Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[Adux]

See, we came up first with just replacing numbers, therefore the whole single engine thingie,
Then we wanted a fighter to suit our Doctrine, thus the twin engined, Strike platform concept

 

[Adux]

Europe and Israel uses American Munitions. Do you even understand the value of JSOM, JDAM, HARM missiles in terms of First Strike Capability. Do you know How Americans Achieve Complete Air Domination.

 

[joey]

Heck the F/A 22 is only 166 million,Now I can say for sure that you dont have much grasp on the issue. The Aussie planes cost them 72 million FYI

umm no I'm talking about with package, mig 35 with package costs around 40mn$ or so, munitions etc indias customization..

see i stand by my point, If you can disapprove my point your welcome, The amount of customization IAF NEEDS FOR IT is not F18 is going to offer.

Will they integrate our datalinks?
let us have their AESA source codes for integrating Astra?

feasibility feasibility again feasibility dude!

the datalink programme is by BEL and TCS to link all aircrafts in a network..

This is not cat ouse game, ok i need B2 bomber but yeah Us will give you it will be on your base with them guarding it and operating it, is it how you want things?

 

[joey]

See, we came up first with just replacing numbers, therefore the whole single engine thingie,
Then we wanted a fighter to suit our Doctrine, thus the twin engined, Strike platform concept

FLAWED concept, it is "Swing Role". not strike platform.

Europe and Israel uses American Munitions. Do you even understand the value of JSOM, JDAM, HARM missiles in terms of First Strike Capability.

ARM missiles can be fulfilled by Meteor.

Yes we dont have JDAM, but are you sure US has offered us JDAM?
We can always manufacture a JDAM with Russia, all you need is proper GPS system...


dude honey is not what matters MOST but the GLASS IN WHICH IT COMES.understand the feasibility/geopolitics first.

I'm for Mig 35 and Rafale/Typhoon.

 

[Adux]

MIG 35 with Package cost $40 million. Source please.
You can expect a clean MIG 35 costs that much or more, Munitions and Packages and others will costs etc, I am guessing here, cuz nobody knows the true amount.

You just divided the whole cost of the aussie deal by the number of aircrafts..lol

 

[joey]

^^ What I have read into Aussie deal, it doesnt contains munitions as they already have those.

Can you show me details on 4 engine deal with it?

Also let me telly ou oen thing logistics A ABSOLUTE FKIN NIGHTMARE If we are to go into D level of TOT (are americans ready to give that in first case?), as per the MRCA ACQUIOSITON policy.

Let me put it in simple again, We have used technologies form other planes for our learning and applied them in ours, somehow i never ever see americans letting us install our datalinks and letting us have free will of installing wepoans of our choice.

You simply cannot beat Russians in TOT, and Europe is there to whatever electronic and israel to compensate, which is what we need for our industry in the long run.

Again I'll be happy with 7bn deal + 2 on MCA rather than 9bn and babus sayisng no money on MCA, funds have squeezed us 70% of what we could have done by now.

 

[Adux]

FLAWED concept, it is "Swing Role". not strike platform.



ARM missiles can be fulfilled by Meteor.

Yes we dont have JDAM, but are you sure US has offered us JDAM?
We can always manufacture a JDAM with Russia, all you need is proper GPS system...


dude honey is not what matters MOST but the GLASS IN WHICH IT COMES.understand the feasibility/geopolitics first.

I'm for Mig 35 and Rafale/Typhoon.

I am off, You can be for whatever you want.

So F/A -18 is only a strike platform, lol....
Americans have offered us compelte Package except for TOT on the AESA.
You are talking more wishful thinking, We will do that, and we will do this.

MoD is not going to take my advice , maybe they will do with yours..I dont know.
You dont understand what kind of airforce we are trying to build, you dont understand for Cold Start Doctrine, How the Army wishes the Airforce to support them. IT is all about Pre-emptive Strike.
WE have one of the best air-superiority Multi-role platforms in the Su-30MKI. We have to enhance the capbility that we are lacking. Its not all about fighting other Fighter jets.

 

[Adux]

Please give me a source for the MIG 35 price,

The Aussie Deal is extensively discussed in Keypub, please check the thread.
You are taking it wrong, as if i am against the russians, No I am not, I am compeletly with More Akula 2's and Talwars. I say...lol
But for the capability we are looking, Russians dont have the best in the market.

 

[Adux]

And I dont know about the MCA, so I cant comment.

 

[joey]

I have read it sometime on BR.. dont remember now, Russian sources.

Since we differ in what kind of capability and practically "how" we need it, let the IAF HQ decide, whatever will be I'm sure they wont decide without the benefits of the same.

 

[Keysersoze]

It's interesting you mention the MCA Will they still go ahead with now that there is the whole 5th gen project with the Russians.

 

[joey]

this is for Adux, if domextic version costs this much exports will cost anything less or more? what logic says?

Note that their approach to "Program Cost per Unit" (PCU) used in their chart is to divide the total cost of each program, as stated in the Pentagon's latest Selected Acquisition Reports, by the number of units to be produced. This means that each PCU includes research and development costs, and even some support costs. Actual acquisition prices tend to be lower, and PCU can be moved significantly up or down if the number of aircraft bought rises or falls. Small-numbers programs are particularly vulnerable to this effect, and will also show up as especially expensive because very few aircraft absorb the entire R&D cost.
Note that all production numbers represent US purchases only.

 

[Adux]

Joey,

I am not looking at 93 million. It is irrelevent.Cuz we wont have to pay for their R&D. As by now they would have breakeven. Therefore the R&D costs on our planes will be considerably less. India doesnt have to pay for Line Drawing of F/A-18. Hope you get my drift. Look at Actual cost/unit.


$46 million....That is even lesser than I expected on a domestic run, That should be a old calculation. It should cost even more now, From what I have heard 50 mill.
Anyways I expect the Indian offer to be around 75 mill/plane including the araments. I have no links to give you just a hunch. I hope you know Su-30MKI costs us 55 million without armaments in India. And we are not paying Su-30MKi any exborhiant amount for developing the SU-30.

Joey if you want to argue about E/F. Talk about AESA. They wont give us a ToT. That is your trump card.
I am not looking at costs anyways, I am looking at the capability of attacking first, pre-emptive strike/air control, With a second wave of Su-30MKI's for total air domination.

Ps: we are buying 126 to 200. Thats a lot of planes, You can expect the price to come down considerably with the 30% offset rule as well as the Indian Manufacturing.

 

[BATMAN]

Ps: we are buying 126 to 200.

Would it be a single purchase or splited in multiple orders, over a period of time?

 

[Contrarian]

No one knows.