Zardari says Pak ‘created militancy for short term tactical gains’

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Which responsible state considers terrorists as "assets"? Even the USA funded the Afghan mujahideen to fight Soviet forces and not to kill innocent civilians.

No side funded their 'assets/proxies' to kill innocent civilians, but that has been seen as an unfortunate side effect of supporting proxies/insurgents that largely operate without any checks and balances.

The Indian created and supported Mukti bahini committed atrocities, the LTTE committed atrocities, the Northern Alliance was comprised almost entirely of warlords infamous for their ethnic massacres, criminal activities and atrocities, and the BLA continues to kill civilians and attack civilian infrastructure.

 

[L'Indien]

So the ball is in your court now and come clean..

Ball is in our court? But you dont really have to view this statement as India centric; This is not some kind of a game that Zardari confesses something and then its Manmohn Singh's turn to confess something! Perhaps it would be better if this statement is viewed keeping in mind Pakistan's domestic situation.

Besides just let us know what exactly it is that you would like us to come clean on WITH PROOF and then perhaps we will.

 

[EyelessInGaza]

Zardari's statement is to be respected. It is an acknowledgment of the errors made, and should be considered in that light. Pakistani forummers - in my limited experience online (not on this forum necessarily) - often speak of izzat and ghairat. Well, IMO, this is how you win true respect on the international stage - by standing up.

As for creating militancy, well, India also did it with the LTTE. There's ample evidence of that.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Zardari's statement is to be respected. It is an acknowledgment of the errors made, and should be considered in that light. Pakistani forummers - in my limited experience online (not on this forum necessarily) - often speak of izzat and ghairat. Well, IMO, this is how you win true respect on the international stage - by standing up.

As for creating militancy, well, India also did it with the LTTE. There's ample evidence of that.

Thank you - this was the sentiment I expressed earlier as well. It is a pragmatic acknowledgment of something that is common knowledge, but its acknowledgment by the Pakistani leadership only stands to boost perceptions about Pakistan's sincerity in the fight against extremism, and therefore perhaps allow other nations to more freel engage with Pakistan and support her efforts.

I appreciate your last line as well - the point is not that Pakistan is blameless, but the India (and the US especially) too has dirty hands when it comes to playing covert games.

 

[salman nedian]

Pakistan did what we thought was right for us at that time. Remember US was also involved in creating the militants, As Agno rightly pointed out Indians created Mukti Bahini and LTTE.

I think what Pak did was to secure its western borders and keep focus on eastern borders which was not a bad strategy coz it worked till 2001 and it was just after American attack that turned the situation.

What if Pakistan settles their matters with Taliban and takes a bold step to pressurize USA? After all these terrorists are on Israeli, US and Indian payroll.

 

[EyelessInGaza]

Thank you - this was the sentiment I expressed earlier as well. It is a pragmatic acknowledgment of something that is common knowledge, but its acknowledgment by the Pakistani leadership only stands to boost perceptions about Pakistan's sincerity in the fight against extremism, and therefore perhaps allow other nations to more freel engage with Pakistan and support her efforts.

I appreciate your last line as well - the point is not that Pakistan is blameless, but the India (and the US especially) too has dirty hands when it comes to playing covert games.

Cheers.

After struggling for a long time to evaluate Indian Pakistan issues dispassionately, I now pretend that I do not have any interest in the two nations. Instead I imagine that they are two antagonistic nations I don't really know about or have a stake in. I use the Serbia Bosnia example, or some such in Africa, to imagine that they are/ parallel India Pakistan.

Using that lens of neutrality, the first questions that usually comes to me are:

Why are these idiots fighting?

Do they really think their cause is all that important compared to human lives?

Do they expect me to believe that only one side is the totally innocent party?

 

[waraich66]

well mr. Fundamentalist terrorists you consider useful for your short term gains you call them freedom fighters and those who harm you you call them terrorists. Thats not the way reality works.

You misunderstood my point , struggle by local kashimiris is freedom struggle , international comunity define it freedom struggle for their right and land.

FATA and SWAT is already part of muslim state , so fight with muslim state always considered is terorism, if they have majority they can prove it through election.

 

[waraich66]

so you agree blochistani are doign right and so are talibani and tribal because they want freedom of will and thoughts too and no involvment from pakistan army.

Freedom fighting and terrorism are two diffrent things. freedom fighters dont kill innocent civilian but TERORIST DO !!

thats what they did in mumbai delhi and other parts of india, there is absolutly no justification for killion innocent people.

thats why if pakistan will keep commiting the same mistake of harbouring terrorist then -they will hit back pakistan . like its happening right now.

War against Kufar is jehad but against muslim state is terrorism and fasad.

I hope defination is enough to clearify your doubts about terrorism .

Islam also dont allow killing of innocent people muslim or non muslim.

 

[notsuperstitious]

So fight with muslim state always considered is terorism

We may have found the root cause.

 

[insas91]

You misunderstood my point , struggle by local kashimiris is freedom struggle , international comunity define it freedom struggle for their right and land.

Well the international community things Pakistan should stop persuing terrorism as its sole weapon. International community got the phrase "aid not to be used against its neighbours" written to make it abundantly clear that terrorism carried out in Kashmir and in India needs to stop.

Kashmiris are not fighting for freedom, but instead helping India beat Pakistani terrorists. Better not live in denial over Kashmir, it is and will be a sovereign part of India and will not be negotiated under any circumstances be it a failed attempt of Kargil or Mumbai attacks.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

We may have found the root cause.

I think the root couse of terrorism is injustice , poverty and illiteracy . More ever if the rights of one are supressed the byproduct will likely endup in the violance.

 

[insas91]

No side funded their 'assets/proxies' to kill innocent civilians, but that has been seen as an unfortunate side effect of supporting proxies/insurgents that largely operate without any checks and balances.

Not in case of kashmir. State support has been proven, and all terror outfits operating in kashmir are operating with checks and balances of the ISI and the Pak Army.

The Indian created and supported Mukti bahini committed atrocities, the LTTE committed atrocities, the Northern Alliance was comprised almost entirely of warlords infamous for their ethnic massacres, criminal activities and atrocities, and the BLA continues to kill civilians and attack civilian infrastructure.

I didnt expect this from such a senior member. Better brush up on history. India didnt create Mukhti Bahini it existed as a guirella outfit much before India became interested in Bangladesh. It was later that India began supporting Bahini after Pakistan Army committed one of the worst atrocacies in history.

LTTE was not created or supported by India. LTTE was responsible for the assasination of Former Indian Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi. Calling it an Indian funded group is not only preposturous but rather naive and kiddish and needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

Not in case of kashmir. State support has been proven, and all terror outfits operating in kashmir are operating with checks and balances of the ISI and the Pak Army.

Their may exist any support during the Kargil campeign but now those groups are banned and their support has been clamped down and is discouraged among many circles of our state machinery .They dont enjoy that liberty anymore like they do in the Past.
I think we need to target the root cause which led Pakistan's Establishment in creating terrorist orgs and that is Solution of All the Standing Disputes . Pakistan is Making serious efforts in bringing down all these terrorist orgs but If all the disputes remain unsolved i fear these all postive attempts may go to waste.

 

[salman nedian]

Not in case of kashmir. State support has been proven, and all terror outfits operating in kashmir are operating with checks and balances of the ISI and the Pak Army.

State involvement of India in FATA and Baluchistan has also been proven and Pakistan government has proofs of it.Indian supported terrorist camps are also working in Afganistan

I didnt expect this from such a senior member. Better brush up on history. India didnt create Mukhti Bahini it existed as a guirella outfit much before India became interested in Bangladesh. It was later that India began supporting Bahini after Pakistan Army committed one of the worst atrocacies in history.

LTTE was not created or supported by India. LTTE was responsible for the assasination of Former Indian Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi. Calling it an Indian funded group is not only preposturous but rather naive and kiddish and needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.

Mukti Bahini always had the support of India and so was LTTE. If you talk in this sense Taliban were also not created by Pakistan. They were the local Afghans and later when they conquered the whole Afghanistan, Pakistan started to support them.

 

[notting hill]

India did it as well - in supporting the insurgents in East Pakistan, the LTTE in Sri Lanka, the Northern Alliance in Afghanistan, and the BLA in Baluchistan (though their current support for the BLA is under dispute).

Hopefully India will have the refreshing honesty to also admit her mistakes in those areas as a gesture of sincerity, like Pakistan and the US have done.

insurgents in east pakistan to whom the right were denied in the previous elections.. they were fighting against an organised army and were were not bombing and killing civilians... i really dont see these terrorists in kashmir or swat or so called taliban in afghanistan fighting a conventional armed force 'coz they know that are simply not up for it and thats why they are killing civilians to make a point..you need public support to wage a war against the state which sadly these terrorists dont have unlike mukti bahini .. indian backing came into view when the refugee problem arose in india 'coz of the situation in bangladesh.

talkin abt LTTE ... no one in indian establishment denies the fact that india backed LTTE and that was one of the reasons why srilankan-indo relations were low .. India supported a concept where they said they wanted more autonomy for the tamils in lanka.they never imposed anything militarily in lanka and when they intervened by sending IPKF they ended up fighting LTTE .. so much for the support eh .. some organisation in tamil nadu did support them with arms ,ammunation and money but the support was broad based and not just LTTE . The world and srilanka understand the tamil problem . india never backed the notion of lanka divided into two . you will soon see the implementation of 1987 peace accord between india and lanka which includes devolution of power in the north and east which india wanted. for india , it was a mistake to back LTTE but the realisation was swift after the assassination of rajiv gandhi and subsequently LTTE was declared a terrorist organization. Indo -srilankan ties have touched new horizons ever since... we all know new delhi backed them at UNSC ..gave them arms and ammunations AGAINST LTTE despite the fact that a crisis was brewing up in tamil nadu .. SO REALISATION DOES PAY OFF.. in the case of pakistan benazir ws assassinated.. what did pakistan do.. signed a peace deal with terrorists in swat and those organisations like jamat -e-dawa and jaish are still thriving in pakistan .jaish is an organisation whcih was founded by a person who was released after indian airliner hijacking .. one person on his honeymoon was killed in that tragic incident . hafeez saeed is still out sumwhere dispite an air tight case co-prepared by india with FBI and all the facts given to the pakistani goverment .. and ppl like him are planning next attack sumwhere in US according to latest US intelligence report ..

northern alliance was fighting taliban.. Taliban was no way an elected government .. it was an armed militia just like NA.. and INDIA made no bones in making clear which side got its backing.. masood khalili the afghan ambassador at the time of US attack on afghanistan was northern alliance( afghan) ambassador to india and he was a close friend of ahmed shah masood.. you dont have to admit on the media about the backing .. it can be done in more subtle ways..

BLA doesn't require attention.. it has been more of loud statements than facts.