China commits $6.5 billion for Pakistani nuclear project

[OrionHunter]

It makes me laugh to see how these people are literally giving every single contract to the Chinese. they come they build and they take the profits. I mean atleast try something on your own.

Financing documents seen by Reuters showed China National Nuclear Cooperation (CNNC) has promised to grant a loan of at least $6.5 billion to finance the project.

So it's neither a free gift or an aid package. What's the deal like? Usually 2-3% interest over the capital cost over a period of 20 years or so.

Can someone calculate what Pakistan would need to pay back to the Chinese every year? As it is they're almost in the default mode with respect to the loans taken from the IMF.

And by the way, the total cost is $9.1 billion for those reactors with $6.5 billion being loaned by China. Where's the balance dosh going to come from? Anyway, it's none of our business as to how Pakistan is going to pay the loan back to China!! But they should know there are no freebies, even from big brother China!

 

[dray]

People as poor as you lot don't deserve quality Chinese products。

If you want quality Chinese products，pay up and ask your merchants to import such。

Unfortunately Indian merchants know every well that an average Indian consumer can only afford products made in Chinese peasants' courtyard. That's why you run into Indian merchants even in the back alleys of Yiwu, a city known for trading cheap consumables.

We already have better brands at higher price segments, most Chinese products won't sell at those price segments.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

We already have better brands at higher price segments, most Chinese products won't sell at those price segments.

All of those brands, regardless of whether they are Western brands (Apple, etc.) or Japanese (Sony, etc.)... or Indian brands like Mircomax... All of these products are "made" in China.

You can't escape it, every electronic device you have, every manufactured product, even the Indian flag and your holy idols... all of these are mass-manufactured in China.

Micromax in particular, they just import Chinese mobiles and rebrand them as Micromax.

India already has by far the largest fiscal and trade deficit in the ENTIRE developing world. And more than half of that record-breaking Indian trade deficit is owed to China. Imagine how that is going to grow in the coming years, with Manmohan Singh openly voicing more trade to China, and Narenda Modi saying the same?

 

[Beast]

All of those brands, regardless of whether they are Western brands (Apple, etc.) or Japanese (Sony, etc.)... or Indian brands like Mircomax... All of these products are "made" in China.

You can't escape it, every electronic device you have, every manufactured product, even the Indian flag and your holy idols... all of these are mass-manufactured in China.

Micromax in particular, they just import Chinese mobiles and rebrand them as Micromax.

India already has by far the largest fiscal and trade deficit in the ENTIRE developing world. And more than half of that record-breaking Indian trade deficit is owed to China. Imagine how that is going to grow in the coming years, with Manmohan Singh openly voicing more trade to China, and Narenda Modi saying the same?

Precisely, those nationalistic igorant Indian thinks India already catch up with China manufacturing and lives in dreamland thinking those are really make in India. Its good they come to Pakistan defense forum to have a real eye opener and know the painful truth

A race between China and India never happen. India dont even qualify the criteria to race with China.

Igorant Indian shall thanks their sensational India media for hyping and spreading plenty of false lies to its own citizens that blind them from truth.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

And another thing @DRAY, why are you guys allowing us to bankrupt you?

If you look at the trade numbers, China is single-handedly forcing India into having the very largest trade deficit in the entire developing world, which every year contributes to India's fiscal deficit, again... the very worst twin deficits in the entire developing world.

You guys seriously need to be more nationalistic. Why are you bankrupting yourselves and voluntarily sending money to us in massive amounts every year for our products? Apparently you don't like Chinese products, yet you are voluntarily bankrupting yourself, in order to pay us for them?

You know we have currency reserves of around $3.66 TRILLION right? If you include the CIC arm of the Chinese currency reserves (the part responsible for investing in buying up assets overseas), the total is well over $4.2 trillion. Now compare that to India's TOTAL GDP which is only $1.5 trillion, or less if you factor in the fall of the Rupee.

We don't need your money, your own money-starved government needs it, they are even cutting back on their defence budget due to money problems:

Govt may cut down on defence budget: PM - Times Of India

^^^ That was news from only 1 month ago, November 2013.

 

[kbd-raaf]

All of those brands, regardless of whether they are Western brands (Apple, etc.) or Japanese (Sony, etc.)... or Indian brands like Mircomax... All of these products are "made" in China.

You can't escape it, every electronic device you have, every manufactured product, even the Indian flag and your holy idols... all of these are mass-manufactured in China.

Micromax in particular, they just import Chinese mobiles and rebrand them as Micromax.

India already has by far the largest fiscal and trade deficit in the ENTIRE developing world. And more than half of that record-breaking Indian trade deficit is owed to China. Imagine how that is going to grow in the coming years, with Manmohan Singh openly voicing more trade to China, and Narenda Modi saying the same?

Micromax has started a factory in India.

And another thing @DRAY, why are you guys allowing us to bankrupt you?

If you look at the trade numbers, China is single-handedly forcing India into having the very largest trade deficit in the entire developing world, which every year contributes to India's fiscal deficit, again... the very worst twin deficits in the entire developing world.

You guys seriously need to be more nationalistic. Why are you bankrupting yourselves and voluntarily sending money to us in massive amounts every year for our products? Apparently you don't like Chinese products, yet you are voluntarily bankrupting yourself, in order to pay us for them?

You know we have currency reserves of around $3.66 TRILLION right? If you include the CIC arm of the Chinese currency reserves (the part responsible for investing in buying up assets overseas), the total is well over $4.2 trillion. Now compare that to India's TOTAL GDP which is only $1.5 trillion, or less if you factor in the fall of the Rupee.

We don't need your money, your own money-starved government needs it, they are even cutting back on their defence budget due to money problems:

Govt may cut down on defence budget: PM - Times Of India

^^^ That was news from only 1 month ago, November 2013.

After the fall of the rupee, the Indian GDP is at 1.78T

Y u do dis Chinese-Dragon, y? y?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Micromax has started a factory in India.

You mean Micromax which has only 600 or so employees?

They'll just import the components from China, and "assemble" them in India. Hardly mass-manfacturing, most of the work will be done in China.

Y u do dis Chinese-Dragon, y? y?

LOL, these guys are trying to insult Chinese products.

I'm just making them aware that all of their electronics and all of their manufactured products will have something to do with China. Even the Indian flag and Indian holy idols are made in China. India has the world's largest trade deficit, the majority of which is owed to China.

Don't you think it's hypocritical to attack Chinese products when you have a record-breaking trade deficit caused by buying so much of them?

 

[kbd-raaf]

You mean Micromax which has only 600 or so employees?

They'll just import the components from China, and "assemble" them in India. Hardly mass-manfacturing, most of the work will be done in China.



LOL, these guys are trying to insult Chinese products.

I'm just making them aware that all of their electronics and all of their manufactured products will have something to do with China. Even the Indian flag and Indian holy idols are made in China. India has the world's largest trade deficit, the majority of which is owed to China.

Don't you think it's hypocritical to attack Chinese products when you have a record-breaking trade deficit caused by buying so much of them?

Yeah the semi-conductors will be imported from China/Taiwan, at first. However it's not simply an assembly plant. The first couple of semi-conductor plants are not going to be in India for a few years yet.

I completely agree with you. I will quote my Materials professor, "Chinese products are as good as the customer wants them to be ". If the Chinese made product you're using is crap, it's because you're poor and can't afford any better.

It's idiotic to mock the Chinese manufacturing sector which has lifted millions of people into relative wealth.

India would be far richer if it hadn't been stupid enough to vote the BJP out of power and brought in the Congress back in 2004(?). It's India's own fault that it is has stagnated and mocking the Chinese for doing better is fallacious.

And to add: it's not just the Chinese people who have benefited from Chinese low-cost manufacturing. Australia is one of the great beneficiaries of the Chinese boom.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

It's idiotic to mock the Chinese manufacturing sector which has lifted millions of people into relative wealth.

India would be far richer if it hadn't been stupid enough to vote the BJP out of power and brought in the Congress back in 2004(?). It's India's own fault that it is has stagnated and mocking the Chinese for doing better is fallacious.

Thanks buddy, I knew I could get a much more logical response out of you.

I'm mostly responding to DRAY here, he has been trolling this topic before. In fact, I think the comments DRAY made on this thread were just a copy-and paste of a previous response he made in a thread about Chinese products being crappy.

 

[kbd-raaf]

Thanks buddy, I knew I could get a much more logical response out of you.

I'm mostly responding to DRAY here, he has been trolling this topic before. In fact, I think the comments DRAY made on this thread were just a copy-and paste of a previous response he made in a thread about Chinese products being crappy.

Oh sure, there are crappy Chinese products. They're aimed at low-income markets.

There are also really very good Chinese products. These are aimed at markets that can afford to pay for them.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Oh sure, there are crappy Chinese products. They're aimed at low-income markets.

There are also really very good Chinese products. These are aimed at markets that can afford to pay for them.

Exactly. People need to resist the urge to just buy a smartphone for only $10 and then complain when there is something wrong with it. It's obviously a fake product that you shouldn't expect anything out of it, and it was a dumb idea to buy it in the first place from the black market.

Just buy a smartphone for a decent amount of money, say $500 or so and you'll get a quality product. And regardless of the brand whether it is Apple/Sony/Samsung/Lenovo, it will be made in China, with components that were made in China.

You get what you pay for. We do both high end and low end, we are dominant in the manufacturing sector, both high end and low end products are made in China now, regardless of their brand.

You wait ten years, and we will become even more of a manufacturing powerhouse than before, when we are industrialize the inner regions of China where the wages are still low and the development levels are still low. These guys in the Politburo mean business, they mean to turn China into a true power some day.

 

[dray]

All of those brands, regardless of whether they are Western brands (Apple, etc.) or Japanese (Sony, etc.)... or Indian brands like Mircomax... All of these products are "made" in China.

You can't escape it, every electronic device you have, every manufactured product, even the Indian flag and your holy idols... all of these are mass-manufactured in China.

Micromax in particular, they just import Chinese mobiles and rebrand them as Micromax.

India already has by far the largest fiscal and trade deficit in the ENTIRE developing world. And more than half of that record-breaking Indian trade deficit is owed to China. Imagine how that is going to grow in the coming years, with Manmohan Singh openly voicing more trade to China, and Narenda Modi saying the same?

There is a major difference between "Chinese products" and "Products made in China", they 2nd one comes with certain quality control (though scandals still happen). India is also becoming a manufacturing & export hub for reputed foreign brands, but these are not Indian products.

The Nuclear plants though will be "Chinese products/tech", that is the concern.

In retail market in India Chinese products have presence in lower segment of the market, and in mobiles, as people change them within a year and quality/durability doesn't matter much.

And all electronics don't come from China, we have our own brands operating here for decades, foreign manufacturing units like Samsung, Hitachi, etc., and imports from Thailand, Malaysia, Japan, etc. All 1.2 billion Indians know they are buying crap when they buy Chinese products, it is a trade between cost & quality, people buy them for their cheap price, but nobody buy them for quality, none.

And another thing @DRAY, why are you guys allowing us to bankrupt you?

If you look at the trade numbers, China is single-handedly forcing India into having the very largest trade deficit in the entire developing world, which every year contributes to India's fiscal deficit, again... the very worst twin deficits in the entire developing world.

You guys seriously need to be more nationalistic. Why are you bankrupting yourselves and voluntarily sending money to us in massive amounts every year for our products? Apparently you don't like Chinese products, yet you are voluntarily bankrupting yourself, in order to pay us for them?

You know we have currency reserves of around $3.66 TRILLION right? If you include the CIC arm of the Chinese currency reserves (the part responsible for investing in buying up assets overseas), the total is well over $4.2 trillion. Now compare that to India's TOTAL GDP which is only $1.5 trillion, or less if you factor in the fall of the Rupee.

We don't need your money, your own money-starved government needs it, they are even cutting back on their defence budget due to money problems:

Govt may cut down on defence budget: PM - Times Of India

^^^ That was news from only 1 month ago, November 2013.

Such trade deficit happened in last one decade, and it is partly because of serious mis-governance by the present Govt. and also because of giving foreign policies preference over trade policies, it was partly allowed to keep China happy till we upgrade our defense infrastructure at our northern border, probably by 2018. However, Govt. is already working on to bring the deficit down and reduce cheap imports from China.
btw our major trade deficit is because of oil & gold imports, not China.

I will not answer any off-topic posts in this thread, you are immune to ban, I am not.

 

[kbd-raaf]

Exactly. People need to resist the urge to just buy a smartphone for only $10 and then complain when there is something wrong with it. It's obviously a fake product that you shouldn't expect anything out of it, and it was a dumb idea to buy it in the first place from the black market.

Just buy a smartphone for a decent amount of money, say $500 or so and you'll get a quality product. And regardless of the brand whether it is Apple/Sony/Samsung/Lenovo, it will be made in China, with components that were made in China.

You get what you pay for. We do both high end and low end, we are dominant in the manufacturing sector, both high end and low end products are made in China now, regardless of their brand.

You wait ten years, and we will become even more of a manufacturing powerhouse than before, when we are industrialize the inner regions of China where the wages are still low and the development levels are still low. These guys in the Politburo mean business, they mean to turn China into a true power some day.

And what of the investments made in Shenzhen etc? It's not exactly the easiest thing in the world to shift production lines like that.

Nah, Samsungs aren't generally made in China. Both my Note and S4 are made in Vietnam.

Yeah I can only wish India some half-competent leadership like the current and recent CCP leadership.

I've decided that if India doesn't vote in a government with sound policies and definite vision of the future, I'll give up and become a Chinese fanboi.

 

[dray]

I completely agree with you. I will quote my Materials professor, "Chinese products are as good as the customer wants them to be ". If the Chinese made product you're using is crap, it's because you're poor and can't afford any better.

What about toxic toys sold in USA, what about melamine in baby food of reputed and costly brands like Nestle and Mead Johnson which were made in China? Are they cheap products too?

Now you will get me banned here. Please stick to the topic.

 

[kbd-raaf]

What about toxic toys sold in USA, what about melamine in baby food of reputed and costly brands like Nestle and Mead Johnson which were made in China? Are they cheap products too?

Now you will get me banned here. Please stick to the topic.

A lapse in quality control. Regrettable but happens.