Are TURKEY and PAKISTAN really ALLIES?

[Kaniska]

No, the reality is even Turkey and India have very good relationship, Indians won't buy any weapons from Turkey, Indians want nothing but the best or the most expensive, Turkey has nothing in their inventory to offer to India, on the countrary, because of good relations with Turkey, Pakistan spent tons of dollar purchasing Turkish equipments, which have few if any countries would consider to buy, it's Turkey the one trying to take advantge of this relationship.

Spot on...Same thing even i was wondering that what is so special with Turkey’s defence industry that China can not provide to Pakistan??? Unless Turkey has access to high end technology for being a partner to NATO.

 

[vishwambhar]

Some one is triggered... Look, india even with this ban of lethal weapons buys more than Pakistan from us, because you guys can't even produce military radios. Same for UCAV's or some other technologies. Maybe after Saudi Arabia you are the second biggest market. Quite simple.

And for the Idlib say it to russian pantsirs...

Nope... you first said that India doesn't have its own national defense industry.... which I proved wrong.... India does have its own industry and success in strategic weapons that makes us one of the most powerful countries on earth.... nukes, BMs, nuke submarines,ASAT capabilities, indigenous corvettes,destroyers and ACs.... so we have our own national defense industry.... this was my point of argument and not how much we import or we are second largest importer after saudi Arabia or not....

Then you said India is not buying weapons from Turkey because you support Pakistan otherwise Turkey could also have its own pie in big tasty cake of large Indian defense orders.... ohh plzzzz.... you go and form a joint union with them who cares.... my point of argument was Turkey simply isn't qualified to be on India's suppliers list.... who wants Turkey when you have USA, France,Russia and Israel.....

We may not be able to make decent radio but we can surely make atom bombs which will reduce our enemies to atoms.... radio we will buy from Israel no issues....

 

[Turan09]

Nope... you first said that India doesn't have its own national defense industry.... which I proved wrong.... India does have its own industry and success in strategic weapons that makes us one of the most powerful countries on earth.... nukes, BMs, nuke submarines,ASAT capabilities, indigenous corvettes,destroyers and ACs.... so we have our own national defense industry.... this was my point of argument and not how much we import or we are second largest importer after saudi Arabia or not....

Then you said India is not buying weapons from Turkey because you support Pakistan otherwise Turkey could also have its own pie in big tasty cake of large Indian defense orders.... ohh plzzzz.... you go and form a joint union with them who cares.... my point of argument was Turkey simply isn't qualified to be on India's suppliers list.... who wants Turkey when you have USA, France,Russia and Israel.....

We may not be able to make decent radio but we can surely make atom bombs which will reduce our enemies to atoms.... radio we will buy from Israel no issues....

Ah, so much pride for an indian... But anyway, perhaps if your army didn't gave orders and show interest to Turkish weaponry, I would have believe you, but it is not the case. Support ship deal occurred, because we gave our permission. Because when we like we can give a better deal. Now, we will never gonna be you supplier, I agree about this part because it is banned by the Turkish State.
Infact, Ismail Demir ''President of the Turkish Defense Industries'' once made a statement about this... He said, ''We want to sell to indians they are a great market, has a huge potential. They also wanted to buy our products, but Turkish Goverment banned all weapon sales. I hope we will sell non lethal products, as our goverment only gave permission to that'' (Support Ships are in the non-lethal category)
Even after everything you said, you are the second biggest market in entire world after Saudis. Like it or not, you are a big cake and most of the countries wants to have a piece. The end.

 

[vishwambhar]

Ah, so much pride for an indian... But anyway, perhaps if your army didn't gave orders and show interest to Turkish weaponry, I would have believe you, but it is not the case. Support ship deal occurred, because we gave our permission. Because when we like we can give a better deal. Now, we will never gonna be you supplier, I agree about this part because it is banned by the Turkish State.
Infact, Ismail Demir ''President of the Turkish Defense Industries'' once made a statement about this... He said, ''We want to sell to indians they are a great market, has a huge potential. They also wanted to buy our products, but Turkish Goverment banned all weapon sales. I hope we will sell non lethal products, as our goverment only gave permission to that''
Even after everything you said, you are the second biggest market in entire world after Saudis. Like it or not, you are a big cake and most of the countries wants to have a piece. The end.

Many factors are behind these things like showing interest in particular support ship from turkey... Even kickbacks....

You said India as a state is rich.... So consider this like a rich man who has a habit of having lunch or dinner in five star hotels (USA, Russia, France) but sometimes he can stop over at local road side eatery (Turkey) for some quick refreshments.... And please I'm not at all afraid that you are never gonna be our supplier.... Keep your garbage with you to fight with Assad regime rag tag forces.....

By the way best cartoon whole world watched was Turkey who first went ahead with S400 offending USA and when Russia the S400 supplier started kicking in your rear you started running for patriot like a headless chicken.... Yeah India is really gonna miss comedian Turkey as a supplier... .

Ah so much pride for a Turk.... .

 

[waz]

I m more for this view now.

I just had to comment on this.
Way before the Xinjiang you had with several Pakistanis we had the likes of Pher and the minority of other bigoted Chinese posters who had something against Pakistan being Muslim and why China was helping. Their stupid and often outrageous posts didn't change our opinion of China being close to us, yet these exchanges changed yours, and you are all for being neutral?
You have to ask yourself this question just whose will and belief was stronger, the vast majority of Pakistanis who let these posts go, or the minority Chinese who changed their minds over some posts made.
Anyway you are entitled to your opinion, it was just worth discussing.

 

[Turan09]

Many factors are behind these things like showing interest in particular support ship from turkey... Even kickbacks....

You said India as a state is rich.... So consider this like a rich man who has a habit of having lunch or dinner in five star hotels (USA, Russia, France) but sometimes he can stop over at local road side eatery (Turkey) for some quick refreshments.... And please I'm not at all afraid that you are never gonna be our supplier.... Keep your garbage with you to fight with Assad regime rag tag forces.....

By the way best cartoon whole world watched was Turkey who first went ahead with S400 offending USA and when Russia the S400 supplier started kicking in your rear you started running for patriot like a headless chicken.... Yeah India is really gonna miss comedian Turkey as a supplier... .

Ah so much pride for a Turk.... .

As a state, correct. india is rich. Too bad for you that money doesn't buy the knowledge, and when that happens your state ran to us for their support ships. And for some other systems... It is pathetic... And really funny to think, your state wanted to brought Anka-S, The UCAV you just called ''Junk'' , but of course like I said Turkish State doesn't allow it.
And there is no need to worry, Still thanks for all this millions.
About S400, our main goal is Hisar And Siper. We can play a game until than.
About my pride, well we Turks we are known with our pride. But an indian? It's like a monkey with roller skates. For the monkey, it is normal. For the people who watching it. It is hilarious.

 

[Hayreddin]

Lets accept the reality , Pakistan and Turkey are not officially Allies . Yes both have brotherly warm relationship and supported each other militarily overtly and covertly in Past but have no " Defence Pact " or such treaty btw two countries . Turkey is a Nato Ally .Turkish forces were in Afghanistan under Nato flag and if Nato goes in War with any nation or league of nations Turkey is obliged to go to war with its Nato allies .

 

[vishwambhar]

As a state, correct. india is rich. Too bad for you that money doesn't buy the knowledge, and when that happens your state ran to us for their support ships. And for some other systems... It is pathetic... And really funny to think, your state wanted to brought Anka-S, The UCAV you just called ''Junk'' , but of course like I said Turkish State doesn't allow it.
And there is no need to worry, Still thanks for all this millions.
About S400, our main goal is Hisar And Siper. We can play a game until than.
About my pride, well we Turks we are known with our pride. But an indian? It's like a monkey with roller skates. For the monkey, it is normal. For the people who watching it. It is hilarious.

Whatever... as long as Indian monkey is capable to convert Turkish monkey to atoms I'm happy.... keep your garbage with you to fight with other rag tag monkeys in ME.....

Without NATO Turkish monkey is nothing...

 

[Turan09]

Whatever... as long as Indian monkey is capable to convert Turkish monkey to atoms I'm happy.... keep your garbage with you to fight with other rag tag monkeys in ME.....

Without NATO Turkish monkey is nothing...

Too bad Our ''garbage'' does bother your lovely state. ''Sour grapes'' indeed.
Everybody can think to convert the other one to atoms in this days, but taking this risk, it is not for the cowards.
Now you can go back to play with your Mig-21's...

 

[vishwambhar]

Too bad Our ''garbage'' does bother your lovely state. ''Sour grapes'' indeed.
Everybody can think to convert the other one to atoms in this days, but taking this risk, it is not for the cowards.
Now you can go back to play with your Mig-21's...

Still you seem to believe that India is in love with your garbage anca or don't know what you call them.... dude we have access to herons, predators..... you think... Indian interest in your garbage is nothing but kickbacks involved somewhere.... plz get lost with your support ship or uav.... it won't be missed anyway....

 

[Itachi]

I just had to comment on this.
Way before the Xinjiang you had with several Pakistanis we had the likes of Pher and the minority of other bigoted Chinese posters who had something against Pakistan being Muslim and why China was helping. Their stupid and often outrageous posts didn't change our opinion of China being close to us, yet these exchanges changed yours, and you are all for being neutral?
You have to ask yourself this question just whose will and belief was stronger, the vast majority of Pakistanis who let these posts go, or the minority Chinese who changed their minds over some posts made.
Anyway you are entitled to your opinion, it was just worth discussing.

The crux of the matter is, and which many Pakistanis can't realize it is, that there is no China - Pak "bhai bhai"....our culture, language and religions are very different.

We do have a solid relationship on a governmental level, that too because we need each other due to geopolitics, which has blossomed into a economic and military partnership......but make no mistake.....of the 1B+ people in China, most don't even know that Pakistan exists.....hence why you have certain Chinese who're extremely toxic because they're brainwashed by their uber nationalist govt. to be nationalistic (which is why nationalism is condemned in Islam) and then you have "neutral" Chinese.......whereas we have Pakistanis extending the hands of friendship all the time even when it doesn't benefit them and in some cases, even harms them...

The Chinese, majority of them, also don't make any effort to learn about their so called iron brother and their culture....they have a superiority complex against us....but an inferiority complex when faced with Western Civ. (which Islamic Civ. triumphed over for a millenia).

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Turan09]

Still you seem to believe that India is in love with your garbage anca or don't know what you call them.... dude we have access to herons, predators..... you think... Indian interest in your garbage is nothing but kickbacks involved somewhere.... plz get lost with your support ship or uav.... it won't be missed anyway....

Kick backs? I didn't consider that in the beginning but I am Happy to hear that.
If a country's army takes this crucial decisions for money, well no one can guarantee that this same army won't run away from the war for the money.
Nothing unusual for your people it seems.

 

[vishwambhar]

Kick backs? I didn't consider that in the beginning but I am Happy to hear that.
If a country's army takes this crucial decisions for money, well no one can guarantee that this same army won't run away from the war for the money.
Nothing unusual for your people it seems.

Lol don't act as if you don't know anything about corruption ... its everywhere.... even in your Turkey... my point was just to make it clear that if ever India has shown any interest in any of your insignificant systems then it is quite possible that some agents involved in kickbacks... nothing unusual....
Don't worry about our army running away from wars.... you better inform Putin about your army running away plan from Idlib....

 

[dBSPL]

Lets accept the reality , Pakistan and Turkey are not officially Allies . Yes both have brotherly warm relationship and supported each other militarily overtly and covertly in Past but have no " Defence Pact " or such treaty btw two countries . Turkey is a Nato Ally .Turkish forces were in Afghanistan under Nato flag and if Nato goes in War with any nation or league of nations Turkey is obliged to go to war with its Nato allies .

Do you have any idea about the TAF's Afghanistan mission and prerequisites?

Its misions are effective education , public services asistance, health and care activities required for the entire public. The Turkish Army's Afghanistan mission has never been carried a combatant attribute and will never. This is a prerequisite. At all relevant NATO summits, the Turkish state has announced that it will never send a combatant element to Afghanistan at the level of leaders.

The TAF undertook its services in the most risky areas. The people of Afghanistan are not just Taliban supporters. However, there was no attack on any Turkish flag from any group, including by Taliban.

In this context: Turkey contributed to the main HQ of UNAMA in Kabul between 2012-2015 with one HQ personnel in the post of military advisor. Within NATO missions: Turkey has been in Afghanistan to; support the Afghan administration, treating equal to people whatever their ethnicity is; train the Afghan National Security Forces and provide assistance to Afghan nation in terms of security, stability and development. Because of the national restrictions of Turkey; Turkish troops do not take part both in activities out of their area of responsibility and other mine cleaning, counter-terrorism counter-narcotics activities. Despite majority of narcotics entering Turkey is known that moved from Afghanistan.

 

[Turan09]

Lol don't act as if you don't know anything about corruption ... its everywhere.... even in your Turkey... my point was just to make it clear that if ever India has shown any interest in any of your insignificant systems then it is quite possible that some agents involved in kickbacks... nothing unusual....
Don't worry about our army running away from wars.... you better inform Putin about your army running away plan from Idlib....

Well, corruption is everywhere. Politicians are doing that all the time. But here in Turkey right now, let say if army ever take a crucial decision like that for money there will be riots in the ranks of Turkish state. Maybe that's because we see army as the red line. Holy land. Politicians can do as they wish but soldiers can't! Their priority must be the nation not the money.
Certanly, this is not the case for your nation.