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Asoka Chakra, Chanakya and RAW

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Let me bring you down from thin air, we didn't have any problem until US invaded Afghanistan, but it's a chain reaction, however in this connection no one blames merely Talibans who were exclusive to Afghanistan. Problems are seldom indigenous until and unless there is an out side connection. Epic Fail.

Mr.Jammer..pleasse dont equate protests and demonstrations by some fringe groups to support the Sri Lankan tamils in their quest for a separate Eelam as a insurgency against India.Their protest and demonstration was against Mahinda Rajapaksa and his lankan army.

And that was just protests and demonstrations wen the LTTE was there.Now its finished.

please dont equate that with Pakistan.The analogy is way off if not downright absurd.

Now whose fall was it.?;)
 
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Great now your obsession with Tamil Nadu is over that you are going for the sepretist movement of Gujrat??PM we when you reach Kerala..i want to know the sepretists movements in my state :pop:

So this thread is gonna be the longest thread in the history of PDF (27 states* 27 pages..)

New world record....All Hail WJ....:yahoo:
 
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Mr.Jammer..pleasse dont equate protests and demonstrations by some fringe groups to support the Sri Lankan tamils in their quest for a separate Eelam as a insurgency against India.Their protest and demonstration was against Mahinda Rajapaksa and his lankan army.

And that was just protests and demonstrations wen the LTTE was there.Now its finished.

please dont equate that with Pakistan.The analogy is way off if not downright absurd.

Now whose fall was it.?;)
You are already on the floor since you were decisively proven wrong for which no resentment is forthcoming hence lack of shame.
Since then you are running around like a headless chicken, well let me give it to you again. The paragraph that turned you giddy from the whole article since TN appeared in it.
Unfortunately RAW continues to engage in disinformation campaigns, espionage and sabotage against Pakistan and other neighbouring countries. On the other hand the RAW failed in dealing with separatist movements in Manipur and Tripura in the northeast, Tamil Nadu in the south and Punjab and Kashmir in the northwestern part of the country.
And the article itself.

Whatever was written in the article wasn't my initiative, to supplement this, i also posted other sources which prove to the effect as insurgency in TN, however habitually you live in denial thus proving to be a bad loser indeed, in fact you are serious loser as i have also proven you completely out of touch with the Dalits issue alas KS you are out of count. done and dusted. Period.
 
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So this thread is gonna be the longest thread in the history of PDF (27 states* 27 pages..)

New world record....All Hail WJ....:yahoo:

All hail to you for being in denial, but hey don't just celebrate yet sine the longest thread in PDF history was also started by me on a small note.
But hey, just like you, your country fellows were blowing hot and cold and eventually settled down like dust. The thread went to almost 300 pages so you know which corner you are standing. :victory:


http://www.defence.pk/forums/members-club/52503-sania-mirza-marry-shoaib-malik.html
 
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OMG im not able to resist this...but both the links u gave describe the LTTE problem..they r also tamils..but in Srilanka..
.please go thru the page and u can see that its just precautions and protests in Tamil Nadu against the Congress Govt's support to the Sri Lankan govt against LTTE by some fringe organisations.

So moral high ground is mine now.
And from on PM me..we can continue our sweet discussion over there.
Just would like to add a bit.

Precautions and protests in a democratically and constitutionally allowed way, and people who spoke a bit too much and people who were going above the law by creating mishaps were arrested by the TN govt.

And those protests were not for a seperate country, but a mere dissatisfication that Central government is supporting Srilankan govt in their fight against LTTE.
 
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You are already on the floor since you were decisively proven wrong for which no resentment is forthcoming hence lack of shame.
Since then you are running around like a headless chicken, well let me give it to you again. The paragraph that turned you giddy from the whole article since TN appeared in it. And the article itself.


Whatever was written in the article wasn't my initiative, to supplement this, i also posted other sources which prove to the effect as insurgency in TN, however habitually you live in denial thus proving to be a bad loser indeed, in fact you are serious loser as i have also proven you completely out of touch with the Dalits issue alas KS you are out of count. done and dusted. Period.

You are going around in circles by posting the article which has been already dicussed, save us the overhead, now start going through this thread from your post in post #106 of this thread again till you understand (I don't think you can). And then, only then I recommend you to reply.

Here let me help you, click the following link.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/14635-asoka-chakra-chanakya-raw-8.html#post862220
 
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You are already on the floor since you were decisively proven wrong for which no resentment is forthcoming hence lack of shame.
Since then you are running around like a headless chicken, well let me give it to you again. The paragraph that turned you giddy from the whole article since TN appeared in it. And the article itself.


Whatever was written in the article wasn't my initiative, to supplement this, i also posted other sources which prove to the effect as insurgency in TN, however habitually you live in denial thus proving to be a bad loser indeed, in fact you are serious loser as i have also proven you completely out of touch with the Dalits issue alas KS you are out of count. done and dusted. Period.

I gotta tell you dear, You are damn good at what you are doing here for quite a while, that is - Frustrating people with your endlessly irritating flavour of posts.


For fellow Indians: He is trying to say there are 1199999999 Insurgents in India out of a population of 1.2 Billion Indians, that is, every indian is insurging upon every other indian ! In a way he is saying the same thing - there are no insurgents among Indians. We call it family trouble, nothing more.

Now stop feeding him your brain cells. Let him be victorious.
 
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I gotta tell you dear, You are damn good at what you are doing here for quite a while, that is - Frustrating people with your endlessly irritating flavour of posts.


For fellow Indians: He is trying to say there are 1199999999 Insurgents in India out of a population of 1.2 Billion Indians, that is, every indian is insurging upon every other indian ! In a way he is saying the same thing - there are no insurgents among Indians. We call it family trouble, nothing more.

Now stop feeding him your brain cells. Let him be victorious.


There is no point in arguing with him. Some people just dont want to listen.
 
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Since it takes half a dozen of you to make a point, why don't you make an effort and comprehend what the issue is here, i merely posted a narrative, the character KS accused me of writing the article and demanded a link to it, which i duly provided and several others for that matter. Is it my indigenous claim ? the author(s) claim there is insurgency in Tamil Nadu in their articles. My argument stands as ever that the information is relayed as a source but you people only observe a flag without any soul searching hence instead of some of you playing arm pit music and dancing in a circle, make an effort to see the light.
But i am sure that's not an impossibility.
 
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Since it takes half a dozen of you to make a point, why don't you make an effort and comprehend what the issue is here, i merely posted a narrative, the character KS accused me of writing the article and demanded a link to it, which i duly provided and several others for that matter. Is it my indigenous claim ? the author(s) claim there is insurgency in Tamil Nadu in their articles. My argument stands as ever that the information is relayed as a source but you people only observe a flag without any soul searching hence instead of some of you playing arm pit music and dancing in a circle, make an effort to see the light.
But i am sure that's not an impossibility.

Ok dear, Agreed that you got your hands over an article claiming there is Insurgency in TN. Not your fault. But why are you trying so vehemently to prove that the article is right and people living in TN are wrong & dont know about it? The article can also be wrong yar, more so when the author's credentials are on question. After all, articles are no more than the author's personal opinion if not backed by reliable sources.

For example, I may say that there is no sea shore in Bombay (I read somewhere, I can provide the link to the article too which say the same), but everybody living in Mumbai know that its not true, no matter how much I confront them with the article reference. The fact is that - Bombay mentioned in that article is a Mohallah in New York sub-urb.

BTW, dont take the example literally, I just want to drive home the point that - nobody know about the home better than the inmates. If you are so convinced that insurgency exists in TN, then at least dont try to force your conviction on us.

Lets make a truce here, cease fire of sorts - " For Indian members who know, there is no insurgencyin TN, fow WJ and a handful of others (including the author) TN is insurgency hit area.

Peace??
 
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Ok dear, Agreed that you got your hands over an article claiming there is Insurgency in TN. Not your fault. But why are you trying so vehemently to prove that the article is right and people living in TN are wrong & dont know about it? The article can also be wrong yar, more so when the author's credentials are on question. After all, articles are no more than the author's personal opinion if not backed by reliable sources.

For example, I may say that there is no sea shore in Bombay (I read somewhere, I can provide the link to the article too which say the same), but everybody living in Mumbai know that its not true, no matter how much I confront them with the article reference. The fact is that - Bombay mentioned in that article is a Mohallah in New York sub-urb.

BTW, dont take the example literally, I just want to drive home the point that - nobody know about the home better than the inmates. If you are so convinced that insurgency exists in TN, then at least dont try to force your conviction on us.

Lets make a truce here, cease fire of sorts - " For Indian members who know, there is no insurgencyin TN, fow WJ and a handful of others (including the author) TN is insurgency hit area.

Peace??
Yaar, i wasn't forcing my views on no body, neither most of us on the forum are in such a position, firstly i was accused of orchestrating the article which i duly proved wrong with several links some even written by Indian oriented sources, then the sad issue of Dalits came up and i also proved that decisively with a reality check much closer to some one's heart, in desperation the member KS went on a digression spree, well hell hath and no fury, a childhood saying comes into mind ,
The aroma of a ripe fruit and the smell of dead mice can't be contained. :cheers:
 
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Yaar, i wasn't forcing my views on no body, neither most of us on the forum are in such a position, firstly i was accused of orchestrating the article which i duly proved wrong with several links some even written by Indian oriented sources, then the sad issue of Dalits came up and i also proved that decisively with a reality check much closer to some one's heart, in desperation the member KS went on a digression spree, well hell hath and no fury, a childhood saying comes into mind ,
The aroma of a ripe fruit and the smell of dead mice can't be contained. :cheers:

Clearly, he was not as convinced as you are.Sometimes we should mutually agree to disagree. Anyways, let be gone bygone. Lets close this thread which was meant to invite trolls (read the thread heading).

Nothing more is left here to discuss. Mods, Puhleeez close this thread.
 
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Lets close this thread which was meant to invite trolls (read the thread heading).

I beg to disagree. Read carefully the opening article it has a great deal of substance.
 
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I beg to disagree. Read carefully the opening article has a great deal of substance.

Go ahead then, Keep yourself feeding on that "Substance" if that makes you high.

Gudbye & gudluck from my side.
 
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Indian Foreign Policy Doctrine: Way of Chanakya Kautilya

by Ahson Malick on November 1, 2009


It was a scene from ancient Bharat, the emperor Chundergupt Moriya and his generals were trying to act like a bunch of care full listeners to a man who was addressing to the council, his name was Chanakya, explaining the policy matter, defining the ruler’s version, ideas of expansions, analysis of the invasions, when policy debate comes towards neighbors, Chanakiya scratches his bald head and with a cruel smile says “your neighbor is your worst enemy but the neighbor of your neighbor is your friend“, sardonically it is the founding principle of Indian foreign policy. India’s 1st PM Mr. Jawaher lal Nehru is said to be a big fan of Chanakiya and his famous “arthshastra” which is considered a bit like “art of war” by Sun Tzu (China) in some extent as both books are considered as pioneer scriptures for the rulers, (one being adopted by Indians and other seemed to be by U.S as poor fellows in U.S have only killings of native Americans substantial enough to talk about in terms of culture, heritage and work of art) while adopting arthshastra as the policy guide line Mr. Nehru needed to revive the ancient concept of “Dharma chakra”, RAW was fond, and RAW revived this particular concept for them. The author of Arthshastra Kautilya AKA Chanakya was the advisor and pioneer of the major policy designs of Indian Emperor Chandragupta Moriya, as Chief Minister, he was just too flourishing who developed a systematic strategy of destabilizing and weakening neighboring states around 320 B.C in order to strengthen the emperor’s rule over the region and provide justifications of having as large army as he happened to poss at that time which required huge material expenditure to be spend on accruing latest military machinery of the time. His methods’, policies and the acquired role model as state strategy proved beneficial for both Chandragupta and his passive regime and off course to his heirs including Asoka (who later after shedding enough blood gave up wars of expansion and embraced Buddhism and adopted the Dharma Chakra as the State symbol). India’s Research and Analysis Wing (RAW ) later researched, revived and used these Kautilyan methods for expanding Delhi’s power in the region including Pakistan, nepaal , bhutaan, China, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. In fact, this is the Indian Government’s real reason to adopt the Saranath Lion Capital and the Asoka Chakra or Dharma Chakra as India’s National symbol – which appears on her national flag – officially they express usual fake impression of showing respect for a great Buddhist Emperor and his religion as many Buddhists would’ve believed, simaler example could be taken out from the act of labeling their 1st atomic experiment as Smile of Buddha, what the heck Buddha had to do smiling on the experiment of a deadly weapon, it can only be termed as yet another mean instance on which Indian policy makers tried to hide the cruelty behind the mask of divinity.

By owning the desire of Imperialism and falling into kotliyan policies India (as one can speculate as of now) historically posses animosity originated mind set of an eager regal state towards most of its neighbors, doesn’t mater how much they pretend and poses of peace loving regime but the decisions of a strong propagation regarding supporting the outburst of a cruel riddle like bharat of Chundergupta Moria by following kotaliyan standers was taken way back by the pioneer strategic planners of the Indian state, Pakistan can be considered as their main target or founding stone of each activity, ironically there is a similar response from Pakistani side mainly as a reaction with the intention of containment of threats, Indians have to keep this in mind, when ever they come up with any such will of implementation of cruel agenda in the region to destabilize the regional peace one way or the other the kotliyan agenda will face the anti kotliyan forces, mainly Pakistan, as this outline scheme is among few of the biggest threats to the survival of Pakistan, right from its foundation.

In inspiring illumination of the strategy followed by the Indian doctrine to implement the Chanakiya agenda and its implication, its worth looking at the few proxies between Pakistan and India, these wars between Pakistan and India which Steve Coll has termed as ghost wars are going for a long time now, off late Indians were looking for a faces saving during one of that proxy in a recent serious set back to their plans in accruing regional objectives in Sri Lanka in shape of suppression of LTTET by Sri Lankans through the help of Pakistan and china, the acceptance of Pakistani support (Sri Lankans have praised the role played by the security establishment of Pakistan, it can be reviewed on several accounts, its not my topic, one can read those articles scattered all around the world Wide web) from Sri Lanka was obvious in the whole episode they found themselves thank full to Pakistan, having said that Pakistan paid the price of friendship by the getting the stains of attack on Sri Lankan cricket team by elements which have serious collaboration with local terrorist organization and LTTE both bloome and nursed by India , defeat of LTTE is considered as another strategic achievement of Pakistan in the region, in the same context, its really amusing that how some Indian media sections are looking for that mentioned face saving by announcing and reporting about the events when “India secretly helped Sri Lanka” in elimination of LTTE, well it seems it was so secrete that even Sri Lankans wasn’t aware about rising reality of this fact, totally absurd and another attempt to win some thing on papers and waves of lies which Indian policy makers lost on the ground, Glimpse of that desperation* (reference: read Krishnakumar P, Gokhale’s interview to rediff.com) can be viewed in the various statements by a renowned defense analysts to web sites and media anchors.

Pakistanis have observed and experienced the Indian accomplishment and hazards of implementation of same policies in East Pakistan, when Bhartis gave birth to the most over used media term of cross boarder terrorism by blooming the rouge mukti bahani element, off course political grounds to the birth were provided by our policy makers by not listening to voices of suppressed Bengalis but India had no right. What’s so ever to intervene, but they did, and rest is an embarrassed and shame full story to narrate in the context of article, reason to quote that point here was an intent to remind people that this kotliyan curse is not something new it is something what we have witnessed and gone through long before 9/11 and long before beginning of rouge elements of TTP and other various unwise people, but again we are providing the grounds by again going into policies of solving political problems with the roasted mentality of military strategy?

Sri Lanka will hope fully now coupe swiftly through remaining challenges of proxy and remains of the LTTE, but there is another soil where yet another proxy is getting to a new plugging hype, Afghanistan. After removal of Taliban government in context of 9/11 and American invasion Indian intelligence agencies have able to build up a huge infrastructure on both military and civilian level, and one can easily contemplate their likely intentions, young Afghans being send to Indian educational institution to get a certain “motivational” education and bit of Indian version of thinking about the answers of the tribulations which will ultimately have same impact on the afghan society like one witnessed during the era of Marxist-Russian-dominated regime of Afghanistan, supported by the soviets dogma to expand the boarders of soviet union and make Afghanistan its sixteenth republic, it was a regime which consist of mainly of youth from various ethnic element majority of which were led by either pro-marxist of Afghanistan or by few which returned after being polished from universities and think tanks of Moscow, those foreign educated elements were overflowing with pro-Moscow leftist views, which eventually caused bloody pandemonium in Afghan society, Soviets were influencing Afghanistan as their neighbor and as a step towards the hot waters, like it or not but the next target would’ve the country* (hint: its Pakistan) with shores which remain open 12 months, either by making it a buffer sate or coming right into the heart of south Asia, but to review and analyze Indian interest in a country like Afghanistan one need to re-remind him self about the will of extension and will of reprisal (Pakistan and Pakistanis are the responsible for the edges of a broken dream called akhund bharat) bhartis posses for Pakistan, every other speculated reason and excuse like containment of China and interference in Sri Lanka is just a bogie which should be termed as the self boasting efforts of bharti policy makers .

In search of a favorite Indian offence* (hint: its usually a back stab) Indian policy makers are looking for the permanent stay in Afghanistan while reluctant pro American afghan government is eagerly gazing to grab each opportunity of having foreign forces on ground zero to help them against possible Taliban reemergence in to power, in a recent interview former ISI chief Gen. Hamid Gull revealed that Afghan government despite of allowing Indians to have various RAW stations has now offered more bases into heart of Afghanistan in cities like Shindand, (near Heart); and the one near Mazar-e Sharif, there are few more hidden camps and area of operations of indian agencies around the valleys and mountains of the Afganistan onwe should bare this fact in mind that India already has an airbase in Tajikistan, named as Farkhor Air Base Farkhor in Tajikistan, about 130 kilometres south east of the capital Dushanbe, most of these newly establish bases which are near Pakistani boaders will be used to maximize the circle of activities and its quite clear to imagine the focal point of movements of those bases considering the impact of already scattered inidan consulates around boarder areas of Pakistan injecting toxin of terrorism through money and arms to several insurgent groups in FATA and Baluchistan, This is why, the Indians, despite a shrinking economy and going down to the way low in world hunger index (more hunger then Sahara desert, well we are not that far, a recent report also confirmed food shortages in Pakistan is touching the “hight” of countries like Ethiopia, thanks to Shoukats of our finance ministries), have continued to raise their defense budget, by 20 percent last year and an additional 34 percent this year. Role of India in destabilizing Pakistan through Afghanistan is the outbreak of failure of our afghan policy which was imposed upon us in the ghosts of the 9/11 scenario, India will always try and manipulate our flaws, exploit each loop hole through every possible opportunity we provide them, an in case of Afghanistan where we cluttered the scene by bending and kneeling in front foreign pressure and by allowing anti Pakistani northern alliance to dominate the Afghan government which was getting support and aid from same intelligence networks even before 9/11.

In some context, Northern alliance is the succession of pro indian and anti Pakistani elements of past, and their support to Indians should be consider as the reaction of the support Pakistani security establishment provided ftotheir adversary, Taliban. Another point could be that the Major non pushtton and pro Marxist pushtoon elements of Afghanistan which historically possesses an obsession for the former NWFP and present province of Puktoonkhwa, historically strategy of supporting destabilization worked as a pulling muscle for Russia in cold war era, soviets pad afghan’s back every now and then to create dsiturbance in NWFP when Pakistan was under SENTO and CETO (mainly due to tackle Indian aggression by acquiring arms and support) and Afghanistan was under strong Soviet influence, former Afghans Intelligence agency KHAD played vital role in that regard, they provide support to numerous terrorist activities over the years specially in 70s and 80s in collaboration with former KGB and RAW, it was nexus worked as a cooperative ministry as Pakistan was the common enemy of the TRIKA, now there is no KGB no KHAD, both have changed and reemerged on the horizon, KGB is turned into FSB and late KHAD is been revivied by the name of RAMA acronym Research and Analysis Milli Afghanistan, Indian version of Afghan RAW to say the least, as basic motive of both the agencies is and will be destabilizing Pakistan, it has confirmed that RAMA is behind use of fake taliban in shape of afghan and uzbuk elements , recruiting them into TTP colurs, it could possibly the ultimate pretenders of locals, RAMA has just emerged , we will ultimately hear a lot about this particular object in coming future, as of now its more on the secret side to the world as not much people have seen and listened about it but echoes can still be heard around, RAW is supposed to be the guardian angel of this infant reminding them the memories of good old KHAD days, spending good chunk of money and infrastructure in training of the band.

Facts about Indian investment in Afghanistan are at the same time alarming as well as interesting, according to times of India New Delhi has pledged $1.2 billion in aid to Afghanistan, making India the fifth largest donor nation to the country after the US, Britain, Japan and Canada, it could become to completely mind bobbling for a logical mind to find a possible reason for India’s extreme desire to spend this much money in Afghanistan if he takes out Indian fascination and fictional based policy doctrine from his consideration, Indian official sources claimed that this 1.2 billion will be used in re-building of infrastructure, such as a completed road link to Iran’s border, well one can consider this as an investment in construction of another entry point into Baluchistan, also same source says that money will be spend on further symbolic development of its democratic aspirations, such as the construction of a new parliament building in Kabul, $1.2 billion just to build a building and road and a building? and rest on other “symbolic” intentions, there shouldn’t be half measures from Pakistani side, indian gain in Afghanistan will certainly be considered as Pakistani loss in the top military brass of the country, India’s neuralgia is seemed to be increasing continuously.

If some buddy is still wondering about questions rising in the minds regarding facts like why Indians are that concern about establishing and training a foreign agency like RAMA or why India has adopted the policy of blooming terrorism into regional states specially Pakistan, or what is the indian interest in supporting nursing TTP and BLA, answer to all of these questions is quite simple that indians are falling into the way of Chanakya Kotliya, they really admire him as the stand out socio-political intellectual of the ancient Bharat and because india consider Pakistan and Pakistanis as the stains of their biggest defeat of the history i.e. division of a concept and riddle that they hold close to thier hearts, and due to the fact that Pakistan is a single large obstacle in Indian dream of being a regional power, and due to the existence of the reason of the most significant reality that Pakistan is India’s neighbor and when it comes to neighbors, Chanakya scratches his bald head and with a cruel smile sums it up by saying: “your neighbor is your worst enemy but the neighbor of your neighbor is your friend”.

Indian Foreign Policy Doctrine: Way of Chanakya Kautilya — Pro-Pakistan
 
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