Confirmed Pics of T-129 in different altitudes & climates in Pakistan

[Tank131]

TAI could always replace the LHTEC T800 with the Rolls Royce Gem2 which originally powered the A-129 Mangusta. It may even source other european engines. If the US engine could be replaced then I would think the T-129 is the way to go over other gunships. It will be able to be customizable with respect to weapons, and it will be able to have fleet uniformity as well with respect to Vipers and (if Turkey allows) even the Mi-35s.

I see the following being the work share amongst gunships in PA:
Mi-35: SSG/Special Forces assault choppers
Ah-1Z and older Ah-1Fs will continue operations in FATA and against TTP
T-129 or WZ-10 will be the main gunship of the Army, specifically against India. In this the T-129 could use local/chinese weapons, but also American weapons like hellfire or TOW missiles giving less logistical issues vs Wz-10.

 

[ADIL SHERDIL]

Most of the guys are saying that we should boycott anything which has anything AMERICAN. May i remind you that USA deals in best choppers . if we follow this approach we are left with Chinese and Russian helicopters. Russia wont sign any major arm deal for known reasons and Pakistan should not keep all of its eggs in one basket. T-129 is an advance attack helicopter Pakistan should buy it if it fulfills our requirement.
Pakistan army should improve and increase its aviation wing. i hope the deals go on as it will be good for our aviation.

 

[Blue Marlin]

I doubt it, the T-129's will carry the US engine which should be ok if Hillary comes to power. Otherwise they will have to look for a European retrofit with either the engines from the Tigre or otherwise.
Still, the T-129's along with the AH-1Z will form the main punch as the Ah-1s are phased our or relegated purely to COIN.
The Z-10s are there like that halwa from your loving Phuppo that you know isnt sweet or what you like, but you take it because its free and its something.

how do you know the t129 has even passed yet? it need to be able to opperate in the karakoram the indian lch has a service of 6500m whilst the ti129 has a ceiling of 6100m followed by the z-10 which is 6400m which is 100m off also look at it climb rate, speed and range.
yes the t129 is a good bird but what you have the ah-1z....... which is more of a premier chopper which will see no more than 30 odd do note its from the usa so its sanction prone too.
the t129 its turkish yes but not all of it most significant part being the engines which is part british and americain so thats sanction prone too. the z-10? chinese and has faired well heck it even took part in the parade. so i would sudgest a mix of both the z10 and the t129 as you need something to go on if somthing happens which results in to maintaince and servicing for the ah-1z and t-129

TAI could always replace the LHTEC T800 with the Rolls Royce Gem2 which originally powered the A-129 Mangusta. It may even source other european engines. If the US engine could be replaced then I would think the T-129 is the way to go over other gunships. It will be able to be customizable with respect to weapons, and it will be able to have fleet uniformity as well with respect to Vipers and (if Turkey allows) even the Mi-35s.

I see the following being the work share amongst gunships in PA:
Mi-35: SSG/Special Forces assault choppers
Ah-1Z and older Ah-1Fs will continue operations in FATA and against TTP
T-129 or WZ-10 will be the main gunship of the Army, specifically against India. In this the T-129 could use local/chinese weapons, but also American weapons like hellfire or TOW missiles giving less logistical issues vs Wz-10.

the gem 2 is 1000hp whilst the lhtec is 1300+ but the mrt390 which is on the eurocopter tiger which produces a max of 1465hp but you have the hassle getting approval from france, germany and the uk to approve the sale

 

[Path-Finder]

What about Z10 with T129 electronics and weapon sytems. Is that a possibility?

 

[Syed Asif Bukhari]

I think PAA will buy T129 in limited number . and perhaps a turkish avionics package will also be sought for Z 10 . my 2 cents.

 

[_NOBODY_]

T-129 or WZ-10 will be the main gunship of the Army, specifically against India. In this the T-129 could use local/chinese weapons, but also American weapons like hellfire or TOW missiles giving less logistical issues vs Wz-10.

Pakistan is currently waiting for Z-10 with WZ-16 engine and some other upgrades.

 

[Arsalan]

Thank God, Army is thinking beyond the US.

In fact, T-129 is not that "thinking beyond US". It carries an American engine.

 

[Piper]

In fact, T-129 is not that "thinking beyond US". It carries an American engine.

Don't think it is a problem though when we are selling you guys top shelf choppers ourselves

 

[Arsalan]

I guess it's Z-10 vs T-129

With Vipers being top tier


The MI-35s going to the SF.

both Z-10 and T-129, which ever is chosen (Hopefully Z-10 for obvious reasons) wont be behind the Vipers. That is unless the Vipers come with long bow which the wont and even if by some miracle they did, the Z-10 will have some replacement to offer. I am not aware of the Z-10 trails, i hope it fared well and if it did it must be the obvious choice over T-129 so many reasons. If there were however some issues, then it is a different debate.

Don't think it is a problem though when we are selling you guys top shelf choppers ourselves

actually, THAT might be the problem. Wont US want to sell more Vipers in this case?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

both Z-10 and T-129, which ever is chosen (Hopefully Z-10 for obvious reasons) wont be behind the Vipers. That is unless the Vipers come with long bow which the wont and even if by some miracle they did, the Z-10 will have some replacement to offer. I am not aware of the Z-10 trails, i hope it fared well and if it did it must be the obvious choice over T-129 so many reasons. If there were however some issues, then it is a different debate.


actually, THAT might be the problem. Wont US want to sell more Vipers in this case?

Even the Turks are working on a MM Radar called MILDAR for the T-129

 

[Arsalan]

.
The Z-10s are there like that halwa from your loving Phuppo that you know isnt sweet or what you like, but you take it because its free and its something.

What makes you say so? As with Chinese systems, the engine is somewhat a problem but that is it. On all other fronts Z-10 is on par, if not better then T-129. Also comes with similarly impressive weapons package. Is sure to be a more flexible deal and not to mention that it comes from Phupoo

 

[Piper]

both Z-10 and T-129, which ever is chosen (Hopefully Z-10 for obvious reasons) wont be behind the Vipers. That is unless the Vipers come with long bow which the wont and even if by some miracle they did, the Z-10 will have some replacement to offer. I am not aware of the Z-10 trails, i hope it fared well and if it did it must be the obvious choice over T-129 so many reasons. If there were however some issues, then it is a different debate.


actually, THAT might be the problem. Wont US want to sell more Vipers in this case?

Sure but can Pakistan buy them en masse? I think you guys made a good play utilizing CSF credit to buy them when you could thus utilizing fund before Congress closed that avenue for military purchase.

In such a scenario US would be happy selling engines, Some sale is better than no sale. At the same time Pakistan gets access to western standard hardware at eastern prices.

 

[Arsalan]

Even the Turks are working on a MM Radar called MILDAR for the T-129

Yes that too. So again, both T-129 and Z-10 wont be be behind the Vipers. In fact with some associated procurement they might surpass the Vipers.

Sure but can Pakistan buy them en masse? I think you guys made a good play utilizing CSF credit to buy them when you could thus utilizing fund before Congress closed that avenue for military purchase.

In such a scenario US would be happy selling engines, Some sale is better than no sale. At the same time Pakistan gets access to western standard hardware at eastern prices.

Well that surely will be more of a political game then, something that we will have to leave for the diplomats to sort out. Strategically, PA may not want to go down that road again but then again, it is not like US and Pakistan have always locked horns, we have been good allies in the past and who can say what the next geopolitical shift might bring?
Frankly, as of now, yes US allowing engine sales is a possibility but it is just that, a 50/50 possibility which by no means equal surety!

 

[Dazzler]

its a case of forced tests and shoved deal. Seeing that PAA is going for other options and ATAK stand much less a chance if any, it is shoved down our throats. PAA does not like it. the shaky platform, small size, thin armor, lackluster maneuverability, plenty of sanction prone western tech are all -ves of ATAK.

You will see the modified Z-10s soon in PA, the specs of which have already been handed to chinese. As a goodwill gesture, we have the option to keep the current z10s if we want to. Seems like we obliged by showing them in the parade

 

[Arsalan]

its a case of forced tests and shoved deal. Seeing that PAA is going for other options and ATAK stand much less a chance if any, it is shoved down our throats. PAA does not like it. the shaky platform, small size, thin armor, lackluster maneuverability, plenty of sanction prone western tech are all -ves of ATAK.

You will see the modified Z-10s soon in PA, the specs of which have already been handed to chinese. As a goodwill gesture, we have the option to keep the current z10s if we want to. Seems like we obliged by showing them in the parade

its a case of forced tests and shoved deal. Seeing that PAA is going for other options and ATAK stand much less a chance if any, it is shoved down our throats. PAA does not like it. the shaky platform, small size, thin armor, lackluster maneuverability, plenty of sanction prone western tech are all -ves of ATAK.

You will see the modified Z-10s soon in PA, the specs of which have already been handed to chinese. As a goodwill gesture, we have the option to keep the current z10s if we want to. Seems like we obliged by showing them in the parade

That sums it up!
I was not using the harsh words as it would hurt many but what you mentioned is exactly what i have been pointing too from post#53 onward!