Arjun News & Discussions

[Ingis]

In another word, continue extend the 38 years another year or so? MY feeling is that if it take 38 years to build a tank and it can't be done. 50-60 years won't make much of a difference. It need a redesign. Why won't India save the design money and just buy more T-90 and use the money else where if Arjun turn out to be a flop.

The engineers will realize what get them the job security.

Read post#3.

India's next tank will be a joint development with Russia.

 

[Trisonics]

In another word, continue extend the 38 years another year or so? MY feeling is that if it take 38 years to build a tank and it can't be done. 50-60 years won't make much of a difference. It need a redesign. Why won't India save the design money and just buy more T-90 and use the money else where if Arjun turn out to be a flop.

The engineers will realize what get them the job security.

Good comment!! Let me explain:

This is what India is fighting today, just because it took India to get a tank out in so many years doesn't mean the product is bad, its the process that is bad. For A country riddled with corruption, and a media that doesn't fear from throwing opinions, its only natural.

What is significant here, is a process that is evolving that may smack Army in the face and show the public what it is up to. If DRDO was not confident they have produced a good product, they wouldn't dare to field this trial. Include its reputation in the media and then you would realize how confident they are.

What if the media in India was not allowed to make one single comment about this tank? would you still see it the same way?

For people who keep thinking it can't cross the border and kill, well, they are living in a fool's paradise !!!!!!!

 

[lockh33d]

Atleast wiki doesn't say so..better provide proof of ur claim..

2008 South Ossetia war - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Article says "most" of the tanks, some 60% were T-72's-The remaining? However, if you surf online for a bit or watch news 3/2 years old, you'd see T-90's driving around the streets of Georgia.

No real tank war they faced in both this situations dude..still you are saying its world class but arguing Arjun is not ..

Come again?

He is trying to sooth himself actually. He think bashing Arjun will make it ineffectual when he will open its flood gates during war.

Arjun is a beast and a separate platform. India is dealing with two best tanks where T-90 is more reliable due to its history. Arjun is an ultra modern tank in an effort to prove its point. Of Course IA love T-90 but at the end of the day we be having surplus machines running over enemy CP.

Whatever dude, whatever. If you don't want to take in concrete fact, then it's your choice what you want to believe. If you want to think that the Arjun surpasses the Abrams, then go fall into your fantasy dream.

So if it cant trump American Tech it should be cast aside is that it.

So if it can't trump Western tech, it still makes the tank world class, is that it?

The trial is more complicated then just that. Its not about what tank is better.

But which tank best fulfills the army's retirements.

For example the IA has overheating problems with both the Arjun and T-90 in the rajastan desert.

While DRDO made specialized cooling systems for effected systems.

the Russians installed an Air conditioners in the T-90 and said that would do the trick.

Now the Russians are known for their simple solutions, so there system may very well be effective.

But that's what these trials are to find out.

Which on of these tanks can best fit the requirements of the army.



Don't drag the IAF down to the corrupt hole of the IA.

They have neglected in the past. But they fully support domestic industry today. taking an active participation in development programs.

Even supporting RnD in ISRO.

Once they get rid of the old mig fleets, they can focus more in Domestic.



It's not about what is better.

Its about which tank suits the Indian Army's requirements best.

It may be T-90 vs Arjun but the battle is not for, I am better title.

But which tank works better for IA.




That's what this trial is to decide the IA needs a tank that meets its requirements best. Which is that T-90 or Arjun

Again, read my previous posts. I didn't say the trials are useless, I'm just saying it's not going to give the Arjun much recognition when put in comparison with similar tanks but with credibility. All the trial does is tell you the tank is working and points out any improvements to be made.

 

[lockh33d]

Read post#3.

India's next tank will be a joint development with Russia.

Russia? As if the Puke Fighter was not enough, now it comes in the form of a Puke tank?

 

[lockh33d]

Good comment!! Let me explain:

This is what India is fighting today, just because it took India to get a tank out in so many years doesn't mean the product is bad, its the process that is bad. For A country riddled with corruption, and a media that doesn't fear from throwing opinions, its only natural.

What is significant here, is a process that is evolving that may smack Army in the face and show the public what it is up to. If DRDO was not confident they have produced a good product, they wouldn't dare to field this trial. Include its reputation in the media and then you would realize how confident they are.

What if the media in India was not allowed to make one single comment about this tank? would you still see it the same way?

For people who keep thinking it can't cross the border and kill, well, they are living in a fool's paradise !!!!!!!

Bad process=Good product? If you're to raise a child bribing him/her everyday, does that make an obedient child after a decade or so? Look, if you have a bad process, you risk the project being bad quality.

 

[RPK]

^^^



Improvements on Russian T-90x


The new compact conditioner for tanks, armored and civilian vehicles was developed in Russia. It used Peltier effect: thermoelectric cooling, based on creating a heat flux between the junction of two different types of materials. The most problem successfully solved was effectiveness of the Peltier modules. It's all solid state freon-free device, without any negative effect on ozone layer and global warming. Also it's very compact and stress-withstanding. Unlike current models it can be installed inside the Russian MBT tank T-90A. However, the more probable target for the new conditioner installation is 'Burlak' - the modernized version of T-90 tank currently over the tests. It could be installed on the export version T-90S or T-90M instead of the external conditioner, which can be seen on the Algerian and Libian T-90s. Naturally the Russian Future MBT, which published name is T-95, would be equipped with a conditioner based on the same principles, if the program succeeds.

SOURCE & more images here
Defunct Humanity: New tank conditioner


Т-90М. New Specs.

Sunday, January 3, 2010
Т-90М. New Specs.

The new pictures and main specs of T-90M (ob.188M) were appeared on a Russian site. This tank was first time demonstrated for Putin in Dec.10 at N-Tagil. It has got:

- New bigger turret without weakened frontal areas and with the all-aspect ERA covering.
- ERA 'Relict'
- Additional roof protection against atop attacking munition.
- New additional autoloader, placed on the aft part of the turret and able using the new longer sub-caliber rods.
- Aft ammo storage.
- Panoramic 3-channel IR commander site with improved anti-split/rounds protection.
- 7.62 mm automatic turret instead of 12.7mm.
- Totally new 2A82 125 mm MG (2A46M5 - optional).
- FCS with the net-centric module.
- New radio.
- New navigation system.
- New anti-split kevlar layer instead of the standard Russian anti-neutron layer.
- new anti-fire system.

Defunct Humanity: ?-90?. New Specs.



T-90ME was demonstrated first time

In work:

- Mono-block power unit on 1200 hp V-99 engine.
- Steering wheel control.

T-90M - is intended for the export purpose mainly. For domestic use there was confirmed 'Burlak' program with heavy Tomsk OKBTM's input.




The export version of modernized T-90M tank was demonstrated for Russian PM Putin today in 'UVZ plant (N-Tagil). The tank has a new, bigger turrets,
- 'Relict' ERA on the turret (but not on the hull),
- a new panoramic commander sight with 360 degree vision,
- new commander hatch with better accessability
- different placement of the air conditioner
- new tracks
- stronger rolls and some improvement in the chassis
- possibly 1200 hp engine





Defunct Humanity: T-90ME was demonstrated first time

 

[RPK]

http://*****************/wp-content/uploads/opinion/army/arjun/dissimilarcombat/general-characteristics.jpg

 

[Hulk]

In another word, continue extend the 38 years another year or so? MY feeling is that if it take 38 years to build a tank and it can't be done. 50-60 years won't make much of a difference. It need a redesign. Why won't India save the design money and just buy more T-90 and use the money else where if Arjun turn out to be a flop.

The engineers will realize what get them the job security.

Only a nutcase idiot can advice not to invest in internal development. No matter what it takes, we should focus on self reliance. Be it Arjun, LCA MCA etc etc.

For those who talk about 30 40 years forget India hardly had money in past which means lack of funds for such projects. Now that India has money, better relationship in world things will start to fall in place.

 

[karan.1970]

Bad process=Good product? If you're to raise a child bribing him/her everyday, does that make an obedient child after a decade or so? Look, if you have a bad process, you risk the project being bad quality.

extreme example.. By bad ProcessTrisonic meant Slow process.

In America, the recognition of African americans as equals was a slow(bad) process but the results are not too bad .. are they.. (hint.. Obama).. This example should resonate with you if you are an american citizen...

On your comment around trials not giving arjun recognition.. you are absolutely right. But what these trials may give Arjun is a ticket to play the field. Once that happens, it will either build a reputation for itself or fade away..We dont neet it to have that recognition right away as there are no export expectations. It just needs a space in the IA asset list so that it gets the opportunity to create that recognition

Puke Fighter...?? Puke Tank???

not very nice..

 

[gogbot]

Article says "most" of the tanks, some 60% were T-72's-The remaining? However, if you surf online for a bit or watch news 3/2 years old, you'd see T-90's driving around the streets of Georgia.



Come again?



Whatever dude, whatever. If you don't want to take in concrete fact, then it's your choice what you want to believe. If you want to think that the Arjun surpasses the Abrams, then go fall into your fantasy dream.



So if it can't trump Western tech, it still makes the tank world class, is that it?



Again, read my previous posts. I didn't say the trials are useless, I'm just saying it's not going to give the Arjun much recognition when put in comparison with similar tanks but with credibility. All the trial does is tell you the tank is working and points out any improvements to be made.

So then what exactly is your issue with the tank ?

Whats your POV here.

 

[lockh33d]

So then what exactly is your issue with the tank ?

Whats your POV here.

What is your point, my point is to argue whatever your point was that you previously stated.

 

[gogbot]

What is your point, my point is to argue whatever your point was that you previously stated.

I am trying to find out what your argument is ?

I am not going to argue with you just because.

whats the motion here, i needs to know what we are conflicting on.

You have been posting on every Arjun thread there is , clearly you have and interest and reason for doing so.

I merely want to know what it is.

 

[karan.1970]

What is your point, my point is to argue whatever your point was that you previously stated.

so 2 guys arguing without knowing each others' pov... Rich...


guys.. let it go.. Arjun will get evaluated... Either it will make the cut or not. If it does, more of its numbers will get inducted. If its really not good, IA will stop after initial 200-300 tanks and DRDO will go back to the drawing board. Else we will see Arjun MKII etc soon..

We can debate it to death but wont know the outcome till these events play out.. so give it a rest..

 

[BATMAN]

"Our aim is not to determine a winner in these trials, but to test the core strength of the tanks," a senior official of the Indian Army said, wishing anonymity.

This line (from the news article) seems to defy the title!
and dosn't fare well for arjun's future!

 

[ptldM3]

-Withstood but heavily damaged+immobilized?

-T-90 was used in the Georgian war only two years ago, add to the fact that it was constantly deployed to fend off Cherneyans (Need Spell check on that).

It's spelled Chechnya.

-As a side note, I hate Russians, no love for the T-90 from me.

Are you a 12 years kid with mental retardasion? Hey, come up to a Russian and tell him the same thing see what happens...never mind, don't do it. It would be unethical of me to put a retard in danger.

Article says "most" of the tanks, some 60% were T-72's-The remaining? However, if you surf online for a bit or watch news 3/2 years old, you'd see T-90's driving around the streets of Georgia.

Can you please show us these videos of T-90's, so far i have yet to see one.

Russia? As if the Puke Fighter was not enough, now it comes in the form of a Puke tank?

This link explains everything>>>> http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/img/2010/surprise-retard.jpg