Are air defence systems like S400 Patriot etc worthless against a modern military?

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

Defensive system work great in concert with offensive ones... but on their own are inherently vulnerable and lackluster in front of an attacker. Initiative and prerogative always rests with the aggressor.

 

[crankthatskunk]

Indian Air Defense has an integrated command this means multiple radar systems provide full picture of aerial situation at once from all over India.
This means S-400 will boost this network and will work in conjunction with multiple Indian and Foreign advance systems.
S-400 radars will be well inside Indian territory and still covering most of Pakistani airspace the launchers are another story they will be dispersed as per the strategy they might be deployed 20 kms or 200 kms from border same is true for

PAD
AAD
Aakash
Barak
Spyder
NASAAM

All above systems provide robust defense against non stealthy targets and can handle sub-sonic cruise missile and UCAVs.

Also all of these are passive air defense... active air defense is always BVR trucks like MKI and Mig29.
Rafales will also come in numbers to add to it.

And then 27 Feb 2019 happened.
Even Mighty Su 30s, the mini AWACS runaway. Got the medal though.
To avoid the fire on their arses. Only Indians

 

[Wood]

I am talking about radar feeds only... S-400 radar wont be able to guide a Spyder missile.
Situation awareness is one of the key area to develop counter strategy for which India has progressed a lot bith Indian and Foreign radars are networked and integrated now in
Indian Air defense.
But launchers will remain specific to its base radars.

IMO, real value for the money spent on these procurements can only be realized if India can reverse engineer and mass produce clones like the Chinese do. But this does not seem to be the plan.

 

[crankthatskunk]

10 nukes wont be able to take out Delhi fully. Even if they are 100-150 kt.

I am completely flabbergasted from your utter ignorance.
10 Nukes on India or any other country for that matter would bring it to its knees.

 

[Tumba]

And then 27 Feb 2019 happened.
Even Mighty Su 30s, the mini AWACS runaway. Got the medal though.
To avoid the fire on their arses. Only Indians

Its good u pakistanis repeat this incorrect fact again and again its good for ur morale.

Aim-120 c5 were wasted that day ... Su-30 proved its worth ... Indian Air force is not a emotional teen girl its an organisation which
Gets trained for years and knows what is the best counter in these situations...

In a real BVR or WVR fight thr is still no real fighter in Paf that can actually go toe to toe against MKI.

If you are happy that F-16 fired multiple Aim120c5 from DMAX ranges then keep on enjoying coz in BVR fight thr r no kills recorded above 40-45 kms so far firing from full range on a 2D TVC MKI is stupidity.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

10 nukes wont be able to take out Delhi fully. Even if they are 100-150 kt.

r u stupid or something? do u understand nuclear fall out from 10 nukes cable of 30+ kilotonnes of TNT?

 

[Tumba]

I am completely flabbergasted from your utter ignorance.
10 Nukes on India or any other country for that matter would bring it to its knees.

I repeat 10 nukes with ~100 kt wont kill a city like Delhi it might get thrown back a decade or two most.
India can take nukes and still recover specially when BMD Phase 1 is fully completed and Phase 2 is progressing well.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Its good u pakistanis repeat this incorrect fact again and again its good for ur morale.

Aim-120 c5 were wasted that day ... Su-30 proved its worth ... Indian Air force is not a emotional teen girl its an organisation which
Gets trained for years and knows what is the best counter in these situations...

In a real BVR or WVR fight thr is still no real fighter in Paf that can actually go toe to toe against MKI.

If you are happy that F-16 fired multiple Aim120c5 from DMAX ranges then keep on enjoying coz in BVR fight thr r no kills recorded above 40-45 kms so far firing from full range on a 2D TVC MKI is stupidity.

so if Su-30 were able to doge AMRAAM then why didnt Su-30 Mirage or Mig-21 shoot PAF Mirages and JF-17?
su-30 would have proven its worth had it even launched a single missile but it actually deserted the battle field like a coward!

 

[Tumba]

r u stupid or something? do u understand nuclear fall out from 10 nukes cable of 30+ kilotonnes of TNT?

Like I told you 100 kt nuke impact 3 km radius area if deployed around 2000 feet and nuke fall out will be severe for 5-7 years after that it will subside.
Millions will be dead if Pak is able to hit all 10 nukes but it wont kill A city like Delhi

 

[Neptune]

There were some rumors that S300 was also defeated by Turkey in Syria while taking down 2 Su24 jets. Can anyone confirm it ?

Confirmed. The official statement did not give details on the types of air defence systems destroyed but many foreign and local journalists confirmed the destruction of Pantsir and S-300 systems. Its all over social media.

https://www.msb.gov.tr/SlaytHaber/132020-48754

 

[Tumba]

so if Su-30 were able to doge AMRAAM then why didnt Su-30 Mirage or Mig-21 shoot PAF Mirages and JF-17?
su-30 would have proven its worth had it even launched a single missile but it actually deserted the battle field like a coward!

Paf did shoot and scoot thr were no Paf fighter flying near LOC after 15 min once Indian fighters were thr in numbers.
Alone Mig-21 who chased F-16 shot R-73 from mere 10 odd km which in simulation give 100 guaranteed kill as thr r no sensors that can detect IR missile in F-16 BLK 52.

 

[JackTheRipper]

Confirmed. The official statement did not give details on the types of air defence systems destroyed but many foreign and local journalists confirmed the destruction of Pantsir and S-300 systems. Its all over social media.

https://www.msb.gov.tr/SlaytHaber/132020-48754

Still no strong proof/evidence,
Most of tweets on twitter are always fake,

i have watched video on twitter, claimed destruction of Pantsir,

It seems like "Syrian Arab Army" or "Russian Air Force" attacked on Terrorists Truck,
May be you are true, but video is not clear,
by watching it seems some one attacked on truck by Air,
but truck destroyed or not, its not clear...

 

[CrazyZ]

Pretty much useless against strong air force. The main problem of SAMs is they are limited by LOS, i.e. even long range SAM can hit low flying target only at 30 km. So modern jets equipped with stand off missiles can attack them safely.

I agree. A first strike with stand off munition will get through many current SAM defense grids. An air defense system built around SAM's alone is very vulnerable to a modern AF.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Paf did shoot and scoot thr were no Paf fighter flying near LOC after 15 min once Indian fighters were thr in numbers.
Alone Mig-21 who chased F-16 shot R-73 from mere 10 odd km which in simulation give 100 guaranteed kill as thr r no sensors that can detect IR missile in F-16 BLK 52.

did you pull that information out of your sameer joshi's rear end? had f-16 been shot down villagers would have leaked those pictures by now! Its not indian occupied kashmir where their is a media black out for past 8 months and where civilians can be killed for taking pictures of the military.

All of abhi's mig-21 missiles have been recovered so which missile did abhi fire?

Right wing r-73 with serial number

 

[sohail.ishaque]

10 nukes wont be able to take out Delhi fully. Even if they are 100-150 kt.

u sure about that ?