Chabahar vs Gwadar

[hussain0216]

you will not be able to trade a single peanut to kabul through chabahar that is our promise and we dont need any countrys help

Absolutely

 

[tsinga]

Only you Pakistanis, and your moronic journalists are talking about time efficient and cost efficient bull. No expert in this whole world is claiming that it saves time. It doesn't, even in most favorable circumstances, even with superman drivers. Overland route never save money or time vis-a-vis sea routes, except for very short distances.




Certainly. Unless Malacca's access is denied to China, your corridor would never make any economic sense ever for bulk of Chinese trade, and would be useless.

You need to an idiot to even think that a land route could beat a sea route in cost or time factor.




Does not change anything.

My first calculation was for non-stop journey.




Probably because if Indian are banned, this forum will become mutual masturbation forum for Pakistanis.

In case a freight train route is built, you will have to increase the average speed you used from 30kmph to minimum of 70 kmph.

 

[syedali73]

Only blame outside forces to cover your problems, surely that will solve your problems. Especially when that comes with stupid conspiracy theories.

Iran is not here to please you on a daily basis.

The fact that many Pakistanis love to ignore: Your Arab brothers which you always seem to look up to, have a much much larger trade with India than Iran. Pakistan's strategic alliance with Saudi Arabia is anything but a 'friendly' gesture towards Iran, adding to ignoring the terrorist problem in Baluchistan which has been threatening Iran for years.

So we will never close our eyes to our economic interests only to please people who look up to Arabs regardless of what they do.

Instead of whining about Chabahar which has absolutely nothing to do with Pakistan, get your stuff together and start developing your country in a proper way, sitting in the dark and hitting the room for being black will not solve the problem.

Gwadar has one purpose, Chabahar has another, they don't interfere with each others' interests, but for people who want to blame outsiders to cover their problems, yes Chabahar might be a problem.

Bozorg Shaitan has given you this tiny little bity leverage and this is your language and tone? What you will do when the Bozorg Shaitan will accept you as partner as at one point of time you were? Iranians are French of Asia, full of arrogance and bloated ego. We have many Iranian students here and unequivocally almost all of them are way too proud of 'something' that they are not, not even remotely. Most of them have issues with their supervisors and are not at all liked here. Many had to leave without their PhDs mainly because of their attitude problem. Your tone is reminding of one of my Iranian graduate student who I had to kick out from my lab exactly for the same attitude issues. Contrary to that, Arabs are liked here for their humbleness and lively attitude. So this is where my friend you Iranians are standing, disliked because of your attitude problem, and your post is exactly a reflection of your general national attitude.

 

[RIP Pak LAW]

In case a freight train route is built, you will have to increase the average speed you used from 30kmph to minimum of 70 kmph.

separate dedicated railway track will be built along with the roads/motorways for big moving vehicles. Entire infrastructure is being elevated.

 

[karan21]

Chabahar can complement Gawadar, however, there is absolutely no alternative for Gawadar. It's in a league of it's own due to geographic location of Pakistan and the economic center of gravity that has shifted towards China. Think of it as if the magnetic poles of the earth have shifted, anyone with even with ONE functioning neuron will realize the magnanimity of what Gawadar means in the long term, and anyone who thinks that this can be somehow replaced by any other port is delusional at best. This is our cash cow, which we shall milk for eons to come!

Honestly, I do see massive potential in Gawdar. It can be the economic hub of Pakistan. The country that seems to benefit the most from Gawdar after Pakistan is China. But when you say Gawdar is in a league of it's own, I got keen to know why?

Why do you think Gawdar is in a league of it's own. You do realize that at the moment infrastructure of Chahbahar and areas around Chahbahar is far ahead of Gawdar. Chahbahar is hub of Iran's oil refining and power generating plants. Economic activity is going on full swing in Chahbahar, while Gawdar is still under design stage.

IMO: Both Gawdar and Chahbahar will be hubs of Chinese and Indian activity. These asian powerhouses will use these small ports to reach middle east. They both serve the same purpose but very important purpose.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Wow! That is what I call a detailed analysis! A far cry from the cut and paste keyboard warriors!

So does that mean transporting goods via the Gwadar - Kashgar route is unviable due to exorbitant costs involved in transportation?? If it is, then this project is a lemon, only to be used by China as an alternative route in case of an emergency, seeing that the cost of transporting goods from Shanghai to Gwadar is $440 per ton! (Rs 44,000 PKR per ton!! ) Am I correct?

I'm sure the chinese have made all calculations .. And hence investing over 50 billion dollars... Unless you know more about the route,the prices etc than those involved in the multi billion dollar mega project !

 

[Emmie]

It would take him 91.57 hours to reach Kashghar, which would be equal to 7.7 days or 8.7 days taking pit stops into account.

Let's assume that it takes only a day to transfer cargo from a Pakistani to a Chinese truck. The time spent before that Truck moves towards CHina is 9.7 Hours.

That Truck would take 170 Hours to reach SHanghai from Kashghar. ie 14 days of driving and assuming two days for pit stops, 16 days.

How good were at matchs? I was terrible but still I knew the basics.

91.57 hours are at par with 7.7 or 8.7 days! And 170 hours means 14 days?

There are 24 hours in a day.

91.57/24 = 3.81 days and you're making it 7.7 days.

170/24 = 7.08 days and you're making it 14 days.

Time required for Travel = 262 Hours = 11 Days.

Time required for transport of a container from Dubai to Karachi = 5 days

BusinessDubai.com - Bizneeds

Total time required when your drivers and port handlers are superman = 16 days.

Time required to transport a container from Dubai to Shanghai = 15 Days.

From Dubai to Shanghai 15 days
From Karachi to Shanghai 14 days
Dubai to Karachi 5 days

How can a ship that takes 14 days from Shanghai to Karachi can take 15 days from Shanghai to Dubai when a ship needs 5 days from Karachi to Dubai? 4 Din aise he gul jer bhai app?

Do your match again and of course google proper and corresponding references.

 

[anonymus]

How good were at matchs? I was terrible but still I knew the basics.

91.57 hours are at par with 7.7 or 8.7 days! And 170 hours means 14 days?

There are 24 hours in a day.

91.57/24 = 3.81 days and you're making it 7.7 days.

170/24 = 7.08 days and you're making it 14 days.



From Dubai to Shanghai 15 days
From Karachi to Shanghai 14 days
Dubai to Karachi 5 days

How can a ship that takes 14 days from Shanghai to Karachi can take 15 days from Shanghai to Dubai when a ship needs 5 days from Karachi to Dubai? 4 Din aise he gul jer bhai app?

Do your match again and of course google proper and corresponding references.

I think I made it pretty clear that this calculation was based on a Truck being driven for 12 hours everyday.

Let's be realistic.

Assume that a driver drives for 12 hour per day, it would take and on average take a day extra to go through customs and refuelling stop.

I have calculated time cycle with 24 hours non-stop shift before this one.

You can always bank upon a Pakistani to make stupid assertion without doing even a basic google search.

Let's calculate time. In order to give you a leeway, I am expecting that a Truck would not stop anywhere (No rest for drivers, no checkpoints, no fuel or repair break) and assume that a Truck runs 24 Hours at 30Kmph, and I am neglecting time it would be needed to transfer goods in Gwadar.

Time required for Travel = 262 Hours = 11 Days.

Time required for transport of a container from Dubai to Karachi = 5 days

BusinessDubai.com - Bizneeds

Total time via overland route required when your drivers and port handlers are superman = 16 days.

Time required to transport a container from Dubai to Shanghai via Ship = 15 Days.

And Karachi to Shanghai calculation is for overland route. It is pretty obvious from Talk about Trucks

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I think that delusion runs rampant among Pakistanis, and bad quality of education is an epidemic.I would demolish this pathetic post of yours assertion by assertion.

And il happily spank your behind to knock some sense into you!

This just shows illiteracy of Geography of one's own country.

Take a good look at this Map.

​

As anyone with eyes could see, Wakhan corridor lies in Afghanistan. You does not share even a millimeter of Border with Tajikistan.

Thanks for posting the map .. Now if you had even a little bit of grey matter you woul have understood my post . When I mentioned Wakhan Corridot (a 20 in strip connecting Tajikistan to Pakistan) with road link being completed and rail link in the works .. I specifically posted 2 sources for idiots like you just in case !

This assertion betrays complete lack of understanding of Economics, and the difference between cost od Sea Transport vs Surface transport.

This is something about which I have posted earlier which was deleted when this website crashed.

Distance between Shanghai and Kashghar = 5121 Km

5121 Km - Distance from Shanghai to Kashgar

Distance between Kashghar and Gwadar = 2747 Km

2747 Km - Distance from Kashgar to Gwadar

Congrats you can google !


Now can you also tell us about the economic corridor being constructed and how much it will reduce the distance between Gwadar and Xinjiang???


Also can you tell us about your assertions that the goods will be transported to Shanghai and other other parts of regions of China specially Xinjiang itself ?

Average Trucking cost per Ton per Km in China = 5 cents.

http://www.worldbank.org/transport/transportresults/regions/eap/eap-china-output.pdf

Average Trucking cost per Ton per Km in Pakistan = 1.8 cents.

https://www.iisd.org/gsi/sites/default/files/ffs_india_irade_trucking.pdf

These cost are of 2002 and would have become 7 cents for China and 3 cents for Pakistan, just by taking inflation into account.

This is the most conservative calculation as I am not taking into account Hazard premium that nature of Terrain imposes on Pakistan (Karakoram Highway is rated world's fourth most dangerous highway World's 10 dangerous roads | CNN Travel ) and Hazard premium that China has to pay for transporting good through Takla Makan Desert , Kulum Shan mountains range, and Altai Shan mountain range.

But still let us calculate cost of transporting a Tonn of good from Shanghai to Gwadar.

Cost incurred in Chinese territory = 0.07 X 5121 = $358.47

Cost incurred in Pakistani territory = 0.03 X 2747 = $82.41

So total cost from Shanghai to Gwadar for a tonn of goods= $440.88

Now let destination port be Dubai.

Cost of Transporting Dubai to Shanghai = $625 per TEU

http://www.simic.net.cn/news_list.php?lan=en&id=368&flag=cnports&pname=shanghai&page=10

Since standard 1 TEU= 21,600 Kg : Cost of Transporting 1 Ton via sea from Dubai to Shanghai = $28.93

Twenty-foot equivalent unit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Similarly cost from Karachi to Dubai for 1 TEU = $125 (rate for Gwadar are not available as port is not operational)

BusinessDubai.com - Bizneeds

Cost of Transporting 1 Ton from Karachi to Dubai = $5.787


Total cost of Shipping a Ton from Shanghai to Dubai via Gwadar = $446.67

Total cost of Shipping directly from Dubai to Shangahi = $28.93 which is 16 times less than that of Transporting via Gwadar.

Heck Total cost of Transport from Gwadar to Chinese border is more than what would be required for Transport from Dubai to Shanghai.


And this is not all. You beloved corridor passed through Khunjareb Pass which remain open only from May 1 to December 31.

Karakoram Highway

Only a fool would believe that it is a main route to anywhere. This is just a backup route for China in case Malacca strait is blocked

indian stupidity strikes again ! Bravo !



Do you think the Gwadar is expensive than Dubai o sea route for China ?

Do you think KKH is not being expanded?

Do you think rail links aren't on the menu? Or the optic fiber links? Etc


Do you think motorway are not being constructed ?


Do you think Motorways from Peshawar to Kabul and road and rail links to Central Asian States are not in the works?


Have you ever read or heard about the Sino Pak economic corridor and the related infrastructure worth over 50 billion $ ??

Do you think the Chinese are fools to invest such large amount of money in a project that is cheaper and dangerous and more time consuming ?


Fuk what do you even know about the project other than a bunch of old data from the Internet ?

Actually, You need to consult map (though that would do no good given your cartographic skills)

​

China is directly connected to Central Asia. It is your country which needs either China or Afghanistan for access to Central Asia.

@OrionHunter

Sure China surely is .. But have you ever fukin hear about topography ? Or the fact that CARS are land locked and their easiest and shortest route (With facilities and infra to the "warm waters" is through Pakistan? do you think Tajikistani govt is run by idiots who have complete a road link with Pakistan and working on a rail link? An and so on?


Start using your brain for once !

I think that delusion runs rampant among Pakistanis, and bad quality of education is an epidemic.I would demolish this pathetic post of yours assertion by assertion.

And il happily spank your behind to knock some sense into you!

This just shows illiteracy of Geography of one's own country.

Take a good look at this Map.

​

As anyone with eyes could see, Wakhan corridor lies in Afghanistan. You does not share even a millimeter of Border with Tajikistan.

Thibk tou for posting the map .. Now if you had even a little bit of grey matter you woul have understood my post . When I mentioned Wakhan Corridot (a 20 in strip connecting Tajikistan to Pakistan) with road link being completed and rail link in the works .. I specifically posted 2 sources for idiots like you just in case !

This assertion betrays complete lack of understanding of Economics, and the difference between cost od Sea Transport vs Surface transport.

This is something about which I have posted earlier which was deleted when this website crashed.

Distance between Shanghai and Kashghar = 5121 Km

5121 Km - Distance from Shanghai to Kashgar

Distance between Kashghar and Gwadar = 2747 Km

2747 Km - Distance from Kashgar to Gwadar

Congrats you can google !


Now can you also tell us about the economic corridor being constructed and how much it will reduce the distance between Gwadar and Xinjiang???


Also can you tell us about your assertions that the goods will be transported to Shanghai and other other parts of regions of China specially Xinjiang itself ?

Average Trucking cost per Ton per Km in China = 5 cents.

http://www.worldbank.org/transport/transportresults/regions/eap/eap-china-output.pdf

Average Trucking cost per Ton per Km in Pakistan = 1.8 cents.

https://www.iisd.org/gsi/sites/default/files/ffs_india_irade_trucking.pdf

These cost are of 2002 and would have become 7 cents for China and 3 cents for Pakistan, just by taking inflation into account.

This is the most conservative calculation as I am not taking into account Hazard premium that nature of Terrain imposes on Pakistan (Karakoram Highway is rated world's fourth most dangerous highway World's 10 dangerous roads | CNN Travel ) and Hazard premium that China has to pay for transporting good through Takla Makan Desert , Kulum Shan mountains range, and Altai Shan mountain range.

But still let us calculate cost of transporting a Tonn of good from Shanghai to Gwadar.

Cost incurred in Chinese territory = 0.07 X 5121 = $358.47

Cost incurred in Pakistani territory = 0.03 X 2747 = $82.41

So total cost from Shanghai to Gwadar for a tonn of goods= $440.88

Now let destination port be Dubai.

Cost of Transporting Dubai to Shanghai = $625 per TEU

http://www.simic.net.cn/news_list.php?lan=en&id=368&flag=cnports&pname=shanghai&page=10

Since standard 1 TEU= 21,600 Kg : Cost of Transporting 1 Ton via sea from Dubai to Shanghai = $28.93

Twenty-foot equivalent unit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Similarly cost from Karachi to Dubai for 1 TEU = $125 (rate for Gwadar are not available as port is not operational)

BusinessDubai.com - Bizneeds

Cost of Transporting 1 Ton from Karachi to Dubai = $5.787


Total cost of Shipping a Ton from Shanghai to Dubai via Gwadar = $446.67

Total cost of Shipping directly from Dubai to Shangahi = $28.93 which is 16 times less than that of Transporting via Gwadar.

Heck Total cost of Transport from Gwadar to Chinese border is more than what would be required for Transport from Dubai to Shanghai.


And this is not all. You beloved corridor passed through Khunjareb Pass which remain open only from May 1 to December 31.

Karakoram Highway

Only a fool would believe that it is a main route to anywhere. This is just a backup route for China in case Malacca strait is blocked

indian stupidity strikes again ! Bravo !



Do you think the Gwadar is expensive than Dubai o sea route for China ?

Do you think KKH is bot being expanded?

Do you think motorway and rail links are not being constructed ?


Do you think Motorways from Peshawar to Kabul and road and rail links to Central Asian States are not in he works?


Have you ever read or heard about the Sino Pak economic corridor and the related infrastructure worth over 50 billion $ ??

Do you think the Chinese are fools to invest such large amount of money in a project that is cheaper and dangerous and more time consuming ?


Fuk why do you evn know about the project other than a bunch of old data on the Internet ?

Actually, You need to consult map (though that would do no good given your cartographic skills)

​

China is directly connected to Central Asia. It is your country which needs either China or Afghanistan for access to Central Asia.

@OrionHunter

Sure China surely is .. But have you ever fukin hear about topography ? Or the fact that CARS are land locked and their easiest and shortest route (With facilities and infra to the "warm waters" is through Pakistan? do you think Tajikistani govt is run by idiots who have completed a road link with Pakistan and working on a rail link? An and so on?


Start using your brain for once !

How good were at matchs? I was terrible but still I knew the basics.

91.57 hours are at par with 7.7 or 8.7 days! And 170 hours means 14 days?

There are 24 hours in a day.

91.57/24 = 3.81 days and you're making it 7.7 days.

170/24 = 7.08 days and you're making it 14 days.



From Dubai to Shanghai 15 days
From Karachi to Shanghai 14 days
Dubai to Karachi 5 days

How can a ship that takes 14 days from Shanghai to Karachi can take 15 days from Shanghai to Dubai when a ship needs 5 days from Karachi to Dubai? 4 Din aise he gul jer bhai app?

Do your match again and of course google proper and corresponding references.

indian logic...

 

[kollang]

you will not be able to trade a single peanut to kabul through chabahar that is our promise and we dont need any countrys help

Oh no.are you going to invade Chabahar?

 

[Emmie]

I think I made it pretty clear that this calculation was based on a Truck being driven for 12 hours everyday.



I have calculated time cycle with 24 hours non-stop shift before this one.



And Karachi to Shanghai calculation is for overland route. It is pretty obvious from Talk about Trucks

I can't help you if you edit your post..... You edited it 5 mins ago..

 

[anonymus]

And il happily spank your behind to knock some sense into you!




Thibk tou for posting the map .. Now if you had even a little bit of grey matter you woul have understood my post . When I mentioned Wakhan Corridot (a 20 in strip connecting Tajikistan to Pakistan) with road link being completed and rail link in the works .. I specifically posted 2 sources for idiots like you just in case !





Congrats you can google !


Now can you also tell us about the economic corridor being constructed and how much it will reduce the distance between Gwadar and Xinjiang???


Also can you tell us about your assertions that the goods will be transported to Shanghai and other other parts of regions of China specially Xinjiang itself ?






indian stupidity strikes again ! Bravo !



Do you think the Gwadar is expensive than Dubai o sea route for China ?

Do you think KKH is bot being expanded?

Do you think motorway and rail links are not being constructed ?


Do you think Motorways from Peshawar to Kabul and road and rail links to Central Asian States are not in he works?


Have you ever read or heard about the Sino Pak economic corridor and the related infrastructure worth over 50 billion $ ??

Do you think the Chinese are fools to invest such large amount of money in a project that is cheaper and dangerous and more time consuming ?


Fuk why do you evn know about the project other than a bunch of old data on the Internet ?



Sure China surely is .. But have you ever fukin hear about topography ? Or the fact that CARS are land locked and their easiest and shortest route (With facilities and infra to the "warm waters" is through Pakistan? do you think Tajikistani govt is run by idiots who have complete a road link with Pakistan and working on a rail link? An and so on?


Start using your brain for once !



And il happily spank your behind to knock some sense into you!




Thibk tou for posting the map .. Now if you had even a little bit of grey matter you woul have understood my post . When I mentioned Wakhan Corridot (a 20 in strip connecting Tajikistan to Pakistan) with road link being completed and rail link in the works .. I specifically posted 2 sources for idiots like you just in case !





Congrats you can google !


Now can you also tell us about the economic corridor being constructed and how much it will reduce the distance between Gwadar and Xinjiang???


Also can you tell us about your assertions that the goods will be transported to Shanghai and other other parts of regions of China specially Xinjiang itself ?






indian stupidity strikes again ! Bravo !



Do you think the Gwadar is expensive than Dubai o sea route for China ?

Do you think KKH is bot being expanded?

Do you think motorway and rail links are not being constructed ?


Do you think Motorways from Peshawar to Kabul and road and rail links to Central Asian States are not in he works?


Have you ever read or heard about the Sino Pak economic corridor and the related infrastructure worth over 50 billion $ ??

Do you think the Chinese are fools to invest such large amount of money in a project that is cheaper and dangerous and more time consuming ?


Fuk why do you evn know about the project other than a bunch of old data on the Internet ?



Sure China surely is .. But have you ever fukin hear about topography ? Or the fact that CARS are land locked and their easiest and shortest route (With facilities and infra to the "warm waters" is through Pakistan? do you think Tajikistani govt is run by idiots who have completed a road link with Pakistan and working on a rail link? An and so on?


Start using your brain for once !

Pathetic counterpoise devoid of any substance. No one (including Chinese) ,except morons like you, are cumming in their panties about Gwadar. And that $50 billion (if they ever come) is loan for plethora of activities,including a gas pipeline to Sindh, not just corridor.

And Geography fail, There is no road in Wakhan corridor.

Wakhan Corridor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Emmie]

And Karachi to Shanghai calculation is for overland route. It is pretty obvious from Talk about Trucks

And you supported your point with a shipping references? Besides, overland route from Karachi to Dubai hardly exists, your analogy in that case make no sense.

 

[anonymus]

I can't help you if you edit your post..... You edited it 5 mins ago..

I only added one word: Overland route in first Karachi to Shanghai equation as you were getting confused by two calculations, one directly via sea, another via Karachi and land route thereafter.

And you supported your point with a shipping references? Besides, overland route from Karachi to Dubai hardly exists, your analogy in that case make no sense.

Overland route is for Karachi to Kashghar. I added sea transit time from Dubai toi Karachi to land trasit time from Karachi to Kashghar.

As the talk was about this corridor being used for Trade with middle east, I took Dubai as reference point for both calculations.

If we are calculating for two routes Dubai-Karachi/Gwadar-Kashghar-Shanghai Vs Dubai-Shanghai (via sea), Dubai to Karachi time would have to be added to total time.

 

[Rasengan]

I'm sure the chinese have made all calculations .. And hence investing over 50 billion dollars... Unless you know more about the route,the prices etc than those involved in the multi billion dollar mega project !

I have spoken to some of my closets friends from China and they have advocated the idea that the CCP government wants to move its industrial and manufacturing sector to central and western provinces of China, because the eastern coast is heavily populated and its not competitive enough due to rising living standards, in the forth coming next decades. In addition a vast amount of mineral resources is located in the western side of China, which is untapped because the level of infrastructure and skilled workers is limited. More importantly historically civil discontent and the uprising of the peasants against Chinese emperors has predominantly occurred in central China, where poverty led to the collapse of most dynasties. The CCP government wants political stability in the long term. Henceforth Pakistan will benefit in the long term because a significant amount of Chinese exports will go through Gwadar, however this will be a gradual process. Shanghai is a financial hub that will combine its stock exchange with Hong Kong in the near future, therefore a restructuring process is transpiring. 50 billion dollars is the first phase of investment and this will increase in the future. Pakistanis should be patient and not expect things to change dramatically within a decade, because this whole project is for the long term. I have worked previously for the Agricultural Bank of China and so I understand how China wants to transform its economy and what the government wants to achieve.