14 including seven FC personnel martyred in Ormara attack

[waz]

Hard questions need to be asked of the military leadership;

Why are our men dying.
What are you going to do about it.
Why has history been allowed to repeat itself e.g. Waziristan.

We all know they read this website and they will listen inshallah.
How can we simply ignore such losses?

 

[PDF]

Everyone, let's be realistic, for all those demanding action against India, you must all be well aware IK is a pacifist. Even when we were bombed and got hold of a PoW in Feb-19, when the chances to go after India were highest, our leadership showed restraint.

So don't expect that we carry out any actions, overtly or covertly like our eastern neighbor does and inflict casualties.

Our military budget does not allow to get MRAPs etc for the foot soldiers in the required quantity. US has a large budget and thus despite heavy ambushes and targeting in Afghanistan, their soldiers do not die in the same numbers as ours.

For us, it is more economical and viable to provide free home, medical to the Shuhada's families and free treatment to the injured.

I would not have held the COAS responsible as such incidents are natural and in the future, more should be expected too, but because the COAS took extension, which in my opinion was immoral, unprofessional and unethical on his part, he needs to be blamed for not taking adequate steps to stop the reinsurgence of the terrorists.

If this is the best current COAS can deliver with getting a 3-year extension, I would opine he should re-think about holding onto his position.

Anyways, this is all my personal opinion.

 

[Awan68]

Everyone, let's be realistic, for all those demanding action against India, you must all be well aware IK is a pacifist. Even when we were bombed and got hold of a PoW in Feb-19, when the chances to go after India were highest, our leadership showed restraint.

So don't expect that we carry out any actions, overtly or covertly like our eastern neighbor does and inflict casualties.

Our military budget does not allow to get MRAPs etc for the foot soldiers in the required quantity. US has a large budget and thus despite heavy ambushes and targeting in Afghanistan, their soldiers do not die in the same numbers as ours.

For us, it is more economical and viable to provide free home, medical to the Shuhada's families and free treatment to the injured.

I would not have held the COAS responsible as such incidents are natural and in the future, more should be expected too, but because the COAS took extension, which in my opinion was immoral, unprofessional and unethical on his part, he needs to be blamed for not taking adequate steps to stop the reinsurgence of the terrorists.

If this is the best current COAS can deliver with getting a 3-year extension, I would opine he should re-think about holding onto his position.

Anyways, this is all my personal opinion.

Ik is not a pacifist mate, the army leadership was on page with him concerning feburary, we delivered a minimal spanking to India, we did a lot more to them than they did to us in that scenario. Our economy was at the helm of default, we were in no condition to sustain a full blown conflict if it arose hence the restraint. In contrast to a few of our trees bombed we shot down two jets, captured one pilot, bombed 6 military installation. This was as agressive a response as could be. India was left humiliated at the world stage.

 

[Areesh]

Our military budget does not allow to get MRAPs etc for the foot soldiers in the required quantity. US has a large budget and thus despite heavy ambushes and targeting in Afghanistan, their soldiers do not die in the same numbers as ours.

For us, it is more economical and viable to provide free home, medical to the Shuhada's families and free treatment to the injured.

Bullshit. Bakwas

You can buy 300 vt4 tanks but can't provide 50 - 60 Mraps for own soldiers??

These are all excuses

Please don't bring this old lame excuse here on this thread. Having Imran Bajwa duo is enough of a pain already

Ik is not a pacifist mate, the army leadership was on page with him concerning feburary, we delivered a minimal spanking to India, we did a lot more to them than they did to us in that scenario. Our economy was at the helm of default, we were in no condition to sustain a full blown conflict if it arose hence the restraint. In contrast to a few of our trees bombed we shot down two jets, captured one pilot, bombed 6 military installation. This was as agressive a response as could be. India was left humiliated at the world stage.

Imran Bajwa would have left balakot strike let gone unchecked too on the name of "peace" but it was India itself who left no chance for these guys

It was India itself who made it easy for Pakistan with its incompetence

 

[Jungibaaz]

Hard questions need to be asked of the military leadership;

Why are our men dying.
What are you going to do about it.
Why has history been allowed to repeat itself e.g. Waziristan.

We all know they read this website and they will listen inshallah.
How can we simply ignore such losses?

I think what the army is doing so far has worked and is working.

These deaths although incredibly painful are happening there because the threats we face are real, our military’s presence and their past operations have allowed people in the rest of Pakistan a degree of security that we’d otherwise lack. These types of terrorists attacks are cowardly and opportunistic, and if it wasn’t for these sacrifices we’d perhaps be seeing sustained and large scale attacks in cities with possibly hundreds of casualties over the course of time.

Dealing in long term with insurgency is not just a security issue, it’s mainly a political/geopolitical and societal issue.

The Americans in all their might and all their MRAPs, they valued their soldiers’ lives over their objectives. Hence they lost the war on the ground. Our boys put their lives on the line for the objective. The coalition forces in Afghanistan fortified themselves and left the country to rot, PA has done the opposite and they are paying the price for providing us all security.

All we can reasonably ask of the army leadership IMO is why our troops are so vulnerable in these sort of attacks. Why don’t we have better protection for them, why do we continue to assign low value to their lives? We know that given their level of protection that in these type of attacks they’d be sitting ducks for any attackers armed with RPGs and rifles. We surely can’t continue sending these men to their deaths , there must be a better way even if it costs us some cash.

Long term as long as insurgency and foreign backed terrorism continues, they’ll continue attacking us and finding spots in which we are weak. If tomorrow troops have MRAPs, which I agree they should have, they’ll move to attacking other vulnerabilities etc. We have to stand behind our men, demand what’s best for us and for our troops, and regrettably... we also have to realise that this cost of war is going to be extracted from us for foreseeable future, we should aim to limit it and achieve our main objectives.

 

[crankthatskunk]

Bajawa's Doctrine is not working.

This "Docile" man has to get his "A" game out and strike the enemies of Pakistan with "Iron Hands".
Nothing else is going to work.

For far too long "Pakistani Generals" had been coy because of American's presence in Afghanistan. And due to their fear of USA, they had let Indians establish terror camps in Afghanistan uncontested.

Thanks to General Kiyani, the "NRO" brought the thieves " Zardaris and Sharifs" to the power, who have no interest of Pakistan and its people in their hearts. They were only interested in looting Pakistan. They let Indians establish their networks and also create their political and diplomatic narratives unchallenged.

Pakistan had knowledge and proofs of Indian terror camps in Afghanistan but failed to expose India for its terror links and its terror activities in Pakistan. Despite video evidence available where Indian politicians including Modi and its security apparatus including NSA Doval publicly acknowledging that India is involved in terror activities in Pakistan.

How many proofs, and for how long Pakistani Generals and Pakistani politicians would allow the murders of thousands of civilians and army personnel !!!

Cowards should get up from their dreams, right now.

The men with no balls should grow some and start showing courage and steal. We had enough.

 

[pak-marine]

Inna Lillahi wa inna ilayhi raji'un

 

[kursed]

A single major commercial plot in Lahore DHA sells for what? 15-16 caror? Get rid of an entire DHA plan in one of the cities and invest money into upgrading HIT to start churning out local versions of IFVs.

And if nothing can be done, depute Falcos on the coastal highway (Karachi, Gwadar, Pasni) to ensure 24 hour surveillance of the place. Imagine hosting nuclear missile equipped submarines in Ormara not so far in the future, and losing tens of soldiers barely miles away in terrorist attacks.

 

[hussain0216]

I think what the army is doing so far has worked and is working.

These deaths although incredibly painful are happening there because the threats we face are real, our military’s presence and their past operations have allowed people in the rest of Pakistan a degree of security that we’d otherwise lack. These types of terrorists attacks are cowardly and opportunistic, and if it wasn’t for these sacrifices we’d perhaps be seeing sustained and large scale attacks in cities with possibly hundreds of casualties over the course of time.

Dealing in long term with insurgency is not just a security issue, it’s mainly a political/geopolitical and societal issue.

The Americans in all their might and all their MRAPs, they valued their soldiers’ lives over their objectives. Hence they lost the war on the ground. Our boys put their lives on the line for the objective. The coalition forces in Afghanistan fortified themselves and left the country to rot, PA has done the opposite and they are paying the price for providing us all security.

All we can reasonably ask of the army leadership IMO is why our troops are so vulnerable in these sort of attacks. Why don’t we have better protection for them, why do we continue to assign low value to their lives? We know that given their level of protection that in these type of attacks they’d be sitting ducks for any attackers armed with RPGs and rifles. We surely can’t continue sending these men to their deaths , there must be a better way even if it costs us some cash.

Long term as long as insurgency and foreign backed terrorism continues, they’ll continue attacking us and finding spots in which we are weak. If tomorrow troops have MRAPs, which I agree they should have, they’ll move to attacking other vulnerabilities etc. We have to stand behind our men, demand what’s best for us and for our troops, and regrettably... we also have to realise that this cost of war is going to be extracted from us for foreseeable future, we should aim to limit it and achieve our main objectives.

Absolutely,, great post


As painful as these attacks are,, our war on terror has been a overwhelming success


have people forgotten what happened before and how bad it got, we were having these attacks every week in the middle of cities


now it our brave forces facing the brunt often in the middle of nowhere either in Waziristan or areas of Balochistan

Our population is largely protected from the violence and hence can get on with bullshit like protests marches for Pmln


We can complain about MRAPs or drones and that is fair


Border fencing, takes time, it will take further years for more comprehensive border restrictions band fencing across Balochistan

In the meantime we carry out IBOs against extremists


our bigger problem isn't this we are winning THIS
we have cornered AFGHANISTAN and with China cornered India



Our Bigger problem is the state of our political situation
if the population is smart then it's a non issue because entities like PPP and PMLN and PTM will be decimated but we have alot of jahils who see rule as some sort of kingly right only a sharif, Zardari or Bhutto can have and they are willing to destroy our national interests for their greed


because we don't have a united voice and our judiciary is so pathetic it gives groups like the PTM our liberals space to spread poison

 

[tarrar]

Why weren't our boys given armored vehicles in danger territory?

Toyota Hilux are death trap vehicle and our boys are continuously been given these death trap coffin vehicles, where as Maxpro and other armoured vehicles vehicles are kept for God knows for what purpose.

 

[Ghost 125]

Bullshit. Bakwas

You can buy 300 vt4 tanks but can't provide 50 - 60 Mraps for own soldiers??

These are all excuses

Please don't bring this old lame excuse here on this thread. Having Imran Bajwa duo is enough of a pain already


Imran Bajwa would have left balakot strike let gone unchecked too on the name of "peace" but it was India itself who left no chance for these guys

It was India itself who made it easy for Pakistan with its incompetence

this is not bakwas,,,u need to go for an indepth study of Pak defence budget... most of it is spent in maintainenece of a huge army, a sizeable airforce and navy and other forces, their pays and pensions. only a fraction can be spent on new procurements...if you think merely 50 or 60 MRAPs would stop these attacks or reduce casualities you are mistaken.. quantum of forces on ground is much larger and daily movmnts cant be carried out properly by even hundreads of MRAPs. there are thousands of vehicles moving from point a to b for various purposes in troubled areas including for patrolling, replenishment, leave, etc.

A single major commercial plot in Lahore DHA sells for what? 15-16 caror? Get rid of an entire DHA plan in one of the cities and invest money into upgrading HIT to start churning out local versions of IFVs.

And if nothing can be done, depute Falcos on the coastal highway (Karachi, Gwadar, Pasni) to ensure 24 hour surveillance of the place. Imagine hosting nuclear missile equipped submarines in Ormara not so far in the future, and losing tens of soldiers barely miles away in terrorist attacks.

oh ya, why dont we start from abolishing pre and post retirement benefits of all govt employees, why single out just DHA ???

 

[Arsalan 345]

See there is no way you can blame India. Have you caught any person with credible evidence of raw involvement? Yes we captured. Kulbhushan yadav. He is our guest who will not see any punishment but rather die in jail. Anyway I would like to talk about few facts. Others might not like my comment at all.
All these parties or terrorists are attacking our forces for many reasons. One of the most common reason they give is independence of balochistan. According to them, balochs doesn't even have basic rights of a human being.
I agree that no country in the world gives independence to it's own province but if we look deeply, we might realize that we have committed mistakes.
Balochistan is part of pakistan but still without electricity, gas and basic rights to human beings. Why are we treating Balochistan in this way? I have seen many governments who completely ignored balochistan. Even in this government, no progress in balochistan. We are getting sui gas from balochistan. We tap their resources and in return, they are getting nothing. Time to wake up.

We must say thanks to Iran because if we replace Iran with India than today, you might be looking at another country called balochistan. India wants to interfere but can't because of balochistan location. Thank God that balochistan is still save but does it solves our problems? No.

See we can't attack iran. Attacking Iran means making more enemies. Why not build houses and provide basic rights of a human being to balochs? Truce with militants is the only solution. Fence entire pakistan. Fencing will not solve our problems. Fence can be cut easily. Attacking Iran is not an option so invite Baloch leaders and make a truce. Stop this nonsense proxy war.

How many insurgencies are we facing? Ttp and all Baloch groups and even pashtuns wants same. How long will we continue to ignore our people and divert their resources towards other provinces? Pakistan was founded on the basis of Islam and Islam teaches us to give equal rights to all people. There are poor families living in balochistan who sell patrol to earn money. Some die due to hunger. It's time for Pak army to solve all problems. Don't allow balochistan to act like Bangladesh. We must not allow our country to divide further. Make truce and put all your attention on India. You can't win a proxy war where militants hide in a nearby country. Even if we finish militancy, problems will continue. Militancy will start again. Don't allow our soldiers to patrol in these useless cars. No safety,nothing at all. Truce is the only solution. I am looking at this this Baloch problem from a long time now. There is no solution. Buy as many mrap as possible. It doesn't solve your problem. Make truce and give jobs to Baloch. Make Universities, colleges, give them fresh water. Let's be together against a common enemy india.

 

[Sifar zero]

See there is no way you can blame India. Have you caught any person with credible evidence of raw involvement? Yes we captured. Kulbhushan yadav. He is our guest who will not see any punishment but rather die in jail. Anyway I would like to talk about few facts. Others might not like my comment at all.
All these parties or terrorists are attacking our forces for many reasons. One of the most common reason they give is independence of balochistan. According to them, balochs doesn't even have basic rights of a human being.
I agree that no country in the world gives independence to it's own province but if we look deeply, we might realize that we have committed mistakes.
Balochistan is part of pakistan but still without electricity, gas and basic rights to human beings. Why are we treating Balochistan in this way? I have seen many governments who completely ignored balochistan. Even in this government, no progress in balochistan. We are getting sui gas from balochistan. We tap their resources and in return, they are getting nothing. Time to wake up.

We must say thanks to Iran because if we replace Iran with India than today, you might be looking at another country called balochistan. India wants to interfere but can't because of balochistan location. Thank God that balochistan is still save but does it solves our problems? No.

See we can't attack iran. Attacking Iran means making more enemies. Why not build houses and provide basic rights of a human being to balochs? Truce with militants is the only solution. Fence entire pakistan. Fencing will not solve our problems. Fence can be cut easily. Attacking Iran is not an option so invite Baloch leaders and make a truce. Stop this nonsense proxy war.

How many insurgencies are we facing? Ttp and all Baloch groups and even pashtuns wants same. How long will we continue to ignore our people and divert their resources towards other provinces? Pakistan was founded on the basis of Islam and Islam teaches us to give equal rights to all people. There are poor families living in balochistan who sell patrol to earn money. Some die due to hunger. It's time for Pak army to solve all problems. Don't allow balochistan to act like Bangladesh. We must not allow our country to divide further. Make truce and put all your attention on India. You can't win a proxy war where militants hide in a nearby country. Even if we finish militancy, problems will continue. Militancy will start again. Don't allow our soldiers to patrol in these useless cars. No safety,nothing at all. Truce is the only solution. I am looking at this this Baloch problem from a long time now. There is no solution. Buy as many mrap as possible. It doesn't solve your problem. Make truce and give jobs to Baloch. Make Universities, colleges, give them fresh water. Let's be together against a common enemy india.

"TTP wants the same" Ok terrorist apologist.It is the job of the government to look after poor families not the army civilians must do their jobs.

 

[Arsalan 345]

"TTP wants the same" Ok terrorist apologist.It is the job of the government to look after poor families not the army civilians must to their jobs.

Go to balochistan and see the poor families with your own eyes. You have no knowledge of balochistan. Do you think ptm is doing all this for fun? Their objectives are same. You have made luxurious cities like Lahore and Karachi but why no investment inside balochistan? Let's speak truth. How many times will we continue to hide? Militancy can't be solved with armed conflict. Dragging army in this conflict is not a good choice. Government can still make truce.

By the way, I don't support any party. You can't solve problems by talking about drones, mraps and hints of attacking Iran. All this, even fence are useless.be practical. Think about a solution that solves this militancy. Your enemy India has their eyes set on Azad Kashmir. How many wars will we fight? It's time to relax and think about negotiations.

 

[Sifar zero]

Go to balochistan and see the poor families with your own eyes. You have no knowledge of balochistan. Do you think ptm is doing all this for fun? Their objectives are same. You have made luxurious cities like Lahore and Karachi but why no investment inside balochistan? Let's speak truth. How many times will we continue to hide? Militancy can't be solved with armed conflict. Dragging army in this conflict is not a good choice. Government can still make truce.

I agree that people in KPK and Balochistan are impoverished but what is PTM doing for that except spewing racist shit what is BLA doing killing own people after labelling them as a informer.