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Capabilities of PAF Dassault MIRAGE-III/V.

Should Pakistan upgrade its Mirages to South African Cheetah standard if not Beyond?

  • Yes

    Votes: 181 59.0%
  • No

    Votes: 126 41.0%

  • Total voters
    307
The Need For Speed.
Mirages remain one of the fastest aircraft in PAF inventory.

FB_IMG_1654857772918.jpg
 
The Need For Speed.
Mirages remain one of the fastest aircraft in PAF inventory.

View attachment 852914

How fast can 30-40 year old airframes and engines reach the original paper performance specifications of factory fresh new builds? Everything mechanically degrades over time, airframes age, engines will degrade and limits are placed on what that plane is allowed to achieve etc.
 
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How fast can 30-40 year old airframes and engines reach the original paper performance specifications of factory fresh new builds? Everything mechanically degrades over time, airframes age, engines will degrade and limits are placed on what that plane is allowed to achieve etc.

Actually overtime things are improved and replaced also.
 
How fast can 30-40 year old airframes and engines reach the original paper performance specifications of factory fresh new builds? Everything mechanically degrades over time, airframes age, engines will degrade and limits are placed on what that plane is allowed to achieve etc.
Well they performed as good as any front line fighter when they visited Indian Occupied Kashmir without benefit of a Visa.
 
How fast can 30-40 year old airframes and engines reach the original paper performance specifications of factory fresh new builds? Everything mechanically degrades over time, airframes age, engines will degrade and limits are placed on what that plane is allowed to achieve etc.

Hi.

Old aircraft are not like the village transport bus. If they fly---they are capable of doing the job they are sent to do.

The function of a fighter aircraft is different than that of a strike aircraft or a bomber aircraft.
 
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Well they performed as good as any front line fighter when they visited Indian Occupied Kashmir without benefit of a Visa.

It took 2 Mirages ( 1 with SOW and 1 to target ), additional JF17s and F16s to protect them to deliver just 1 SOW.......just 1.... a Rafale can deliver 2 SOW ( SCALPS ) and is capable of defending itself on the way in and out ...

When they visited IOK - the flaws in the Mirages were also exposed - it is incapable of targetting itself or defending itself and in a high intensity war when using SOWs - the flaws of the Mirage were also exposed alongside its success..

It is time to retire these relics and move onto J17s/J10Cs who have better capabilities to deliver SOW and to be able to defend themselves while doing it..
 
It took 2 Mirages ( 1 with SOW and 1 to target ), additional JF17s and F16s to protect them to deliver just 1 SOW.......just 1.... a Rafale can deliver 2 SOW ( SCALPS ) and is capable of defending itself on the way in and out ...

When they visited IOK - the flaws in the Mirages were also exposed - it is incapable of targetting itself or defending itself and in a high intensity war when using SOWs - the flaws of the Mirage were also exposed alongside its success..

It is time to retire these relics and move onto J17s/J10Cs who have better capabilities to deliver SOW and to be able to defend themselves while doing it..
Only role mirages are fit to do is delivering RAADs/nuclear payload

Thats pretty much it..two squardons should suffice..rest should bw retired
 
Only role mirages are fit to do is delivering RAADs/nuclear payload

Thats pretty much it..two squardons should suffice..rest should bw retired
What if you are able to carry out SEAD successfully(even in some sectors), then won't having more mirages as bomb trucks be favourable so as to not decrease the availability of the frontline fighters
 
The Need For Speed.
Mirages remain one of the fastest aircraft in PAF inventory.

View attachment 852914
It took 2 Mirages ( 1 with SOW and 1 to target ), additional JF17s and F16s to protect them to deliver just 1 SOW.......just 1.... a Rafale can deliver 2 SOW ( SCALPS ) and is capable of defending itself on the way in and out ...

When they visited IOK - the flaws in the Mirages were also exposed - it is incapable of targetting itself or defending itself and in a high intensity war when using SOWs - the flaws of the Mirage were also exposed alongside its success..

It is time to retire these relics and move onto J17s/J10Cs who have better capabilities to deliver SOW and to be able to defend themselves while doing it..
Where did I say anything about the capability of Mirages.
My post which you quoted only said about the aircraft's high speed.
 
It took 2 Mirages ( 1 with SOW and 1 to target ), additional JF17s and F16s to protect them to deliver just 1 SOW.......just 1.... a Rafale can deliver 2 SOW ( SCALPS ) and is capable of defending itself on the way in and out ...

When they visited IOK - the flaws in the Mirages were also exposed - it is incapable of targetting itself or defending itself and in a high intensity war when using SOWs - the flaws of the Mirage were also exposed alongside its success..

It is time to retire these relics and move onto J17s/J10Cs who have better capabilities to deliver SOW and to be able to defend themselves while doing it..
It took 4* mirages actually and were protected by F-16s.

Now in modern combat every strike package is supported by escort/sweep/OCA-A/OCA-G/SEAD/DEAD etc, irrespective of the aircraft. Yes you could argue that Mirages needed extra number of aircraft to defend them even JF-17s carrying ReK were escorted by other JF-17s. Indian M2Ks were also escorted by Su-30s and same applies for Rafaels. So you cannot declare Mirages to be useless on basis of this argument.

You think PAF wasn't aware of flaws of the Mirage? You think they never practiced same mission before? Of course they did, the issue is PAF doesn't have any suitable replacement for Mirage yet and that's why we are using them but mind it they did their job in the hour of need.

There's only one case (in modern history) of a strike aircraft (F-18) going all offensive and targeting threat aircraft successfully otherwise strike aircrafts always stick to their primary role and are defended by support aircraft.So once again, be it J-10/JF-17/F-16 or Rafael .. none will solely perform all the roles in a mission.

What if you are able to carry out SEAD successfully(even in some sectors), then won't having more mirages as bomb trucks be favourable so as to not decrease the availability of the frontline fighters
This statement is very vague. You didn't mention who will be performing SEAD. If Mirages, then I don't see them performing this role until last resort. We are yet to see any SEAD action from PAF but I expect JF-17s and MAYBE J-10s to perform this role (even though they have been acquired for different purpose).

If you meant any other aircraft other than Mirage, then what's Mirage got to do with the whole scenario? Except for it will be flying in the same package. Even if JF-17s are performing strike then they too will be needing SEAD aircraft as support. So availability of frontline fighters will remain same irrespective of which platform is performing the strike.
 
It took 2 Mirages ( 1 with SOW and 1 to target ), additional JF17s and F16s to protect them to deliver just 1 SOW.......just 1.... a Rafale can deliver 2 SOW ( SCALPS ) and is capable of defending itself on the way in and out ...

When they visited IOK - the flaws in the Mirages were also exposed - it is incapable of targetting itself or defending itself and in a high intensity war when using SOWs - the flaws of the Mirage were also exposed alongside its success..

It is time to retire these relics and move onto J17s/J10Cs who have better capabilities to deliver SOW and to be able to defend themselves while doing it..

Sorry, this post shows an ignorance of air combat ops. In every country and scenario and war (NATO, Red Flag, Gulf War), missions are run with combined teams, strike aircraft do not "defend themselves", if PAF wanted to it could of sent in F-16s armed with AMRAAMs and Paveways.

The moment a strike aircraft has to fight off enemy planes it has failed in it's primary mission. The PAF strike was textbook, and that is not just my opinion but held by some comentators worldwide.
 
I'm not impressed with these rose upgrades you might have increased capacity but most importantly it only can fire or drop few bombs limited cruise missile and air to air just magic and few old missiles
 
This statement is very vague. You didn't mention who will be performing SEAD
My judgement is that most of the SEAD ops will not be performed by airforces on both the sides. And what weapons pak uses depends on the escalation ladder.
I believe that if India uses Brahmos and Nirbhay then Pak will also use its CMs. If India brings out its tactical BMs(which both sides know are for conventional warheads) then Pak will also respond with TBMs to hit Indian installations. The cost of using airforces will be too high for just SEAD.
Also the mirages have been grouped in 50 "tactical" attack squadron. This clearly shows the role of mirages in the future apart from ALCM.
 
My judgement is that most of the SEAD ops will not be performed by airforces on both the sides. And what weapons pak uses depends on the escalation ladder.
I believe that if India uses Brahmos and Nirbhay then Pak will also use its CMs. If India brings out its tactical BMs(which both sides know are for conventional warheads) then Pak will also respond with TBMs to hit Indian installations. The cost of using airforces will be too high for just SEAD.
Also the mirages have been grouped in 50 "tactical" attack squadron. This clearly shows the role of mirages in the future apart from ALCM.
Can you please shed some light on what is your understanding of "SEAD"?
 

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