Beautiful Response to a Statement "Islam is not Peaceful"

[FaujHistorian]

There is no real Christianity left around the world.

I beg to disagree.

Christianity got smart and adjusted its role when it saw the wave of freedom and enlightenment sweeping through Western Europe. When the intellectuals pushed it out of the governments it didn't launch its version of Talib@stards and Hizbullah-cesspoolla.

That has allowed the Christian countries to become free from Popes, Ayatullahs, and Mullahs and thus progress and prosper by leaps and bounds.

Some small groups in Christianity still behave as anti-science and anti-freedom just like their medieval days, but luckily they get routed in the courts and by government laws.


Muslims countries in general and Pakistan in particular refuse to see this. We have our eyes shut, our ears closed. We are like village idiots laughing at the passing train, or worse dogs that bark at the passing car.

Many of our intellectuals equate intelligence of Christian societies with weakness.

And thus

we fail to emulate the successful implementation of kicking government and politicians out of our mosques.

This in turn makes our mosques a cesspool for 2-bit Mullahs and Ayatullahs f@rking our countries and our people.


And most Muslims are just too happy with being f@rked by Ayatullahs and Mullahs and their militant wings like Talib@stards and Hizbullah-cesspoolla.


And the worst thing we all do is that by doing all these terrible deeds, we bring bad name to beautiful and egalitarian religion of Islam.


peace

 

[notsuperstitious]

If, and ONLY IF Muslims care what others think, then their communication with others must not have Islamic references or basis, pls don't expect non muslims to think like you do. Talk to them like you would with other human beings.

I have this indian muslim friend who I like as a person but he attributes everything of that to his religion and tries to win me over. I don't have the heart to tell him I don't care.

 

[FaujHistorian]

The simple factor is.. Whether Islam is peaceful or not will be judged by the conduct of Muslims. A conduct that is recorded , re-recorded and not left in any sort of pure narrative. If for eg.. We are doubtful of the accounts of CNN or Fox News on the Iraq war and so on.. why cant we assume that there were similar reporting "ethics" in place back in those times as well. Where, massacres were disguised as error of judgement.. and where a liberation army has been accused of being invaders.
History is as those in power choose to tell it, and it is quite easily vetted by ensuring that academics vouch for it which makes it suddenly kosher. Eloquence of voice and prose will ensure that you may be able to convince a realist of surrealism that will be real to him. Phrases such as "Paranoia of Islam under siege" or "Violence is visible in Islamic history" are used to negate any defensive arguments with an encompassing ruse of being above the argument itself.

So, whole accounts of history, culture.. can be re-written into deriding a religion and its ethos so that those who have even the slightest of doubts feel ashamed of it. None more so are involved in these acts than the equivalent(to borrow a brilliant analogy by Mohsin Hamid) of Jannisaries in these times. Just as the Turks took these christian boys to raise them as Muslims.. today the opposite is happening.. and these western Muslims..the foreign educated.. are being turned into the Jannisaries of today. More paranoid and vitriolic than the harshest of external critique's.. these "Born-again" Jannisaries are convinced that they have seen a better light in the exorcism of Islam. It starts with critique of Muslim countries, then re-interpretation of Islam in a very abstruse manner that baffles even the most accommodating of scholars and practicing muslims alike.
The second front is the "home-grown" Islamic extremist, terrorist.. those that are born and bred in these countries. These promote the view that Islam is violent from the get-go regardless of the "modern" values and so on. Hence, it is a religion to be either cautiously avoided or committed genocide against in order to protect "our way of life".
So either , identify yourself as a Muslim who isnt one at all..a homosexual by choice who tattoo's Allah on his body.. or be prepared to be demonized by examples of criminals and demons who are bred in mosques where the Imam's preach hatred between sects on a regular basis and encourage no intelligence but total compliance to the clergy. Yet all of these may very well be dismissed as fanciful conspiracy theories..

It just depends on what you choose to believe in.. and you believe in something by researching it.. reading about it..
Perhaps all that there is ; is Paranoia about Islam under siege..

Or perhaps it truly is .. in a long, well thought out.. and very well executed siege.

How many surrealists will it take to decipher that question? Nutella

Well said. Thank you.


It is time we the Muslims learn how to be good citizens of whereever we live.

That means we should be known for the most truthful and most trustworthy lot.

If and when that happens, our way of life will be emulated by others.


However

If we behave like medieval Christians, then pretty much every modern European will hate our guts and hate our way of life.

Not because they hate Islam, but they absolutely hate Medieval Christianity.


I hope we all see this difference in their outlook.

peace

If, and ONLY IF Muslims care what others think, then their communication with others must not have Islamic references or basis, pls don't expect non muslims to think like you do. Talk to them like you would with other human beings.

I have this indian muslim friend who I like as a person but he attributes everything of that to his religion and tries to win me over. I don't have the heart to tell him I don't care.

Well said.

Muslims do not have patience to "convert" themselves to good global citizens,

and

yet

they want everyone else to get "converted".

Here lies the irony.


peace

 

[shuntmaster]

An easy way to gauge whether a religion is peaceful or not is to look at the life of its founder. To analyse whether Islam is peaceful, see whether Mohammed was a peaceful man..

 

[Joe Shearer]

It isn't Mehdi Hasan who comes out well in the debates, but @FaujHistorian.

 

[shuntmaster]

[video]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rh34Xsq7D_A[/video]

 

[FaujHistorian]

An easy way to gauge whether a religion is peaceful or not is to look at the life of its founder. To analyse whether Islam is peaceful, see whether Mohammed was a peaceful man..

This is not good.

If you make a mistake, a serious mistake, then you should be held responsible,

and NOT your granpa.

No one should go around and say Oh, Mehdi Hassan is a rapist or bank robber because his granpa was too.


Nothing personal.


I hope you see that we all are responsible for our actions,

No one should be allowed to say that he robbed the bank because of a person who existed One Thousand Four Hundred years ago.


p.s.
Let's not turn an ugly debate topic into an uglier one by attacking someone who is long gone long long long time ago.



peace to you.

May you live long and prosper

May you have great spiritual experience during this holy month.

Amen

 

[Armstrong]

@Oscar - Respect !

 

[RAMPAGE]

I asked a Question - @Marshmallow @RAMPAGE ?

sorry dude ! he's only a british national .....

 

[notsuperstitious]

The simple factor is.. Whether Islam is peaceful or not will be judged by the conduct of Muslims. A conduct that is recorded , re-recorded and not left in any sort of pure narrative. If for eg.. We are doubtful of the accounts of CNN or Fox News on the Iraq war and so on.. why cant we assume that there were similar reporting "ethics" in place back in those times as well. Where, massacres were disguised as error of judgement.. and where a liberation army has been accused of being invaders.
History is as those in power choose to tell it, and it is quite easily vetted by ensuring that academics vouch for it which makes it suddenly kosher. Eloquence of voice and prose will ensure that you may be able to convince a realist of surrealism that will be real to him. Phrases such as "Paranoia of Islam under siege" or "Violence is visible in Islamic history" are used to negate any defensive arguments with an encompassing ruse of being above the argument itself.

So, whole accounts of history, culture.. can be re-written into deriding a religion and its ethos so that those who have even the slightest of doubts feel ashamed of it. None more so are involved in these acts than the equivalent(to borrow a brilliant analogy by Mohsin Hamid) of Jannisaries in these times. Just as the Turks took these christian boys to raise them as Muslims.. today the opposite is happening.. and these western Muslims..the foreign educated.. are being turned into the Jannisaries of today. More paranoid and vitriolic than the harshest of external critique's.. these "Born-again" Jannisaries are convinced that they have seen a better light in the exorcism of Islam. It starts with critique of Muslim countries, then re-interpretation of Islam in a very abstruse manner that baffles even the most accommodating of scholars and practicing muslims alike.
The second front is the "home-grown" Islamic extremist, terrorist.. those that are born and bred in these countries. These promote the view that Islam is violent from the get-go regardless of the "modern" values and so on. Hence, it is a religion to be either cautiously avoided or committed genocide against in order to protect "our way of life".
So either , identify yourself as a Muslim who isnt one at all..a homosexual by choice who tattoo's Allah on his body.. or be prepared to be demonized by examples of criminals and demons who are bred in mosques where the Imam's preach hatred between sects on a regular basis and encourage no intelligence but total compliance to the clergy. Yet all of these may very well be dismissed as fanciful conspiracy theories..

It just depends on what you choose to believe in.. and you believe in something by researching it.. reading about it..
Perhaps all that there is ; is Paranoia about Islam under siege..

Or perhaps it truly is .. in a long, well thought out.. and very well executed siege.

How many surrealists will it take to decipher that question? Nutella

Is the question only for today's time? But if its religion then it can't be. And Muslims were the imperialist conquerors and used the practice of writing history the way they wanted for centuries and centuries.

Yet that history is not flattering, to be blunt. The massacres and destructions and slave taking and sikandar butshikans were not invented by today's popular media but by the muslim historians themselves. Qasim't history as recorded by muslims - to supposedly save a muslim woman's honor itself is not flattering, let alone the Persian historian who recorded it and showed qasim in horrible light. Nalanda destruction was not recorded by Fox news.

So if muslims care at all, they must discard their Islamic glasses first, do not expect non muslims to think like you, even one bit.

I've not said that very well, but I essentially agree with your post, if it means the onus is on muslims and not non muslims.

 

[FaujHistorian]

......
Yet that history is not flattering, to be blunt. The massacres and destructions and slave taking and sikandar butshikans .

My dear dear.

the only request I have is to Please Please use the year, the place, the geographical location when quoting an historical even, especially those that involve wholesale accusations.


Otherwise Islamists will continue quoting empty history
And their detractors will commit the same mistake.



As we discussed earlier, a debate without context is simply a bar room brawl or worse a "girl fight".


peace to you.

May you live long and prosper

May you have great spiritual experience during this holy month.

Amen

 

[RazPaK]

The kalay engraz have come out from their parent's basements wielding their keyboards.

 

[notsuperstitious]

My dear dear.

the only request I have is to Please Please use the year, the place, the geographical location when quoting an historical even, especially those that involve wholesale accusations.


Otherwise Islamists will continue quoting empty history
And their detractors will commit the same mistake.



As we discussed earlier, a debate without context is simply a bar room brawl or worse a "girl fight".


peace to you.

May you live long and prosper

May you have great spiritual experience during this holy month.

Amen

Sikandar Butshikan is a specific name, for example, he worked hand in hand with religious leaders.

That's enough to make the point I wanted to make, about victors writing history.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

this video has gone absolutely viral

what an intelligent and charismatic speaker; i have great respect for him


this is the way to argue and debate and present facts rather than burning cars, smashing things and screaming in the streets -- which is what the minority do (the minority who seem to garner most attention in media, unfortunately)

 

[RazPaK]

this video has gone absolutely viral

what an intelligent and charismatic speaker; i have great respect for him


this is the way to argue and debate and present facts rather than burning cars, smashing things and screaming in the streets -- which is what the minority do (the minority who seem to garner most attention in media, unfortunately)

The snubbing was great too.