hadith, 'hudd' cannot be applied on a person who is victim of drinking.

No Sir: Please read the verdict of the court and its rationale.

The Federal Shariat Court (FSC) has declared whipping for the offence of drinking as un-Islamic and directed the government to amend the law to make the offence bailable. A full-bench of the FSC comprising Chief Justice Haziqul Khairi, Justice Salahuddin Mirza and Justice Fida Mohammad Khan gave the ruling on Thursday after hearing the arguments that the Holy Quran asks Muslims to stay away from liquor but does not specifically declares it Haram, or prohibited.

The FSC had taken up a Shariat petition of Dr M. Aslam Khaki, who had challenged different provisions of the Prohibition Order (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance 1979, in which drinking was provided as Hadd, prescribing 80 lashes as punishment for the offence. Pleading the case, Dr Aslam Khaki argued before the FSC that the punishment of 80 whips was neither provided by the Holy Quran nor Sunnah, hence the offence should not be termed as Hadd. Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him), he recalled, had awarded only 40 sticks that too of a date tree to the offender, but not 80 whips. Article 8 of the Prohibition Order (Enforcement of Hudood) Ordinance 1979 declares drinking liable to Hadd and suggests that whoever being an adult Muslim drinks intoxicating liquor by mouth is guilty of drinking liable to Hadd and shall be punished with whipping numbering 80 whips. Islam had declared some specific offences as Hadd which are heinous, but the offence of drinking is not a heinous crime, he argued. Though the Holy Quran has attributed drinking as both beneficial and also injurious but declared that its injury is more than its benefit. Thus the offence of drinking is not absolute Haram.

He contended that Article 25 of the ordinance which provided punishment for attempt to drinking was violative of the injunction of Islam as neither Holy Quran nor Sunnah had provided any punishment for it. "If a person makes an attempt to drink but withdraws, he should be appreciated but not be punished," he said, adding intention of commission of crime without any physical act was not a crime. The court agreeing with the petitioner declared the provisions of 80 lashes as un-Islamic and directed the federal government to amend the relevant laws to replace the punishment of whipping with sticks within six months by making it bailable offence. In case the government failed to amend the Hadd law, the punishment will cease to exist and become void, the judgment held.

 

[jam master]

The FSC verdicts outlaws whipping for using alcohol based on the fact that is is not haram, hence a person cannot be subject to the hadd imposed for haram acts.

hello vcheng, you dont even know if alcohol is haram according to quran

i suggest you not to comment in this thread because you are deliberately lying without knowledge

 

[VCheng]

hello vcheng, you dont even know if alcohol is haram according to quran

i suggest you not to comment in this thread because you are deliberately lying without knowledge

Wrong. I do read and understand the Quran, and I think you should read the relevant ayaat as well as the verdict of the FSC given above for yourself.

And please remember that I have as much of a right to express my opinion as you do.

Therefore, it would be better if you could respond to the substance of my posts rather than trying to prevent me from saying my mind.

 

[53fd]

This thread is getting pretty boring now... snoozefest...

 

[fd24]

This thread is getting pretty boring now... snoozefest...

agreed. Lets go for a drink and call it a day............( non alchoholic of course)

 

[VCheng]

agreed. Lets go for a drink and call it a day............( non alchoholic of course)

Nah, you guys go ahead, I think I will stay here for a while yet!

 

[jam master]

Hi,
So here i'm with both references.
I agree it is recommended not to drink because of bad consequences ONLY.

Lets see one by one:

5.91
'It clearly says 'satan' wishes us to drink so that we make 'adawat' and 'bugaz' in society......'
My questions:
1- What about those who makes trouble in society without drinking wine? I think by virtue of Indian TV we only learn 'adawat' and 'bugaz' and this is what our new generation is learning.

Is it not much better to avoid such up bringing where we learn 'adawat' and 'bugz' without drinking wine?

2- How much one peg can un-sober you?

It is also clear 'satan' eventually wish us to be jealous of each other and be enemy to each other.
One ceremonial peg will not take away your senses and if inherently you are not a jealous person, you fail 'satan' even after drinking.
At the same time all men do not have same nature, therefore by rule it is discouraged/forbidden, what ever you believe.

The description of the 'ayyat' in above picture is self explanatory.
In the same sense many other things are non-recommended.

Does watching indian movie is recommended?

dear batman, i ask you that in ayyat its written that through alcohol the devil makes a guy do bad things, so it means, when a person even drinks one sip, then the devil engages with him, so why you think that drinking to certain amount is not haram??please explain

the ayyats also mention to turn to prophets guidance, and we all know the story in which prophet strictly orddered the sahabas to throw down and smash their vessels of wine when the ayyats were disclosed to him??

there was reason to prohibit of any use of alcohol in islamic society, the ban was not allow muslims to engage with alcohol in the first place, if a guy drinks certain amounts he wishes to drink more till he lose his senses, the evil cannot be eridicated without cutting its entire roots