11 flights cancelled due to PIA, PALPA tiff

[ACE OF THE AIR]

A private company has the right to fire or hire whom ever it wants...

You have problem with that, setup your own private company.

Gov. creating barriers like license requirements etc etc ? Then that's your true enemy, regulations.
Long Live Free Market !

There are problems too in free market... Private companies do have to be controlled by some rules and regulation....Wild animals also have some laws that govern... In the wild even the Lion does not hunt until and unless he feel threatened or is hungry.

Now can a country or state give the authority to a private company to do what she likes?

first answer this is PIA private? If yes why is state bailing it out repeatedly?

No PIA is not private but an autonomous entity.

Majority of the shares are state owned hence the the bail out.

Ever been to a PIA crews house? I once visited someone, all the crockery and cutlery has PIA printed on it

You are most welcome to visit mine...

Did you know the products are available in the market...visit Sadar and you can buy every thing.
I do have some cutlery of Swiss Air as the used to sell it as a way to advertise the brand. PIA is a company in its own right and they can sell their products be it as souvenirs or a brand.

PIA is state owned. It goes in a loss every year, due to over hiring. They have toooooooo many people, and these are political workers. Which ever party comes to power, it pays its workers through jobs in PIA and other state run enterprises (steel mill and railway and many many many others). That's why the state bails it out every year, year over year...It's a very valuable asset to all political parties.

But don't you already know all this ?

There is over employment but do you know if they are being paid in accordance to international standards for the same job. There are certain areas where there is a shortage of employees .

Cancel thier licences for life and make an example

On what grounds working according to safety requirements? A very very poor defense for the management...

Was just listening to Minister of flying Shujaat azeem on program 'G for gharida', these fu*king c.u.n.t pilots salaries range from 2,00,000 -- 3,00,000 & they're demanding 100% increase in it & other bullsh!ts like PIA will not fire any employe even if he is criminal or corrupt.

Haramzado ke license cancel kar dene chahiye.

Do you know what is the international salary of a pilot?

The lowest top-scale captain’s salary was $123,480 at JetBlue Airways, and the highest among passenger airlines was again at Southwest: $181,270 a year. Many Southwest pilots pick up more trips than the minimum scheduled -– some fly right up to the federal limit of 1,000 hours of flying a year -– so their actual paychecks are higher.
Airline Pilot Salaries: How Much Does Your Captain Earn? - The Middle Seat Terminal - WSJ

Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer Salary
(United States)
An Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer earns an average salary of $101,853 per year. Experience strongly influences pay for this job.

Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer Salary (United States)

First Officers
According to a 2009 salary survey conducted by airline industry website FltOps, average entry-level salaries for first officers ranged from a low of $21,600 at U.S. Airways to a high of $49,572 at Southwest. Continental and United also paid relatively low entry-level salaries of between $26,000 and $28,000, while among large carriers, Delta distinguished itself with an average starting salary of $40,630. With five years of experience, average first officer salaries ranged from a low of $60,488 at AirTran to a high of $108,847 at Southwest.
Average Commercial Airline Pilots Salary | Chron.com

Hope you would do some research before and then comment. If PIA pilots ask this kind of salary then there will be no airline in Pakistan...If these pilots are removed by canceling the licence International issue would be raised promoting a world wide retaliation... International Civil Aviation Organisation would have to intervene prompting to an international restriction on Pakistan...And all major airlines in the world would be facing similar flight disruptions as this is to implement safety of passengers. If this case goes to any Court be it Pakistan or International Court of Justice the Pilot would win hands down.

 

[Dubious]

Salary
(United States)

well how can PIA pilots compare to US pilots esp when they are repeatedly caught stealing, being drunk and breaking other rules? Let alone landing like they are throwing the plane from the air....and worse part is PIA management .....very few flights lift off on time and very few land on time!

 

[I S I]

There are problems too in free market... Private companies do have to be controlled by some rules and regulation....Wild animals also have some laws that govern... In the wild even the Lion does not hunt until and unless he feel threatened or is hungry.

Now can a country or state give the authority to a private company to do what she likes?



No PIA is not private but an autonomous entity.

Majority of the shares are state owned hence the the bail out.


You are most welcome to visit mine...

Did you know the products are available in the market...visit Sadar and you can buy every thing.
I do have some cutlery of Swiss Air as the used to sell it as a way to advertise the brand. PIA is a company in its own right and they can sell their products be it as souvenirs or a brand.


There is over employment but do you know if they are being paid in accordance to international standards for the same job. There are certain areas where there is a shortage of employees .


On what grounds working according to safety requirements? A very very poor defense for the management...



Do you know what is the international salary of a pilot?

The lowest top-scale captain’s salary was $123,480 at JetBlue Airways, and the highest among passenger airlines was again at Southwest: $181,270 a year. Many Southwest pilots pick up more trips than the minimum scheduled -– some fly right up to the federal limit of 1,000 hours of flying a year -– so their actual paychecks are higher.
Airline Pilot Salaries: How Much Does Your Captain Earn? - The Middle Seat Terminal - WSJ

Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer Salary
(United States)
An Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer earns an average salary of $101,853 per year. Experience strongly influences pay for this job.

Airline Pilot, Copilot, or Flight Engineer Salary (United States)

First Officers
According to a 2009 salary survey conducted by airline industry website FltOps, average entry-level salaries for first officers ranged from a low of $21,600 at U.S. Airways to a high of $49,572 at Southwest. Continental and United also paid relatively low entry-level salaries of between $26,000 and $28,000, while among large carriers, Delta distinguished itself with an average starting salary of $40,630. With five years of experience, average first officer salaries ranged from a low of $60,488 at AirTran to a high of $108,847 at Southwest.
Average Commercial Airline Pilots Salary | Chron.com

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Hope you would do some research before and then comment. If PIA pilots ask this kind of salary then there will be no airline in Pakistan...If these pilots are removed by canceling the licence International issue would be raised promoting a world wide retaliation... International Civil Aviation Organisation would have to intervene prompting to an international restriction on Pakistan...And all major airlines in the world would be facing similar flight disruptions as this is to implement safety of passengers. If this case goes to any Court be it Pakistan or International Court of Justice the Pilot would win hands down.

You can't compare east to west

 

[Faiez]

There is over employment but do you know if they are being paid in accordance to international standards for the same job. There are certain areas where there is a shortage of employees .

I don't think you've ever met any of PIA pilots. They have $hit skills. No english communication skills, no nothing (They often have trouble communicating with towers abroad). Can't compare it to foreign pilots. Also, those stats you posted, they're incorrect. There is currently over supply of pilots in USA, Canada etc. Their salaries are much lower. PIA pilots should be paid market rate, no more, no less. I think they are being paid a reasonable amount considering the fact that there's pilots in pakistan willing to take these very jobs very happily at these salaries.

PIA should be privatized or even better, liquidated. That will solve all problems.

There are problems too in free market... Private companies do have to be controlled by some rules and regulation....Wild animals also have some laws that govern... In the wild even the Lion does not hunt until and unless he feel threatened or is hungry.

Now can a country or state give the authority to a private company to do what she likes?

No there are no problems in the free market. Except for those who are stupid and lazy...

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Free market...
Equal pay for equal work...

Moreover Pilots fly in the same way all around the world their training is at similar standards...This is the very reason they can cross over to other aircraft and other airlines with ease.

As far as being caught for stealing being drunk and breaking rules then this also happens in other countries. This is not an Ideal environment we stay in...If it was a fairy tale (Ideal Situation) yes it would have been possible to be crime free...

Crime is part of being human if it was not then today we would not be on Earth but living in Heaven there would have been no crime and no deaths...

well how can PIA pilots compare to US pilots esp when they are repeatedly caught stealing, being drunk and breaking other rules? Let alone landing like they are throwing the plane from the air....and worse part is PIA management .....very few flights lift off on time and very few land on time!

You can't compare east to west

I don't think you've ever met any of PIA pilots. They have $hit skills. No english communication skills, no nothing (They often have trouble communicating with towers abroad). Can't compare it to foreign pilots. Also, those stats you posted, they're incorrect. There is currently over supply of pilots in USA, Canada etc. Their salaries are much lower. PIA pilots should be paid market rate, no more, no less. I think they are being paid a reasonable amount considering the fact that there's pilots in pakistan willing to take these very jobs very happily at these salaries.

PIA should be privatized or even better, liquidated. That will solve all problems.



No there are no problems in the free market. Except for those who are stupid and lazy...

Your assumption....

 

[Dubious]

Free market...
Equal pay for equal work...

Moreover Pilots fly in the same way all around the world their training is at similar standards...This is the very reason they can cross over to other aircraft and other airlines with ease.

As far as being caught for stealing being drunk and breaking rules then this also happens in other countries. This is not an Ideal environment we stay in...If it was a fairy tale (Ideal Situation) yes it would have been possible to be crime free...

Crime is part of being human if it was not then today we would not be on Earth but living in Heaven there would have been no crime and no deaths...

Training isnt really quality if 1 pilot lands a plane and another drops it from the sky...Crime is part of human but to have them repeatedly embarrassing Pakistan AS WELL AS risking people's lives by flying drunk ....if that is the case then they have a very bad nature!

 

[Faiez]

Your assumption....

from experience...

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

from experience...

If you are considering communication skills in English then you should compare them not on the accents but on the nomenclature that they use. ICAO English language proficiency should be considered. Which states that even some pronunciation issues are also problematic if considering the Aussi to the Irish or the Scots, hence it is not going to be taken into consideration.

There are some exceptions every where so one should not take the few and blame all, though this is normally a practice in the west.

Pilots are judged on radio communication skills which do not require long paragraphs or speech power. The requirement is to correctly asses the situation and report precise information that is clearly understood.

The terms Loud and Clear and say again are often used and that is due to bad communication between ground station transmitter and aircraft radio receiver this is due to the distance the aircraft is.

Do not know how much experience you have it is hard to believe what you are saying.

 

[Haroon Syed]

Good.Nothing comes for free. Whoever is talking about morals and ethics should know nothing comes for free. They are working and should be paid for their efforts.

 

[SHAMK9]

BTW2: Do PIA staff also get free flying benefits for entire family including parents, like the Air India maharajas do? The number of times I have had to object to some staff's uncle being 'escorted' to the front of the line is atrocious. They stop only when you resort to shouting

They dont anymore, they used to offer free hajj trips to employees all expenses covered, not anymore.

 

[Tiger Genie]

@ACE OF THE AIR - why are you comparing the salaries of USA and European countries to PIA pilots? The US Air pilot has to own a house in the USA and pay for it (as for all his domestic expenses) in the USA. Aren't Pakistani living costs much cheaper in comparison?

I know Mumbai & New York. To get to the airport I will pay $50 to $100+ in New York. In Mumbai I'll pay RS.300 to Rs.1500 depending where from. So can the cabbie in Mumbai demand $50 to $100 (which will make it INRs.4000 to INRs.6500 !!!

 

[black-hawk_101]

I think this drive will make all the ways clear for privatization of PIA and soon PR too.

 

[Donatello]

Why is that all the compulsory teaching and exhortations of Islam over the decades are not having their desired effect in a overwhelmingly Muslim society? Before prescribing more religion as the treatment, why not assess the efficacy of the existing dose?

This is called hypocrisy, and it is found everywhere in the world regardless of religion or money.

Pakistan was an Islamic Republic in 1960s and 70s...PIA was fine then....so what happened now?

When you don't have checks and balances, no amount of religion will correct that deficiency.

 

[I S I]

This is called hypocrisy, and it is found everywhere in the world regardless of religion or money.

Pakistan was an Islamic Republic in 1960s and 70s...PIA was fine then....so what happened now?

When you don't have checks and balances, no amount of religion will correct that deficiency.

Well Pak was Islamic Republic by name only until Zia came in power with his extreme version of Islam sponsored by Al-Sauds during Afghan Jihad..

 

[Donatello]

Well Pak was Islamic Republic by name only until Zia came in power with his extreme version of Islam sponsored by Al-Sauds during Afghan Jihad..

It actually started before Zia....it started with the ignorance of Bhutto and his politics.....that matched the acumen of a Jahil at best.