'CIA doctor' accused of treason

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Mian ghulam nabi was known to have links with ISI and kashmiri groups

alleged

However his balls were squeezed as a response to your armys act of "tactical brilliance" of shielding US's most wanted terrorist.

where's the proof that they shielded him? Can u shed light on it if u have more information?

and don't talk about balls squeezing when you get your feet stomped on by your new obama buddies. You should be more worried about protecting your citizens in foreign countries; even your top diplomats whose daughters get humiliated in new york prisons

Fai was just a lobbyist who highlighted indian crimes in occupied Kashmir.....like the fine folks at AIPAC highlighting "Palestinian/Arab terrorism" in Washington

Fai got screwed in the whole business.

but not the cause, which is humanitarian one


Dr. Afridi however violated trust of his patients, violated the trust of the country that bore him.

 

[lem34]

No need. Commentary here.

I love it lol:

“Pakistan has a pretty legitimate” case, said Peter Bergen, a national security expert and director of the New America Foundation, a non-partisan Washington think tank. “It doesn’t really matter how valid the goal is. That doesn’t change the fact that you’re spying for a foreign intelligence service.” Why, Bergen asked, “should Pakistan somehow not play by the same rules that a lot of countries play by?”

then some sad zionist trys to defend and the operative word being tries to defend the indefensible lol I like it that Peter Bergen, a national security expert and director of the New America Foundation, a non-partisan Washington think tank agrees with me lol

 

[Hulk]

I think helping other spy agency amounts to treason. To understand it separate the result, let's assume he was doing something else.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

I love it lol:

“Pakistan has a pretty legitimate” case, said Peter Bergen, a national security expert and director of the New America Foundation, a non-partisan Washington think tank. “It doesn’t really matter how valid the goal is. That doesn’t change the fact that you’re spying for a foreign intelligence service.” Why, Bergen asked, “should Pakistan somehow not play by the same rules that a lot of countries play by?”

then some sad zionist trys to defend and the operative word being tries to defend the indefensible lol I like it that Peter Bergen, a national security expert and director of the New America Foundation, a non-partisan Washington think tank agrees with me lol

touche....

 

[VCheng]

................Why, Bergen asked, “should Pakistan somehow not play by the same rules that a lot of countries play by?”

..................................

And therein lies the rub: The reason Pakistan gets the short end of the stick time and again that other sovereign countries do not, is rooted in the abject servility and beholdenness of its ruling class to foreign powers, namely USA and UK, for its own selfish and shortsighted reasons. A sad but true state of affairs.

 

[fd24]

It's sarcasm, but of the constructive sort. The point is, where do you draw the line? There doesn't appear to be anything in the doctor's conduct that rises to the level of treason unless you stretch the definition so much that all other crimes are included, or else to confess that shielding Osama Bin Laden was official Pakistani policy and by helping rat him out the doctor was, in some way, undermining the constitution.

I'll remind you that the treason charge isn't going to hold water under international law since, under binding U.N. Security Council resolutions 1373 and 1368, Pakistan had failed at its sovereign obligation to at least attempt to root out Bin Laden so Pakistan has no sovereignty in this matter. Indeed, it can be construed that prosecuting the doctor will put Pakistan in violation of international law.

Now then mr Solomon2

You and i are unaware of the full evidence that has been presented to the Pakistani judiciary system to judge where to draw the line. You may assume from the knowledge you have that treason hasnt been committed but this really cant be pre judged when you dont have access to the evidence. Once again the issue regarding OBL is not paramount to this charge and you are off topic to talk about Pakistani policy regarding him.
The second part of your post one has to chuckle. Pot calling the kettle black when you start talking about "the violation of international law". Since when has your chosen flag and Israel ever considered international law when carrying out the systamatic bullying and throwing your weight around? The way Bush and Blair were never put on trial for war crimes. The way mossad go around murdering people around the world? The way your nation kills innocent Palestinians? I find it rather rich for you to suggest that Pakistan is in violation of international law.
Solomon2 your sheer hatred of Pakistan is crystal clear and evident in every post you bless us with. Let me enlighten your brain. Afridi is accused of treason and will be trial. If he is guilty or not guilty will depend on the evidence that has been gathered and if it stands up in court he will suffer whatever the Pakistani court and Pakistani judge decides. Its a matter for Pakistan. I love justice - it is a dish best served cold. Solomon2 keep burning.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

And therein lies the rub: The reason Pakistan gets the short end of the stick time and again that other sovereign countries do not, is rooted in the abject servility and beholdenness of its ruling class to foreign powers, namely USA and UK, for its own selfish and shortsighted reasons. A sad but true state of affairs.

The above does not make Pakistan's position on prosecuting Afridi for treason any less legitimate.

What you have offered is a reason for double standards practiced by the West, while accepting that double standards are indeed being applied given Western instances of prosecution for treason, and that Pakistan's position, given global precedence, is valid.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I'll remind you that the treason charge isn't going to hold water under international law since, under binding U.N. Security Council resolutions 1373 and 1368, Pakistan had failed at its sovereign obligation to at least attempt to root out Bin Laden so Pakistan has no sovereignty in this matter. Indeed, it can be construed that prosecuting the doctor will put Pakistan in violation of international law.

Was there a time limit on 'apprehending OBL' in those resolutions? Was there some sort of 'precise definition/articulation' of what 'kinds of efforts' by a nation would satisfy the UN resolutions?

If not, then how can you argue Pakistan 'failed in its sovereign obligation', especially given that critical intelligence about the courier who led to OBL was obtained by Pakistan and passed on to the US, not to mention the arrests of KSM and other AQ members by Pakistan, whose interrogations provided further pieces of the puzzle that enabled the US to determine OBL's location?

Given the above, international law will be on Pakistan's side - the publicly available information alone points to significant Pakistani effort and assistance in hunting down AQ and OBL.

 

[VCheng]

The above does not make Pakistan's position on prosecuting Afridi for treason any less legitimate.

What you have offered is a reason for double standards practiced by the West, while accepting that double standards are indeed being applied given Western instances of prosecution for treason, and that Pakistan's position, given global precedence, is valid.

Firstly, I agree that some form of prosecution for malpractice can be justified; I just have a problem agreeing that his misconduct rises to the level of treason.

Secondly, the West is not the only practitioner of what you call double standards; governments of all kinds of countries on all continents have done this throughout history, and it is not about to change now or anytime soon either.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Oh I agree that some form of prosecution for him would be entirely justified; I just have a problem agreeing that his malpractice rises to the level of treason.

I referenced that earlier in the thread - the need to establish that Afridi knowingly and deliberately assisted in some sort of a foreign intelligence operation, and/or carried out a 'scam vaccination program' on behalf of a foreign government.

Mere participation in the vaccination program without realizing it was being conducted for foreign intelligence operations would not, alone, be grounds for arguing treason.

Secondly, the West is not the only practitioner of what you call double standards; governments of all kinds of countries on all continents have done it throughout history.

Sure, but on this thread we are talking about a specific topic ...

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi Abou,

Actually it is the american generals who need tobe charged with high treason for letting OBL escape at tora bora---not supporting the calls for air strikes by the rangers on ground----.

You know what---the biggest cowards in this scenarios were the 50 odd rangers on the scene at the mouth of tora bora----these cowards cowed down----and were afraid of their lives----if they wanted revenge from OBL---they should have dived after him into that pass---and died fighting as proud men do for the honor fo their country and that would have put whole of the american army at shame for not acting up----.

Solomon is full of it as usual----he can keep his sanctions and whatever----there ain't going to be any sanctions on pakistan----and if any---won't mean nothing----.

Even the u s president and sec of state are on record in stating that OBL is not the primary tarhget anymore---that was in 06---07----.

By the way how many u s generals would be ezxecuted for letting OBL escape for at least 3 times---. Why don't they hand the white boys first then go and blame some one else...

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

it was a collective failure but Pakistan was scape-goated for obvious reasons that have already been discussed. . .

VCheng & Suleiman --- good intentions or bad intentions, you already i think understand that citizens of a country can't take directives or 'serve' the interests of another country's government. It's more than just a "conflict of interest" even if the common interest is to see to it a certain end result (in this case, capturing --or rather blowing the brains out of the worlds most wanted man)

it goes down to espionage. Espionage is treason.


and it's like a slap on the face when American govt. gets angry with Pakistanis for arresting this man, and it's insulting that they offer him money and American citizenship.

I think after Raymond Davises and Xe Services rumors not to mention issues of contention like drones, the feeling that America is abandoning Pakistan (again) among other things -- that Pakistanis, as resilient and patient as they are, simply can't tolerate any more jabs.


somewhere along the line, both sides forgot that partnership and trust are a 2-way thing. They are mutually inclusive. They can take years to build, and days to destroy.

 

[karan.1970]

she was an indian who ALLEGEDLY worked with and reported to State elements in Pakistan. So regardless of whether she did or didn't ''leak state secrets of india to Pakistan'' --you do agree that the second she reports to a country that is not her own, there are issues?

What you nincompoops keep missing out is that most folks here are not arguing that Afridi has not done anything wrong. Only whether this merits a high treason charge..

if protecting bin laden were a state policy, there'd be much better places to keep him hidden

Hindsight is surely 20-20

the problem is that Dr. Afridi was not only handing out fake vaccines -- in other words --misreporting his activity and intentions; but he was also taking orders from and reporting to the intel agency of a foreign govt. That is treason in any country.

worst case - espionage (even that is a long shot since he did not act against Pakistan..

also, if he had info on bin laden or his whereabouts --the smartest thing to do would have been to notify the local law enforcement agencies and administration. It was silly of him to sell his honour for a few dollars and an American passport.

May be he was not sure of the honor of local law enforcement agencies and administration. And he had all the reasons to I guess..

whats the point of those benefits when it lands you treason charges and jail time?

Picture abhi baaki hai.. I dont think he will get either...

i've brought it up 3 times in this thread but you nincompoops kept over-looking it.....so perhaps now, you can address it

So what's your stand on that?? Should Fai be charged with Treason under American laws?

---------- Post added at 09:02 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:00 AM ----------

For Solomon2: Why Doctor Ghulaam Nabi Fai was arrested by FBI? After all he was just promoting the cause of Kashmiris?

For Financial fraud.. If I use the logic most Pakistanis are using in this thread, he should be charged with treason and killed.. Do you support that ?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

my take on it is simple


espionage = treason

treason = grounds for firing squad


i'm an old-fashioned man......that's how things are supposed to be done

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

i saw a lot of you numb-nutted indians calling for all kinds of violence and repercussions against your human rights activist (Ms. Roy) --- and in her case she REALLY never did commit treason.

i can be more specific....but in the interests of maintaining some semblance of on-topic discussion, i wont.