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American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

You are comparing a covert op. to an open attack.
How was this an 'open attack'? I am referring to US/Afghan ground forces covertly supporting terrorists attacking Pakistan or carrying out attacks themselves against Pakistan, being caught out and fired upon.
 
Let me try to explain with regards to the present incident:

The ground reality that will soon be accepted is that nothing substantive will change. The supply routes will reopen soon.

What needs to be done to change the status quo is not chest thumping as is being done by most here, but to build up national character and strength so that over a few years, things might improve.

What you are referring to is not done over easy..
If anything, its common history of the subcontinent you must go back to when looking at such incidents.
perhaps a canard, but a certain members comment about how our armed forces were more than willing to stand up to India aggressively yet seemed to only meow at the US is relevant to national character.

It is easy to shout it all out at other Pakistanis..
it is another matter to put up an actual effective response to the "gora saab" in power.
National character for us is reflective of our leadership, if that can be changed.. so can the people.
History is testament to some of the most deplorable nations being turned around by leadership as long as the conditions were ripe for it. The current outburst at the US(and perhaps your point of view and yourself) is indirectly a shout at our leadership(both civilian and military), a frustration with what is happening to our nation due to their incompetence.
There are faults in the Pakistani nation which are not the fault of all Pakistanis.. but the leadership needed to identify such and rectify them(which is a time intensive process) has been absent. Till such arrives.. we must contend with the will of the people for quick relief from any crises, we must understand the impatience which is justified. Whether the international community does or does not is irrelevant for now. Our current leadership(civilian and military) does not seem to posses the ability to balance this appeasement of emotion , diplomatic caution ..and national interest effectively.

To put it straight.

I just saw the coffins of 26 of my brothers draped in my flag.
By blood boils, My BP has shot up.. my eyes went wet, My fist clenched.
My "heart" wants LGB strikes on the Apache unit, their barracks.. their equipment.
My "Mind" however, lets me know of the consequences of such a move and how ill prepared we are to handle such.

But that is my mind.. it may not be thinking along the lines of everybody else.

But my heart does have a lot in common with a large section of my nation.
 
...all this 2.5km inside Pakistan border?
WRT the location of the post - if the distance from the border is correct, then, given the terrain, what weapons did the Pakistani soldiers at the post allegedly use to 'attack NATO forces' INSIDE Afghanistan? Small arms fire would obviously not be feasible at that distance, especially given the mountainous terrain.

If it was small arms fire as is being alleged, and the distance of the base WRT the border is correct, then NATO troops were inside Pakistan and they have no excuse/reason to complain about 'being fired upon by Pakistani troops'.
 
I know first hand how much hospitality we show to these foreign defence officals when they come to Pakistan and thats why their commanders, like this nazi jacob carsten, think that they can kill us and just give some lip service after the incident and get away with it.

We need to put the NATO/US commanders, who are relying heavily on inputs and support they get from sources in Pakistan, in the dock. We have to target NATO/US commanders who happily get easy info during informal talks , we have to make their job tougher and we have to make them pay in blood!
 
Pakistani response to Afghan/NATO allegations of initial Pakistani fire:

"No first fire came from Pakistan troops," said a senior Pakistani military official Sunday. "But they did respond in self-defense after NATO gunship helicopters and jet fighters carried out unprovoked firing."

Afghans Say Pakistan Fired First in NATO Attack - WSJ.com
 
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Photo credit: AP | Afghanistan-bound trucks carrying supplies for NATO forces parked as authorities close border at Torkham border in Pakistan on Sunday, Nov 27, 2011. Pakistan on Saturday accused NATO helicopters and fighter jets of firing on two army checkpoints in the country's northwest and killing 24 soldiers. Islamabad retaliated by closing the border crossings used by the international coalition to supply its troops in neighboring Afghanistan. (AP Photo/Qazi Rauf)
 
WRT the location of the post - if the distance from the border is correct, then, given the terrain, what weapons did the Pakistani soldiers at the post allegedly use to 'attack NATO forces' INSIDE Afghanistan? Small arms fire would obviously not be feasible at that distance, especially given the mountainous terrain.

If it was small arms fire as is being alleged, and the distance of the base WRT the border is correct, then NATO troops were inside Pakistan and they have no excuse/reason to complain about 'being fired upon by Pakistani troops'.

Valid, if they were not chasing militants. But then it boils down to effective communication.
 
Pakistan's military disputes this version of events. Military officials say the posts were attacked without warning at 2 a.m, while most of the around 50 soldiers were sleeping, and that NATO helicopters and jets even attacked Pakistani military forces sent in as back-up during the two-hour assault. Pakistan says it has increased the number of soldiers at border posts like these as part of a campaign in Mohmand this year to wipe out the Taliban in the area.
Afghans Say Pakistan Fired First in NATO Attack - WSJ.com
 
Muje aik baat samaj nahi aa rahi. Hundreds or thousands of innocent Tribals of FATA are killed in drone attacks by US...uss par kisi ne itna shor nahi machaya and now that 30 soldiers are killed, ghairat and temper has raised to the skies and there are talks of war with US...Kyun , civilians ka khoon sasta he aur foji ka mehanga?

this truely shows our hypocrisy dude.yahan mulq ki beizati hui hai so all internet warrior is on the forum showing their guts.aam aadmi ko to yahan ***** bhi nahi poochta.
 
NATO conducts operations along the border quite often and their air support is probably in the air non-stop - tracking fighter jets in the air would not provide any indication of a potential attack on a Pakistani border post. Low flying helicopters would be hard to detect on radar in that terrain.

Even if there air support is in the air non stop, that actually gives more reason for Pak Radar operations to be on a higher alert all the time. Plus, a helo being slow speed does not travel 2.5 km in a blink of an eye.. And then the question of 2 attacks...Even if they were caught by surprise the 1st time (which itself is inexcusable) how come the second one went unchallenged as well..
 
Our Leadership is spineless - The assault lasted for well over 2 hours.Why couldn't PAF scramble the jets from the nearest bases?
 
How was this an 'open attack'? I am referring to US/Afghan ground forces covertly supporting terrorists attacking Pakistan or carrying out attacks themselves against Pakistan, being caught out and fired upon.

Was this revealed in the so called investigation by Pakistan.. I thought one version of the report said that the soldiers were sleeping when they were killed.
 
The question is WHY WOULD NATO TROOPS DO THIS?

a. They are murderers who like killing muslims
b. indians and afghani forces have fed them stories about how Pakistan is responsible for their failures in afghanistan
c. They are hypocrites who pretend to be allies but infact are the enemy
 
Pakistan's military disputes this version of events. Military officials say the posts were attacked without warning at 2 a.m, while most of the around 50 soldiers were sleeping, and that NATO helicopters and jets even attacked Pakistani military forces sent in as back-up during the two-hour assault. Pakistan says it has increased the number of soldiers at border posts like these as part of a campaign in Mohmand this year to wipe out the Taliban in the area.
Afghans Say Pakistan Fired First in NATO Attack - WSJ.com

2 hour assault ?? Where was PAF..?? There's more to it that meets the eye.. Wont be surprised if it was a secretly sanctioned operation by Pakistan Army like the drone strikes.. The attackers probably messed up on the target location though..
 
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