Acts of Terrorism in pakistan I

[Scorpius]

1 military dictatorship
2 taliban like regime
3 corrupt politicians

I will take the corrupt politicians,at least i can vote them out if i do not like them




What like mushy dropped all corruption cases against those who supported his govt and locked up the ones that where against him.



Eeerrrr yes there is ,an islamic welfare state

Right, but what do you replace them with? Yeah, like I said it will take time.

So there it is, you want an Islamic state..

A backwards system where people have the mindsets of slaves, being obedient to a ancient ideology that can never be progressive due to it's very nature. Such a system might be beneficial to Pakistan for a short period of time but eventually it will run into major problems.

It wont produce independent and smart individuals, just ones who are slaves and obedient to the ideology of the state. I wouldn't wish that on any nation.

 

[dabong1]

The institutions of democracy need to be established across Pakistan, free education primary and secondary schools. Education should be compulsory for all citizens. Once the masses are educated then full control should be handed over to the Politicians. In the mean time a elected leader would be ok, as long as the Military has the power in the background, like Turkey.

The institutions of democracy is established in pakistan, its just that the army keeps coming and trying to destroy it or taylor it to its own needs.

 

[roadrunner]

The institutions of democracy is established in pakistan, its just that the army keeps coming and trying to destroy it or taylor it to its own needs.

Not true. A country where nearly half the people cannot read or write is not able to make democratic decisions. It's still an infant in democracy terms.

 

[Bull]

The point that gets me is when people keep repeating western media catchphrases,the oppressed woman,they kill civilians ect..

They oppressed women. Those who failed to wear viels were beaten up in public, they were forbidden from working, they were forbiden from going to school/college. Or are these all western media propoganda?

I do not have a problem with mushy if he stands in proper election and gets voted in then great...he is doing the will of the pakistani people and i have no problem.
But at the moment he is doing what "he" thinks is best and not what "we" think is best.
I do belive that if the taliban had carried on in govt for a period of 10/15 years they would have matured.

Well you are ready to give ruthless Taleban's 10-15 yars to mature, but not an inch to Mushraff.

 

[Bull]

1 military dictatorship
2 taliban like regime
3 corrupt politicians

I will take the corrupt politicians,at least i can vote them out if i do not like them

Unfortunatly thats wrong. Corrupt politicians in a country with no strong constitutional instituions would bend/fake election rules and manage victory.

 

[dabong1]

Right, but what do you replace them with? Yeah, like I said it will take time.

So there it is, you want an Islamic state..

A backwards system where people have the mindsets of slaves, being obedient to a ancient ideology that can never be progressive due to it's very nature. Such a system might be beneficial to Pakistan for a short period of time but eventually it will run into major problems.

It wont produce independent and smart individuals, just ones who are slaves and obedient to the ideology of the state. I wouldn't wish that on any nation.

So the turkish AK party falls under the "mindsets of slaves, being obedient to a ancient ideology that can never be progressive due to it's very nature"

Do i want an islamic state? i am a muslim off course i want an islamic system.
I dont want a system where "bastard" children are called love childs,homosexuality is taught to children,the woman has five children to five different fathers,young girls/children are given condoms and told to have "safe sex",breakdown of the family structure,increase in sexual diseases,drunkeness in society ect ect.This system you champion is corrupt and evil and you think it will be beneficial to Pakistan?

 

[dabong1]

They oppressed women. Those who failed to wear viels were beaten up in public, they were forbidden from working, they were forbiden from going to school/college. Or are these all western media propoganda?.

YES

Well you are ready to give ruthless Taleban's 10-15 yars to mature, but not an inch to Mushraff.

NO

 

[Bull]

YES

So you mean to say Women were not at all discriminated against.

 

[dabong1]

Not true. A country where nearly half the people cannot read or write is not able to make democratic decisions. It's still an infant in democracy terms.

Why can not half the people read or right?
Something to do with the army running pakistan for the past 60 years give or take 15/20 years where there was a democratic govt

 

[dabong1]

So you mean to say Women were not at all discriminated against.

What do you mean by "discriminated against".

 

[Scorpius]

So the turkish AK party falls under the "mindsets of slaves, being obedient to a ancient ideology that can never be progressive due to it's very nature"

Do i want an islamic state? i am a muslim off course i want an islamic system.
I dont want a system where "bastard" children are called love childs,homosexuality is taught to children,the woman has five children to five different fathers,young girls/children are given condoms and told to have "safe sex",breakdown of the family structure,increase in sexual diseases,drunkeness in society ect ect.This system you champion is corrupt and evil and you think it will be beneficial to Pakistan?

The Turkish AK party is unique, no other Muslim nation has the level of education or prosperity of Turkey. It is the most modern muslim nation and the AK party is a reflection of this.

Compare this with the muslim parties in Pakistan, they're massively different.

Now your just going to the extreme.

There are problems with western democracy but 5 children to 5 different father's, that's nonsense and you know it. It's very rare, as for "bastard children" again it does happen but it's not the norm.

What's wrong with safe sex and educating people about homosexuals? Your sounding like the pope now...

The system I propose has made the UK one of the richest countries in the world, look at the size of the British Isles and look at the power it wields.

There will always be problems with society, but you can't hide these problems under the guise of religion and pretend that God will protect you, it's all very comforting im sure but not realistic.

What any nation needs is people who will think for themselves and are independant, not parrots who spout propaganda for a 1400 year old system.

 

[roadrunner]

Why can not half the people read or right?
Something to do with the army running pakistan for the past 60 years give or take 15/20 years where there was a democratic govt

Actually no. One word, "colonialism", nothing to do with the Army- you're too blinded and brainwashed it seems. Literacy in Pakistan was 7% in 1947, every decade it's risen by 10%. It's now around 6 decades later, and Pakistan's literacy has risen to nearly 60%, the biggest leaps in literacy have come under Army/Musharraf's rule (in fact Western universities are setting up campus there now). 40% illiteracy is still too much for democracy to take shape.

 

[Bull]

What do you mean by "discriminated against".

Well they were allowed to do all what men could.
Could go out to study. to participate in public life. could speak to others..and so on and so forth.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

1 military dictatorship
2 taliban like regime
3 corrupt politicians

I will take the corrupt politicians,at least i can vote them out if i do not like them

The problem with that my friend, is that there is no guarantee that those "corrupt politicians" will not extend their "corruption" to the ballot box come election time, so in reality you will not be able to "vote them out". The only way a democracy can properly function is if it is supported by institutions such as a strong independent judiciary, an independent election commission and an independent police force and/or some sort of accountability bureau.

 

[dabong1]

The Turkish AK party is unique, no other Muslim nation has the level of education or prosperity of Turkey. It is the most modern muslim nation and the AK party is a reflection of this.

Compare this with the muslim parties in Pakistan, they're massively different. .

okay so when i talk of an islamic welfare state it has to be along the taliban lines and can not be based on the turkish model so it can suit your argument...i understand.
The same i hope applys to mushy who is trying to emulate the turkish model,how can it work going of your logic?

Now your just going to the extreme.
There are problems with western democracy but 5 children to 5 different father's, that's nonsense and you know it. It's very rare, as for "bastard children" again it does happen but it's not the norm. .

You quote extreme examples to me about the islamic system but i can not do the same to a system thats killed more people then all the religious wars in history put together.

What's wrong with safe sex and educating people about homosexuals? Your sounding like the pope now... .

I am a muslim and these norms/ideals/values maybe okay for children and family but not for me mate.
You sounding like a atheist/materialist

There will always be problems with society, but you can't hide these problems under the guise of religion and pretend that God will protect you, it's all very comforting im sure but not realistic.
What any nation needs is people who will think for themselves and are independant, not parrots who spout propaganda for a 1400 year old system.

What do understand of the islamic welfare system?
First go and find out why the AK party of turkey are "parrots who spout propaganda for a 1400 year old system."