Battles of 1971

[salman nedian]

Hey.. Who told you Bengalis are angels?? We live, we learn, we purify.. That is how it should be. Aint it?

Yes we should learn….at least now.

I cant see your flag(which emerged from our flag) in smilies so consider it waved up as well.

 

[toxic_pus]

I think, the readers of my previous post deserve an explanation for my comment about Hindu freedom fighters. 10 million Hindus fled to India from east Pakistan, but proportionately very few of them fought in 1971. This is history. My very intimate friend Debabrata Roy and some others fought in the war. But, the number of Hindu fighters were low. The reason may be that they were seeking to domicile in India.

I am stating this fact mostly on this context that some Pakistanis and our Razakar Gaddars here in this forum always blame India and our Hindus for the war. This was far from reality. It was the majority muslim population that were offended, who then took arms to fight the invaders. No offence was intended to our Hindus.

I will not separate the hindu from muslim in our liberation war and there is no need to play down the indian role either. but fact is
there were very few hindu freedom fighter but major brutality of Pakistani army was against the hindus.

Firstly, I would like to see one academic research - peer reviewed and published in a journal/publication which is generally considered to be reasonably neutral - which says that the freedom fighters consisted of lesser number of Hindus compared to their proportion in Bengali population.

Secondly, if at all it is true, that Hindus were less in number among the freedom fighters, it still doesn't dilute, in any way, the sacrifice that they made. It was only after the Pak army started to systematically exterminate the Hindus that the world opinion changed, that the refugee influx increased, that Pak lost the diplomatic game, that India could legally and morally help the freedom fighters.

If after a couple of weeks into the crackdown, Pak army had stopped its orgy of genocide, this whole independence of Bangladesh would have taken more time, perhaps even years.

As a cruel reminder, here is what was happening in Bangladesh:

Let me also give an excerpt of a letter written by Ms Gandhi to the President of US, Richard Nixon, on 13th May, 1971.

Until the 12th May, 1971, the number of fugitives who were registered on their crossing the border into India was 2,328,507. We believe that there is a fair number who have avoided registration. Refugees still continue to pour in at the rate of about fifty thousand a day. We are doing our utmost to look after them. But there is a limit to our capacity and resources. Even the attempt to provide minimum facilities of shelter, food and medical care is imposing an enormous burden on us. The rains have begun in the Eastern region and soon the fury of the monsoon will be unleashed and vastly complicate the problem of providing shelter to the evacuees. Apparently, Pakistan is trying to solve its internal problems by cutting down the size of its population in East Bengal and changing its communal composition through an organised and selective programme of eviction; but it is India that has to take the brunt of this.

Really, what difference does it make, if there were 'less' number of Hindu freedom fighters.

 

[khabib]

I think you are taking the issue towards another direction, which i respectfully did not challenge. I did not challenged that atrocities did not happen they off course happened, i had challenged the assumption of the figure as i said its just like how jews prove their 6 million dead from their accounts, no body says jews did not die, but people challenge the figure quoted, same way i am not challenging or showing any doubt about what happened, i doubt the figure which you or other quote of 3 million.

You have a very valid point and that is well respected. A lot number of people inside Bangladesh also question this 3/3.5million number. But, some how they are not brave enough to come forward with this.
December 20, 1971 time magazine article put the number to roughly 1 million. Please see for yourself:

The World: Bangladesh: Out of War, a Nation Is Born - TIME

Page # 8

End of the second paragraph.

One year ago last week, the Bengalis thronged the polls in Pakistan's first free nationwide election, only to see their overwhelming mandate to Mujib brutally reversed by West Pakistani soldiers. That crackdown took a terrible toll: perhaps 1,000,000 dead, 10 million refugees, untold thousands homeless, hungry and sick.

Read more: The World: Bangladesh: Out of War, a Nation Is Born - TIME

 

[TopCat]

Firstly, I would like to see one academic research - peer reviewed and published in a journal/publication which is generally considered to be reasonably neutral - which says that the freedom fighters consisted of lesser number of Hindus compared to their proportion in Bengali population.

Secondly, if at all it is true, that Hindus were less in number among the freedom fighters, it still doesn't dilute, in any way, the sacrifice that they made. It was only after the Pak army started to systematically exterminate the Hindus that the world opinion changed, that the refugee influx increased, that Pak lost the diplomatic game, that India could legally and morally help the freedom fighters.

If after a couple of weeks into the crackdown, Pak army had stopped its orgy of genocide, this whole independence of Bangladesh would have taken more time, perhaps even years.

As a cruel reminder, here is what was happening in Bangladesh:

Let me also give an excerpt of a letter written by Ms Gandhi to the President of US, Richard Nixon, on 13th May, 1971.



Really, what difference does it make, if there were 'less' number of Hindu freedom fighters.

This can not be a subject of discussion nor does it has any importance. Its not only the people who faught with guns and bullets but every citizen who wanted a free country are freedom fighters. My salute goes towards all hindus who suffered and sacrificed most in our freedom struggle. My sympathy also goes towards non Bengalis who were supported or misguided by the W. Pakistanis and later abandoned by them and at the end became the biggest looser of 1947 and 1971.

 

[TaimiKhan]

You have a very valid point and that is well respected. A lot number of people inside Bangladesh also question this 3/3.5million number. But, some how they are not brave enough to come forward with this.
December 20, 1971 time magazine article put the number to roughly 1 million. Please see for yourself:

The World: Bangladesh: Out of War, a Nation Is Born - TIME

Page # 8

End of the second paragraph.

One year ago last week, the Bengalis thronged the polls in Pakistan's first free nationwide election, only to see their overwhelming mandate to Mujib brutally reversed by West Pakistani soldiers. That crackdown took a terrible toll: perhaps 1,000,000 dead, 10 million refugees, untold thousands homeless, hungry and sick.

Read more: The World: Bangladesh: Out of War, a Nation Is Born - TIME

Sir, hardly just few days had passed since the war ended, the whole new country was in war, and martial law and curfews were imposed, definitely movement of journalists and foreign journalists must have been restricted to certain areas or none so ever allowed, how the hell could Time research those figures in a all this chaos and just in few days when everyone was mourning their dead ones or celebrating their liberation ??

Can a Bangladesh Govt inquiry or report or a commission report link be provided to see what figure the Govt quoted after the Independence ?? There must have been something done, as in one of the above posts one of our members quoted that when Mujeeb's govt asked people to enter claims for their dead ones, only 92,000 peoples claims got submitted which included claims of pro-pakistan razakars too, so with such low number of claims the Govt hushed hushed the matter as it may have shown the real number of people who died. So plz can anyone provide a detailed report by government claiming the number of people killed.

 

[toxic_pus]

This can not be a subject of discussion nor does it has any importance. Its not only the people who faught with guns and bullets but every citizen who wanted a free country are freedom fighters. My salute goes towards all hindus who suffered and sacrificed most in our freedom struggle. My sympathy also goes towards non Bengalis who were supported or misguided by the W. Pakistanis and later abandoned by them and at the end became the biggest looser of 1947 and 1971.

Precisely my point.

Glad we agree on at least one thing.

 

[Al-zakir]

I don’t know what makes you think this is right by any means. I know only one thing Pakistan is not your enemy neither it was. So stop hating Pakistan and lets forgive each other. Remembering these bitter events will only give chance to our common enemy to laugh at us

No point telling salman bhai. Some Bengali minded Bangladeshi will never get it.

 

[Al-zakir]

Mutiur Rehman .

What did this guy done to deserve war hero status in 71 when he did not even participate in the war except got killed while killing another fellow Muslim.

 

[Coolyo]

MUST WATCH ZAID HAMID'S VIDEO:

 

[gromell]

No you can’t salute both of them. Ask any Aalim what he would call a Muslim who wants his Muslim brother to become a slave of Non-Muslim army.

a munafik is worse than a kafir. The assassin of Usman(peace be upon him) was supposed to be a muslim. Both side of Battle of Karbala were muslims too. If everyone wanted to keep Muslim unity intact for the cost of justice, then Imam Hasan and Hussein(peace be upon them) would not have raised any voice against Yazid.

Bir Shrestho Matiur rahman was fighting for justice and a fair cause. Sheikh Mujib and his followers did not want to divide the Pakistan they fought for, more than any West Pakistanis. They wanted to establish justice and equal rights and West Pakistanis pushed for it. No where in Islam tells us to stay silent in that situation. Enough was enough.

 

[sonicboom]

You are contradicting yourself. You are saying west pakistani civilian getting killed in erstwhile East Pakistan was a bigger event by the measure of the volumes killed than the Bengali victims. but then you are concluding by condoling us that to secede, a nation has to pay higher price! so which one is true!?! I never imagined I'd have to hear that from a sane human being during my life time. This is like saying Pakistan army lets say was comprised of Bengali personnels alone(just the opposite of 71) and they invaded West Pakistan and fought a war for nine months against a non-militarized West pakistani public and then when they were defeated by India we have higher casualty rate for Bengali civilian than west pakistani civilian in west Pakistan where the Bengali civilian were less than 1% of the west pakistani population. I know that I am never going to claim such absurdity because that defies every single logic out there. I just don't understand why would any "Bangladesh commission"(i dont know where u got that name from) claim 2000 people came forward when the Pakistani Hamoudur Rahman commission after 1971 reported 26000 Bengali civilian dead (which is of course the edited Pakistani version to save some honour of the Pak army) and mass rape occurrence by the Pakistani army, and in one incident a top brass raping women when his troops were bombarded by the Indian and Bengali troops at the closing stage of the war! therefore, you are not only contradicting your logic of argument but you are coming up with vehemently false facts to justify your distorted views.

3 million Bengalis were killed. That's fact and figure. Your saying two thousand people came forward is the ugliest lie I have ever heard. 3 millions were killed and the information collected by us is authentic whether or not you believe it sitting back in Pakistan The mass graves were not the only place where Pakistani army dumped the deads. Mass graves were mainly for the intellectuals, the students and hindus killed by the Pakistani army in 26th of March and 14-16 December. They often shot individuals dead near the rivers, which are plenty in Bangladesh. I can imagine that being from Pakistan it is not easy for you to imagine such geographical features.

Mukti bahini soldiers and officers were some of the highest trained military personnel of your army and some of them won the highest gallantry awards during 65 war against India. So you are saying you guys render highest awards to personnel who have objectionable morals?! This mukti bahini fighters along with Bengali civilian fighters were from the simplest of the homes of Bengal and most of them were not even involved in the politics. They went to the war against all odds, sometimes even not telling their mothers in case they stop them from going to the war for the fear of their sons' lives. These people had no dream but to liberate Bangladesh and her people. Why would they kill the same people who supported them?!!! Did you even take one second to contemplate the grave remarks you are making against mukti bahini here? The intellectuals were killed during 26th of March and 14 December mainly in Dhaka or major cities. All these times the cities, specially Dhaka were fully under Pakistan Army's control. Mukti bahini was not even formed in 26th of March and Bengali military and police personnel were busy saving their own lives without any weapon(as they were taken away by Pakistan Army before 26th March) against the brutal attack of Pakistan Army on the barracks containing sleeping Bengali soldiers. On December 14, Dhaka was under Pakistani occupation and Mukti bahini was with Indian army outside Dhaka preparing to enter Dhaka. So the atrocities were committed by Pakistan Army. Let the truth prevail.

Comparing Nazi with Pakistan Army is an insult to the greatest fighting machine of the 2nd world war. Russians, Americans raped more women in 2nd world war than the Nazis. German Wehrmacht was one of the better behaved army in the 2nd world war and their treatment of POW was the fairest. During 1st world war, famous Belgian women spying for the Entente told the world the honour with which they were treated in the German prison. Germans were the highest trained, the best man to man fighting force of the both world wars and I do not see the point of your comparing Pakistan army with them. Nazis did not even kill 6 million jews. that's a Zionist propaganda. That does not underestimate the number of civilians killed during 2nd world war though because jews were not the only victims of the world war. The total civilian dead during 5 years were 49 milion in world war two, not 6 million. so 7.35 million civilian died in every 9 months during 2nd world war. out of which 6 million/nine month were allied civilian casualty. so you see, in 1971 Pakistan army was much less brutal, if that relieves you a bit, by only killing 3 million Bengalis, at less than half the rate of the Axis army in 2nd world war

Yes we have proofs of the ones who were killed. The bodies were in Bangladesh, at the place of their death, sometimes taken a further few kilometers from the place of the death by the Pakistani Army to bury them all in mass graves. According to Muslim rule, the dead must be buried as soon as possible. Sometimes they were thrown at the river where the fish had eaten the rotten flesh and sometimes dogs and foxes had eaten away the deads on the land. Pakistani army atrocities brought back the once extinct vulture species Gyps indicus in Bangladesh to feed on the dead Bengali civilians lying on everywhere. There is not a single relative of mine who did not witness a dead body killed by Pakistani army during 71. Did you expect us to preserve the bones and dead bodies till now so that a sonicboom from Pakistan questions the validity of the truth 40 years after the incident and we ought to show him the bones? Well, I am sorry, we weren't that big of a visionary

Bengalis never betrayed anyone, let alone betraying themselves. It was always invaders, let it be, the wondering Arab opportunists, or the British colonialists or the Hindu landlord class. Mir Jafar was an arab who betrayed the nawab of Bengal. Pakistanis were the betrayers during 47-71 by pretending to be muslim brothers but doing the worst form of zulum , dishonesty and terror. There was nothing Islamic in the way West Pakistani treated Bengalis. Talking about BDR incident, BDR was not part of the army. SO Bangladesh Army were not betrayed by its own soldiers. Not a single Bangladesh Army soldier rebelled in the incident. But then in what face do you even talk about such incidents happening in Bangladesh when unspeakable things are happening in Pakistan?! how come Muslims are scared of going to the masjid in Islamic Republic of Pakistan nowadays?! how come a Pakistani muslim blows himself up in a jumma prayer?! what have your security forces done to the public that there is probably one attack on their training camp each week?! man from outside Pakistan, as a non-pakistani it is hard to grasp who is betraying whom in Pakistan! Actually you are right, we Bengalis were lucky to have got away from you guys in 1971 with just 3 million deads. Because even if it had to take the whole 70 million Bengalis to liberate Bangladesh from West Pakistan, we would have done it. It is Allah's rahmat that we got away with 3/70*100%=4.3% of our population earning the glory of being shaheed in the jihad against oppression. alhamdulillah

Part A

First of all, I had asked you the following 2 things:

1. Recognize the fact that mass killings were committed by the EPR, EBR and Muki bahini before the army action.

2. Provide the proof for 3 million killings.

You totally avoided both and kept on beating about the bushes in your 9 yard long meaningless post except for your half heartedly acceptance of 26000 killings as stated by the Hamood ur Rehamsn’s report. You seem to have a one track mind and can’t see the other side of the picture.

Secondly, you should be thankful to owner of this forum and all the moderators who are letting you rehash and dump all this nonsense without any proof and facts.


Now, let me show you the other side of the picture:

Initial thoughts:

While the killings were unfortunate but blaming it purely on the Pakistan Army alone is very one-sided. Pakistan Army in any case was a very late entrant in the drama. By the time they took action, massive number of West Pakistani soldiers, their families, civilians and non Bengalis were already killed by Indian created and trained Mukti Bahini, deserters form the East Pakistan Rifles and the East Bengal Regiment. The killings even continued months after surrender of Pakistan Army.

Why are we forgetting brutal fascist Mukti Bahni, who call people in a ground and killing ceremony was done like a live show. It’s all available on the internet.

It’s easy to look back at the past and pass judgment, but life was hell for Pakistani solders and their supporters in Bangladesh. It does not matter how you perceive it, but you have to understand that it was a treason and the punishment for treason is death. You can’t expect to cut off a country into two halves and expect from the Government not to do anything about it.


Killings of Pakistani and non Bengalis in East Pakistan

A quote from a Pakistani:

“I do hear and read lot about Bengalis being killed by either Pakistan army or their so called collaborators but what I failed to understand after 38 years how come no one ever mentions hundred of thousand non-Bengalis who were killed mercilessly by Bengalis. I was a child at that time and my family used to live in Dinajpur. I saw hundreds if not thousand of people killed including my own grand parents. My mother side of the family lost all seven family members. I am sure I am not the only person who used to live in Dinajpur’s New Town and still alive. I know of lot of people who can tell you the same story. Who started all this? Who were they? In my opinion since Bengalis were majority in than East Pakistan they were the one who started all this. Since Bengalis were no match to Pakistan army they and their agents killed thousands of people all over East Pakistan. In my own town thousand were killed from March 28th though April 13th 1971. I am sure lot of people can verify this as they were eye witness to all this horrific crimes. Arshad”


INTERNMENT CAMPS OF BANGLADESH by Loraine Mirza, an American born Journalist

Armed Awami League supporters, their ranks swelled by students and deserters from the army and police, went on a rampage in East Pakistan, in which tens of thousands of non-Bengalis, at least 25,000 or more, were butchered between January and March 1971. The victims included the Urdu-speaking people (Biharis) as well as officials and their families from West Pakistan.

But the story of the Bihari Muslims is far more serious and tragic. Branded as 'traitors' by the Bengalis, they were tormented, terrorized and shoved into 66 squalid camps in Bangladesh after the Pakistan army surrendered to the invading Indian army on December 16, 1971.

It is interesting to note that the same people who were complaining of being victims of a genocide, started themselves a horrifying genocide against helpless people called Biharis.


Now back to some of the allegations of mass killing and rapes by the Pakistan Army.


Allegation of Mass Killings of Bengalis:

US State Department conference

The historian branch of the State Department held a two-day conference on June 28 and 29 on US policy in South Asia between 1961 and 1972, inviting scholars from India, Pakistan and Bangladesh to express their views on the declassified documents.

During the seminar, Bangladeshi scholars acknowledged that their official figure of more than 3 million killed during the military action was not authentic.

They said that the original figure was close to 300,000, which was wrongly translated from Bengali into English as three million.

Shamsher M. Chowdhury, the Bangladesh ambassador in Washington who was commissioned in the Pakistan Army in 1969 but had joined his country’s war of liberation in 1971, acknowledged that Bangladesh alone cannot correct this mistake. Instead, he suggested that Pakistan and Bangladesh form a joint commission to investigate the 1971 disaster and prepare a report.

Almost all scholars agreed that the real figure was somewhere between 26,000, as reported by the Hamoodur Rahman Commission, and not three million, the official figure put forward by Bangladesh and India.

William J. Drummond, Los Angeles Times Staff writer

William J. Drummond, who later became Professor of Journalism at Berkeley, debunked stories about the genocide of three million Bengalis, a lie endlessly repeated even by Mujib.

And did you read the post # 180 and 193?


Allegation of Mass Rapes:

Prof Sarmila Bose, an Indian academic

She told the seminar that allegations of Pakistani army personnel raping Bengali women were grossly exaggerated.

INTERNMENT CAMPS OF BANGLADESH by Loraine Mirza

The allegation of mass rapes of one million Bengali women by 83,000 Pakistani soldiers, impregnating 200,000 in a matter of a few weeks, was circulated endlessly. How an army in the midst of an insurgency had time for such activity is mind-boggling.

Loraine Mirza debunks these myths admirably. When she arrived in Bangladesh in 1986, she found abortion clinics, set up in 1972 ostensibly to cater to the rape victims, were still doing brisk business. Several clinics were opened by an American, Dr Harvey Carmen, who turned out to be not a medical doctor but a sociologist, as Ms Mirza reports (p.57). Women allegedly 'raped' by Pakistani soldiers in 1971 still needed abortions 15 years later!

There were accusations that were reported in the world wide western press and media of alleged rapes by the Pakistan Army. However, it has been proven without a doubt by meself, in interviewing thousands on both sides, and corroborated by William Drummond of the Los Angles Times, that this was gross exaggerations.

Professor Sarmila Bose

The most scientific of all proofs has come from a Bengali, herself. Professor Sarmila Bose, from George Washington State University, USA, has done research on the 1971 War.

In all of the incidents involving the Pakistan army in the case-studies, the armed forces were found not to have raped women. While this cannot be extrapolated beyond the specific incidents in this study, it is significant, as in many cases the allegation of rape was made along with allegations of killing in prior verbal discussions or in some cases even in written form in the Bengali literature. However, when Bengali eye-witnesses, participants and survivors of the incidents were interviewed they testified to the violence and killings, but also testified that no rape had taken place.

Another quote

"Talking to people on Bangladesh, 1971 gets very very circular after a bit. It boils down to this. There is no evidence of mass genocide or mass raping, though I have no doubt some war crimes were committed, since they happen in any war, especially if discipline breaks down in the ranks or you have some undisciplined soldiers. This is not at all uncommon. You will find every single war has had breaks of the Geneva Conventions. It's as much to do with training a soldier to kill and manipulate their minds if need be so that they're filled with hatred for their enemy that will cause some to act out like that."


Liers Exposed:

Then there are all the reporters like Aubrey Menon, the Indian-Irishman, or Simon Dring, the reporter who got a nice job owning his own Bangladeshi TV channel, financed by the Awami League; he's the one who reported all the mass killings of Bangladeshis.

These can hardly be called creditable witnesses. I know that war crimes happened, but none presents any evidence for the scale of war crimes you claim occurred. It's all just empty words until you find some solid proof.


Key actors

The most important fact is that the three main characters died brutal un-natural deaths (lets call it divine justice)i.e. Sh.mujib-ur-rahman, mr.zulfiqar ali bhutto and mrs. Indira gandhi.

It did not take long for retribution to come from the Providence to avenge this horrific bloodshed in which several thousands (and not Millions for God’s sake) lost their lives. All the key players met unexpected deaths very soon by their own people.

Sheikh Mujib Rehman and his all family members except Sheikh Hasina were eliminated by his own army in their diamond house.

Indira Gandhi and her two sons Sanjay and Rajiv died violently.

Zulfiqar Bhutto got hanged, his eldest son Murtaza got murdered and younger son Shahnawaz died of poisoning. His daughter Benazir was killed in a suicide attack.



And lastly, as a Pakistani I say this unequivocally that I am truly happy for Bangladeshi’s for getting their deserved freedom.

In the end I shall request all readers to offer a little prayer for all those people who lost their precious lives to this insane conflict.

This was all from printed media. In part B, I will share some of my personal observations.

 

[eastwatch]

Sir, hardly just few days had passed since the war ended, the whole new country was in war, and martial law and curfews were imposed, definitely movement of journalists and foreign journalists must have been restricted to certain areas or none so ever allowed, how the hell could Time research those figures in a all this chaos and just in few days when everyone was mourning their dead ones or celebrating their liberation ??

Can a Bangladesh Govt inquiry or report or a commission report link be provided to see what figure the Govt quoted after the Independence ?? There must have been something done, as in one of the above posts one of our members quoted that when Mujeeb's govt asked people to enter claims for their dead ones, only 92,000 peoples claims got submitted which included claims of pro-pakistan razakars too, so with such low number of claims the Govt hushed hushed the matter as it may have shown the real number of people who died. So plz can anyone provide a detailed report by government claiming the number of people killed.

I believe the death figure was Time's own estimation. It does not have to be true. But, the fact remains that there was a genocide by the Pakistan army. Even 1 lakh to 3 lakh figure is very large. There was a time when the total population of many countries was less than this. It was unnecessary killings of innocent people. Kijilbash Yahya opted for a military solution to a political problem, and fell in his own trap.

 

[TaimiKhan]

I believe the death figure was Time's own estimation. It does not have to be true. But, the fact remains that there was a genocide by the Pakistan army. Even 1 lakh to 3 lakh figure is very large. There was a time when the total population of many countries was less than this. It was unnecessary killings of innocent people. Kijilbash Yahya opted for a military solution to a political problem, and fell in his own trap.

Even 1 innocent death is regrettable and not allowed to go easily, but i have seen lot of hatred in Bangladeshi eyes and nearly everyone quotes these millions figures, all i need is a govt researched approx figure so that we should know how many in reality died, as if the millions figure proves to be a lie, then why it is still quoted and also it shows the real intent of those who had quoted those figures initially as they used this figure of their own people killed for exploitation.

 

[TaimiKhan]

Matiur Rahman was joining the war risking his whole family. He was going to participate in the Jihad against Pakistani oppression, zulum and brutality against Bengali Muslims and minority. Rashid Minhaz was not smart enough to realize that and he acted immaturely and they both died. Matiur Rahman is a shaheed in the cause of Islam because Islam tells us to join in the struggle against oppression.

He was taking the aircraft to India and not to East Pakistan to fight, plus it was a trainer aircraft not a fighter. If he was so much interested in the Jihad, should have taken another route to East Pakistan or India. Taking PAF aircraft to India was/is an act performed by traitors only.

And the person whom you called immature and not so smart was a much better person compared to that traitor, and knowing that he was gonna die and still took the aircraft to the ground needs a very large set of balls to perform such action and people mature enough and smart enough knowing the consequences do such actions to not let his country down.

And Bangladesh giving him their highest bravery medal was not for acknowledging his attempt, rather as a counter to what we gave Rashid Minhas for showing extreme bravery. As Mati Ur Rehman showed no bravery in stealing the aircraft nor he took the aircraft to the ground, i bet he must have pissed in his pants once he saw the aircraft nose dive towards the earth.

Next time show some respect to the martyrs of another nations hero.

If we are letting you post on this forum with all this anti-pakistan unsubstantiated BS, it doesn't means you come here and disrespect our war heroes.

 

[Patriot]

The Bengali continue to amuse me.They continue to rant about their 3 million killed like Jews do about holocaust.Unfortunately for them, nobody in the world gives a **** about Bengali's being killed except Bengali's themselves and as far as Mati Ur Rehman is concerned..how the **** is he hero?He was trusted with the defense of this nation and given the Pakistani uniform. Despite what was happening in East Pakistan, this Bengali officer, like so many others was still trusted with expensive equipment and the honor of PAF and the country.He stole air craft from PAKISTAN AIR FORCE and then not only stole air craft also put a life of HIS student on the line.As far as the action of Rashid Minhas is concerned well that's the kind of Spirit PAF Pilots have.Mati-ur-Rehman was thawed by a simple duty bound teenager and his student. .On a side note, I guess recently BDR was also doing Jihad against officers of Bangladeshi Army....Rashid Minhas did what any other officer of a professional organization would have done.