Does Chinese blood really lack the DNA for aggression?

[sahaliyan]

Dude, you completely get me wrong..

I said I'm realistic...
And you said Indonesia and china are friend? Indeed.. But you also have to see how Indonesia and china back when you guys poor and backward, and how Indonesia underestimate china that day.. The only reason Indonesia and china have a good relation is because the trade, china is indonesia biggest market...

And have you watch documentary films, The act of killing? That documentary film got nominated for Oscar..
And by watching that... You might have a bigger picture..

Because I know more in history(not the Indonesian history though),I know people should forgive and compromise.You can see how many barbaric things happened in China,just in 20th century,we got the Xinhai revolution when the Manchu population of Xi'an were totoally wiped out,should we hate the Han Chinese?And what about the KMT and CCP killed each other?What about the horrible things Hui warlord Ma Bufang did to Hans and Tibetans in Qinghai(just go to Qinghai,ask the local Han Chinese and Tibetans)
And in the Chinese civil war,our family have members executed by CCP because they are members of Huzi(the northeasterners call the bandhits "Huzi" means beards),but my grandfather was a 4th field army sodier.But now we have no hate in our family,because we know the history is difficult in that time

 

[Aepsilons]

Does Chinese blood really lack the DNA for aggression? | South China Morning Post

Even before Qin Shi Huang's time, Chinese feudal rulers have seen themselves as rulers of "all under heaven"

Expansion is not in the Chinese DNA", Premier Li Keqiang declared during his visit to Britain, apparently in an attempt to allay fears driven by China's territorial claims in the South China Sea, "nor can we accept the logic that a strong country is bound to become hegemonic."

He was echoing comments by Xi Jinping the previous month when the president asserted: "In Chinese blood, there is no DNA for aggression or hegemony." China has moved to the centre of the world stage but has yet to truly lead, partly because of apprehension about its intentions, despite deep-seated problems dogging the United States.

At a recent summit in Shanghai of the Conference on Interaction and Confidence-Building Measures in Asia, Xi called for an "Asia for Asians" approach, saying that Asian countries themselves could resolve security issues in the region.

Beijing has long dismissed the idea that a rising China was a threat to its neighbours, asserting that the country throughout its long history has never been expansionist.

Citing DNA as proof makes the assertion sound scientific, especially when China appears to be making progress in studying the DNA of historical figures, such as the warlord Cao Cao, who lived 1,800 years ago, and even Confucius.

However, a glance at a historical atlas will show that China's borders have changed greatly from the time of the first emperor, Qin Shi Huang, to today. How, one wonders, did China grow so big without being expansionist?

One explanation is that China grew by being conquered, especially by the Mongols and the Manchus, who subjugated the Han Chinese and also invaded and took over other territories. According to that narrative, the Han Chinese, who make up more than 90 per cent of the population today, inherited the enlarged empire after the alien dynasties fell.

However, that is inconsistent with another official narrative, which is that Mongols, Manchus and Han are and have always been Chinese. Thus, all had Chinese DNA.

Actually, long before Qin Shi Huang, Chinese rulers sought to control what they thought of as the whole world, which was called "all under heaven".

In his book Ancient Chinese Thought, Modern Chinese Power, the scholar Yan Xuetong of Tsinghua University wrote: "The emperors of China's feudal times called themselves Son of Heaven, which shows that they thought of themselves as rulers of the world … The contention … was … a contention for world leadership."

This is not to say that Chinese leaders today want to rule the world. But it does suggest that, from a historical standpoint, there is little evidence to support the notion that there is no DNA in Chinese blood for aggression or expansion.

Unless, of course, ongoing studies show that Chinese today have somehow inherited only the sagely genes of peace-loving philosophers like Confucius, while those of Cao Cao and other warlords have vanished from the land.

Aggression may be resorted to by people who want to make ... robbery, to try and plunder other people; or for the criminal satisfaction of supposed sexual need through grabbing the unwilling other person; or from people who want to smash the face to other people that they for some perhaps irrational reason do not like or cannot tolerate;

Aggression may be resorted to by a nation against another nation with the aim of conquest, or from a religious group against people of another religion.

Aggression may be resorted to as a result of social learning, of imitation, let us say in a society where occurrences of aggression are known and perhaps for some reasons justified, also where simulations of aggressions are much shown through cinema- or tv-movies or computer games in ways of entertainment for the ... cheap sensation-hunger of young people or populace.

Aggression may be learnt from violent family-life, or perhaps required from being member of a gang, of a criminal organization.

 

[Phukimak]

Yes. I am a proponent of assimilation into the host nation. Take for example the success of Chinese immigrants in the : 1) Philippines, 2) Malaysia, 3) Thailand.





This is not necessarily so.

Philippines and Thailand yes...


Malaysia?? Huahahaha epic failed..
As long as there's a laws called bumiputera.. Malaysia government just set up a bomb.

 

[Lux de Veritas]

I take issue when these so called statistical samples are used to put down one ethnic group -- or as being predisposed to some kind of crime / problem.

As i said before, there are measures that have to be taken into consideration when making multivariate analyses, as well as environmental factors that should be considered when making a meta-analysis / conclusion on data results.


Regards,

I am careful in statistical evidence. Also I do careful comparison across races.

 

[Edison Chen]

No, Xi Jinping and CCP deserve the prize. In addition I suggest both should be nominated for nobel peace prize and best comedy show on earth.

Xi Jinping is much greater than you little wanker, who the hell are you?

 

[Phukimak]

Xi Jinping is much greater than you little wanker, who the hell are you?

He's the father of xi jinping... Lol

Hahahaha

 

[Edison Chen]

He's the father of xi jinping... Lol

Hahahaha

 

[xesy]

Human history is full of war. Our technology advances not because we want to make life easier, but to make it easier to take life. So as long as human exists, there will be conflicts, there will be wars. Nothing can change that.

To deny the brutal side of humanity is to deny our own existence. It's in our instinct, in our blood.

But still personally China is blaming aggression to DNA, like someone born to be the bad guy, someone born to be the king. Please, we are living in the 21st centery. Our genese does not decide the way we act. Our society decides how we will act.

 

[Grand Historian]

Our genese does not decide the way we act..

Are you serious?

Scientists have already shown aggression is linked to heritability in mice I don't see why this wouldn't apply to humans.

 

[Jlaw]

should give Xi the Peace Nobel for the dream.

while Chinese ship sunk Vietnamese fishboat with 10 fishermen in daylight, and ignore to their life ( without throw any liferaft )

Murder is the proper term not aggression.

Video shows Vietnam fishing boat sink after collision with Chinese vessel| Reuters

A vietnam fishing boat rams Chinese vessel than sinks and blame it on the Chinese boat, LOL. It's like you try to punch me, I block your punch, you break your arm and cry to your mom about me being the instigator.

My prodigal son, you have not wise up yet.

We can only only hope that Premier Li and President Xi were being rhetorical and not scientific, because if they try to use science to explain Chinese 'blood', science is going to bite them in their bums.

Are they saying the gene associated with aggression is not in Chinese DNA ?

https://news.brown.edu/articles/2009/01/hotsauce


Association study on tardive dyskinesia and ... [Psychiatr Genet. 2013] - PubMed - NCBI

China's history is no different than that of the Europeans -- containing periods of warfare. It is irrelevant if those wars were internal to Chinese land and among Chinese. The fact of the matter is that some Chinese felt a need to violently subjugate some other Chinese for some reasons and wars resulted.

Why was there a need for all Chinese to be under one ruler any way ? What is wrong with several Chinese kingdoms or countries ? If aggression is not in the Chinese DNA, then what is the (Kung Pao) beef with Taiwan ? Why not just leave the islanders alone ?

These questions are not meant to be answered but to point out the absurdity of what these Chinese leaders said and IF they were trying to bring science to their side, and if any Chinese members here pick up this line of belief, then you guys are truly as stupid as the argument goes.

have you considered there may be a translation error? Media misquote people all the time.

The pic about killing a person by many cuts kinda make you look silly.

It was a great way to kill traitors back then. Wish we still use some Qing torture methods to deal with some people nowadays.

 

[BoQ77]

A vietnam fishing boat rams Chinese vessel than sinks and blame it on the Chinese boat, LOL. It's like you try to punch me, I block your punch, you break your arm and cry to your mom about me being the instigator.

My prodigal son, you have not wise up yet.



have you considered there may be a translation error? Media misquote people all the time.


It was a great way to kill traitors back then. Wish we still use some Qing torture methods to deal with some people nowadays.

you cannot see the video?

 

[Jlaw]

you cannot see the video?

I see the Vietnamese boats were in Chinese waters. Naturally the Chinese have the right to defend their territory. If Chinese vessels enter Vietnam water, I expect Vietnam boats to act more hostile than tthe Chinese.

 

[gambit]

I am not in the view that human intellect is genetic, but rather, influenced multifactorially. Environment has a significant attribution to this -- dependent variable.

Same here. Something like the gene-culture co-evolution theory.

Dual inheritance theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.nature.com/ng/journal/v35/n4/full/ng1263.html

Milk from domestic cows has been a valuable food source for over 8,000 years, especially in lactose-tolerant human societies that exploit dairy breeds. We studied geographic patterns of variation in genes encoding the six most important milk proteins in 70 native European cattle breeds. We found substantial geographic coincidence between high diversity in cattle milk genes, locations of the European Neolithic cattle farming sites (>5,000 years ago) and present-day lactose tolerance in Europeans. This suggests a gene-culture coevolution between cattle and humans.

Asians who are lactose intolerant are corollary to the lactose tolerant Europeans who have long history of dependency on cattle ranching.

But returning to the Chinese and now going to their favorite subject of IQ and the mythical 'high Chinese IQ' argument...

First off...I have not seen any evidence of that on this forum.

Second...Even if this unique 'high Chinese IQ' gene exists, socio-biologists who study the gene-culture co-evolution theory proposed that despite the IQ, the long history of Chinese institutional subservience to the state, notably with the mandarinate examination systems that emphasized more on rote memorization of classics than on creativity, effectively conditioned the Chinese at the genetic level to be conformists. It is a controversial argument and Toby Huff asked in his book 'Intellectual Curiosity and the Scientific Revolution' as to why, the Europeans with supposedly lower IQ, leaped ahead of the Islamic and Chinese civilizations in terms of scientific achievements.

Talking about the contexts of what is a 'generation'. Biologically, a generation could be seen as a span of twenty yrs, approximately the fertile child bearing period for men and women that produces healthy children. But culturally speaking, a generation could be stretched to eighty yrs. Elders who can no longer produce children can still influence their adult children and grandchildren in subtle intellectual and moral ways.

North Korea can be seen as a gigantic on going experiment of the gene-culture co-evolution theory, observable and measurable. North Koreans, after just two biological generations, began post Korean War, now have a people who are physically and intellectually inferior to their South Korean cousins due to persistent inferior diet and psychological oppression and indoctrination of being subservient to the state. There are North Korean men who defected to the South then asked to be returned to the North because their shorter height and weaker physicality reduced their odds of finding mates in South Korea.

There is no scientific basis for the absurd argument, no matter how rhetorical may be, that aggression is not the Chinese DNA. But it seems like conformity and obedience to authority gene is quite active.

 

[xesy]

Are you serious?

Scientists have already shown aggression is linked to heritability in mice I don't see why this wouldn't apply to humans.

Our scientists love to prove something to be disproved later. Like Einstein proved that Newton was wrong, then later Hawking proved that Eintein was wrong. I am sure later there will be someone prove that Hawking was wrong. Same goes to your theory.

Maybe genetic or bloodline has some degree of effects on how a human behave. But I think that degree has about the same effect as geography, moon phase or food intake, etc. Like scientists used to say that full moon makes people more aggressive by 1.13%, but does not have any effects on crime rates.

I think life style, living environment and education have much more impact on how a human behave, not genetic or bloodline, something you are born with.

I see the Vietnamese boats were in Chinese waters. Naturally the Chinese have the right to defend their territory. If Chinese vessels enter Vietnam water, I expect Vietnam boats to act more hostile than tthe Chinese.

Chinese vessels entered Vietnam water with warships and helicopter escorting them. If Vietnam had acted hostile, there would have been a war.

 

[Aepsilons]

Malaysia?? Huahahaha epic failed..
As long as there's a laws called bumiputera.. Malaysia government just set up a bomb.

Bumiputera is one of the vestiges of racial preferential treatment in the world. I am totally against it.

Same here. Something like the gene-culture co-evolution theory.

Dual inheritance theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.nature.com/ng/journal/v35/n4/full/ng1263.html

Asians who are lactose intolerant are corollary to the lactose tolerant Europeans who have long history of dependency on cattle ranching.

But returning to the Chinese and now going to their favorite subject of IQ and the mythical 'high Chinese IQ' argument...

First off...I have not seen any evidence of that on this forum.

Second...Even if this unique 'high Chinese IQ' gene exists, socio-biologists who study the gene-culture co-evolution theory proposed that despite the IQ, the long history of Chinese institutional subservience to the state, notably with the mandarinate examination systems that emphasized more on rote memorization of classics than on creativity, effectively conditioned the Chinese at the genetic level to be conformists. It is a controversial argument and Toby Huff asked in his book 'Intellectual Curiosity and the Scientific Revolution' as to why, the Europeans with supposedly lower IQ, leaped ahead of the Islamic and Chinese civilizations in terms of scientific achievements.

Talking about the contexts of what is a 'generation'. Biologically, a generation could be seen as a span of twenty yrs, approximately the fertile child bearing period for men and women that produces healthy children. But culturally speaking, a generation could be stretched to eighty yrs. Elders who can no longer produce children can still influence their adult children and grandchildren in subtle intellectual and moral ways.

North Korea can be seen as a gigantic on going experiment of the gene-culture co-evolution theory, observable and measurable. North Koreans, after just two biological generations, began post Korean War, now have a people who are physically and intellectually inferior to their South Korean cousins due to persistent inferior diet and psychological oppression and indoctrination of being subservient to the state. There are North Korean men who defected to the South then asked to be returned to the North because their shorter height and weaker physicality reduced their odds of finding mates in South Korea.

There is no scientific basis for the absurd argument, no matter how rhetorical may be, that aggression is not the Chinese DNA. But it seems like conformity and obedience to authority gene is quite active.

@gambit

Well written post, sir. You posit a very significant point, namely the issue of memorization of concepts and information. This is rather true for East Asian , and overall Asian societies in general. For example, Japanese medical students learn information and simply remember the shear volume of facts in anatomy, physiology, pharmacology, pathology, behavioral science, statistics, pediatrics, internal medicine, surgery, family medicine, psychiatry etc. But in the United States, medical education is different because they emphasize problem based solving skills, and conceptualization. Perhaps we can even deign to say that many East Asian students perform rather high in standardized exams or on mathematics, biological science, chemistry, physic because there is a set emphasis to memorize theorems, laws. But when asked to solve a problem assymetrically or in PBS methodology, they will not perform as high as American students or western students who emphasized PBS/ PBL (Problem based solving/ problem based learning).

Also, it is already becoming important to implement maturing tests, personality tests and multi-set batteries in hiring processes when selecting candidacy. Long gone are the days when organizations select candidates merely on IQ alone. Other factors that are considered include: professionalism, maturity level, interoperability into the organizational culture, communication skills, education experience, work experience.

This is why I contested @Lux de Veritas ' premise of high IQ among East Asians being a predictor of capability and professional success. Other factors are to be considered -- and what may work in Japan, South Korea, China....may not be applicable to say the United States, Canada, Germany, United Kingdom et al, who have a profoundly different culture ; especially in regards to communication, religion. One large difference is the wests' value of individuality , whereas in East Asia, there is emphasis on collectivity and social harmony.


Regards,
I remain,
@Nihonjin1051