Do or die....open questions to the IAF pilot

[Windjammer]

You should ask your contact.. May be he will help you access the CCTV footage.. No one can match you when it comes to claims.. Like the below

Indeed no one can specially the likes of you who will just blush at the mere mention of the term, sensitive information.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Question stands apart. How do we compare IAF and PAF on the basis of :
- AWACS
- Ground Staff Training
- Availability of Machines
- Combat Tactics
- Know how of the Adversary
- Exercises

A few of these are hard to quantify and the results of the other parameters would not be met with a warm reception by many on this thread (and would be disputed more than likely).

 

[Iggy]

Indeed no one can specially the likes of you who will just blush at the mere mention of the term, sensitive information.

I am sure you phoned your contact of ISPR for that sensitive information and good to know that you are getting used to it..

 

[Windjammer]

I'm sorry but if you are (for your own nonsensical reasons) discounting the IAF's participation in Kargil then you can't possibly claim the airstrikes in Pakistan's so-called "WOT" is adding that much "battle hardening" to the PAF- the pilots are flying within their own airspace, fighting an enemy with absolutely no AA capability and are effectively acting as bomb trucks.

I guess idiocy has no limits, unlike the IAF in Kargil, the PAF is not exactly attacking and bombing just one designated area, the same enemy has known to hit some US/NATO and PA air assets.

 

[Abingdonboy]

I guess idiocy has no limits, unlike the IAF in Kargil, the PAF is not exactly attacking and bombing just one designated area,

Umm, yes they are. Unless you're telling me the PAF has a free hand to hit anywhere in Pakistan?

the same enemy has known to hit some US/NATO and PA air assets.

You can't compare RPG-7s bringing down low flying Chinooks and Mi-17s to a F-16 flying at 30,000 feet dropping PGMs. Be honest (for once) and admit the Taliban have ZERO capability to touch a PAF fighter jet (in the air anyway) OR tell me what PAF fighter jets have been shot down by the Taliban whilst in the air.

And did the PA not have Stingers (that they used to bring down Indian a/c) during Kargil? As such the threat faced by the IAF was many times higher than the PAF faces today.

 

[Windjammer]

Umm, yes they are. Unless you're telling me the PAF has a free hand to hit anywhere in Pakistan?

Not anywhere but then again, not just a few prominent mountain tops.

You can't compare RPG-7s bringing down low flying Chinooks and Mi-17s to a F-16 flying at 30,000 feet dropping PGMs. Be honest (for once) and admit the Taliban have ZERO capability to touch a PAF fighter jet (in the air anyway) OR tell me what PAF fighter jets have been shot down by the Taliban whilst in the air.

And did the PA not have Stingers (that they used to bring down Indian a/c) during Kargil? As such the threat faced by the IAF was many times higher than the PAF faces today.

The IAF aircraft were hit with Anza missiles, none the less the Taliban are known to have Stingers and related rounds in their possession and a variety of anti-aircraft guns, certainly the footage i have seen doesn't imply as if PAF was resorting to just high altitude missions nor are all missions flown with smart weapons.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Not anywhere but then again, not just a few prominent mountain tops.

These are trivial details really and I don't see what point you're trying to prove. Or shall we talk about the inherent difficulties the IAF faced in 1999 flying at such heights and striking targets at such heights (all while making sure not to cross the LoC) which in itself is was remarkable and has been praised by the international aviation community.

none the less the Taliban are known to have Stingers and related rounds in their possession and a variety of anti-aircraft guns,

And still, they have (to date) not shot down a single PAF/NATO fighter jet. One can surmise that the Stingers in Taliban possession are past their shelf life, being used by people who are unable to use them or present in such few number to pose a negligible threat to fighter jets.

certainly the footage i have seen doesn't imply as if PAF was resorting to just high altitude missions nor are all missions flown with smart weapons.

Well if that's true then more fool them (if the threat matrix is as high as you are trying to make out) and is the PAF is trying to maximise the efficacy of its strikes on the Taliban and minimise the potential for collateral damage and risk to their a/c.

 

[Basel]

Leme Sum it up for you Mlu upgrades gave f 16 a extra boost, F 16 can go head to head anything what iaf currently have but you cant say for 100 % who will be flying back home , mostly on pdf users compare planes with each other they only count , rcs , radars ,and range of the weapon systems that plane caries , but in the real word unicorns dont exist, cz when you are in g suit even a blink of eye can change every thing most of these things doesnt matter because pak and india they arent that far from each others and if paf and iaf go head to head that will be mostly dog fight not a bvr battle. so its up to the people who are in these birds

Thank you for you response, would you please shed more light on the bold part as many Indians think that days of WVR battle in IAF vs PAF are long gone and IAF will eat PAF due to their MKI long range radar and BVR missiles.

One more thing I will like to ask you is how much capable Harpoon (specially block-IIs) are? specially against modern SAMS like Barak & ASTER? can they penetrate those line of defense? opinion from a professional is always better to have.

 

[Usama78]

Since, All I see is arguments all around, lets talk some facts. I have very less information about both the air forces so what I say might be wrong :
Technology : India wins
Number of machines : India wins
Training : PAF wins
Combat Experience : PAF wins

So, any sort of claims right now by either side are useless, aimless and all those "lesses" that might fit here

How about we close the thread? - Just saying....

 

[halupridol]

Since, All I see is arguments all around, lets talk some facts. I have very less information about both the air forces so what I say might be wrong :
Technology : India wins
Number of machines : India wins
Training : PAF wins
Combat Experience : PAF wins

So, any sort of claims right now by either side are useless, aimless and all those "lesses" that might fit here

How about we close the thread? - Just saying....

close this thread?!!!!
r u serious!
this is life n death situation,,,,,"do or die"
this is d kind of threads on which pdf survives on,,,bread n butter,,gharibo ke pet me laat na maro...

 

[Chanakyaa]

Training : PAF wins
Combat Experience : PAF wins

Data ?
Plus over half a dozen other imp. factors to consider.
Do consider the year , Indian GDP , Defense Expenditure.

Can any knowledgeable Pakistani Member shed some light before this thread as usual will be an example of classic rants and chest thumping ?

 

[sms]

@sms, ''real parameters which are simply NOT under the domain of chest thumping.''
at least i am not the one who claims to have access to CCTV footage from Indian bases, nor do i dream of seeing IAF add more pollution in the Ganges within a week.....or talk of India not needing wood for any pyres.....but then that floats the boat for a certain community.....what to say of chest thumping.

Bro it was you who started this thread based on chat with you most reliable contacts in PAF. It was you who in dire need of moral boost started this useless thread based on some assumptions born out of nationalism with no relation to reality.

We respect the nationalism (always) but not chest thumping.

PS: whatever you've posted in above has nothing to do with subject on hand. Please do not sway from topic.

Not anywhere but then again, not just a few prominent mountain tops.

The IAF aircraft were hit with Anza missiles, none the less the Taliban are known to have Stingers and related rounds in their possession and a variety of anti-aircraft guns, certainly the footage i have seen doesn't imply as if PAF was resorting to just high altitude missions nor are all missions flown with smart weapons.

View attachment 107211

We appreciate the fact that PAF is making it an even fight by providing Taliban a fair chance against a superior air force.
I'd say it's very unprofessional at least if not stupid or Taliban is not a threat at all, or lack of resources at PAF might be forcing them to resort to these tactics.


In short these tactics will not be viable (for PAF) in a head on fight with a vastly superior air force like IAF.

 

[OrionHunter]

Playing Alot Video games arent we ? if it was that easy My friend than why nations spend billion of dollars training their soldiers

i bet you wont even go above 5 =))

Your vid: 'A guy passes out on a fighter jet... 7+ Gs.'

So what's the big deal? I pass out whenever I see Katrina Kaif!! Jeeez!

 

[Windjammer]

Bro it was you who started this thread based on chat with you most reliable contacts in PAF. It was you who in dire need of moral boost started this useless thread based on some assumptions born out of nationalism with no relation to reality.

We respect the nationalism (always) but not chest thumping.

PS: whatever you've posted in above has nothing to do with subject on hand. Please do not sway from topic.

I started this thread as a reply to some bold and absurd claims made by the gentleman who allegedly served in the IAF, I replied to him accordingly with input from reliable sources (Accept it at your peril, i don't need to prove anything to anyone)....perhaps you don't know the meaning of the chest thumping expression as it was not me claiming that PAF will annihilate IAF in a few days, nor we had a birds eye view of Indian runways while sitting inside Pakistan.......in any case, what i type or post has no effect whatsoever in the PAF corridors.

We appreciate the fact that PAF is making it an even fight by providing Taliban a fair chance against a superior air force.
I'd say it's very unprofessional at least if not stupid or Taliban is not a threat at all, or lack of resources at PAF might be forcing them to resort to these tactics.
in short these tactics will not be viable (for PAF) in a head on fight with a vastly superior air force like IAF.

Well that's the one difference between combatant and a smart alec internet warrior, I am sure the likes of IAF could benefit from your services...... for, these tactics are working efficiently against the culprits and no doubt they polish PAF's ability against the so called superior air force. Alas i am forced to quote my contact once again......''PAF pilots, don't just consider themselves as some fancy flyers..... once in the cockpit, he is a seaman, a trooper, a tank driver, a gunner and a sentry manning a post.

 

[IceCold]

I don't understand why do we need to prove anything at all to the Indians. If IAF or Indians in general think they can wipe Pakistan air force in 4 days, good for them, and good for us. We have nothing to prove to them until and when push comes to shove. Let them disrespect us at their own expense. We shouldn't be bothered about how we re perceived from across the border.
From an Indian point of view India has the booming economy and the money to spend and they are inducting new assets where as Pakistan has neither the economy and nor the money to induct new assets (FC-20 put on hold for the exact same reason).

From a Pakistani POV I would be worried on certain aspects of our security apparatus as we couldn't defend our assets in peace time resulting in the destruction of our most prized assets such as Erieye and Orions. If we are to believe that Indians were behind it, than i will say a job very well done by them, destroying our assets in peace time while they did not had to lift finger.