China's new strategic bomber: H-6K mass produced

[Secur]

Its still better than anything China have made quality wise.

90+ % composite structure.
Much better electronics.
Much smaller RCS.
and Engine as compared to any 3rd gen.(4th for western standards) Chinese fighter.

Should I consider it as the same delusions that " India is on par with West in Electronics Warfare Tech " Or " Going to be super power in missile tech in 5 years " ?

Are we now comparing an operational plane with something which is even now in the PT stage ?

Really ? Any Prove of your claim ? Where's the indigenous Kaveri ?

 

[manofwar]

congrats China.......
but isn't H-6 a very old platform (and reportedly unreliable nowadays)??
And anyways Strategic bombers were fine in Cold war but with the advent of advanced and modern BMD and Sam's, they don't have much of a scope.....

 

[DARKY]

Should I consider it as the same delusions that " India is on par with West in Electronics Warfare Tech " Or " Going to be super power in missile tech in 5 years " ?

Are we now comparing an operational plane with something which is even now in the PT stage ?

Really ? Any Prove of your claim ? Where's the indigenous Kaveri ?

On par yes quality wise much better than anything China makes in Electronic Warfare department.

PT stage is already past it is under IOC stage and the planes are named as LSP(Low Scale Production) 7 LSP flying 8th ready to take skies soon ... better get educated before embarrassing your nation on a global forum.

Yeah really son.. and I don't have time to prove things to uneducated boys... who spend too much time on internet rather than reading their books and attending their school.

 

[Secur]

On par yes quality wise much better than anything China makes in Electronic Warfare department.

PT stage is already past it is under IOC stage and the planes are named as LSP(Low Scale Production) 7 LSP flying 8th ready to take skies soon ... better get educated before embarrassing your nation on a global forum.

Yeah really son.. and I don't have time to prove things to uneducated boys... who spend too much time on internet rather than reading their books and attending their school.

Really ? Even when the Beijing had a head start of almost 2 decades and has been reverse engineering and innovating longer than you can even imagine ! Somehow India makes a radar with massive Israeli assistance and declares itself superior ! Develop Brahmos - 2 which is basically Russian made and declare itself superior ... WOW !

Yeah , I know ... 3 decades in the making ... So why did your HAL go for IOC-2 ? Still not satisfied , huh ? LSP which is still being improved ? And here you are acting as a joker , comparing it with an operational plane like J 10 and declaring it superior despite the specifications which are available to everyone wishing to activate his grey matter ? Talk to me when you get it in operational service ...

Kiddo , I know your lot habits of making tall claims which later fall flat Dont get me started !

And anyways Strategic bombers were fine in Cold war but with the advent of advanced and modern BMD and Sam's, they don't have much of a scope.....

Well , they have a different role for it ...

 

[DARKY]

Really ? Even when the Beijing had a head start of almost 2 decades and has been reverse engineering and innovating longer than you can even imagine !

Reverse engineering and innovating are two different things... yes I can't imagine since when China has been Reverse engineering foreign goods.

Somehow India makes a radar with massive Israeli assistance and declares itself superior ! Develop Brahmos - 2 which is basically Russian made and declare itself superior ... WOW !

Does that make any difference... Germans helping American, Jews helping Russians or Chinese helping Pakistanis ?.. Atleast those Radars and Missile are top class and modern unlike those 60 year old soviet bombers or 30 year old rusting carrier waiting to be scrapped as junk.

Yeah , I know ... 3 decades in the making ... So why did your HAL go for IOC-2 ? Still not satisfied , huh ? LSP which is still being improved ? And here you are acting as a joker , comparing it with an operational plane like J 10 and declaring it superior despite the specifications which are available to everyone wishing to activate his grey matter ? Talk to me when you get it in operational service ...

Again lack of education exposes you here....they took 30 years to make something which is upto the latest standards... its better than taking 10 years to RE something which is 60 years old.

Even the in service aircrafts are improved asper requirements and demand of customer... thats still an LSP.

Kiddo , I know your lot habits of making tall claims which later fall flat Dont get me started !

aren't you started yet...... better learn somethings while on internet rather than fooling around.... that(trolling, flaming, Insulting..etc.. and feeling good about it) would get you nowhere.

 

[Secur]

Reverse engineering and innovating are two different things... yes I can't imagine since when China has been Reverse engineering foreign goods.

Does that make any difference... Germans helping American, Jews helping Russians or Chinese helping Pakistanis ?.. Atleast those Radars and Missile are top class and modern unlike those 60 year old soviet bombers or 30 year old rusting carrier waiting to be scrapped as junk.

Again lack of education exposes you here....they took 30 years to make something which is upto the latest standards... its better than taking 10 years to RE something which is 60 years old.

Even the in service aircrafts are improved asper requirements and demand of customer... thats still an LSP.

aren't you started yet ... better learn somethings while on internet rather than fooling around.... that(trolling, flaming, Insulting..etc.. and feeling good about it) would get you nowhere.

Yeah , and the Beijing has been doing both for decades , enlightened , are you ? Else , what is J 20 and their AWACS ?

I am not saying that it is a wrong thing but declaring yourself superior using other's technology and claiming that you build it indigenous sure is ! Your scientists proudly do it all the time ! ... Who declared them top class ? I can say the same for China's defense equipment ... What difference does it make ? What makes you so sure these are the same as the 60 years Soviet bombers and haven't been innovation/improved upon ? As for the old carrier , you know how long have you been bearing the burden of a 1953 British commissioned carrier ! ... How old is the highly overpriced Admiral Gorshkov ( according to Wiki , it was laid down in 1978 ) ? ... Are you accepting them both as rusting crap ? China bought that for gaining experience and now they are proudly improving its design and building a indigenous one ... SO ?

Learn to debate with civility ... I know its difficult when constantly being refuted but still ...
They took 30 years to make something which is constantly being rejected by your AF , let alone any foreign one ! Seriously , was this the longest period of time taken to develop a military hardware ? You have had JV's and have been building license building aircraft so long ... Why couldn't you develop a new one based on that experience ? ...

Both things are different ... Things are customized as per customer requirements ... Not like your constant design changes ...

Not really , you showed us who was trolling when you declared a PT to be superior than operational aircraft ! We know who constantly loves to troll and flame on China defense threads as your lot began here ... Just check from the start of the thread ... This , thinking is getting you nowhere ... Your own first post was a in this thread ... China's still way ahead and self reliant !

 

[Secur]

Another Russian product with improved name ...nothing else

Did you mean the same like almost all your defense hardware ? ...

 

[DARKY]

Yeah , and the Beijing has been doing both for decades , enlightened , are you ? Else , what is J 20 and their AWACS ?

I am not saying that it is a wrong thing but declaring yourself superior using other's technology and claiming that you build it indigenous sure is ! Your scientists proudly do it all the time ! ... Who declared them top class ? I can say the same for China's defense equipment ... What difference does it make ? What makes you so sure these are the same as the 60 years Soviet bombers and haven't been innovation/improved upon ? As for the old carrier , you know how long have you been bearing the burden of a 1953 British commissioned carrier ! ... How old is the highly overpriced Admiral Gorshkov ( according to Wiki , it was laid down in 1978 ) ? ... Are you accepting them both as rusting crap ? China bought that for gaining experience and now they are proudly improving its design and building a indigenous one ... SO ?

Learn to debate with civility ... I know its difficult when constantly being refuted but still ...
They took 30 years to make something which is constantly being rejected by your AF , let alone any foreign one ! Seriously , was this the longest period of time taken to develop a military hardware ? You have had JV's and have been building license building aircraft so long ... Why couldn't you develop a new one based on that experience ? ...

Both things are different ... Things are customized as per customer requirements not being improved/design changed ...

Not really , you showed us who was trolling you declared a PT to be superior than operational aircraft ! We know who constantly loves to troll and flame on China defense threads as your lot began here ... Just check from the start of the thread ... This , thinking is getting you nowhere ... China's still way ahead and self reliant !

J-20 a mixture of Technology imported from Russia and West... why do you thing would they hack the F-35 data or send their spies in Russia... That AWACS is build from Israeli help.... fail to see innovation here.

They never claimed the Israeli radar as their own... neither are those radars a stole tech. or hacked from some website or stolen by some spies.

What innovation did you make on this bomber... Its the same old Tu-16 design.... worthless and useless against any country equipped with long ranged SAMs, BMD and long ranged Interceptors.. but yes it can against banana republics and failed states... but then there are much better alternatives.

Both Aircraft carriers were operational thought their service as well as maintained.. not thrown uncompleted to be rusted for 20 years and waiting to be scrapped.

Our AF competes our domestic machines with the best of best available in their world... they don't drop an inch below the best available... and they won't until LCA emerges as the best in its class... a draw back of open defense market yes.. but you know you how to come out with the best... There is no compromise on this like in China which is embargoed from Western markets.

Again wrong here.. look for any aircraft development timeline they are improved with time(Design also changed)... Its another thing that they are inducted at an early stage to support their development.. such is not the case with Tejas as of now.

Self reliant on RE yes... however Big wars won't be won on that thinking the enemy would be much ahead of China since she would be busy copying what enemy makes.

 

[Donatello]

Nice 50 years old Tu-16. Very cutting edge

As usual, useless rant by Indians.

B52 bombers are also 50 years old.


See, i opened this thread up and saw Indians taking a piss. Can't do shyt on their own so just babble here and there.

 

[Secur]

J-20 a mixture of Technology imported from Russia and West... why do you thing would they hack the F-35 data or send their spies in Russia... That AWACS is build from Israeli help.... fail to see innovation here.

They never claimed the Israeli radar as their own... neither are those radars a stole tech. or hacked from some website or stolen by some spies.

What innovation did you make on this bomber... Its the same old Tu-16 design.... worthless and useless against any country equipped with long ranged SAMs, BMD and long ranged Interceptors.. but yes it can against banana republics and failed states... but then there are much better alternatives.

Both Aircraft carriers were operational thought their service as well as maintained.. not thrown uncompleted to be rusted for 20 years and waiting to be scrapped.

Our AF competes our domestic machines with the best of best available in their world... they don't drop an inch below the best available... and they won't until LCA emerges as the best in its class... a draw back of open defense market yes.. but you know you how to come out with the best... There is no compromise on this like in China which is embargoed from Western markets.

Again wrong here.. look for any aircraft development timeline they are improved with time(Design also changed)... Its another thing that they are inducted at an early stage to support their development.. such is not the case with Tejas as of now.

Self reliant on RE yes... however Big wars won't be won on that thinking the enemy would be much ahead of China since she would be busy copying what enemy makes.

Well whatever it is , serves as a prove that Beijing is now well past reverse engineering and now onto creating new aircraft based on previous experience whatever way they chose , supports the fact China is capable of developing 5th Generation fighters ... And as there are none except F22 Raptor operational at the moment , that is fact that confirms that China hasn't stolen this tech And since Western media is desperate to prove otherwise , they are making fancy titled propaganda news that " How the hackers got sensitive info " and ... Is it so easy to steal the blueprints and other information of sensitive and top secret American military hardware ?

I can get you a couple of threads from Indian defense suggesting otherwise , you own scientists making tall claims with no real prove ...

How old would be the B52 design ? Hmmm lets see according to wiki The B-52 took its maiden flight in April 1952. Built to carry nuclear weapons for Cold War-era deterrence missions, the B-52 Stratofortress replaced the Convair B-36.The B-52 has been in active service with the USAF since 1955. The B-52 marked its 50th anniversary of continuous service with its original operator in 2005 and after being upgraded between 2013 and 2015 it will serve into the 2040s.[N 1]

See , how ridiculous and baseless this argument of yours is ... The design has been improved/innovated upon tremendously and now evolved into H-6K ... Why do not you ask Uncle Sam about their ancient design serving until now ? As major AF's around the world still operate this sort of aircraft , you have no reason to question the Chinese and then foolishly assume that they wont be escorted by air superiority fighters ! Besides , this particular one can carry upto 6 long range Cruise missiles ... Just because you cant do something , doesn't mean you have to downplay other's achievements !

I am well aware of the condition of both AC's ... I was using your claim to refute you on the aged designs and nothing else ... You said that this Chinese AC is more than 30 years old ... I showed you how the INS Viraat is almost 60 years old ... Admiral Gorshkov the same story ... Rusting old crap , as you said ? ... Yes , this will now be completed in China along with another one of which construction has started indigenously ! Better to build it yourselves than pay a highly inflated price to the Russians right ?

No , being continuously rejected despite having 3 decades of making shows that something is terribly wrong with the Tejas ... Why do you need IOC-2 ? You had decades of experience license manufacturing planes , doing JV's since decades and still cant get it operational ! Why ? ... All AF's induct their aircraft and then improve the design/systems ... Why is it so different this time ? China hasn't compromised on anything , they have bought major Russian systems ( Yeah , the same beloved hardware ) over the time as well as reverse engineer , innovate and now create aircraft ... Nice strategy right ? Resulted in J 10 , FC 1 / JF 17 , J 11 , J 8 and a couple of other aircraft ...
Not to mention the Russian hardware they operate !

Reliant on reverse engineering , were ... Good old time , now they are into the " creation " part ... You cant say it now when new classes/generation of military equipment is coming out of China's domestic industries ! Go ahead and search instead of being in the state of denial , burying your head in the sand and desperately claiming all Chinese hardware to be inferior than your's / being a copy , reverse engineered , stolen without any prove ! If your non-operational LCA is so good enough to take on everything PLAN can possibly throw , ask your decision makers not to waste money on the Rafale !

 

[rcrmj]

again too much useless indian rants```please making bullets first then come here to lecture

 

[Beast]

J-20 a mixture of Technology imported from Russia and West... why do you thing would they hack the F-35 data or send their spies in Russia... That AWACS is build from Israeli help.... fail to see innovation here.

They never claimed the Israeli radar as their own... neither are those radars a stole tech. or hacked from some website or stolen by some spies.

What innovation did you make on this bomber... Its the same old Tu-16 design.... worthless and useless against any country equipped with long ranged SAMs, BMD and long ranged Interceptors.. but yes it can against banana republics and failed states... but then there are much better alternatives.

Both Aircraft carriers were operational thought their service as well as maintained.. not thrown uncompleted to be rusted for 20 years and waiting to be scrapped.

Our AF competes our domestic machines with the best of best available in their world... they don't drop an inch below the best available... and they won't until LCA emerges as the best in its class... a draw back of open defense market yes.. but you know you how to come out with the best... There is no compromise on this like in China which is embargoed from Western markets.

Again wrong here.. look for any aircraft development timeline they are improved with time(Design also changed)... Its another thing that they are inducted at an early stage to support their development.. such is not the case with Tejas as of now.

Self reliant on RE yes... however Big wars won't be won on that thinking the enemy would be much ahead of China since she would be busy copying what enemy makes.

BBC NEWS | Business | Kalashnikov upset by Indian 'copy'

 

[SinoChallenger]

As usual, useless rant by Indians.

B52 bombers are also 50 years old.


See, i opened this thread up and saw Indians taking a piss. Can't do shyt on their own so just babble here and there.

Even the indian capital city is overrun by monkeys. So the indians come to PDF to hurl their verbal feces everywhere like a monkey.

 

[Ammyy]

Even the indian capital city is overrun by monkeys. So the indians come to PDF to hurl their verbal feces everywhere like a monkey.

[video=youtube;cg2AezJo8aQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cg2AezJo8aQ[/video

PDF (or Internet) is the only place where you can release your frustration cause in your own country you are not allowed to do that ...

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

J-20 a mixture of Technology imported from Russia and West... why do you thing would they hack the F-35 data or send their spies in Russia... That AWACS is build from Israeli help.... fail to see innovation here.

They never claimed the Israeli radar as their own... neither are those radars a stole tech. or hacked from some website or stolen by some spies.

What innovation did you make on this bomber... Its the same old Tu-16 design.... worthless and useless against any country equipped with long ranged SAMs, BMD and long ranged Interceptors.. but yes it can against banana republics and failed states... but then there are much better alternatives.

Both Aircraft carriers were operational thought their service as well as maintained.. not thrown uncompleted to be rusted for 20 years and waiting to be scrapped.

Our AF competes our domestic machines with the best of best available in their world... they don't drop an inch below the best available... and they won't until LCA emerges as the best in its class... a draw back of open defense market yes.. but you know you how to come out with the best... There is no compromise on this like in China which is embargoed from Western markets.

Again wrong here.. look for any aircraft development timeline they are improved with time(Design also changed)... Its another thing that they are inducted at an early stage to support their development.. such is not the case with Tejas as of now.

Self reliant on RE yes... however Big wars won't be won on that thinking the enemy would be much ahead of China since she would be busy copying what enemy makes.

India cannot hack though. If someone can hack a very secure system like that, it proves that their programming skills are top tier. Indians cannot, so that's why when someone says India shining service superpower or software superpower I just laugh. India doesn't even have a single notable software product. They do "software service" which is just another name for debugging code of others and coding the ideas of others lmao.

AWAC was not built with Israeli help. In fact, it was because we couldn't get Israeli help that we built it ourselves. The deal was blocked in 1998. Prove KJ-2000 had any foreign help at all. You are just intellectually dishonest, if not lacking.

KJ-2000 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If KJ-2000 was built with foreign help, then there's no way we could make a derivative product so quickly unless we absorbed the foreign technology so fast we could make a miniaturized version.

KJ-200 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Of course, India is still buying whole systems from foreign countries. In the supply chain of materials, materials processing equipment, components, subsystems and systems, India is at the "import systems" level and just starting to understand how to buy subsystems. It is not even ready to talk about even understanding components, materials and processing equipment.

There is nothing in India that's indigenous except for "cheapest" of X (like the fire-it-up Nano or 35 dollar tablet, which actually costs 50 dollars to make).