Claims of some North Korean starving individuals are eating own kids

[phylumchordata]

that is your indian version of arrogance and ignorance. dont keep repeating these indian trashes here. we know these long before all trolls

china is a morally loose and opportunistic regime.period

 

[beijingwalker]

how terrible western propaganda is ,check it out.
the war you don't see
http://www.qire123.com/videos/36548vod-play-id-36548-sid-3-pid-0.html

 

[PlanetWarrior]

nation bashing - depends on which nation. on this thread, bashing indian cheerleaders and their clones are definitely worthwhile

we are not asking for fame. we are saviing human lives here. simple and clear. cut out all those indian cheerleading "humanitarian highhorsing humility" b/s!

You're an idiot, unworthy of a response. I regretably have a low thresh-hold for idiots. Therefore I will ignore your posts with the contempt that all idiots deserve.

 

[Kaniska]

This won't help. Cannibalism will keep arising every time people pass through a prolonged period of starvation. You can kill those who are doing it now, but, if North Korea doesn't alleviate its food crisis, more people will feel compelled to eat their fellow men. Now, I admit to not knowing what's behind this issue, whether the sanctions of the fact that the government diverts such a large part of its fiscal resources to the military.

But why not China, being their major ally helping out to them in this kind of humanitarian crisis??

 

[shuttler]

china is a morally loose and opportunistic regime.period

You're an idiot, unworthy of a response. I regretably have a low thresh-hold for idiots. Therefore I will ignore your posts with the contempt that all idiots deserve.

take a decent bath with a good pieces of soap you indian rubbish trolls! you cheerleaders need it!

 

[Plexyre]

I never said China should ask them to calm down because quite frankly you guys have lost control of the rabid dog

Pardon my going off-topic for a bit but...here we go again with the 'you guys' statement. A certain JayAtl already got served for saying that to me. I speak for no one else but myself, and vice-versa, unless explicitly stated. However, that does not make facts any less valid, facts which you have not properly rebutted (if you can that is). Also, may I remind you that I am an American citizen, feel free to go have a field day over that little tidbit of trivia.

what I did say was that if you stopped their economic and food aid which only serves the Kim family than change may be accepted by the North Koreans because of necessity

And what I said was that stopping aid would mean a collapse of the North Korean regime, which would result in millions of refugees streaming across the Chinese border as well as destabilizing the region. Of course from a moral standpoint that does not excuse any of the 6 nations from blame for the current situation, but now you can at least understand why the 5 nations talking with North Korea are rather keen on keeping the unsustainable status quo for as long as possible, because all the other practical scenarios are worse (at least for the short term after the collapse of North Korea). None of the nations in the Six-party talks have any illusions when it comes to the reality of the geopolitical situation.

or the military itself may turn on the family and adopt changes (like the Myanmar situation).

Burma was able to progress because not only did they decide to do it, they also took concrete steps to change. Keep in mind that even Burma took well over half a century to make substantial reforms. Burma and North Korea are similar in that both nations can and could choose a different path for a better future. The difference is that after half a century Burma has, while North Korea has not.

As long as fluff boy Kim is getting fed I don't see why he would care if a couple thousand of his people starve every so often. China may not have as much leverage over the North Koreans as it used to but then I ask you this, which country on this planet has more leverage over NK than China??

Please enlighten us, how 'much' leverage did China 'used to' have over North Korea? And how was that leverage exercised? China does have the most diplomatic leverage over North Korea at the moment from a relative standpoint compared to other nations, but even that is extremely limited as it is, unless you're saying that China could threaten to withhold aid. Well, North Korea already knows what will happen in that scenario - they collapse, millions of refugees will end up crossing the Chinese border. North Korea can simply call that bluff and we end up back at square one.

And yes, there is one nation with more potential leverage over North Korea - the United States. Why do you think North Korea has been doing all these provocative acts such as nuclear and missile tests and even directly calling out America recently? Do you really think North Korea is doing all that to get China's attention? No, North Korea is doing it because they want diplomatic recognition and a peace treaty from the United States. That is something that only the United States can offer them, and the Wikileaks document has made that explicit.

 

[KingMamba]

Pardon my going off-topic for a bit but...here we go again with the 'you guys' statement. A certain JayAtl already got served for saying that to me. I speak for no one else but myself, and vice-versa, unless explicitly stated. However, that does not make facts any less valid, facts which you have not properly rebutted (if you can that is). Also, may I remind you that I am an American citizen, feel free to go have a field day over that little tidbit of trivia.

Okay if you are an American citizen let me talk to the Chinese citizens because my comments are directed towards them anyway. I do not see what facts you have given which I have not refuted. Everything we say here is just posturing unless it actually happens and than we can see who is right and who is wrong.

And what I said was that stopping aid would mean a collapse of the North Korean regime, which would result in millions of refugees streaming across the Chinese border as well as destabilizing the region. Of course from a moral standpoint that does not excuse any of the 6 nations from blame for the current situation, but now you can at least understand why the 5 nations talking with North Korea are rather keen on keeping the unsustainable status quo for as long as possible, because all the other practical scenarios are worse (at least for the short term after the collapse of North Korea). None of the nations in the Six-party talks have any illusions when it comes to the reality of the geopolitical situation.

North Korean citizens are already trying to run away from North Korea, they are already starving. You act like the majority get food everyday which is not the case. Only the elite aka Kims and the military get meals there are enough sources all over the net which agree with this along with testimony from people who escaped North Korea. Whatever China would have to deal with if it stops supporting Kim today, they have already been facing and effectively. Besides in any such hypothetical scenario South Korea would reunify the peninsula the minute Chinese support for the North ends.

Burma was able to progress because not only did they decide to do it, they also took concrete steps to change. Keep in mind that even Burma took well over half a century to make substantial reforms. Burma and North Korea are similar in that both nations can and could choose a different path for a better future. The difference is that after half a century Burma has, while North Korea has not.

I brought Burma up because it stood as an example of a pariah state which reformed when it so survivable was no longer feasible, North Korea is not there yet because the people in charge are being propped up by the Chinese.

Please enlighten us, how 'much' leverage did China 'used to' have over North Korea? And how was that leverage exercised? China does have the most diplomatic leverage over North Korea at the moment from a relative standpoint compared to other nations, but even that is extremely limited as it is, unless you're saying that China could threaten to withhold aid. Well, North Korea already knows what will happen in that scenario - they collapse, millions of refugees will end up crossing the Chinese border. North Korea can simply call that bluff and we end up back at square one.

And yes, there is one nation with more potential leverage over North Korea - the United States. Why do you think North Korea has been doing all these provocative acts such as nuclear and missile tests and even directly calling out America recently? Do you really think North Korea is doing all that to get China's attention? No, North Korea is doing it because they want diplomatic recognition and a peace treaty from the United States. That is something that only the United States can offer them, and the Wikileaks document has made that explicit.

Yes China had leverage over the North, in fact the Chinese had the very existence of North in its hands. Had the Chinese not intervened in the Korean war this dispute would long be over but they did and it was because they cannot stand a democracy right next to their border in fear of the collapse of the CCP party. Even the wiki article you keep bringing up does not say China has lost influence, it just says it is not as enormous as it once was. Read what you wrote, "potential leverage". There is no such thing as potential leverage, either you have leverage or you do not and the US currently has no leverage except the food aid which the North has given up by their own belligerent actions. I maintain China is the one nation on this planet that has the most leverage when it comes to NK.

china is a morally loose and opportunistic regime.period

Morally inept not loose. The CCP has no humanity, it all about the money and preserving their commie regime.

But why not China, being their major ally helping out to them in this kind of humanitarian crisis??

China does not care for their people, the US despite being considered an enemy regime has offered repeated food aid. It is not the US fault that NK is a psycho who likes to act dumb and continue being belligerent.

 

[Icewolf]

This is what happens when you have china as your ally.
Where as see where south korea is having USA as a ally.

North Koreans have a better life than average Indians in most cases.

 

[Kaniska]

North Koreans have a better life than average Indians in most cases.

OF COURSE...because average Indian do not belong to neither Pakistan not NK...So we would be rather be happy to be whatver we are rather than being bombarded every day by foreign power or being suicide bomber training center for the entire terrorist world...

Do you guys have anything to do rather than insult India in every thread...

 

[Plexyre]

Any idea why the pact wasnt concluded ? If the US and North Korea cant break ground then is it not possible for them to get a mediator such as China to hedge them forward ?

Hope you don't mind the late response. There was the Six-party talks, hosted by China, with the end goal of reaching a peace treaty to replace the truce to formally end the Korean War, among other things. However the talks have stalled since 2009, and have not resumed since. In any case North Korea has long preferred direct bilateral negotiations with the United States. We can only speculate as to why, but it seems reasonable to venture that it's because North Korea prefers direct bilateral negotiations with the U.S. instead of having to contend with the various differing agendas and the bureaucratic nature of the Six-party talks.

You can get a general idea of the Six-party talks here:
Six-party talks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Plexyre]

Okay if you are an American citizen let me talk to the Chinese citizens because my comments are directed towards them anyway. I do not see what facts you have given which I have not refuted. Everything we say here is just posturing unless it actually happens and than we can see who is right and who is wrong.

Hardly. The prospects of North Korea collapsing, as well as millions of North Korean refugees crossing into China in order to go to a third country and get asylum to the South is a very real prospect, and has been the foremost concern of the PRC government. In fact it has even been a subject of academic discussion abroad.

North Korean citizens are already trying to run away from North Korea, they are already starving. You act like the majority get food everyday which is not the case. Only the elite aka Kims and the military get meals there are enough sources all over the net which agree with this along with testimony from people who escaped North Korea. Whatever China would have to deal with if it stops supporting Kim today, they have already been facing and effectively. Besides in any such hypothetical scenario South Korea would reunify the peninsula the minute Chinese support for the North ends.

Let's try at the very least to avoid making unsubstantiated accusations at each other (though I can't say I'm expecting even that much from you to be honest...see what I did there?). When have I ever said that the majority of North Koreans receive an adequate amount of food, or even implied so? At present, North Korea forbids and prevents nearly all of its people from leaving their country except for diplomatic or work related reasons. Even then there are already tens of thousands of North Korean refugees in China. Even those numbers are a trickle compared to the numbers China will be facing when Kim's regime collapses. Once the North Korean regime collapses, millions of North Koreans will be willing to cross the Sino-Korean land border to get to South Korea without fear of punishment from a regime that no longer exists.

Yes, South Korea will reunify with the North when the Kim regime collapses. But you don't really believe that millions of North Koreans are going to cross the world's most heavily fortified border laced with land mines and other surprises until it's been cleared do you? And of course that will take time, and while that's going on, the nations in the region will be left with the logistical challenge of having to develop food distribution networks in the North for millions of North Koreans. Developing food distribution networks will also take time, and in that time many North Koreans will opt to cross the Chinese border to try and get asylum in South Korea. A sudden influx of millions across the border is a nightmare scenario that no nation would ever willingly accept.

Yes China had leverage over the North, in fact the Chinese had the very existence of North in its hands. Had the Chinese not intervened in the Korean war this dispute would long be over but they did and it was because they cannot stand a democracy right next to their border in fear of the collapse of the CCP party.

First part is true, while the last part may have been true half a century ago, but is completely false today.

Even the wiki article you keep bringing up does not say China has lost influence, it just says it is not as enormous as it once was. Read what you wrote, "potential leverage". There is no such thing as potential leverage, either you have leverage or you do not and the US currently has no leverage except the food aid which the North has given up by their own belligerent actions. I maintain China is the one nation on this planet that has the most leverage when it comes to NK.

You are implying that I said China has 'lost' influence, when I have never stated so. What I did say was that China's influence over North Korea is nowhere near as much as you make it out to be.

Of course there is potential leverage, otherwise what do you make of North Korea trying to enter direct bilateral negotiations with the U.S.? Not with any other nation, but with the United States. Putting such a card off the table or dismissing it outright is strategically unsound, and why you would do so is beyond me.

 

[BigDaddyWatch]

The Chinese have no humanity, people will bash North Korea but anyone with even a little bit of knowledge about the situation know that the day the Chinese stop supporting the Kims North Korea will accept change with open arms. Of course it doesn't matter for the CCP if a couple of common koreans die as long as they have a buffer state between them and a thriving democracy.

What about the humanity of Americans a million dead in Iraq. Children's are being born disformed from Vietnam to Kosovo to Iraq because of the crap you throw over there during you're wars. For every one dollar the US spend on foreign aid America spends another 2 to 3 dollars on wars abroad. Killing people from Yemen to Pakistan to Afghanistan to Libya etc.

And isn't one of the problems in North Korea the sanctions that makes it hard for North Korea to trade and invest and develop their economy. So Americans are placing sanctions on starving people not only in North Korea but also in Gaza and other parts of the world. And what about the US led sanctions against Iraq in the 1990's that killed 500,000 children's in Iraq that according to former secretary of state Madeline Albright was worth it. And what about the sanctions against Iran that has caused medicine shortages and other hardships to the 75 million Iranian people.

This is the humanity of Americans who keeps electing and re-electing warmongers like these. Because the American people either agree with what their leaders are doing or because they don't care or are ignorent to what their leaders and country is doing to people around the world. I don't know which one is worse.

 

[phylumchordata]

North Koreans have a better life than average Indians in most cases.

?? that's a tall claim, maybe u have fallen for republic's lavish ceremonial celebrations.

 

[itaskol]

oh man， it is rubbish news...

 

[ganesh177]

North Koreans have a better life than average Indians in most cases.

Well, in that case both koreans and indians have better life than average pakistanis.